Arrogant Americans!

The netherlands is a fine country, and I am thankfull I was born here.
Some things are wrong over here, and other things are right, just like in most other places.

For me it has absolutely nothing to do with pride.

I'm also from the Netherlands and proud of it. I think we get a biased view of america by the views we get served by the socalled 'networks' CNN and FOX
There you only can see the media horny americans how want to get there 5 minutes of fame. If you watch an election meeting here in holland, its the same BS......

Hey, it's bad but not that bad.
We don't have those banners.

Originally posted by Jakko
The netherlands is a fine country, and I am thankfull I was born here.
Some things are wrong over here, and other things are right, just like in most other places.

For me it has absolutely nothing to do with pride.

AHHHH!!!! So then by your own standards as admitted here, you are an "Arrogant Dutchman"!!!!


Hypocrisy rears its ugly head again.....

Jakko you seem to have self esteem issues.
I am proud to be an American. I am proud of the sacrifices Americans made in WW1 and WW2. I am proud that it was Americans who landed the first man on the moon. That it was Americans who built the panama canal. I am proud that Americans built the hoover dam. I am proud of my Nation and my countrymen because of the things that we as a nation have accomplished. Just as I am sure you are proud of what your grandfather did in WW2. Does your pride in your grandfathers accomplishments mean that my pride in my own grandfathers service is lessened?
My pride in my nation has NOTHING to do with your nation. My pride in my nation is NOT about comparing my nation to yours it is about what we have done. Does the fact that holland recently opened a revolutionary new dam take anything away from the accomplishment of building the hoover dam?
The fact is my pride in America has nothng to do with, is not in reference to, or in comparison to, any other nation on earth.
What don't you get?
When I or another American says that we are "proud to be Amercans" we are not thinking of any other nation. Why do you seem unable to grasp ths most basic point?

The fact is jakko I would bet good money that not a single one of the delegates you mentioned was even thinkng about any other nation than America when they were waving those banners. So how is it an insult to anyone else?

If I say that I am proud that America has the worlds strongest economy is that arrogance or a statement of fact?

If a chinese citizen says he is proud of china building the worlds biggest dam is that arrogance?

Pride in oneself or one country has NOTHING to do with others. Its not about saying we are better. Its about saying this is who we are and we are proud of who we are. It comes from within, not comparisons to that which is without.

Originally posted by mwm1331
The fact is jakko I would bet good money that not a single one of the delegates you mentioned was even thinkng about any other nation than America when they were waving those banners. So how is it an insult to anyone else?

It's not, but it's stupid in my opinion.
All these people sitting there with their huge "NATION OF COURAGE" banners, smiling at eachother.
It's hilariously stupid.

Maybe it was the way I was raised, I dunno anymore.

"The netherlands is a fine country, and I am thankfull I was born here.
Some things are wrong over here, and other things are right, just like in most other places.

For me it has absolutely nothing to do with pride. "



Pride means a sense of one's own proper dignity or value; self-respect
....do you not have any of this about your country? how very saddening that you truely think that you have been born into a country that you cannot be proud of... if you choose to do nothing about it then thats your problem... don't slate others for having pride in the country to which they were born or live... I detect that you are not happy with your own life and see the pride shown in others as a threat... if not then I apologise for the last statement but this is the impression you give of to American, European and readers of this thread from other global locations... would reckommend you read your comments before you post them..

"If you speak before you think the other guy gets his joke in first."

Hey Jakko:


LOL.

Is this really going anywhere? The Americans that think ALL Europeans are arrogant. The Europeans that think ALL Americans are patriotic zealots.

These are the truly ignorant. Yes, you'll find some arrogant Europeans, but also some truly great people. Same with the U.S.

What this boils down to is basically Jakko doesn't like the gung-ho patriotic types. That's fine, everybody is entitled to their opions. Personally, I just snicker when I see 'em and that's about it.

Originally posted by DiabolusFireDragon
What this boils down to is basically Jakko doesn't like the gung-ho patriotic types. That's fine, everybody is entitled to their opions. Personally, I just snicker when I see 'em and that's about it.

Thats my opinion too. I like my country. I like America (especialy your serie's like A-team and Knightrider, those are the Bomb), but everywhere there are loony people.....

Great!
Well let's just say I learned a lot today.
Thanks for replying all!

Love, peace and understanding to you all.

PS: Nice burger there diabolus, I really want to go to the USA some day, they just don't make burgers like that in Europe.


[edit on 31-8-2004 by Jakko]

Originally posted by Jakko
Wow, it seems as if some people feel insulted. Probably the hamburgers right?

It's not that I am not proud of my country, if I would look at it like you look at it I guess I could be proud about the huge dutch resistance in the WWII, something that was not the case in other countries.
Or maybe I could be proud about our very social system and tolerant climate.

