Christianity, is it child emotional abuse?

reply to post by gabby2011

You only have to look at the judgement and self righteousness of some non believers to see.. that non Christians can be full of judgement..intolerance..and really lack love and compassion much of the time.

You only have to look at the judgment and self-righteousness of some so-called "CHRISTIANS" to see....that "CHRISTIANS" can be full of judgment..intolerance..and really lack love and compassion much of the time.

Christ was a man. He taught the Golden Rule, and he did NOT claim to be the "only begotten son of God." He claimed to be, like the Buddhists believe, part of the divine which is in ALL OF US.

Christianity tries to show us a way to rise above the flaws of humanity...and if some don't get that concept..perhaps in time they will.

Yes, they will. After many, many lifetimes of not getting the concept. Of harming others with thoughts, words, and deeds. Of not realizing that the Buddhists in Tibet taught Jesus what he tried to teach...that within every one of us is the divine; we are all going to be reunited with the divine, after learning not to condemn others or harm others or call others nasty names and never apologize for being so rude and belligerent and ugly. There is no Biblical "hell." There is only love, enlightenment, and ignorance.

Watching others do things that are evil, deceptive, and lacking in love -- like ....

*killing a man who was trying to spread the ACTUAL truth, that we are all capable of attaining the same level of enlightenment that he exemplified, and that we are all going to get there -- or

*attacking others who want justice for victims and to have those responsible be held accountable.... -- or

*taking what someone has written and then twisting it, editing, deleting, changing, obscuring -- so that one can continue to remain in their comfortable delusions of self-righteousness ---

....and then being ridiculed, labelled, and cursed for pointing out and objecting to those evil, deceptive, and loveless acts: THAT is hell, and it is here right now, and has always been here.






One more edit to add:
If you see something wrong being done and do nothing to correct it, you are part of the problem. You are complicit in the act. To blindly defend an evil-doer is doing evil. Evil-doers must be -- and will be -- held accountable. In time.

reply to post by wildtimes


yes ..I agree Christians can be unloving at times..all humans can regardless of race or religion.

My point was made because you implied earlier that Christianity seemed to be so unloving and judgmental...which is why you left your church.

I can understand your feelings... BUT.. how many non Christians are just as unloving and judgmental?

That is why I said..that it is HUMANITY that is flawed...

..a humanity that Christ came to save with His sacrifice.

*taking what someone has written and then twisting it, editing, deleting, changing, obscuring -- so that one can continue to remain in their comfortable delusions of self-righteousness ---

Yes..I have been a victim of the above.. by people who say they are "loving"..

One more edit to add: If you see something wrong being done and do nothing to correct it, you are part of the problem. You are complicit in the act. To blindly defend an evil-doer is doing evil. Evil-doers must be -- and will be -- held accountable. In time.

Oh I have done what I can to correct things..and have paid the price for it at times.

I try not to judge others based on their education level..and avoid calling uneducated people "ignorant trash".

I do hope that all evil doers will pay the price.. even those who are deluded into thinking that what they do is not evil.

My hope is they suffer in purgatory..where they realize the extent of their wrong doings..in a very repentant state.. I wish hell on no one.

reply to post by gabby2011


gabby, you arrived here a little late; your earlier post was made on page 6 to an early post of mine on page 1.
If you have taken the time to read through the debate that has been taking place since page 1 you may get a different picture of me than you seem to have so stubbornly already settled on.

I want to forgive you, honestly. I even pray -- to my Universal Divinity -- for the strength and grace to do so. I don't think you have an actual concept of the hurt that is making that difficult for me. And I don't think you WANT to. Which is, sadly, typical of many so-called "Christians." And "non-believers" alike.

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by gabby2011

 

gabby, you arrived here a little late; your earlier post was made on page 6 to an early post of mine on page 1.
If you have taken the time to read through the debate that has been taking place since page 1 you may get a different picture of me than you seem to have so stubbornly already settled on.

I want to forgive you, honestly. I even pray -- to my Universal Divinity -- for the strength and grace to do so. I don't think you have an actual concept of the hurt that is making that difficult for me. And I don't think you WANT to. Which is, sadly, typical of many so-called "Christians." And "non-believers" alike.

