Global Flood explains Oil Deposits and Geological layers

a reply to: Ravenwatcher

Can we not just get the CliffsNotes?

a reply to: andy06shake

Hummingbirds eat about half their body weight in food per day.
Their diet consists of insects and nectar.
They have to eat approximately every 15 minutes and they apparently visit between 1500 and 2000 flowers per day.

Even if we believe that it may have been possible to keep them alive on an Ark where did the flowers and all the bugs come from when they were released from the Ark after a year?

Same with the trees and leaves etc required for giraffes to feed.

How did the penguins get back to Alaska and Polar Bears to the Arctic?

Perhaps Noah did a whistlestop tour of the globe dropping the different creatures off in their places of origin?

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: cooperton
If the water was salty enough to preserve fish it would have destroyed the lands ability to grow most vegetation.

They likely had salt on board for preservation purposes

Also, we are not talking about human knowledge of preservation. Could Noah and his family even preserve enough fish to feed two of each animal on earth?

Considering there were countless fish in the ocean, yeah

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: cooperton
If the water was salty enough to preserve fish it would have destroyed the lands ability to grow most vegetation.

They likely had salt on board for preservation purposes

Also, we are not talking about human knowledge of preservation. Could Noah and his family even preserve enough fish to feed two of each animal on earth?

Considering there were countless fish in the ocean, yeah

Those fish would have been dead due to Salinity temp and PH change there's no argument there . All Aquatic life would have died .

a reply to: cooperton

You missed this. Address the special needs of the food supply for the animals.

Noah had to have a years supply of food and water for each animal. Fruit, veggies and meat do not last that long. Pandas HAVE TO have bamboo. Noah couldn't get that. Koalas HAVE TO have eucalyptus. Noah couldn't get that. AYE-AYE only eat insects. Did Noah have a years supply of insects for both Aye-Aye? The Ostrich has to eat gravel in it's diet or it dies. Did Noah have a years supply of gravel on the ark for both ostrich. Giant Anteaters eat only termites and ants. Did Noah have a room full of ants and termites for them? Same with Pangolins. And what did the termites eat ... the ark? The star nosed mole only eats worms, insects, and other small invertebrates that they find in the soil. Did Noah have a supply of this in the ark? The hoatzin eats only flowers and leaves. How did Noah keep a fresh supply of flowers for a year on the ark? The walrus eats only clams, snails, and other mollusks. How did Noah keep a fresh years supply of those on the ark? The platypus eats only aquatic insects, crustaceans, and mollusks. How did Noah keep a fresh years supply of those on the ark? Snail kites are found in South America and eat only apple snails from that area. Did Noah go to South America and get a years supply of apple snails for the Snail Kites to eat? How did he keep those snails alive for a year on the ark? Monarch butterflies eat nectar. Did Noah have flowering plants on the ark for the butterflies? But as caterpillars, they only eat the leaves of the toxic milkweed plant. Did he have a years supply of milkweed plants and how did he keep them fresh? Black-footed ferrets will only eat prairie dogs. Did Noah have a years supply of prairie dogs on the ark and how did he keep all those prairie dogs alive for a year? The pen-tailed treeshrew of Thailand and Indonesia only drinks the naturally fermented nectar of the bertam palm. How the heck did Noah pull off having Bertram palm trees on the ark and keep them alive? Did he go to Thailand and get some ahead of time? Deep-keeled flamingo eat plankton and algae, and filter with water through their beaks. How did Noah pull that off? And of course we have BEES - who need fresh flowers. Did Noah have a meadow of flowers on the ark to keep alive like a hot house or something? The Northern Shrike has to have spiney plants to stick insects on to eat. It only eats parts of the insect and has to have the plants. Did Noah have those plants on board and how did he keep them alive, and enough insects for the birds for a year? The leafcutter ant has to have fresh leaves to cut and add it's saliva to in order to make the fungus that it eats. Did Noah have years supply of FRESH leaves for the ants? How?

a reply to: Freeborn

Feeding them aside for a moment.

