We, ATS Members, Must Focus On Politics

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


"Deny Ignorance" ...The unforgivable sin. The SIN OF STUPIDITY. Stupidity is a negative attitude towards LIFE.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Skeptic:

I agree with every thought you so elegantly posted in the OP. Politics most definitely ARE the centre of most, if not, all topics on this site, and those who miss this point, need to re-evaluate why it is they come to this site for answers.

Great thread, I really hope it opens the eyes of those who would embrace ignorance.

S+F (I'd flag and star it again, if I could!)

Thank you, SO, and all staff, for your pursuit!

Jephers0n

Well this is going well ...

Eek, you know folks, at the risk of being sycophantanstic, you might want to to consider that all SO and staff are doing is trying to reclaim ATS from those who use it as a dumping ground for their masters' talking points, and encourage us to do that with some intelligence, awareness, and decorum. That's it really, nothing more nothing less. You don't have to do it if you don't want to, it's a suggestion not an order.

We keep bitching about every single post he makes he's going to say "the hell with these ingrates" and sell the board to EMPIRE.

Just saying ...

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


I agree 200%, and this problem is not just in the USA, it's the whole world.
Let them know why we are rejecting them!

I am only going to say this once...


If you can't or won't (because it disavows your desire to throw distracting partisan crap around) see the reality of this "Call to Sanity and Critical Thought", then ATS is most likely not for you.

I can't believe some of the posts I've read in this thread.

We are putting every single political hack who pollutes our site on notice:

The parroting of the party line without substantive ISSUE oriented dialog and the childish name calling won't fly on ATS anymore.

Springer...

One of the reasons our political discussions get so polarized into hostile camps that are more interested in annihilating each other than they are at arriving at any new insights, or dare I say truths, is that our media has likewise become so polarized.

We read and listen mainly or only to those sources that most agree with out own biases. We tend to ignore, discount or deliberately avoid those sources that do not. To us, they are clearly partisan, while we ourselves generally think of ourselves as objective and discerning.

Once upon a time our media made sincere attempts to present the news "objectively." That was their goal, anyway. I'm persuaded that pure objectivity doesn't actually exist; almost all people have conscious or unconscious preconceptions and biases that color their view of the world. We are all partisan in one way or another.

I think, though, that the journalistic attempt to present the facts, unvarnished by personal biases or hopes or distortions, was a more noble goal than the ones we have today.

Almost every media source today blatantly appeals to a particular audience. We have Fox News vs. MSNBC. We have Rupert Murdoch vs. anybody who disagrees with him and/or challenges his empire. We have the New York Times vs. the New York Post, ad infinitum.

It's all a matter of money and power.

The complete inability of the two major parties in Washington to come together or agree to accomplish any goals whatsoever is a reflection of the state of our country, and vice versa.

This is also reflected in the rising generation. I am often asked to teach a course in argument and one of my chief frustrations is in trying to impart the rules and goals of debate. Many of my students are only interested in tearing their opponent to shreds personally, not in learning classical rhetoric, which seems irrelevant to them.

They have learned well from their elders and their society.

If all of this shows up at ATS, it's not surprising. Even the best debates on the internet are going to be infused with this national, and possibly also international, type of mud fights.

Even on ATS, a contributor is usually called a troll by those who don't agree with him or her and a valiant defender of truth by those who do.

Discussions like those in this thread will hopefully make us all more reflective and better debaters.

It's going to take practice, though.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
Deny Ignorance.

This motto has life. It has purpose. It demands ATS members to think.

It is a state of mind.

It is a sense of purpose.

ATS politically motivated members will think for themselves the day after biased news sources are no more.. And especially when political news entertainers and personalities have lost the ability to fill their heads for them.

You want to deny ignorance here for real?

Deny, ban or prohibit the use of text sound and video clips from biased cable news outlets on any political subjects... And especially from people like Glenn Beck, Hannity, Rush, Olberman and a long list of others... You know who they are.... Most of you have them embedded deeply into your thought process.

When members stop copying and pasting crap, or re-regurgitating crap maybe ATS can rise above that crap.



[edit on 2-3-2010 by Walkswithfish]

reply to post by Walkswithfish

Deny, ban or prohibit the use of text sound and video clips from biased cable news outlets on any political subjects... And expecially from people like Glenn Beck, Hannity, Rush, Olberman and a long list of others... You know who they are.... Most of you have them embedded deeply into your thought process.