You think you are the only one who hurts wildtimes?.. Do you think that I ever would have lashed out at you in other threads if it had not been in self defense to cruelty of others..and to myself?

It really doesn't matter what anybodys judgement of you is in the end. It will be God who judges your heart and actions..as He will mine.

I realize I am in need of the forgiveness of Christ ..as well as His grace every day. I also realize He knows the truth about me..while others are content to pass around rumors.

You say Christ did what he did by achieving simple mind control?

I will assume that all of the miracles that have been done in His name and through His grace..are all mind control as well?

Perhaps you would be interested in reading a bit about Saint Pio..a very gifted man of Christ..and someone no one could fool in the confessional.

The miracles and stories of this man.. are quite impressive..and the suffering he experienced with Christ is a testament to the POWER and truth of Christ and His salvation.

www.padrepio.catholicwebservices.com...

I wish you the best wildtimes... and pray for both of us.. that we may both see clearly..and understand fully the spirit of Christ.

reply to post by gabby2011

I try not to judge others based on their education level..and avoid calling uneducated people "ignorant trash".

You try not to? Ah, I remember -- you prefer calling people mean, evil, vile [snip]s, hypocrites, and tell them to stick their opinions of you up their [snip]s, and tell them you hope their karma hurts them for doing so. And you prefer twisting, misconstruing, judging, condemning others for using the term "ignorant trash" to describe someone who is both uneducated and poorly-brought-up.

"Ignorant trash"....a fairly common term....I did a google search for you. In .19 seconds, 10,500,000 instances of people using that term were found online. Can you please go stalk and harass them for a while? I grow quite weary of it.

And as per USUAL, you are

O F F T O P I C

and clouding up the thread.

with the same EMOTIONAL ABUSE that the church uses to control people.

Originally posted by gabby2011
.....

.... Christ did what he did by achieving simple mind control..

...

edit on 22-12-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)

Actually the thread is about child emotional abuse.......but yes christian brainwashing also happens (had hoped to leave that to another discussion)

Originally posted by wildtimes
a bit further down, there is this:

'It is true that Christ lived in India during most of the 18 unaccounted years of his life; studying with India's great masters. That doesn't take away from his divinity and uniqueness. It shows the unity and brotherhood of all great saints and avatars.' This was not unlike studying ways of martial arts in Shaolin temples. Was Jesus learning knowledge and truths that the masses were NOT ready for?

What happened to the records of Christ's lost years? Emperor Constantine called more than 300 bishops together in 325 A.D. This was the Council of Nicea. What to do with the holy records and the masses? Corrections, deletions, admissions and omissions were agreed upon. These savage, unholy men of the cloth butchered the Bible. It was here that Jesus Christ was elevated to become the 'only begotten Son of God.' This ideology became the Nicean Creed.

Emperor Constantine discovered that the historical Jesus conflicted with his new philosophy. In 389 A.D., the vast Library at Alexandria was burned. Manuscripts that might have contradicted Constantine's Nicean Creed were destroyed. Somewhere, the history of the teenage Jesus was deleted out of our education. Could it have been erased because it implied the great answers to life were learned in the East? Was reincarnation and eastern philosophy the ways of Truth that absolutely opposed the simple standards of Christianity? What other things were edited out? The Book of Enoch, for one. Ezekiel nearly got edited out for its blasphemy. And, gods became the singular GOD.

The early disciples of Jesus believed in REINCARNATION. Jews believed in it; Orthodox Jews still believe in it. Early writers recorded that they first heard of reincarnation from apostolic times. The teaching of reincarnation was not officially taken out of the Church's Christian doctrine until 553 A.D. This second Council of Constantinople eliminated all teachings of reincarnation and Biblical references. There are still hints or glimpses in the Bible of reincarnation....

edit on 22-12-2011 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)

Wouldn't it be easier to explain the similarity between the teaching of Jesus and Eastern religions by guessing that Eastern religious ideas might have spread into Alexandria already or that truth can be discovered independently? For example calculus was invented independently by two people. Also, Alexander the Great invaded parts of India and surely there was an exchange of ideas from that.

