War in Georgia, page 11

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 06:34 PM

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I disagree it would already be in Russian hands. They would have invaded our nation, I don't think killing a few more Russian soldiers and damaging "Russia's" infrastructure would have me deposed. I would continue to fight there until we clearly lose the confrontation or we win, then I would attack from afar and prolong the war for South Osetia

gnothiseauton

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 06:38 PM

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reply to post by unbelievable

How can people possibly blame Georgia for this "war." South Osetia was in fact part of Georgia. Thus, they can send troops in there.

The northern part of Cyprus is officially part of the Republic of Cyprus but the Cyprus government doesn't have any soldiers there, instead Turkey does. Cyprus is in a very similar situation, its too small to fight Turkey, just like Georgia is too weak to fight Russia, but in Cyprus they try with politics not with army and hopefully we will see an ethnic conflict finally get resolved peacefully.

These fights need politics not war, unfortunately Saakashvili blew it

maloy

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 06:39 PM

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Originally posted by unbelievable
I disagree it would already be in Russian hands. They would have invaded our nation, I don't think killing a few more Russian soldiers and damaging "Russia's" infrastructure would have me deposed. I would continue to fight there until we clearly lose the confrontation or we win, then I would attack from afar and prolong the war for South Osetia

Stick to the military forums. You obviously do not know what this conflict is about, and I bet you only found out today that there is a country called Georgia.

Read about Georgia's post-USSR history and about previous president Shevarnadze, before pretending that you are president of Georgia.

GaidenX15

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 06:47 PM

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America dosen't care about small countries.

I3LiP

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 06:50 PM

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Originally posted by GaidenX15
America dosen't care about small countries.

It cares about small countries that have its precious OIL running through it though.

unbelievable

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 06:51 PM

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well I do know what the conflict is about and I have heard of Georgia. Even though I am American, I still follow international news and politics. And I stand by Georgia's decision to assert its sovereignty, regardless of what country is interfering. Georgia has the right to attack radicals in South Osetia, and Russia does not have the right to invade what is considered Georgia's territory.

gnothiseauton

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 06:56 PM

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reply to post by unbelievable

well I do know what the conflict is about and I have heard of Georgia. Even though I am American, I still follow international news and politics. And I stand by Georgia's decision to assert its sovereignty, regardless of what country is interfering. Georgia has the right to attack radicals in South Osetia, and Russia does not have the right to invade what is considered Georgia's territory.

Then as an American who respects another nation's sovereignty how did you feel when Clinton took over in Kosovo under EXACTLY the same circumstances? Also Russia is protecting ethnic Russians, America had what reason for that?

How did you feel when your country "interfered" in Iraq?

You really need to step back and see the situation from a third-person perspective and it looks like Armerica has 2 "rule books" when it comes to other nations sovereignty. One "book" applies to them and another for the rest of the world...

maloy

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:04 PM

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Originally posted by unbelievable
well I do know what the conflict is about and I have heard of Georgia. Even though I am American, I still follow international news and politics. And I stand by Georgia's decision to assert its sovereignty, regardless of what country is interfering. Georgia has the right to attack radicals in South Osetia, and Russia does not have the right to invade what is considered Georgia's territory.

Georgia attacking Russian peacekeepers is suicidal for the small country with an already unstable government and economy. Saakashvilli just set Georgia back 20 years in the negotiations progress.

This is like Cuba attacking the U.S. to assert Guantanamo Bay as part of its territory. Brave? Yes. Utterly retarded, suicidal, and useless? Most certainly.

But for Saakashvilli there isn't even bravery involved. You can't call an armchair commander like Saaka brave. He put thousands of Georgian troops in danger to fullfill his personal moronic ambitions.

[edit on 8-8-2008 by maloy]

The Undertaker

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:07 PM

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reply to post by maloy[/...

Admitedly I haven't read this entire thread but you seem pretty well informed on this conflict so I have a question. Georgia has asked the U.S. to help transport Georgian troops from Iraq to Georgia to join in the fight. This seems like the perfect opportunity for Russia to take out a good number of troops in route. What would be the ramifications of this? Prelude to the mother of all wars? On the other hand, these transport flights would undoubtedly have an escort flight but couldn't this be the false flag the PTB have been looking for to really get the old war ball rolling?

Thanks in advance
The Undertaker

Anonymous ATS

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:12 PM
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reply to post by Spooky Fox Mulder

NO MORE WAR?CONSIDERING THAT US HUMANS ARE THE ONLY SPECIES ON THIS PLANET THAT HAVE SPENT AS MUCH TIME & THE RESOURCES AVAILABLE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO DESTROY OURSELVES? AS PLATO SAID:"ONLY THE DEAD HAVE SEEN THE END OF WAR." I FEAR THIS IS AN ACURATE ASSESSMENT. AND ALTHOUGH THE ROMPIN,STOMPIN RED ARMY IS A THING OF THE PAST,RUSSIAN LEADERSHIP HAS NOT EVOLVED VERY FAR FROM THE DAYS OF THE SOVIET MINDSET. WITHOUT RESTRAINT FROM MOSCOW THIS COULD BECOME VERY UGLY.HOW DOES A DRIVE TO THE GEORGIAN CAPITOL SOUND?LETS HOPE NOT.

maloy

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:18 PM
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Originally posted by The Undertaker
Admitedly I haven't read this entire thread but you seem pretty well informed on this conflict so I have a question. Georgia has asked the U.S. to help transport Georgian troops from Iraq to Georgia to join in the fight.

