California girl sues doctors over breast removal gender-affirmation surgery at 13

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

As far as the you all statement… to who are you referring? I’m here from the original ats, where we would scrutinize mars rocks and mj12 document typefaces. So please explain to which group you think I belong. You’re bordering stereotyping someone you know absolutely nothing about… ironic

The you should have been you all here interested, sorry about that. Now it is unfortunate you can't put some of those scrutinizing techniques to this case because nobody here has all the facts but jumping to conclusions is not a good look.

you have no idea on my stance in regards to this case because I’ve not stated it. You are generalizing again in a big way. I unlike you am remaining neutral til all the facts present themselves. Im merely pointing out your major bias portrayed under the guise of neutrality. Btw my lovely skepticism has brought me to you… do with that what you will.

I didn't say you had a stance with this case, I said you were jumping to conclusions about me. The generalizing and stereotyping is only being done by you. Read what you post.

No need to play the victim, you contradict yourself and I’m pointing it out. Have you ever had any experience in an actual debate?

Yes, but I'm not likely to here with anyone because it's trolling season.

Anyway, since the beginning of this thread my stance has been to find out if this girl was categorized into a suicide-prone group for treatment and this is where my interest is at this point. From the court document it can be argued that her saying she will drink bleach and there's no point certainly falls into that category.

Threatening suicide should not yield immediate gratifying results. It’s just bad behavior reinforcement… any credible therapist would agree. Should every hostage situation end in the demands being met immediately?

Everything and everybody had a part leading up to this girl's transition. What will come out in court is the trajectory followed and by whom and how. Who knows maybe the flaws along the way can be identified and remedied and not just throwing out the baby with the bathwater scenario that some states think is the answer.

Except you’re suggesting we do the polar opposite… neither is acceptable.

When it comes to pubescent children I think they should not have surgery but as for hormonal therapy that's a tricky slope because if you read the court document about this case, Layla's mood improved during the surgical part of the transition (see pages 12 and 13 of the court document). So all I am suggesting is read the court document and note the complexities involved.

All the court documents in the world will not give me enough insight into this mental phenomenon, i think a psychology degree barely prepares someone for a client suffering from body dismorphia. do I think the judicial branch is equipped to handle such delicate matter, no way. They can barely handle most run of the mill cases.

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

As far as the you all statement… to who are you referring? I’m here from the original ats, where we would scrutinize mars rocks and mj12 document typefaces. So please explain to which group you think I belong. You’re bordering stereotyping someone you know absolutely nothing about… ironic

The you should have been you all here interested, sorry about that. Now it is unfortunate you can't put some of those scrutinizing techniques to this case because nobody here has all the facts but jumping to conclusions is not a good look.

you have no idea on my stance in regards to this case because I’ve not stated it. You are generalizing again in a big way. I unlike you am remaining neutral til all the facts present themselves. Im merely pointing out your major bias portrayed under the guise of neutrality. Btw my lovely skepticism has brought me to you… do with that what you will.

I didn't say you had a stance with this case, I said you were jumping to conclusions about me. The generalizing and stereotyping is only being done by you. Read what you post.

No need to play the victim, you contradict yourself and I’m pointing it out. Have you ever had any experience in an actual debate?

Yes, but I'm not likely to here with anyone because it's trolling season.

Anyway, since the beginning of this thread my stance has been to find out if this girl was categorized into a suicide-prone group for treatment and this is where my interest is at this point. From the court document it can be argued that her saying she will drink bleach and there's no point certainly falls into that category.

Threatening suicide should not yield immediate gratifying results. It’s just bad behavior reinforcement… any credible therapist would agree. Should every hostage situation end in the demands being met immediately?

Everything and everybody had a part leading up to this girl's transition. What will come out in court is the trajectory followed and by whom and how. Who knows maybe the flaws along the way can be identified and remedied and not just throwing out the baby with the bathwater scenario that some states think is the answer.

Except you’re suggesting we do the polar opposite… neither is acceptable.

When it comes to pubescent children I think they should not have surgery but as for hormonal therapy that's a tricky slope because if you read the court document about this case, Layla's mood improved during the surgical part of the transition (see pages 12 and 13 of the court document). So all I am suggesting is read the court document and note the complexities involved.

All the court documents in the world will not give me enough insight into this mental phenomenon, i think a psychology barely prepares someone for a client suffering from body dismorphia. do I think the judicial branch is equipped to handle such delicate matter, no way. They can barely handle most run of the mill cases.

I think this battle will be the battle of the scientific empirical evidence and the mix of people on the jury.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

As far as the you all statement… to who are you referring? I’m here from the original ats, where we would scrutinize mars rocks and mj12 document typefaces. So please explain to which group you think I belong. You’re bordering stereotyping someone you know absolutely nothing about… ironic

The you should have been you all here interested, sorry about that. Now it is unfortunate you can't put some of those scrutinizing techniques to this case because nobody here has all the facts but jumping to conclusions is not a good look.

you have no idea on my stance in regards to this case because I’ve not stated it. You are generalizing again in a big way. I unlike you am remaining neutral til all the facts present themselves. Im merely pointing out your major bias portrayed under the guise of neutrality. Btw my lovely skepticism has brought me to you… do with that what you will.