I haven't read the arguments for this theory of Jesus as a world traveller, but it seems far fetched to me. There is a tradition that St. Thomas went to India, and maybe this is the source of legends of Jew in India or whatever.

reply to post by cloudyday


The article (in the link from which the quote was taken) talks about St Thomas as well -- he was one who wanted proof that Jesus was actually resurrected. That's where we got the term "Doubting Thomas".

I think you might find it an interesting article. here's the link again: Teenage Jesus

Is there any evidence that disciples of Jesus lived in India? According to the Catholic Encyclopedia, St. Thomas evangelized the lands between the Caspian Sea and the Persian Gulf as well as further East to India. Called 'Doubting' Thomas, because he required physical proof of Jesus' resurrection, he was known to spread the Gospel in India. Records in Madras report that he entered India as a carpenter and died as a martyr. The tomb of the disciple is in India. A mountain was named for St. Thomas in India.

He lived AFTER Jesus.

Look at the Evil Emperor Constantine who made Christ God. Jesus was made the savior of all your sins. The truth is we do not NEED Jesus or the Church to save us! We do not need saving. We do need to learn eastern philosophy. We can be like Christ and meditate; be nonviolent; a person of peace; live good lives; recycle; learn; improve and eventually, when the total Spectrum of Life is over, then reach a oneness with this God-thing…and exist on a higher plane. We can all save ourselves. We build our own Karma and create our own fate. This writer is not saying Jesus is not God. This writer is saying WE ALL ARE GOD! We have the potential of being gods and eventually reaching a higher plane.

You ask if it would be "easier"... I don't think "easy" has much to do with finding the truth. It seems that many followers and believers in the Bible find it "easier" to simply believe that it is the Word of God, and not a piece of propaganda that has been carefully composed and edited and then "fed" to the masses as such.

We KNOW that the Bible is not in its original form. So how can people just "accept" it as the truth? This, to me, is taking the "easy" route.

truth can be discovered independently?

This I find is an absolute. The Truth CAN be discovered independently. That's why the fanatical Bible-followers seem to be taking the easy route by claiming that if someone doubts it, or questions it, they are doomed. In the case of the man Jesus Christ, there is evidence he went to India and studied there for 18 years. There are records of it that have been seen and corroborated by more than one seeker. He was called St Essa while he was there learning. He mastered the Buddhist tenets and the mystic powers. Then he went back home to teach it, and was killed for trying it.

Originally posted by vogon42

Originally posted by gabby2011
.....

.... Christ did what he did by achieving simple mind control..

...

edit on 22-12-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)

Actually the thread is about child emotional abuse.......but yes christian brainwashing also happens (had hoped to leave that to another discussion)

Vogon..why did you edit my comments to make it appear like i said Christ used simple mind control?

I did not say that.. ..does it make you feel good to misquote me?

Does that make you a "loving" non christian ?

What about those who will control their children into believing false stories?..and teach them to hate Christians?

Will you be a better parent for teaching your children to hate?

reply to post by gabby2011

What about those who will control their children into believing false stories?..

What about them? They are who vogon is referring to: the Christian churches who teach that the Bible is the truth.

reply to post by wildtimes


I'm just saying that Jesus might have been exposed to Yoga, Buddhism, Mithras, Isis, and other things simply by growing up in Egypt - especially if he grew up in Alexandria. Because I suspect there were merchants from India in Alexandria and merchants from Alexandria in Egypt - or at least there were merchants from Persia in both places. So Jesus didn't need to travel anywhere. Also he could have simply discovered things on his own.

reply to post by cloudyday


Yes, he may have smply become aware of them...but he was not born in Egypt. He traveled to there from where he was born, as a young teen, and stayed until he was almost 30, studying with them.
(at least that's what the author of that link says. I'm going to look further into it. I read the Tibetan Book of the Dead earlier this year, and found it to be awesome and revealing. I didn't know that Jesus learned those traditions until....today!)

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by gabby2011

 

What about those who will control their children into believing false stories?..

What about them? They are who vogon is referring to: the Christian churches who teach that the Bible is the truth.

we are of different opinions on what is the truth..