In actuality the 1,000 troops to be transported (half of the entire 2,000 person Georgian contingent in Iraq) won't make any difference in the S. Ossetia conflict. Georgia already has an army of about 40,000. That is unless Georgia plans to make this a prolonged war.

Originally posted by The Undertaker
This seems like the perfect opportunity for Russia to take out a good number of troops in route.

That would not be easy to do. I am sure the transport will be secret mission and it will not be easy for Russia to intercept, assuming they would even want to. Tbilisi airport still has all the scheduled civilian flights coming in and out, except for one to and from Russia. it would be difficult to tell the flight apart. Plus U.S. might be providing air cover. Georgia is within range of U.S. fighters stationed in Iraq and maybe even the Gulf.

An interesting note aside - during Abkhazian war in the 90's, the pro-Russian rebels shot down several Georgian transport airplanes with military personel. Of course that was in Abkhazia's airport (Sukhumi I believe), and not in Tbilisi.

Originally posted by The Undertaker
What would be the ramifications of this? Prelude to the mother of all wars?

Assuming its U.S. aircraft and aircrews, it would be pretty bad. But I think the ramifications would mostly be political. Again this is an extremely unlikely event, as Russia is not interested right now in destroying all of Georgia's military. The 1,000 Georgian troops mean nothing to Russia.

Do not bet on these transports being intercepted.

[edit on 8-8-2008 by maloy]

unbelievable

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:24 PM
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There is a difference between this and the USA's relations with Iraq and Kosovo. In regards to Kosovo, Kosovo was regarded as a separate entity by many major powers in the world. Even though this is not the majority of people in the world, enough superpowers were involved in supporting their independence to warrant the USA's interference because it was debatedly a sovereign nation. Furthermore, the USA thought that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction that could be possibly be used against the USA and our allies, so we acted to invade and rebuild freedom and get rid of oppression. Georgia did not have a threat of weapons of mass destruction, and this province was offically under Georgia control. It was known throughout the world as Georgian territory. Thus, Georgia's offensive was in its own territory, and Russia's invasion was coming into a nation that is not debatable among the superpowers of the world

Gando702

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:24 PM
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This has the potential to be bad. But that's said about every thread on this board, so it will either fade away, or will drag on forever to the point of no one caring anymore.

Bush isn't going to do anything until the Olympics are over. He doesn't wanna miss out on USA RedeemTeam Basketball.

[edit on 8-8-2008 by Gando702]

gnothiseauton

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:31 PM
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reply to post by unbelievable

Thus, Georgia's offensive was in its own territory, and Russia's invasion was coming into a nation that is not debatable among the superpowers of the world

It doesn't matter where the attack took place. That is completely ridiculous. Georgia kills Russian peacekeepers and you say they shouldn't do anything? You invaded for "fear" of WMDs, Russia invaded because of actual lost lives. Somehow in your logic "fear" of WMDs is more legal than actual deaths...

I am sorry but I cannot understand how you do not see the conflict in your beliefs.

Fulcrum29

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by gnothiseauton
reply to post by unbelievable

Thus, Georgia's offensive was in its own territory, and Russia's invasion was coming into a nation that is not debatable among the superpowers of the world

It doesn't matter where the attack took place. That is completely ridiculous. Georgia kills Russian peacekeepers and you say they shouldn't do anything? You invaded for "fear" of WMDs, Russia invaded because of actual lost lives. Somehow in your logic "fear" of WMDs is more legal than actual deaths...

I am sorry but I cannot understand how you do not see the conflict in your beliefs.

Well not that I agree with it but I think what he's saying is possibly that yes the peace keepers were killed but the 'peace keepers' were already in Southern Ossetia presumably which would mean they are already in Georgian territory and 'invading' Georgia unless of course Russia and Georgia had a signed treaty/agreement for those peacekeepers to legally be there, and if that's the case then I suppose them being outright brutally murdered (which they were) is sort of an act of war and then I wouldn't blame Russia for 'invading' because let's be honest Georgia started it first by murdering the peace keepers.

gnothiseauton

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:44 PM
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reply to post by Fulcrum29

I am not sure about this, so please anyone who know more please share, but I think the Russian troops were there because since last night Georgia started killing civilians in S.O. This is what BBC World News was saying in the morning. If anyone knows for sure please share.

I3LiP

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:45 PM
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The Russian peacekeepers were illegally placed into Southern Ossetia. They did not have UN sanction to be there, assuming of course, they actually were there to begin with, I am unsure of the validity of claims that peacekeepers were present before the Georgians engaged the seperatists. If someone has a link to this I would appreciate it.

princeofpeace

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:48 PM
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Georgia was already set to bring home its troops from Iraq...this was immenent anyway, todays events just sped it up a little so dont read too much into that.

FredT

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:49 PM
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Ahem!

Kindly stay ON topic and cease the personal sniping. It adds nothing to the debate at hand. If your agrument depends on Strawmen and ad hominem attacks then perhaps its time rethink how you are defending it.

FredT

[edit on 8/8/08 by FredT]

camain

posted on Aug, 8 2008 @ 07:58 PM
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you know I wonder, is it possible that the reason why georgia did this was to bring about its destruction of its military. In doing this, it would radicalize the population against russia, and move it towards the west. Additionally, after the current president was removed, I'm positive that the U.N. would sanction troops to move in and secure the country, the majority of them being countries from the E.U. and N.A.T.O. Is it possible that this wasn't a trap setup by the russians, but a trap to entrap the russians by giving georgia the ability to unite with Europe after this is all over? After all, georgia has a huge port, a huge pipeline, and a stable "christian" community that is easier to deal with by world powers then "Islamists".

Just some thoughts,

Camain