But the thing is, why should I be proud about something I did not do/choose/achieve?
I mean I can either like it that I am living in a country like this, or I can dislike it. But if I like it, why should I be proud about it?

Waving around your "OH WE ARE SUCH COURAGEOUS NATION" banner is one step further even, why on earth would someone (even if that someone is very courageous) do such a thing?

Are we Europeans maybe too polite?

Obviously not TOO polite, eh?

Originally posted by Jakko

Originally posted by mwm1331
The fact is jakko I would bet good money that not a single one of the delegates you mentioned was even thinkng about any other nation than America when they were waving those banners. So how is it an insult to anyone else?

It's not, but it's stupid in my opinion.
All these people sitting there with their huge "NATION OF COURAGE" banners, smiling at eachother.
It's hilariously stupid.

Maybe it was the way I was raised, I dunno anymore.

Jakko just because you don't understand something, or feel it is stupid doesn't make it so. Personally I don't understand your lack of pride in your nation, and your heritage. I think that maybe you need to examne yourself and determine why you seem to be threatened by the pride of others. I am not threatened by the pride of the poster who was proud of the netherlands. I am not threatened by the pride of the germans or the french. Why should you be threatened by the pride of Americans?

As for whether its stupid have you ever considered that one of the root causes of friction between Europe and America is the sense of superiorty that many Europeans display?

Comments like "you woud never see that in holland"
Or " our sytem is so much better"
or "europeans are so much more humble and socially advanced than those loud brutsh Americans"

In fairness only the first comment was posted by jakko, but I have heard many on these boards post similar sentiments as the other two and I ask you who is more arrogant, Those who are proud of thier nation and it accomplishments, or those who beleve that they are better than others because they are more "socially advanced"

Nice debate Jakko! Enjoy more of it chief

INCREASE THE PEACE AND SILENCE THE VIOLENCE!

Fnord!

(or should that be Fjord.... hehehe)

I'l be onboard...

Signing off.

PS. I'm proud to be an ATS'er

Well Jakko,

IMO, I don't think that the "Nation of Courage" was intended for anyone but those voters who are undecided. Although, how people can be in two minds about what to do, is beyond me.

Most of the sheeple that go to these gatherings are there to make up the numbers so it looks good for the cameras, "Unified we stand" and all that BS. Staged and clicheic (sp?). The speaker says what the audience wants to hear and gets a standing ovation....yawn..!!

Amazingly sad as it is, the UK is starting to do similar things.
People are so used to basing their decisions on sensationalistic news coverage alot of the time they don't even know what the story is about.

I believe most western countries are guilty of what you're trying to accuse the US of and begrudgingly agree with alot of what has been said against your argument.

One point which doesn't seem to have been covered regarding the "Nation of Courage" statement, is that it could quite easily be held by either Republican or Democrat, or are they actually saying that the US is only courageous with a Reublican Leader..??

Doh..!! Where did everybody go...??

[edit on 31-8-2004 by Koka]

bush LOST the election- he had less total votes than al gore.

he was not ELECTED... he was SELECTED (by the courts).

not all of us americans support, agree with, nor have ONE OUNCE OF RESPECT for this man.

Why is it that I hear this all the time? The American public has no control over what it's government does....hell, we can't even vote in those we really want.....our last election was stolen!

Originally posted by redalert
bush LOST the election- he had less total votes than al gore.

he was not ELECTED... he was SELECTED (by the courts).

not all of us americans support, agree with, nor have ONE OUNCE OF RESPECT for this man.

Yes, but we shouldn't be blind to the fact that the country was virtually split in half. Virtually just as many people wanted Bush in there as people who didn't. It's not like Bush lost the popular vote by a landslide.

I won't be voting for either of those big business whores, but I know that one of them will win. All I can hope for in this election is that it will be a very decisive win. No more recount, dangling chad, 50/50 BS. I would like to see a clear cut winner that the rest of the country can have no doubt is the winner. It will be easier to rally behind a president (even if you didn't vote for him) when you don't have to worry about whether he should really be in office.


[edit on 31-8-2004 by mpeake]

Originally posted by redalert
bush LOST the election- he had less total votes than al gore.

he was not ELECTED... he was SELECTED (by the courts).

not all of us americans support, agree with, nor have ONE OUNCE OF RESPECT for this man.

Besides being a TOTALLY off topic post, you are wrong. Do a little research before you make stupid statements like this. President Bush had more electoral votes, which is the way the President is elected in this country. When you finally enter the sixth grade, you will have classes in Civics which will teach you about our system of government.

Gore lost, get over it....


Geeze, how many of these little children does one have to put up with in one day....

Originally posted by Affirmative Reaction
Geeze, how many of these little children does one have to put up with in one day....

Hay there, I'm not complaining about having to argue with apes like yourself okay?
Keep your shirt on.