I believe that Christ is the way and the truth.. you do not.. and neither does vogon.

I respect that you make your choice..

but to say that Christians are child abusers because they care to teach their children about Christ....yet to teach your children to hate Christians is not?

In His time God will reveal .. until then I am grateful for the prayers and sacrifices of the faithful.. and offer prayers through the loving spirit of Christ for you..and all .

Matthew 7:13 "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it.

Matthew 7:15 "Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.

EKET, Nigeria — The nine-year-old boy lay on a bloodstained hospital sheet crawling with ants, staring blindly at the wall.

His family pastor had accused him of being a witch, and his father then tried to force acid down his throat as an exorcism. It spilled as he struggled, burning away his face and eyes. The emaciated boy barely had strength left to whisper the name of the church that had denounced him – Mount Zion Lighthouse.

A month later, he died.

Nwanaokwo Edet was one of an increasing number of children in Africa accused of witchcraft by pastors and then tortured or killed, often by family members. Pastors were involved in half of 200 cases of "witch children" reviewed by the AP, and 13 churches were named in the case files.

Some of the churches involved are renegade local branches of international franchises. Their parishioners take literally the Biblical exhortation, "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live."

"It is an outrage what they are allowing to take place in the name of Christianity," said Gary Foxcroft, head of nonprofit Stepping Stones Nigeria.

Here's a story about emotional AND physical abuse by Christians against CHILDREN.

The idea of witchcraft is hardly new, but it has taken on new life recently partly because of a rapid growth in evangelical Christianity. Campaigners against the practice say around 15,000 children have been accused in two of Nigeria's 36 states over the past decade and around 1,000 have been murdered. In the past month alone, three Nigerian children accused of witchcraft were killed and another three were set on fire.

African Children Denounced As "Witches" By Christian Pastors

Originally posted by wildtimes

EKET, Nigeria — The nine-year-old boy lay on a bloodstained hospital sheet crawling with ants, staring blindly at the wall.

His family pastor had accused him of being a witch, and his father then tried to force acid down his throat as an exorcism. It spilled as he struggled, burning away his face and eyes. The emaciated boy barely had strength left to whisper the name of the church that had denounced him – Mount Zion Lighthouse.

A month later, he died.

Nwanaokwo Edet was one of an increasing number of children in Africa accused of witchcraft by pastors and then tortured or killed, often by family members. Pastors were involved in half of 200 cases of "witch children" reviewed by the AP, and 13 churches were named in the case files.

Some of the churches involved are renegade local branches of international franchises. Their parishioners take literally the Biblical exhortation, "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live."

"It is an outrage what they are allowing to take place in the name of Christianity," said Gary Foxcroft, head of nonprofit Stepping Stones Nigeria.

Here's a story about emotional AND physical abuse by Christians against CHILDREN.

The idea of witchcraft is hardly new, but it has taken on new life recently partly because of a rapid growth in evangelical Christianity. Campaigners against the practice say around 15,000 children have been accused in two of Nigeria's 36 states over the past decade and around 1,000 have been murdered. In the past month alone, three Nigerian children accused of witchcraft were killed and another three were set on fire.

African Children Denounced As "Witches" By Christian Pastors

yes..there are many who profess to do things in the name of Jesus..but they are not of the spirit of Christ..

That is like saying all police are terrible criminals ..because of the actions of some of them.

Its like saying all coaches are child molesters because of the actions of a few.

Do we judge all child welfare workers by the actions of a few? I would hope not.

So because there is some strange spiritual practices in Africa.. and not only in Christianity I might add.. we should come to the conclusion that all Christians are spiritually unbalanced and cruel?

reply to post by gabby2011

but to say that Christians are child abusers because they care to teach their children about Christ....yet to teach your children to hate Christians is not?

What are you talking about?
I taught my children to hate NO ONE. And I chose not to subject them to the shame and relentless allegations of worthlessness and perpetual sin that were part and parcel of the denomination in which I was brought up.

