Rockets fired at Israel from Gaza rocket attack terrorists have infiltrated from Gaza

a reply to: datguy

People don't like to point that out when they are trying to demonize muslim people/religion/beliefs

Wrong plenty of muslim people/nations that are not actively trying to butcher innocent people.

Hamas isnt one of them.

originally posted by: Muldar

originally posted by: Oldcarpy2
a reply to: Muldar

And how do millions of Jews feel about this?

In Israel?

I can't tell you about each person's views on killings of the enemy. It's not unreasonable to want to take some revenge. But you know nobody wants to kill civilians especially children.

Sad. But there was a convey in Gaza where 70 people were killed. The video I saw documented an ambulance that pulled up to the aftermath of one explosion. Then while the crew was getting out a second explosion set off with no indication of it coming from an air strike.

If it comes out Hamas blatantly lied about the deaths being from an Israeli air strike, and was from their own booby traps. What does that say about your Hamas sources. When many already knew their game is propaganda, not facts.

a reply to: WhatItIs

That's what happens when you engage in apologetics for Hamas propaganda and then cry when you get called out?

originally posted by: datguy
a reply to: Xtrozero

The point is that this wasn't just some vagrant hunting ground filled with nomads. People have lived there for thousands of years, had cities and kings before what what we today even realize, some of which include the bedouin who happen to be nomadic, but not the standard.
All that was before god told Abraham to kill them all.

People don't like to point that out when they are trying to demonize muslim people/religion/beliefs and justify the same type of barbarism they blame others for. They want to say it has nothing to do with happened oct. 7th, but it has everything to do with those horrible events.

You say it depends how far back I want to go, I want to know the truth, as far back as it can be found. So far the furthest point of contention between arabs and jews, is after God told Abraham to kill all the canaanites, and Israelites (named after Abrahams son Jacob) are the ones who invaded.

Those are the events that history has followed up until now. Those are the events that led to successive wars and atrocities for millenia.

It didnt start in 1947, or 1100, or 610 or 30bce
It has been raging for literally thousands of years, if not longer

None of the crap you wrote above means anything at all. History is great, but do you want to redefine the whole world with your logic? My point that most were nomads over wide areas is the reality, so what land do you want to say is theirs? 6 miles by 21? Also, how do you define the Jordanians from them? Same damn people, my friend.

If anything they have more rights to chunks of Egypt than Israel, so why not complain about that? If we only go back 2000 years here are the 12 tribes of Israel. Seems you want to pick and choose some point in time that suits you.

a reply to: Irishhaf

I have not parroted any de escalation, I have only pointed out all parties in this ongoing war have done nothing but fan the flames and are all guilty of the same crimes

I have made several suggestion to end the conflict. mainly that of Israel accepting some form of palestinian statehood as was intended by UN resolution 181.
Many of the accords and pacts and treaties that have been proposed, that everyone says is the fault of the palestinian people for not accepting, have been one sided peace agreements that ignore the "right of return" or independence. In some case (camp david/oslo accords) even the UN has been against the agreements for these same reasons.
in the camp david accords, the UN convinced arafat not to agree, after the 1994 palestinian elections Hamas took over, there has not been any accountability to the people of palestine since. Much like the US MIC during and after WWII

Lets say Israel suddenly accepted Palestinian statehood. gave them back land, ended the occupation of the west bank/gaza.
what would happen?
we dont know because in 70 years its never been tried.

Would that end Irans hatred for Israel? or syrias, or jordans, or qatar...No...probably not
but that would expose the underbelly of this beast and perhaps the Palestinians could finally get out from under Hamas

originally posted by: datguy

I have made several suggestion to end the conflict. mainly that of Israel accepting some form of palestinian statehood as was intended by UN resolution 181.

Are we to push that deep into Egypt as part of their statehood while giving up the West Bank that was never theirs even going back 1000s of years?

I would support that...

a reply to: datguy

The psychology term to describe the person who blames the other person for which he himself is guilty of is called "projection." It is a defense mechanism in which individuals attribute their own unacceptable thoughts, feelings, or impulses to others. In other words, they project their own negative traits onto someone else. This allows them to avoid taking responsibility for their own actions and feelings, and instead place the blame on someone else.

Im not the one denying history and reality by reaching for pre-historic genetic markers...
Im not the one with bloodlust calling for a Jew free palestine, or calling to 'Gas the Jews'!!!

The Jewish nation is the only nation actually helping palestinians atm by actually destroying their tyrannical dictatorship that uses them as human shields and steals their money to build weapons!!! palestinians should be thanking them, supporting them. Not calling for their deaths.

Whats the next anti-semitic trope you can use as a rebuttal?? Hmmm.... oh i know.... "they arent the real Jews"... khazarian, black israelites etc etc!!!!

It simply doesnt end! The Jew hatred!!

a reply to: Xtrozero

I am not disagreeing what Hamas did was horrid, it's 100% on them, goes without saying.
Just like the bombing of Pearl Harbor was 100% on the Japanese.

But this is a conspiracy website, it just might be like a Pearl Harbor event.
A very old lady once told me, her husband was in the navy, always said the Americans knew something was on the way to Pearl, just not how bad it would be, they specifically moved all their carriers out of Pearl, as this ship class would be needed during the coming war more than any other type. Which proved to be very true in the following naval battles.

