The Disclosure Project is looking for a Professional Publicist

Originally posted by torsion

Originally posted by millerman

I have seen NO evidence of dissatisfied CSETI trainees; whereas I have seen plenty of evidence of satisfied CSETI trainees. And I have seen plenty of other evidence that Greer has huge cred, albeit more from positive word-of-mouth and networking than from Internet marketing/advertising.

Please tell us who these satisfied trainees are

Some articles by CSETI members here

and give us some examples of the 'other evidence' Greer has.

I said I have seen plenty of other evidence that Greer has huge cred - credibility.

Like the fact that he has worked with MANY high-profile, credible people - like former Canadian Minister of Defense Paul Hellyer, astronauts Ed Mitchell and Gordon Cooper, plus all the other DP witnesses, many of whom are doctors, scientists etc....

The fact is that Greer has surrounded himself with all kinds of high-profile, credible people - HOW? If he has been lying/hoaxing about vectoring in UFOs for 17 years? Why do all these high-profile people even give him the time of day, if he is a liar?

He has HUGE cred from other credible people and positive word-of-mouth, even if not credibility on the Internet.....

He was involved with these people prior to his claim that he could levitate and vector ufos. If he had told them that he could vector ufos at the beginning of Disclosure they would have walked, for sure! In fact, they would have told him that their help and testimony wasn't required - just get on with the vectoring...

I bet none of these high profile people dare admit to having been involved with Greer these days.

Originally posted by torsion

I've no doubt the video is real but what does it prove?

Nothing at all, torsion, that's the point I've been trying to make. Photographs and video footage aren't really proof positive of anything any more, not now that everything can be edited and manipulated with computers.... plus the fact that we can produce fake/hoaxed videos with CGI and special effects that are 1000 times more photorealistic than real videos!

So, don't look to video footage to be the definitive proof of all this.....

Originally posted by torsion
He was involved with these people prior to his claim that he could levitate and vector ufos. If he had told them that he could vector ufos at the beginning of Disclosure they would have walked, for sure! In fact, they would have told him that their help and testimony wasn't required - just get on with the vectoring...

No, you are not correct. TDP started in 2001, CSETI started in 1990 - 11 years before TDP. And Greer claims that it was his work with CSETI - vectoring UFOs - that directly led to him making all these covert and high-profile contacts and to the NPC Disclosure conference.

You are thinking of "Hidden Truth", which didn't come out until 2006 - well after the NPC conference.

I bet none of these high profile people dare admit to having been involved with Greer these days.

Well, former Canadian Minister of Defense Paul Hellyer has, for one....

Originally posted by millerman
I have seen plenty of evidence of satisfied CSETI trainees.

So? Cult members are often satisfied. Ex cult members often don't bother talking about their lack of satisfaction for various reasons. Usually it's years before they do, and not until the piling-on starts.

If I came across a circle of people in a field meditating, talking about beings only they can see, and showing obvious deference to one member of the circle - a leader of sorts - I would rightly conclude this was a religious group.

Originally posted by Sophismata

Originally posted by millerman
I have seen plenty of evidence of satisfied CSETI trainees.

So? Cult members are often satisfied. Ex cult members often don't bother talking about their lack of satisfaction for various reasons. Usually it's years before they do, and not until the piling-on starts.

You are flat-out wrong in equating CSETI to a cult.

In real cults - you are not allowed to leave!

With CSETI, you go on an expedition for a week - and then you go back home again.

So, nice try, but, no, you are wrong....

millerman, despite your claim. If someone were to levitate in front of me and I had every opportunity to verify that using ANY means that I wanted, then I would believe that they could levitate.

Now, will the real Greer stand up and levitate? No, of course not, he's too busy posting moth pictures on his internet website.

Even better, you brush the pictures off with an indifferent 'so what?', as though cheating the general public is acceptable. Claiming that pictures of moths are alien/UFO/energy anchor/light beigns is stupidity of the highest form.