Where do you get these enormous leaps from? Months ago I referred to a total stranger whose baby vanished on her watch as having the appearance of "ignorant trash." You have never let me forget that, and hounded me in the name of your "faith" and then you attacked ME with rabid viciousness that FAR, FAR surpassed the knee-jerk assessment I made about an irresponsible mother whose behavior indicates she didn't really do a good job. In fact, I think you would crucify ME for saying that one thing about her at the very beginning when her baby disappeared...if you could get away with it.

How, gabby, did my description of that person -- whom I've never met and hope to never meet -- and with whom I was disgusted because of the circumstances surrounding her own daughter's questionable disappearance -- entitle YOU to attack ME with your hateful and decidedly un-Christian wrath? To ME, DIRECTLY? Did I write the two words on her house? Call her up and say it in her ear? Send her a private message of my opinion? No, I did not.

Now, look at what you did to ME in "support" of her. If the worst thing I ever did was say someone looked like ignorant trash, it was nowhere NEAR your incessant attacks on people who happen to find that total stranger suspect and lacking. You attacked everything from educational attainment to professional integrity, and even twisted the words and accused me and others of being evil and probably even in on the child's disappearance!! How cruel is that?

That is your Christian heart?

We have established on this thread that SOME Christian denominations use Biblical rhetoric to instill FEAR, SHAME, and ETERNAL DAMNATION as a way to control people. These lessons, while being perhaps understood by some adults as symbolic, are often quite traumatic for children. They also have the result of turning out adults who even now are pouring acid down children's throats.

That is love and kindness?

To browbeat someone who is upset by an adult's atrocious parenting, and who says so on a discussion board, and to even slander them, and allege they are unfit professionals, or accomplices to evil secret societies? That is Christian?

reply to post by gabby2011

we should come to the conclusion that all Christians are spiritually unbalanced and cruel?

Who said we should conclude that? No one said we should come to that conclusion.
We were discussing the various METHODS of Christianity being preached, and which of those METHODS were traumatic to impressionable kids!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by berenike
Sunrise today at Stonehenge:

edit on 22-12-2011 by berenike because: (no reason given)

This morning, at dawn...the gentles who visited Stonehenge; an ancient place of worship and mystery.

Originally posted by gabby2011

... teach your children to hate Christians is not?

I am not teaching anyone to hate christians, not sure where you pulled that from.

What I do hate is child abusers....I dont care if your christian, Buddhist, or Jedi.....if you abuse children I have a problem with that.

reply to post by wildtimes

Where do you get these enormous leaps from? Months ago I referred to a total stranger whose baby vanished on her watch as having the appearance of "ignorant trash." You have never let me forget that, and hounded me in the name of your "faith" and then you attacked ME with rabid viciousness that FAR, FAR surpassed the knee-jerk assessment I made about an irresponsible mother whose behavior indicates she didn't really do a good job. In fact, I think you would crucify ME for saying that one thing about her at the very beginning when her baby disappeared...if you could get away with it.

I would never want to crucify you for anything wildtimes..that is your perception .

Have you not judged me wildtimes?.. have you not made many cruel insinuations about me on that thread?.. yes.. so lets leave it at that..

To browbeat someone who is upset by an adult's atrocious parenting, and who says so on a discussion board, and to even slander them, and allege they are unfit professionals, or accomplices to evil secret societies? That is Christian?

Atrocious? She was not being a good parent by drinking while children were in her care.. but how many have done this ?..are they all atrocious?

I have already stated my actions and words are not always in the Christian spirit wildtimes.. and that is why I am in need of the grace of god everyday. I hurt.. and I lash out ..sometimes for others..and sometimes for myself. I know I fall short of Gods loving ways often...because I am human..and prone to sin.

But lets not derail this thread any longer with personal issues between us.. feel free to u2u me with your concerns.

I agree many atrocities have been done in the name of Christianity.. but many have been done in the name of voodoo religions... as well as others.

How much child abuse has happened under the satanic religions.. and the "enightened' Luciferian religions ?

Were the people who experimented with mind control programs and implemented them real TRUE Christians? I think not.

My only wish for you wildtimes.. is the same for me.. that we both fully understand the love and sacrifice of Christ...and trust me when I say I would do my best to stop anyone from literally crucifying you.