Eighty thousand deserters in Ukraine

a reply to: annonentity

There is going to be a class war like it or not simply because someone got too greedy.

Possibly.
My opinIons about class discrimination and the greed of corporations, politicians and elites is pretty well known here on ATS.

The working class doesn't need letting off their leash by the middle classes or anyone....they need to grow a pair of balls, stand up for themselves and demand - or force - real and lasting change.

Relevance?

a reply to: annonentity

What do you mean there is going to be?

Class war is rife annonentity.

And it's been happening for quite some time.

Just a fact.

a reply to: charlest2

"I don't know why I do this any longer. These discussions have gotten old for me by now."

Not this, again? 😭

a reply to: Freeborn

What is strange is that you can not see by now that Putin didn't start this fight and that our federal government, sad to say, has morphed into a vile corruption, evil to it's core.

a reply to: charlest2

Putin did start this when he invaded Ukraine.

A simple fact.

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

There are none so blind as those that WILL NOT see.

Our federal government, "of the people, by the people and for the people" has evolved into a bloodsucking parasite sucking the life out of the entire world. And your government is it's baby sister.

What is a simple fact is that you don't have a clue.

a reply to: charlest2

Whereas Putin is as pure as the driven snow?

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

What is a simple fact is that you don't have a clue.

a reply to: Freeborn

That would be great for Ukraine if they took land worth something...as it is though Russia is currently sweeping through capturing 3 out. Of 4 of Ukraines richest districts as far as resources go...never mind the heavy infrastructure there. Why would Russia be leveraged to trade rich land for basic land?

a reply to: charlest2

Here we go with the childish insults, yet again.

a reply to: andy06shake

That doesn't sound even close to equal to losing those lands they are losing in the east. Eastern Ukraine has huge resoruce deposits and industrial networks. Kursk has...not much of anything important. Also as they bleed men down in the east they better hope Russia doesn't cut off the Kursk push because that encirclement would be very very costly...and in my opinion ( not that it means much to anyone else ) thats exactly what will end up happening.

a reply to: charlest2

Your Federal government may have 'morphed into a vile corruption, evil to it's core' - I'm not going to comment on that here.
The political system in my own country is broken and requires urgent reform.
Both of our respective nations have their own issues and problems - they are both still a damn sight better places to live than the majority of countries on this earth.
But they are discussions for another time and place.

That doesn't alter the FACT that Putin - a vile and corrupt de facto dictator whose ideologies and policies are diametrically opposed to those so often espoused and valued by so many Defenders of Freedom and The Constitution - invaded a non-threatening country for no other purposes than self-aggrandisement, delusions of recapturing some imagined former Russian glory and outright bullying and extortionism.

If he hadn't invaded there would be no war and thousands upon thousands of people would not be dead due to this inane war.

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

There are single celled organisms that have more sense than some humans.

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

It started in 2013/14 when the US engineered a coup they hand picked a puppet government. I am not saying there wasn't russian puppets there already...but its Russia's sphere of influence... Not the US's.

a reply to: charlest2


Anything useful to add to what the adults are discussing?

a reply to: RickyD

Russia installed a corrupt President who ignored the will of the people to have closer ties with Europe and tried to take them back into Russia's fold.

They weren't that keen on that by all accounts.

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

Only part of the country wanted closer NATO relations...that would be mostly in the western part of Ukraine...down in the east they did not want that...

What do you think we would do if Russia engineered a mexican coup and installed hand picked puppets on our boarder? We would have a special operation authorized by the president similar to how we went to vietnam without declaring war.

End of the day its there sphere of influence not ours...we don't have to like it or agree with it but its not our business...just like its none of Russia's business what puppets we install in our sphere of influence.

I don't particularly like Russia but I am also not gonna be disingenuous and pretend I can't see how we got here and who made it happen.

a reply to: Freeborn

I have been siting here typing out a long diatribe but have deleted it. If you refuse to willingly open your eyes to reality, I can't force them open for you.

Freedom in this western society has become, is a fallacy. We have all been brainwashed into believing this is still our condition but in reality, we are all serfs of our creations, our governments by now. Freedom? Nobody is free! We are all slaves to our governments. Try not paying your taxes and see how free you will be. Try making a left turn without turning on your signal first. Try not paying the ticket for it. Freedom is an illusion.

All I can say right now is, "be content in your delusions".

a reply to: RickyD

Europe, not NATO.

Ukrainians experience of being a Soviet vassal state was not good and they don't want to go back under Russia's heel.

Neither do the other countries that shared that experience.

Now, because of his invasion and expansionism he now has Sweden and Finland in NATO with maybe more to come.

The UK is part of Europe, not the EU anymore, so it very much is our business.

Putin was not forced into his war, it was his blunder and blood soaks his hands.

a reply to: charlest2

"I have been siting here typing out a long diatribe but have deleted it".

Thank God for small mercies 😁.