Putin issues fresh demands to Ukraine to end war

He is haggling. He starts with an outrageous deal so he can bargain down to the deal he is looking for or to make it appear as if that is what that offer is about. He is probably just stalling by making it seem like he wants to make a deal.

The same Trump that wants Europe to buy lng from the US instead of Russia, costing them billions.

www.cnbc.com...

Or the Trump that wanted European countries to pay more into NATO.

www.politico.eu...

Children will be children

originally posted by: grey580
a reply to: Boomer1947

Are you saying that Trump and Putin are having a bromance? And that Trump would help Putin?



Possibly.

originally posted by: Lazy88

originally posted by: BedevereTheWise

The idea that significant resources are going to line people pockets in Ukraine is fantasy.

God bless the ignorant..

How Deep Does Corruption Run in Ukraine?

foreignpolicy.com...#:~:text=According%20to%20the%20most%20widely,be%20as%20corrupt%20as%20Russ ia.


During a recent off-the-record think tank discussion on Ukraine, a respected journalist raised the issue of the damaging effects that Ukraine’s ongoing corruption issues have had on U.S. congressional Republican support for the country as it resists Russia’s invasion. The journalist’s comment, of course, was not the first about what has become a bugbear for Ukraine’s friends and enemies alike. Indeed, corruption in Ukraine’s economy, and more recently within its military structures, is a problem that needs to be addressed forcefully and forthrightly by Ukraine’s leaders.

Same article..

First, it’s necessary to be precise about the scale of the problem. Because corruption is hidden, estimating its scale is always problematic. According to the most widely cited source—the annual ranking of corruption by Transparency International (TI)—Ukraine has scored poorly for decades. As late as 2016, amid major anti-corruption reforms, TI’s survey still judged Ukraine to be as corrupt as Russia. The most recent TI index suggests that Ukraine has made some strides since then, but it still ranks 104th among 180 countries. Denmark is ranked first—meaning that it is perceived as cleanest—while Russia ranks 141st.

In other words, they know it’s a big problem people are getting rich lining their pockets. And they are never going to be honest about that. Like you now being disingenuous. Politicians are getting rich off this war.

Did you actually read the article?

It's about how much improvement there has been in Ukraine since it became less under Russian influence.

Ignorant indeed.

As Ukraine’s war against Russia proceeds, policymakers and the public should expect further corruption scandals. These must be addressed, and their perpetrators punished, but they must also be seen in the proper context. Occasional lurid headlines notwithstanding, Ukraine has made major progress in tackling grand corruption, reducing the power of oligarchs, and managing a vast increase in defense spending without scandals on a massive scale. That in itself is testament to how much has changed in Ukraine since a decade ago

originally posted by: charlest2
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

This is a discussion, a bantering back and forth I no longer have the desire or stamina to even participate in any longer. The futility of it all is more than I can bear at this point. It's been hashed and rehashed far too many times here for me to even remotely care or consider joining into.

To everyone else here, carry on.

Thank you for posting that you aren't going to post.

Not sure where we would be without that...

originally posted by: watchitburn

originally posted by: BedevereTheWise

So you are pro land grabs by military force?

You realize that's how every country was founded?

Putin would get that result in the end anyway.

Saudi Arabia has de-pegged oil from the dollar. It's only a matter of time before the US dollar collapses now, and our money stops flowing to Ukraine's oligarchs.

China will help Russia wait us out.

I suspect saudi arabia will change their tune IF trump becomes president. And trump should see about us going back to gold backed money/or silver.
STart charging saudi arabia for those weapons we provide them for "upkeep"

a reply to: BedevereTheWise

It's about how much improvement there has been in Ukraine since it became less under Russian influence.

How's farming around all of those mines and bomb craters going? Not to mention the improvement in housing quality there. Free air conditioning and all!

originally posted by: charlest2
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

This is a discussion, a bantering back and forth I no longer have the desire or stamina to even participate in any longer. The futility of it all is more than I can bear at this point. It's been hashed and rehashed far too many times here for me to even remotely care or consider joining into.

To everyone else here, carry on.

Toys thrown out of pram - check.

Dummy spat - check.

originally posted by: charlest2
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

It's about how much improvement there has been in Ukraine since it became less under Russian influence.

How's farming around all of those mines and bomb craters going? Not to mention the improvement in housing quality there. Free air conditioning and all!

Glad you find Russian bombing of civilians funny.

Oh and your 2nd post in thread you weren't going to post in.

a reply to: BedevereTheWise

I couldn't resist! The temptation was just too great.

a reply to: charlest2

Back again, so soon?

Glad you find all that so amusing. Not.

originally posted by: charlest2
a reply to: BedevereTheWise

I couldn't resist! The temptation was just too great.

3rd.

Welcome to the chat.

a reply to: charlest2

"I couldn't resist!".

Try harder.

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

I'm not in the mood to get into another pissing contest with you today.

Carry on.

originally posted by: Oldcarpy2
a reply to: charlest2

"I couldn't resist!".

Try harder.

On the contrary.

Whiie I think Charlest2 is completely wrong on this subject I welcome his participation.

a reply to: charlest2

You will, tho.....you can't resist, dear boy.

a reply to: BedevereTheWise

Me too. I need the laughs.

a reply to: BedevereTheWise
So why didn't Viktor Yanukovych strike a sought-after deal with the West in which he negotiated in good faith to achieve? Because the US and EU were demanding far too many economic concessions he could not agree to.

That's why. The West and EU were intent on plundering Ukraine and Viktor Yanukovych could not agree with the terms demanded of him.

Know your history.

a reply to: BedevereTheWise

International recognition for territories Russia has claimed (even those not under Russian control), no NATO membership for Ukraine and an end to sanctions.

If that was all he demanded, it wouldn't be such a big problem. However, if we read in between the lines, he also demands "demilitarization" and "denazification" and we can only guess what that means. He wants Ukraine to reduce its army and make it completely defenseless. That would make it a prey to further invasion. By "denazification" he means reversing Maidan revolution and installing in Ukraine the puppet government, together with the persecution of any opposition.

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

It's too hard to idly sit by and watch ignorance prevail.

a reply to: bigginpc

The same Trump that wants Europe to buy lng from the US instead of Russia

Europe already gets almost 50% of total LNG imports from the US with Norway providing almost 30%.
www.consilium.europa.eu...