Russian nuclear doctrine and the likelihood of nuclear war

originally posted by: Kurokage
a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel

Imagine a squatter has taken over your home and is sh*tting on the floor, and raping your family after promising to never try to get into your house.

Would you happly let him carry on if he says he'll only do it in the living room and a one bedroom? Because thats pretty much what you're saying Ukraine should do about Russia?

That's not even close to the same analogy LOL. It would be more like you and your family have been living in your house your entire life (ethnic Russians) and then all of a sudden a new bully moves in a few streets over (new Ukrainian Government Poroshenko) and he starts telling you what you can do in your house, how your gonna do it, basically takes away your entire life in your home as you have known it.

a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel

Russia will stand up for and fight for Ethnic Russian people in Ukraine

Another member that has never heard about Russification!!

The term comprises two different notions, one applied for domestic, the other for international purposes. The domestic application denotes forcible imposition of the Russian language and culture at the expense of the native language. Russia is a multiethnic country, and Moscow-encouraged immigration of Russian speakers into non-Russian areas together with the creation of a Russian language-medium environment aims at a subtractive language shift from non-Russian to Russian and absorption of a Russian mind-set.

a reply to: lostgirl

"Aged fish"?

Carp fisher, actually, old girl.

a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel

"That's not even close to the same analogy LOL."

No, but it's more apposite than yours.

originally posted by: Kurokage
a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel

Imagine a squatter has taken over your home and is sh*tting on the floor, and raping your family after promising to never try to get into your house.

Would you happly let him carry on if he says he'll only do it in the living room and a one bedroom? Because thats pretty much what you're saying Ukraine should do about Russia?

Your anology only would make sense if Russia wanted to take over the Western Ukraine where all the Nationalists live and where basically no ethnic Russian Ukrainians live and that is not what their goal was.

a reply to: RussianTroll

Well, I did everything honestly. All that remains is to fulfill the promise.

That sounds like something a Bond villain would say ffs.

Go on then.

Tell us your plan Blofeld.

originally posted by: RussianTroll
a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel
You are sincerely right. I myself was in Crimea in those days of 2014 with my friends. And I personally saw the happiness, joy and incredible love that was in the eyes of the residents of Crimea. Their sincere joy at reunification with Russia. These are the most emotional and happiest days of my life. This was worth living for! Thank you for understanding this))))

No worries. I live in North America since young toddler basically but I'm ethnic Russian 🇷🇺

Edit- I gotta run though everybody, good chatting and debating have a very good Friday and great weekend ATS!

a reply to: Kurokage

Kind of like what happened in Crimea with the Tatars under the Soviets.

Or Kaliningrad, which if we’re examining land that “used to belong to someone else”, by Russian logic is on the table for Germany and other neighbors.

a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel

I will fully support you. For thousands of years, Russians lived on this land, had their own principalities and their own history. But then squatters-invaders from NATO come, bring money and bags of cookies, and try to exterminate not only the Russian spirit from these lands, but also Russians in principle. And who are the invaders here?
I respect Western states, Western lands and their property rights. But history turned out that it was not the Russians who tried to conquer the West. And the West manically tried to conquer the Slavs. These attempts always ended sadly for the West. But the Russians always, even after their victories, extended a hand of friendship, and not of plundering the colonies. And every time the Russians were betrayed.
I hope this practice ends in the 21st century.

a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel

Ignoring the facts doesn't make them go away???

Stop lying to yourself. When we deny our own truth, we deny our own potential. – Steve Maraboli

a reply to: RussianTroll

Yet the Ukrainians ask for our assistance in honoring the Budapest Memorandum.

They have had enough spirit to keep this a war of attrition for years.

So it appears you don’t respect self determination of a nation and instead fall back on “it used to be ours”.

I’m sure you wouldn’t agree with that mindset if European countries tried to take Kaliningrad or China with the outer Manchuria.

a reply to: RussianTroll

But the Russians always, even after their victories, extended a hand of friendship, and not of plundering the colonies. And every time the Russians were betrayed.

You might want to tell that to Eastern Europe after World War 2! You know that pesky thing I've been talking about 'russification'

a reply to: RussianTroll

Interesting versions of history that they indoctrin....I mean, teach, in Russia?