I like that idea. Unfortunately, I was one of those who posted countless Glen Beck threads right after he went to Fox News. Yes...i shamefully admit it.

Now I can't stand him...nor any other talking head. People don't realize how much these people influence their opinions.

reply to post by David9176


Hey David, why don't you stop into one of ExPostFacto threads and give your opinion there.

Here is the thread, I would like to see your input. Kind of gives his side of what he was doing.

What you need to know about Sen. Bunning

Alright, I wasn't going to post a reply, to tell you the truth I figured the thread spoke for itself.

However, I do feel the need as a member to address some of idiocy I have seen in the replies for this thread.

To those who have the Arrogance and the perverbial Balls to think that this thread along with other seen this week, have come from something they personality authored and then decided NOT to post of out their own will...

Well, I speak for all of us when I say this: HA HA HA.

I'm relatively certain that SO along with the staff and membership as a whole realize that we have our own thoughts, our own ability to think critically and have no need to "plagerize" the work of fellow members to get a point accross.

Secondly,

This is a business, the point of any business is to make money. The beautiful thing about this place is that it provides a forum for truth and ideologies not widely accepted in society that should be.

This is a GREAT way of making money, and I personnaly consider the staff along with SO and Springer philanthropists, and if that makes me a brown noser than so be it.

Actually I consider every contributing member a philantropist as you help spread awareness and the truth everyday. Now I'm not saying we are perfect or that this website runs as we all would like, but hey, it's better anything else on the internet.

I dare anybody who complains to find a better venue. I will eat my foot.

On Topic:

The political battles raging accross the world right now and the most important things we can focus on in contemporary society. Politics is our way forward. A succesfull change of the system, or a return to the original system with it's original rules, can get any country and our world back on track.

We use this as an outlet to discuss, debate and research our idelogies and the various stories that come up throughout the day.

George Bush said it best.

When we argue amongst ourselves, the terrorists win.

Good job SO, thanks for continually bringing the conversations that matter to US the members, to the forefront of ATS.

Let's all do our ATS civic duty and continue to ignore the trolls and morons who just poo fling and complain for being slapped when they act like children.

You all know who you are.

~Keeper

Deny Ignorance.

Nothing any more simple than that.

Stop leaning to the left...

Stop leaning to the right...

Stop hacking at each other...

Stop being divided by partisan politics...

STOP, being a PART of the PROBLEM, and become PART of the SOLUTION.

I support neither side of the political aisle, I support America, as a whole.

Registered as an Independent, watching the fools on both sides, divided by party politics.

Stop being a puppet dancing on a string, Pinocchio, and become a real boy or girl.

Sandie Shaw - Puppet On A String (1967)


Think for yourself, not your political party, speak on policy, foreign and domestic.

Otherwise, you are the problem with your country, and you're letting the terrorist's win.

Do not become complacent, compliant, and complicit, become a free-thinker.

Some of the responses in this thread are downright shocking, especially coming from a place like ATS. It makes me feel like we are losing the battle overall, that the government's propaganda is working faster than our attempt at spreading the truth. Time is definitely not on our side, because as more time goes by more people seem to forget the truth about things and succumb to the propaganda and lies of the government and mainstream media. I seriously can't believe everyone is buying into the 2-party crap so much. I even have a friend who thinks we need to elect Mitt Romney of all people in the next election... it's just crazy to hear that. I bet he also thinks things would be somehow different right now had we elected John McCain last time around. This is real simple stuff in the conspiracy world... I thought it was common knowledge that they throw 2 puppets in our faces every 4 years who are basically on the same "team." The perfect example was John Kerry and George Bush, but I am afraid that most people around here now don't even know what I'm talking about.

Originally posted by David9176
...nor any other talking head. People don't realize how much these people influence their opinions.

They tell you things you already know, they say things many want to hear mixed with sensationalized material, paranoia, fear-mongering, distortions, lies and all of the needed elements to build an audience. At the end of the day they are selling themselves and products they endorse to an ignorant and desperate public.. Capitalism at its finest, entertainment at its worst. Exploitation of people's anger, frustrations with government, fears and paranoia are highly profitable in these times.

They are the pimps and the whores.

Beck is on fox LIVE now, don't miss it.





[edit on 2-3-2010 by Walkswithfish]

reply to post by Walkswithfish


Everyone has to admit though, we cannot find out everything here on the web.

Of course I watch Beck, I also watch CNN MSNBC etc etc.