I didn't say you had a stance with this case, I said you were jumping to conclusions about me. The generalizing and stereotyping is only being done by you. Read what you post.

No need to play the victim, you contradict yourself and I’m pointing it out. Have you ever had any experience in an actual debate?

Yes, but I'm not likely to here with anyone because it's trolling season.

Anyway, since the beginning of this thread my stance has been to find out if this girl was categorized into a suicide-prone group for treatment and this is where my interest is at this point. From the court document it can be argued that her saying she will drink bleach and there's no point certainly falls into that category.

Threatening suicide should not yield immediate gratifying results. It’s just bad behavior reinforcement… any credible therapist would agree. Should every hostage situation end in the demands being met immediately?

Everything and everybody had a part leading up to this girl's transition. What will come out in court is the trajectory followed and by whom and how. Who knows maybe the flaws along the way can be identified and remedied and not just throwing out the baby with the bathwater scenario that some states think is the answer.

Except you’re suggesting we do the polar opposite… neither is acceptable.

When it comes to pubescent children I think they should not have surgery but as for hormonal therapy that's a tricky slope because if you read the court document about this case, Layla's mood improved during the surgical part of the transition (see pages 12 and 13 of the court document). So all I am suggesting is read the court document and note the complexities involved.

All the court documents in the world will not give me enough insight into this mental phenomenon, i think a psychology barely prepares someone for a client suffering from body dismorphia. do I think the judicial branch is equipped to handle such delicate matter, no way. They can barely handle most run of the mill cases.

I think this battle will be the battle of the scientific empirical evidence and the mix of people on the jury.

That’s tricky seeing as empirical is being disregarded more and more in favor of anecdotal evidence that can’t be corroborated.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

Already posted- if you are asking about Olivia- the name of the professor is known now- Olivia got an A

In this story we face a scandal- child mutilations in the name of gender confusion-

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

Already posted- if you are asking about Olivia- the name of the professor is known now- Olivia got an A

In this story we face a scandal- child mutilations in the name of gender confusion-

Let's see her paper to see whether or not she still used the offending terminology, that is the crux of the issue now isn't it? Freedom of expression even though it harms others? So regurgitate that thread and post her paper.

As for this thread, stay on topic.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

Already posted- if you are asking about Olivia- the name of the professor is known now- Olivia got an A

In this story we face a scandal- child mutilations in the name of gender confusion-

Let's see her paper to see whether or not she still used the offending terminology, that is the crux of the issue now isn't it? Freedom of expression even though it harms others?

She got an A in her original proposal- activism considers biological sex an offending terminology - glad you've admitted it-

But activism too says we should perform operations to gender confused kids-where do you stand on this one?

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

Already posted- if you are asking about Olivia- the name of the professor is known now- Olivia got an A

In this story we face a scandal- child mutilations in the name of gender confusion-

Let's see her paper to see whether or not she still used the offending terminology, that is the crux of the issue now isn't it? Freedom of expression even though it harms others?

She got an A in her original proposal- activism considers biological sex an offending terminology - glad you've admitted it-

But activism too says we should perform operations to gender confused kids-where do you stand on this one?

Let's see it, provide the proof.

If it was indeed activism or profit margin greed on the part of the hospital/doctors then that will be determined at the jury trial.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

Already posted- if you are asking about Olivia- the name of the professor is known now- Olivia got an A

In this story we face a scandal- child mutilations in the name of gender confusion-

Let's see her paper to see whether or not she still used the offending terminology, that is the crux of the issue now isn't it? Freedom of expression even though it harms others?

She got an A in her original proposal- activism considers biological sex an offending terminology - glad you've admitted it-

But activism too says we should perform operations to gender confused kids-where do you stand on this one?

Let's see it, provide the proof.

If it was indeed activism or profit margin greed on the part of the hospital/doctors then that will be determined at the jury trial.

Already in my other thread- she got an A-

All these operations are motivated by profit n greed- no teenager n child should have his/her bodyparts removed-

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

Already posted- if you are asking about Olivia- the name of the professor is known now- Olivia got an A

In this story we face a scandal- child mutilations in the name of gender confusion-

Let's see her paper to see whether or not she still used the offending terminology, that is the crux of the issue now isn't it? Freedom of expression even though it harms others?

She got an A in her original proposal- activism considers biological sex an offending terminology - glad you've admitted it-

But activism too says we should perform operations to gender confused kids-where do you stand on this one?

Let's see it, provide the proof.

If it was indeed activism or profit margin greed on the part of the hospital/doctors then that will be determined at the jury trial.

Already in my other thread- she got an A-

All these operations are motivated by profit n greed- no teenager n child should have his/her bodyparts removed-

Well all you can do as usual is opine and not provide any proof.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3
You say that yet your actions would say otherwise. You seem very bias for someone waiting for the outcome. I’m curious, is it just contrarianism?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: CR4SH0V3R1D3

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

Why don't you define this sentence:

"Layla was a severely troubled 11-year-old when she self-diagnosed herself as suffering from gender dysphoria."