Something would be humming thats for sure.

I mean how are they getting rid of all the excrement pish/sh@t/puke these ""magically well-fed and watered animals"" are apt to produce?

Does the Ark have specialised toilets, and dedicated plumbing system, designed to meet the requirements and accommodate the needs of every individual pair of animals on board?

And/or a dedicated plumbing/cleaning staff ready to step in at a moment's notice and sort out any blockages that are apt to occur?

I mean enquiring minds just want to know?

Ever seen what happens on a cruise ship when the plumbing system goes breasts up?

My wee mate worked on one, apparently it's not a pretty sight, with diarrhea and dysentery at all angles even before they were able to reach port.

originally posted by: FlyersFan

And there is no evidence that wolves would breed into dogs naturally without human interference in the breeding. And most definitely not naturally happening in a few hundred years - a process that takes over 15,000 years even with human manipulation.

YOU ARE WRONG

Baseless claims. There are many different kinds of wolves:

Gray Wolf (also known as Timber Wolf)
Arctic Wolf (also known as White or Polar Wolf)
Red Wolf
Indian Wolf
Himalayan Wolf
Ethiopian Wolf
Eastern Wolf
Tundra Wolf

There's literal dog breeders that say it only takes 30 to 50 years to make different dog breeds. Unless you have a good reason that they're lying and that your arbitrary 15,000 year old date makes more sense? Are dog breeders just lying?

originally posted by: Ravenwatcher

Those fish would have been dead due to Salinity temp and PH change there's no argument there . All Aquatic life would have died .

Even if that were the case, there is still saltwater fish. I picture the rainwater from above causing a layer of less dense freshwater to form near the surface

originally posted by: FlyersFan
And what did the termites eat ... the ark?

Termites aren't animals.

The star nosed mole only eats worms, insects, and other small invertebrates that they find in the soil.

OH speaking of soil yeah he definitely grew plants on the deck of the ark, thanks for the hint! 45,000 square feet on the top deck and thats a lot of plant life you can grow for food. It's like the more we look into it, the more plausible it becomes.

The walrus eats only clams, snails, and other mollusks. How did Noah keep a fresh years supply of those on the ark?

The platypus eats only aquatic insects, crustaceans, and mollusks

Remember that net they used to fish for things? You bet there were more fresh shellfish, crustaceans, etc, than they knew what to do with.

Monarch butterflies eat nectar. Did Noah have flowering plants on the ark for the butterflies?

butterflies are not an animal

The pen-tailed treeshrew of Thailand and Indonesia only drinks the naturally fermented nectar of the bertam palm.

"Treeshrews are omnivorous, feeding on insects, small vertebrates, fruit, and seeds. Among other things, treeshrews eat Rafflesia fruit."

It's like every objection you have has an answer to it lol.

And of course we have BEES - who need fresh flowers. Did Noah have a meadow of flowers on the ark to keep alive like a hot house or something?

as discussed before, yeah, the top deck would have been a booming plant sanctuary. No shade and full sun, perfect growing conditions, plenty of flowers

Did Noah have those plants on board and how did he keep them alive, and enough insects for the birds for a year?

An abundance of insects would be alive in the top deck garden. Not to mention seeds store very well, and this was likely a lot of what he fed the birds. Whats amazing is that the top deck garden could easily have been a mature garden since he had time before the flood hit to plan out what would be on it.

The leafcutter ant has to have fresh leaves to cut and add it's saliva to in order to make the fungus that it eats. Did Noah have years supply of FRESH leaves for the ants? How?

The strawgrasper flyers fan has to grasp at straws to survive, do secular websites have enough straws to allow him to continue the conversation?

a reply to: cooperton

Termites aren't animals.

Actually, termites are indeed animals.

Apparently belonging to the order of "isoptera", and are a "eusocial insect".

butterflies are not an animal

I'm sorry, but that statement is not accurate either.

Butterflies are indeed animals, more specifically, they are insects belonging to the order of "Lepidoptera".