A Present For Tezzajw

Since you are SO damn lazy....

www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by millerman
A Present For Tezzajw
Since you are SO damn lazy....

Oh, millerman. At the same time as I want you to give up for your sake, I want you to keep continuing for my sake. You entertain me each day.

Video 1 is fake. The garbage can near the truck moves between 'takes'.

Videos 2, 3 and 4 are all fake. Criss Angel is an ILLUSIONIST! Don't you get it? His job is a professional illusionist! I could show you plenty of David Copperfield's physics-space-time defying stuff but what's the point when they are ALL ILLUSIONS! You are using YouTube videos of an illusionist performing his tricks to try and prove that people can levitate?

Video 5 is fake. We don't see his upper body so we can't see his arms lifting him up on a bar while the camera is firmly on his feet.

Now, where is Greer's video of him levitating?

I think, for your sake, millerman, that you would be best not to post this sort of evidence any more. It's about as credible as Greer's moth pictures.

Originally posted by tezzajw
Even better, you brush the pictures off with an indifferent 'so what?', as though cheating the general public is acceptable. Claiming that pictures of moths are alien/UFO/energy anchor/light beigns is stupidity of the highest form.

Great job totally brushing aside the strong evidence and argument I put forth that Greer is credible, and homing in on the most TRIVIAL of issues - ONE PHOTOGRAPH on his website!

Did it occur to you that maybe it wasn't even Greer that posted these pictures?

Maybe Richard asked "Debbie" to post some pictures, and she goofed and
posted some silly pictures. Maybe she will post some better ones, like some pics of actual UFOs, when it's pointed out to her how silly those pics are....

Let's try cutting them a little slack shall we, instead of pouncing all over their every move like vultures?

LMAO!!!

tezzajw, you are behaving EXACTLY LIKE I TOLD YOU YOU WOULD.

I predicted, right here in this thread, that if you viewed some footage of people levitating, you would refuse to believe it.

You demanded to see some footage, I provided it for you, so what's the first thing you do? "Fake! Fake! Fake! Fake! ILLUSION! Fake!"

How is anyone supposed to prove levitation to you, if you won't even accept video footage? Do David Blaine and Criss Angel have to come right to your door and do it right in front of your face?

Video 1 is fake. The garbage can near the truck moves between 'takes'.

The levitation is all done in one continuous take, and you can clearly see that he isn't wearing any kind of harness that could support his weight, he isn't attached to a crane or anything like that.....

Videos 2, 3 and 4 are all fake. Criss Angel is an ILLUSIONIST! Don't you get it? His job is a professional illusionist!

So what? He's a paid magician so therefore he can't possibly do anything real? Completely faulty logic. You provided absolutely no proof at all that videos 2, 3 and 4 are fake.

You are using YouTube videos of an illusionist performing his tricks to try and prove that people can levitate?

You demanded evidence, I provided it for you. But I even told you ahead of time that video footage wouldn't be sufficient proof for you, you would just continue to believe what you want to believe! I predicted exactly how you were going to behave ahead of time!

Video 5 is fake. We don't see his upper body so we can't see his arms lifting him up on a bar while the camera is firmly on his feet.

Nope, I just rewatched it and rewatched it, you can see at least one of his hands in every single one of the levitation takes, and you can clearly see he isn't grasping any bar.

Anyway I think I have more than adequately proven my point - not even video footage is sufficient proof for you, because you are determined to NOT believe! Greer could post footage of a CSETI team doing the CE-5 protocol and UFOs showing up, and you would STILL refuse to believe it - you would immediately cry "Hoax! Those aren't real ET craft, those are 'satellites' [ala torsion]. That's just CGI and special effects!"

Originally posted by millerman

Videos 2, 3 and 4 are all fake. Criss Angel is an ILLUSIONIST! Don't you get it? His job is a professional illusionist!

So what? He's a paid magician so therefore he can't possibly do anything real? Completely faulty logic.