My friend and No 1 fan.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

You have already decided: you are defenders of Ukrainians or Crimean Tatars. Because it was under Russia that the Crimean Tatars received real autonomy, all their rights, senior positions in the government, religious freedoms and their own language in school education. This did not happen in Ukraine.
But there remained offended marginalized people who were deprived of the property they acquired through corruption. Now they are trying to present themselves as representatives of the Tatars. The Tatars now sit in the highest power in Crimea, and really solve the problems of their people..
And your attempt to become their representative is simply ridiculous))))))

a reply to: CriticalStinker

The whole World used to be controlled and owned by our Crown for centuries. Until late this week, apparently, according to the OP.

So, by the same logic, can we have it back? Please?

a reply to: RussianTroll

You’re right that the Tatars experienced autonomy under the Russian empire.

But the Soviets deported many or most of the Tatars before handing control of the region to Ukraine years later.

But I suppose you can still claim to be liberating the people of Ukraine even though they’ve turned your special military operation that was supposed to last days or weeks into a war for years.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

The Budapest Memorandum was purely declarative in nature. In no way obliges the parties to do anything. The United States officially recognized the declarative nature of the treaty, and did not even ratify this treaty.
You are trying to run ahead of the locomotive. Be careful, the locomotive may catch up with you))))

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel

Russia was blockading Ukrainian grain and going after farmers.

They even struck some of the silo reserves of grain and targeted energy infrastructure.

But sure, Russia whose only allies are Iran, China, Belarus, and North Korea is a beacon of morality and a defender of humanity.

You are forgetting about the rules of the ' special military operation' where Russia is allowed to do anything it wants but Ukraine has not to do anything in return.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

What reality do you live in? The USSR is long gone, now the Russian Federation exists)))
Damn, you watched the movie "Back to the Future"))))

originally posted by: RussianTroll
a reply to: CriticalStinker

You have already decided: you are defenders of Ukrainians or Crimean Tatars. Because it was under Russia that the Crimean Tatars received real autonomy, all their rights, senior positions in the government, religious freedoms and their own language in school education. This did not happen in Ukraine.
But there remained offended marginalized people who were deprived of the property they acquired through corruption. Now they are trying to present themselves as representatives of the Tatars. The Tatars now sit in the highest power in Crimea, and really solve the problems of their people..
And your attempt to become their representative is simply ridiculous))))))

Really?? You lie like a cheap rug.

en.interfax.com.ua...

“Eighty years ago, one of the most terrible crimes against human life was committed: the Soviet government deported the Crimean Tatar people. Both children and adults - everyone. In several days. Ruthlessly. To a foreign land. To the accompaniment of lies. The exact number of deaths is still unknown - the Crimean Tatar people lost at least a third from this deportation. And people were able to return home only after decades,” the president wrote on Telegram on Saturday.

www.theguardian.com...

Rights activists in Crimea say Russia’s mobilisation drive in the occupied peninsula is disproportionately targeting Crimean Tatars, an ethnic group that has largely opposed Russian rule since the area was annexed in 2014.

“Everywhere, in every town, I am hearing that the majority of those mobilised are Crimean Tatars, and we know they are particularly targeting settlements with predominantly Crimean Tatar populations,” an activist from the group still living on the peninsula said in a telephone interview.

“This will be a catastrophe for us that will take years to heal.”

Vladimir Putin announced “partial mobilisation” on Wednesday in an attempt to bolster Russia’s flagging invasion of Ukraine with new troops. Across the country, families have said goodbye to men who have been called up to fight. There have been reports of disproportionately high numbers mobilised in poor regions populated by ethnic minority groups, such as Buryatia and the republics of the North Caucasus.

www.aljazeera.com...

At 6am on Thursday, a group of seven Russian soldiers raided Leila Ibragimova’s home in Melitopol in southeastern Ukraine.

Ibragimova, an ethnic Crimean Tatar, is a well-known figure in the city, which has fallen under the control of the Russian army following Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. A deputy of Zaporizhzhia Regional Council and director of the Melitopol Municipal Museum, she has been a strong advocate for her constituency, including the local population of about 12,000 Crimean Tatars – a Muslim group indigenous to nearby Crimea, a territory Russia annexed in 2014.