Animals are a highly diverse group you see ranging from simple invertebrates like sponges and worms to complex vertebrates such as mammals, birds, and reptiles ""Butterflies"", ""termites"", and humans, but to name a few.

originally posted by: cooperton
Baseless claims.

No. Easily googled. SCIENCE says it took 15,000 years for human manipulation to breed wolves into dogs. And then hundreds more for generic dogs to become pugs.

There's literal dog breeders that say it only takes 30 to 50 years to make different dog breeds. Unless you have a good reason that they're lying and that your arbitrary 15,000 year old date makes more sense? Are dog breeders just lying?

15,000 years is not 'arbitrary'. It's easily googled. It took 15,000 years for humans to manipulate wolves into becoming dogs. You fail to address the fact that any wolves off Noahs Ark would be IN THE WILD and not subject to purposeful breeding practices to become dogs. They would just stay wolves because there would be no breeding interference from humans. There would be no reason for the wolves to change into dogs without humans interfering .

So again, you fail.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Ravenwatcher

Those fish would have been dead due to Salinity temp and PH change there's no argument there . All Aquatic life would have died .

Even if that were the case, there is still saltwater fish. I picture the rainwater from above causing a layer of less dense freshwater to form near the surface

That much water would have diluted The salinity to a point where even salt water animals would have died they are highly sensitive to salinity chang temp change and PH change ... Please stop there is no argument that much water mixes any amount of water mixes I mix salt and freshwater every day - I work in wholesale and supply Public Aquariums and pet stores alike .

a reply to: cooperton
The animals, as they went back home without humans, what did they eat?

originally posted by: cooperton
Termites aren't animals.
butterflies are not an animal

And yet they would have to have been on the ark. Otherwise, they wouldn't exist today. And the termites were needed as food for the animals that ate termites. And ANTS were needed for food for the animals that ate ants. You fail to address these things.

Remember that net they used to fish for things? You bet there were more fresh shellfish, crustaceans, etc, than they knew what to do with.

You are making up a net to fish for things. That's YOUR imagination. There was nothing about that said in scripture. And no, nets handled by Noah and his family couldn't catch enough shellfish, crustaceans to feed the animals that ate them. Plus the ocean would have been DEAD. The mix of water would have killed all the fish and animals and crustaceans in it. So would the poison from waters below - full of poison and minerals not good for ingestion. You fail to address this.

It's like every objection you have has an answer to it lol.

No, it doesn't. YOU keep failing.

as discussed before, yeah, the top deck would have been a booming plant sanctuary. No shade and full sun, perfect growing conditions, plenty of flowers

No. There is no mention of a 'top deck' or a boat-garden in scripture. You are making that up.

AND 40 days and 40 nights of heavy pounding rain would have destroyed any so called 'garden' sitting on top of a boat.

An abundance of insects would be alive in the top deck garden.

No. There was no 'top deck garden'. You are making it up. AND 40 days and 40 nights of heavy pounding rain would have destroyed any so called 'garden' sitting on top of a boat. And even if there were, which there wasn't, there wouldn't be enough insects for all the animals and birds that ate them. You fail to address the needs of certain animals and birds to eat insects.

The strawgrasper flyers fan has to grasp at straws to survive, do secular websites have enough straws to allow him to continue the conversation?

I'm a HER, not a him. And I'm not the one grasping straws. I'm posting proven science. You just make up crap.

You make up crap about a garden on 'the top deck' of the ark when there was no such thing. And you failed to address each of the animals Iisted. What about the eucalyptus for the Koalas that have to have eucalyptus. And the bamboo for the pandas that have to have bamboo. and what about the apple snails for the snail kites, that come from South America. What about the ferrets that only eat prairie dogs - where would the one year supply of live prairie dogs go and what about food to keep them alive too and space for them? What about the carnivores ... lions and tigers that had to have fresh kill meat every day? And what about the walrus that eats clams, snails, and other mollusks - no net catches those.