Oh. My. God. I suppose you believe David Copperfield vanished the statue of liberty FOR REAL, too, huh? And that David Blaine can levitate and read minds and stuff? I don't even know where to begin. I'll just say this, then: If Greer attracts folks who believe that illusionists like Criss Angel are doing actual supernatural magic, then I don't fear for his victims as much as I did before. He's only fooling people who deserve it.

Originally posted by Sophismata

Oh. My. God. I suppose you believe David Copperfield vanished the statue of liberty FOR REAL, too, huh? And that David Blaine can levitate and read minds and stuff? I don't even know where to begin. I'll just say this, then: If Greer attracts folks who believe that illusionists like Criss Angel are doing actual supernatural magic, then I don't fear for his victims as much as I did before. He's only fooling people who deserve it.

You are missing the point Sophismata.

I really want to prove levitation to you guys, but how am I supposed to do it if even VIDEO FOOTAGE isn't good enough proof? What manner of evidence can I POSSIBLY provide to you, over the internet, to prove levitation, if video footage isn't even good enough?

You see, it's real easy to sit back and play skeptic, and demand people prove things to you, and then no matter HOW MUCH evidence people provide, you can just sit there and go "Nope that's disinformation, that's fake, that's a hoax, that's a trick, that's not real....."

ANYONE can do it, it only takes an IQ of Mud or so to do it... and people like tezzajw do a fantastic job of it, sitting back and mocking me and acting like I'm stupid and demanding that I prove things and then not accepting ANY level of evidence I provide....

Do you see? It's all a game. People like tezzajw contribute absolutely nothing useful at all, they just get off on making people jump through hoops for them and then treating them like they're stupid.

Originally posted by millerman


How is anyone supposed to prove levitation to you, if you won't even accept video footage? Do David Blaine and Criss Angel have to come right to your door and do it right in front of your face?

The levitation is all done in one continuous take, and you can clearly see that he isn't wearing any kind of harness that could support his weight, he isn't attached to a crane or anything like that.....

I am sorry Millerman, but you are way way out there on this one. Criss Angel and Blaine are called ILLUSIONISTS for a reason - they are not MAGICIANS, but ILLUSIONISTS. There are MANY sites out there that describe HOW they do their levitation trick... look it up.

Illusionists create an ILLUSION for the purposes to trick people to make them BELIEVE what they are seeing is an impossibility. SO, now that you have brought ILLUSIONISTS into this thread - are you putting Greer into this category too? Good for you perhaps you are seeing the light after all!



Ambassador Greer, Mt. Shasta UFO/ET Illusionist - Tickets $800-$15,000.


"Behold, my people! WITNESS THE ALIEN COMMUNICATION ANCHORS!!!!"
*puff of smoke*
"Bzzzzz... flutter flutter flutter, bzzzzzz"

Originally posted by millerman


Do you see? It's all a game. People like tezzajw contribute absolutely nothing useful at all, they just get off on making people jump through hoops for them and then treating them like they're stupid.

No, I think all he wanted you to do was back your stuff up man, just like I do. It is ridiculous to make claims and never have any proof - and then tell people that YOU want proof to prove YOUR wrong... gimmeeee a break. As for contributions - I think all you have contributed is basically circular argumentation but nothing worth any weight. All Tezzajw wants is you to prove your claims that Mr. Greer and his Greerians can do what they claim to do... I mean, we all want disclosure right? He has the means (according to his vectoring in Alien Com Devices and 100ft UFOs), so why not put good use to those talents and capture an anchor or snap some daylight pictures?

He can't.

Originally posted by millerman


Do you see? It's all a game. People like tezzajw contribute absolutely nothing useful at all, they just get off on making people jump through hoops for them and then treating them like they're stupid.

SO you present Illusionists as PROOF? Who is playing the game then?

You darn well knew Tezzajw would say it was fake - as would EVERY MEMBER ON HERE - ASK THEM! No one believes illusionists can actually do what it seems they can - that is why it is called an ILLUSION.