They do provide info. People just need to back it up with proof.

Damn, Beck's on? Oh, I do not watch it on TV, it gets posted right after the show on YouTube.

Earlier in the thread I saw someone commenting about how the 2-party paradigm is not "false" and that there are ideological differences between the two parties.

Can someone please tell me, as far as the big picture goes, what exactly has "changed" throughout all of these "different" administrations that we have had? And I don't mean tiny miniscule things like a 2% change on a certain tax or anything like that, I'm talking about the big things that matter the most. Let's look at the military industrial complex for example, what has "changed" in that regard over the last few decades? Our foreign policy remains exactly the same regardless of which "party" is in office. We have had both Republicans and Democrats in office all this time, so according to some of you there should have been drastic differences. I don't see anything changing at all... doesn't matter if a Republican is in office or if a Democrat is in office, the SAME B.S. IS STILL HAPPENING!

One more thing and then I'll leave this thread alone: Not only is the 2-party paradigm a distraction, but even most of the non-partisan issues they have you all arguing about are nothing but distractions. They give you something to fight about such as whether or not the Federal Reserve should be audited, so you all go on arguing back and forth about that, when in reality you all should be educated enough by now to realize that the FEDERAL RESERVE SHOULD NOT EVEN EXIST IN THE FIRST PLACE! Yet, here we all are arguing with each other about trivial policies regarding the FED. People are busy arguing about "how many troops" we should be sending to Afghanistan, when in reality WE SHOULDN'T BE SENDING ANY TROOPS TO AFGHANISTAN. C'mon people, stop being so easily distracted by the issues thrown in your face by the corrupt mainstream media and think for yourselves!!

Originally posted by SpectreDC
I like how all you can do is offer joke responses and banter instead of an actual argument.

There was no joke meant in any of my responses. In several cases I re-worded what was previously stated because I thought it still answered your questions.

There is also no joke when I stated that it is easy to post complaints, but harder to actually try and do something. As for me, I've actually done more than post complaints about the status quo here. I've actually gotten involved in local government and local affairs - working within the system so many just complain about - because that's where I can actually make a difference. True, it costs me more time and energy to attend meetings, etc. than it does to just type responses here, but I still do it - because it accomplishes more than just complaining and I don't feel "helpless" as it sounds like so many here do.

I know it goes against the grain of what many have been taught for so long, but I suggest that people stop setting themselves up as (political) victims and try going out and involving yourselves in the process to change the process.

[edit on 3/2/2010 by centurion1211]

Originally posted by centurion1211
Does anyone truly believe that the answer to political passion is to simply pretend it doesn't exist.

Oh... it exists alright, there can be no doubt.

However, conspiracy-minded people (on which ATS is built) tend to apply some critical thought to the scenario, tosses in some historical perspective, and comes to the conclusion that the "passions" of the people are being manipulated.

For example: why must this "passion" be manifest in knee-jerk parroting of the insults and derogatory slang handed down from loud-mouthed firebrands? The vast majority of "political debate" among the populace is nothing of the sort, it's one group of simmering haters reflexively jabbering about how they despise the other group.

If you're impulsively calling liberals communists or conservatives fascists (for example), you've fallen prey to the conditioning.

reply to post by Springer


What you fail to grasp is that no matter how many threads are stared on this topic the people that choose to deal with the issues more then partisan bricking will do so and those that choose not to wont do so . In terms of partisan mud slinging the worst offenders are the ones who will not do enough to get banned but still do enough to disrupt threads .

Cheers xpert11 .

Wonder what it would take to get the war ended. That's political. Someone should make it a thread. Someone should make it a thread every week until it happens. We want what is good for our country. This war is bad on several fronts and not good on any. I know we are not supposed to advocate anything on ATS, but this needs advocating before it's too late.

reply to post by EMPIRE


We are here. I.e., they have not won.

WE are the mainstream now. We form an intelligent body here. Using what works in other countries can help each. Keeping the basic human rights in mind can approach something better.

We can throw ideas out there until a cohesive policy is formed. We can raise one of our own number to grassroots positions or higher with the force of our numbers and the influence we have in daily life. We can find out what helps mankind and do it. Microloans have changed the world for some people, for example. Some of us do it frequently and it does work!

It can happen. Do not even begin to admit defeat. We are here. That is my proof.

SkepticOverlord is trying to promote our growth in this direction, I think. And it is good.