You fail.

originally posted by: cooperton
as discussed before, yeah, the top deck would have been a booming plant sanctuary. No shade and full sun, perfect growing conditions, plenty of flowers

Kinda hard with waterlogged soil after non-stop rain for over a month.

And you have the nerve to say others are clutching at straws.

How is this still a thread? We have enough hammers and nails to actually build an Ark at this point.

I can be a hammer too.

a reply to: cooperton

Termites aren't animals.

Well actually, they are.

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Arthropoda
Class: Insecta
Order: Blattodea

I also admire Noah's ability to sex insects. That's no easy task, to catch two of every insect, and then know which ones are which.

There are more than 1,000,000 different kinds (species) of insects known in the world. About 7,000 new species are found each year. Entomologists estimate there may be as many as 10 million undiscovered insect species.

I want to know more about this ark's sun deck. Did he use planters for the trees or something? To also need to take care of vegetation. That seems insurmountable.

It seems that Noah needed to have not merely "many" seeds but many samples of all the seeds and spores of the 420,000-plus species of plants in order to guarantee their survival—or else we must tally up a few million more miracles of divine preservation.

Finally, I got another bone to pick...

Ark is biblically stated to be 300 cubits long, 50 cubits wide, and 30 cubits high.

Noahs Ark dimensions = 450 ft long, 75 ft wide, and 45 ft high or 1,518,750 cubic feet of volume.

Titanic dimensions = 883 ft long, 93 ft wide, and 104 ft tall (175 with funnels) or 8,540,376 cubic feet of volume.

So...

How do you put all that on a boat with LESS THAN ⅕ (17%) THE AREA BY VOLUME of Titanic?

There are two boats at our cruise ship terminal right now bigger than Noah's Ark. And they only fit a few thousand fat people.

Was it a magical boat with the spacial rules of The TARDIS? It has to be a really magical boat, because 1.2 million (identified species, with 8.7 million estimated) and 420,000 species of plant is not fitting on something literally smaller than James Cameron's 3/4 Scale Titanic replica.

I need either spacial manipulation or a Rick Moranis' shrinking gun.

Noah and his sons couldn't have built the ark In the time limits the Bible says they had. IMPOSSIBLE. Besides .. they didn't know how to build boats either.

The Noahs Ark Myth Makes No Sense According to Science

That’s a massive ship, obviously. And it needed to be. Its purpose was to accommodate two members of every single species on the planet—millions of animals, plants, and fungi. The interiors had to be build accordingly. The task was more monumental than building any of the known wonders of the world, especially since wonders took many hundreds of years to build with thousands upon thousands of people working on it. For the ark, four people had to build it in less than a century, according to Genesis. Noah and his three sons supposedly built it in 82 years. Four people. To build a structure comparable in complexity and scale as the Pyramids of Egypt.

Even if thousands collaborated to build the massive structure, 82 years is still both a long and a short time to effectively finish the task. It’s too short because the ship is so big and complex and gathering the materials alone would have taken many decades, that it’s hard to believe it took less than half a millennium. And it’s too long because, as is usually the problem in wood shipbuilding, by the time the later layers of the ark were placed, the earlier wooden pieces would’ve rotten away already.

Lots more at this site. Including that ships of wood couldn't be made that large. They would have been torn apart by their own weight. The question of why did people go back to simple canoes and simple ships if they had all that ship building knowledge? It just disappeared? At least 8 million species of animals, meaning around 20 million animals, would have to have fit on the ship, and they couldn't. No tangible traces of this incredible even were left behind. It all disappeared. Species re-evolved to their current state as if nothing had happened in just a little while. The seas receded without leaving a scar.