A Casus Belli is like playing chess, and knowing you are going to have to sacrifice a piece, maybe an important one, to win.

If you allow your enemy to be as evil as they want to be, for a day, to stop them forever, well that is interesting moral debate to be had.

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33

If you allow your enemy to be as evil as they want to be, for a day, to stop them forever, well that is interesting moral debate to be had.

I don't think even Hamas had an idea it would go that way.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Im not trying to redefine anything, im trying to expose it.

The 12 tribes of israel were named after jacob's (Israel's) children, after they invaded you missed the point.

It isnt about what suits me, its about the truth.

and yes, if could take the land from egypt (which is where all the second class palestinians live in even more camps) then do it.

a reply to: combatmaster

orwell would be so proud of you

originally posted by: datguy

It isnt about what suits me, its about the truth.

and yes, if could take the land from egypt (which is where all the second class palestinians live in even more camps) then do it.

I'm not sure if that truth counts when you need to go back to 1500 BC and there were many different conquers over all that time. Even going back 600 years we have the Ottoman Empire that controlled it all up to modern times.

a reply to: datguy

Lets say Israel suddenly accepted Palestinian statehood. gave them back land, ended the occupation of the west bank/gaza.

5 times Israel HAS ACCEPTED giving them lands for statehood, 5 times Palestinians leadership has said NO.

Maybe you should try studying some recent history, after a point if you follow logic at all you have to stop excusing the terrorists.

a reply to: Xtrozero

The truth always counts

How did the Ottomans get it, was it a prize in a box of cracker jacks?
From the beginning history is always cause/effect he blamed him who blamed him and then blamed her because he did this to that person....

No body is "right", to say one side has more cause to kill and destroy for any reason, is to support the same thing you are fighting against, it is all hypocracy in the name of "insert cause here"

You are either against death and destruction or you are for it.
I am against it

a reply to: Irishhaf

oh spare me, its literally the only thing i have been reading about for the last week and i have done lots of reading. If you research the number of "peace talks" that have taken place since 1967 you wouldnt even make such comments

Israel was then required to dismantle settlements established after March 2001, freeze all settlement activity, remove its army from Palestinian areas occupied after 28 September 2000, end curfews and ease restrictions on movement of persons and goods.

Israel said no

That was in 2003 just before Hamas took over, in a deal that was supposed to be brokered by the "quartet" alliance of the US, UN, EU, and Israel

Go back a bit to 2000 when Israel said they would offer land, a small portion of what is the west bank, under Israeli control and only to a limited number of refugees that Israel would pick.
After a point if you knew what you were talking about you wouldnt make claims you couldnt back up.

Edit to add, i got my dates mixed up, it was 1993 when Israel offered land not 2000, that 1 time was the only time Israel ever offered land

a reply to: Irishhaf

All that on top of the fact that only the camp david summit (2000) and the oslo accords (1993)
were the only summits to include the palastinain people. The other summits and peace talks were convened around them with other nations like syria and egypt, the palestinians didnt have choice to accept or deny.

That is why they fought so hard for statehood, that is why they so eagerly allowed abbas to lead them with promises of independence. That is what led to conditions that allowed Hamas to take over in the first place.

a reply to: datguy

Blah blah blah more excuses.

Bend over backwards for them anymore and you will start rolling down hill.

Nobody has said israel are angels but it certainly takes a special kind of stupid to try and equate the behaviors of the two groups.

for decades I have heard the laughable genocide argument (which is what you tip toe around) and if Israel wanted to wipe them out they could fairly easily.

But sure whatever I now have seen your measure and you offer nothing but more of what has already been offered and you expect a different outlook.

Check the video I posted earlier they cover the who what where and when, your propaganda sound bites are old, outdated and wrong.

a reply to: Irishhaf

so you make accusations you cant defend and when shown proof you are wrong you call them excuses, its like arguing with children.
all i offer is the truth, i would say you only lie but in reality it is you who doesn't know the truth and when shown it calls it an excuse, typical childish argument from someone who condones violence of any sort. Its not me calling for genocide.

Go read the accords, read about who was involved, what was offered and what wasn't. you know, since

Maybe you should try studying some recent history

All the bloodthirsty warmongers here are the same, you just make more claims you cant back up and try to distract from that fact with baseless accusations

originally posted by: datguy

No body is "right", to say one side has more cause to kill and destroy for any reason, is to support the same thing you are fighting against, it is all hypocracy in the name of "insert cause here"

You are either against death and destruction or you are for it.
I am against it

Then you must be against the refugees from not joining Israel in peace for decades and just run on the old "Destroy the Jews" Hezbollah is the same as both groups who want to see Israel wiped off the map. Israel is the only one in the ME that is fighting for their lives. Both Gaza and the West Bank do not need to attack and can go all Gandi which would reap great benefits. Every nation that bid for peace with Israel gained it.

a reply to: datguy

AHem I guess i should be more specific. as a PEOPLE they were eliminated. IS that better? a people taken as slaves and bred out of existence. Same effect as if they were all LITERALLY killed off no? In short a real genocide.

Genetics we all are related down the line by common ancestors. There is also archalogical proof of Israel existing as well btw. And that COIN they keep showing saying palestine,the line below it is in hebrew saying its from israel.