STOP PLAYING GAMES and people will actually take you seriously...

Originally posted by kroms33

I am sorry Millerman, but you are way way out there on this one. Criss Angel and Blaine are called ILLUSIONISTS for a reason - they are not MAGICIANS, but ILLUSIONISTS. There are MANY sites out there that describe HOW they do their levitation trick... look it up.

Illusionists create an ILLUSION for the purposes to trick people to make them BELIEVE what they are seeing is an impossibility. SO, now that you have brought ILLUSIONISTS into this thread - are you putting Greer into this category too? Good for you

perhaps you are seeing the light after all!

Ambassador Greer, Mt. Shasta UFO/ET Illusionist - Tickets $800-$15,000.


"Behold, my people! WITNESS THE ALIEN COMMUNICATION ANCHORS!!!!"
*puff of smoke*
"Bzzzzz... flutter flutter flutter, bzzzzzz"

Wait a minute, kroms!

TEZZAJW was the one who DEMANDED to see footage of people levitating!

I was kind enough to oblige him and do PRECISELY what he asked for, right down to the letter, I provided not just one but five different samples of footage of people levitating. I was only doing exactly what I was ASKED to do.....

So why am I now being mocked, ridiculed, belittled and abused by you and tezzajw and Sophismata like this? When I was only doing exactly what I was ASKED to do?

Do you guys get off on mocking, ridiculing and abusing people like this or something? What did I do to deserve this treatment???

I hope you realize, this whole setup just exposes you (...) .....

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Removed incident of name-calling


[edit on 22/4/07 by masqua]

Originally posted by kroms33

Originally posted by millerman


Do you see? It's all a game. People like tezzajw contribute absolutely nothing useful at all, they just get off on making people jump through hoops for them and then treating them like they're stupid.

No, I think all he wanted you to do was back your stuff up man, just like I do. It is ridiculous to make claims and never have any proof -

Well wait a minute, isn't that what I did? Tezzajw demanded proof to back up the levitation claim, so I did EXACTLY WHAT HE ASKED FOR, so why am I now being ridiculed and abused like this? What did I do to deserve this treatment?

(...)

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Removed incident of name-calling



[edit on 22/4/07 by masqua]

Originally posted by kroms33

Originally posted by millerman


Do you see? It's all a game. People like tezzajw contribute absolutely nothing useful at all, they just get off on making people jump through hoops for them and then treating them like they're stupid.

SO you present Illusionists as PROOF? Who is playing the game then?

You darn well knew Tezzajw would say it was fake - as would EVERY MEMBER ON HERE - ASK THEM! No one believes illusionists can actually do what it seems they can - that is why it is called an ILLUSION.

STOP PLAYING GAMES and people will actually take you seriously...

What GAME am I playing??? I did exactly what I was asked to do!! Tezzajw demanded that I post some footage..... so I obliged him and did exactly what he asked for!!

Why am I now being ridiculed and accused of playing games, when all I did was precisely what I was ASKED to do??

(...)
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Removed incident of name-calling

2) Behavior: You will not behave in an abusive and/or hateful manner, and will not harass, threaten, nor attack anyone.

T&C's


[edit on 22/4/07 by masqua]

Originally posted by millerman


Well wait a minute, isn't that what I did? Tezzajw demanded proof to back up the levitation claim, so I did EXACTLY WHAT HE ASKED FOR, so why am I now being ridiculed and abused like this? What did I do to deserve this treatment?

----- (name calling quote - sorry mods)

Nice going with the name calling - just shows what level of intelligence we are dealing with now - and we have PROOF.

All you are doing is trolling and playing games with people instead of having an actual discussion with people. Yes, it can get heated - but I have never called you any names - EVER. You are the one that spews out derogatory comments and names about others all the time - and nothing is ever said to you about it. Sorry, YOU have crossed the LINE this time. How dare you.

Perhaps you will meet the same fate as your buddy Richy Tock?


[edit on 4/22/2007 by kroms33]