TOO FEW GENES - Second, all animals, humans included, require genetic variation to survive. Human genes were reduced to just the lineage of Noah and his wife—a single line. The same for all other animals, if we take the tale literally. That’s absurd. All in all, conservation experts estimate that it takes a minimum of 50 organisms of a single lineage for it to survive, depending on the species. And even that is debatable. 50 leaves no room for error; if only a few were to die, say, by hitting their head after violent winds rocked the ark (which must’ve happened), then that’s that. And that’s with 50. Two is simply impossible. In fact, many biologists argue we’d need around 150 specimens to account for minor incidents—and far more to account for severe situations.[/quote

LETS TALK ANIMAL POOP AND PEE ....

8 people couldn't clean up all the poop and pee as needed. It's impossible.

The myth of Noahs Ark as Literal History

Living in piles of their own dung is very unhealthy for most animals, and before long their health would suffer. The animals on Noah’s ark would have to have their cages cleaned periodically. In most places that care for animals, this is done once a day. Eight people cleaning 16,000 cages a day is absurd. A healthy human, working hard, can clean roughly 100 or so “average” cages or stables in a really tough workday. Remembering the above, we also had to allocate time to providing water and food.

Let’s take a closer look at what it takes to clean an animal’s cage.

Setting the estimate low we could say the process of removing the dung took 60 seconds for a large cage, 10 seconds for a small cage. We could say the average time spent per cage would be 30 seconds.

The dung would have to be thrown overboard eventually, so, again setting the estimate low, we could say the cleaner would have to empty his waste container only every 20 cages.

The time taken to empty the waste overboard would vary on the position of the cage being cleaned. The ones working on the deck below the water would take longer to empty their waste than the ones on the upper decks, while the ones working in the center of the ark would take longer to empty their waste than the ones on the edge. Setting the estimate low again we are looking at 3 minutes to empty waste.

Calculating this out we are looking at 17 human hours of labor removing dung.

Of course, if Noah had built various magical machines (mostly powered inclined planes and those “screw” things), the disposal of the poop would have been a bit easier.

An alternative explanation is that each animal cleaned its own enclosure periodically. However, given the lack of opposable thumbs for most of the species on the ark, this explanation is implausible.

Certainly since Scripture related nothing about the places which we said were set apart for the excrement of the animals, but tradition preserves some things, it will appear opportune that silence has been maintained on this about which reason may sufficiently teach of its importance. And because it could less worthily be fitted to a spiritual meaning, rightly, therefore, Scripture, which rather fits its narratives to allegorical meanings, was silent about this.

ORIGIN (AD 184/5-253/4)[17]

Animals also pee. Animals on the top deck would not need to have their urine dealt with because the decks could theoretically be slanted so the urine would flow out into the ocean. (God must have supplied really detailed blueprints for Noah to get all this right.) The urine on the bottom decks, however, would have to be manually removed or else it would build up and sink the ship. Say there were only 10,000 animals on the bottom two decks. Say, setting the estimate low, each animal only peed on average one fourth of a cup per day. That gives us 2500 cups (165 gallons) of urine that needed to be bilge pumped per day.

Now, reasonably, the most a person can carry[note 5] is about eight gallons per trip.[note 6] That results in roughly twenty trips per day of “piss duty”.

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: FarmerSimulation
When it comes to Egyptology there is a 400 year dark period unaccounted for.

NOT at 2400 BC when the Noahs Flood was supposed to take place. Egyptian culture and peoples flourished before, during and after that time period. No break in it. No wipe out. No people immigrating in and instantly taking up the Egyptian culture, the Egyptian language, the Egyptian religion, etc etc

Edited to add ... WHY would Noahs offspring move to Egypt and take up the Egyptian religion? Wouldn't they be all-in with the one-God religion of Noah? After all ... that's what saved Noah and made it possible for them all to be alive. Why would they abandon that religion and take up Egyptian gods? MAKES NO SENSE. Doesn't work.

The Hyksos.
The blonde and red haired, blue eyed sons of Noah that civilized Egypt and most of the Mediterranean, Africa, India.
They were the ones that brought in the tamed horses and chariot technology.
Yes. The dark period of Egypt history of 400 years happened after Noah.
Most of modern Egyptology is a cover up of Hyksos influence and historical significance.