What does severely troubled mean to you?

What does self-diagnosed mean to you? 80%+ of young people who identify as trans are actually just gay.

I just read where the first doctors at that medical clinic seeing Layla refused to treat her because she was too young, but the parent(s) and Layla insisted so much so that they were then referred to three other doctors who started the treatment.

I also read where Layla had severe problems before transition and because of her unrealistic thoughts of how society would treat her afterwards, she then became disillusioned and unhappy with her transition. It all seems to have hinged on how society would treat them after transitioning. Did the doctors prepare Layla for the harsh realities of the anti-trans sentiment she would face? Whose responsibility would that be to prepare these patients for the realities of an intolerant society?

A lot needs to be unpacked here. It well be that the doctors could be at fault but that remains to be proven.

, from the horses mouth

Here's the court document:

www.documentcloud.org...

As I said previously, I will wait until the trial is over so I can learn both sides of the story. Here you all have one side. If you notice Layla was verbalizing self harm and all of this information would have been provided to the three doctors who ultimately ended up giving her the transitioning treatment. It just shows self harming behaviour is very serious and this must have been taken into account by the doctors.

I just like to learn all the facts from both sides. Why is that such a foreign stance to take?

The position you had even in the other thread I made-but you knew there was nothing more to it- I am referring to Olivia who got 0 on her assignment for using the term biological woman-there was no doubt who was wrong but you pretended we had to know all facts- we didn't have to wait a lot n the facts didn't change but Olivia had her original proposal remarked by a non-woke professor n got an A-

The story of the 13-year old is straight forward- the answer to gender dysphoria is not removal of body parts or puberty blockers- they should be outlawed immediately-it's a scandal

Good example because all anyone on this site got from you on that topic was one side and where is the other side of the story?

Already posted- if you are asking about Olivia- the name of the professor is known now- Olivia got an A

In this story we face a scandal- child mutilations in the name of gender confusion-

Let's see her paper to see whether or not she still used the offending terminology, that is the crux of the issue now isn't it? Freedom of expression even though it harms others?

She got an A in her original proposal- activism considers biological sex an offending terminology - glad you've admitted it-

But activism too says we should perform operations to gender confused kids-where do you stand on this one?

Let's see it, provide the proof.

If it was indeed activism or profit margin greed on the part of the hospital/doctors then that will be determined at the jury trial.

Already in my other thread- she got an A-

All these operations are motivated by profit n greed- no teenager n child should have his/her bodyparts removed-

Well all you can do as usual is opine and not provide any proof.

I am not the one who doesn't provide proof- a whole thread exists on the other topic - you tried to question the credibility of Olivia n of the thread but you were proven wrong-

A whole thread exists (many more before this) for the scandal of child mutilations-

a reply to: linda72

Hard to debate a machine, isn’t it.

originally posted by: Topcraft
a reply to: linda72

Hard to debate a machine, isn’t it.

Still winning-

!!!!!

They haven't made any reasonable n strong arguments in any of the threads- it's just denial n pretending to be skeptic- but reality proves them wrong -this is a scandal involving the removal of body parts in the name of gender ideology n gender confusion inflicted by this ideology-

originally posted by: quintessentone
I think these bias' within people and our binary society play a larger part in causing most of the suffering transgendered people experience than we'd like to admit. At least that is what I am reading from the studies on them.

Their suffering is internally caused. Stop blaming everyone else for their issues. In Asia, it seems that trans happily live within a normalized level of society that aligns them with their desired gender while understanding they are not truly 100% that desired gender. A trans-female is not female, but trans-female... Get it?

We all need to accept who we are, and we all wish on many levels that we were different in so many ways, but it seems there is only one group today trying to force acceptance of their physical/mental issues on to others.

originally posted by: quintessentone

I think this battle will be the battle of the scientific empirical evidence and the mix of people on the jury.

Adults leading an underage person down a nonreversible path will end up 100% in favor of the underage person if a jury gets a hold of it. If adults encourage a kid to drink, smoke, or do drugs would go the same path with a jury crucifying the adults.

a reply to: Xtrozero

I am with you, and even the 1 person I do know that was diagnosed with GD is happy she didnt get any procedures or drugs because if she did her kids wouldnt exist.

originally posted by: Irishhaf

I am with you, and even the 1 person I do know that was diagnosed with GD is happy she didnt get any procedures or drugs because if she did her kids wouldnt exist.

So I game with a trans-female and we had a long talk one night about getting the bottom done. She told me that she is mostly depressed that she can not find a suitable partner and so getting the bottom done will change all that.

So, I said if .01% of the male population would date her for who she is now then getting the bottom done would still be .01% while losing all abilities to have sexual satisfaction which opens up a massive number of new issues for the rest of her left. She has thought well and hard on that and as of today has not been talking about that procedure.

Falling back on my phycology days I'm 100% convinced that serious depression in trans is not a causality of their condition, but another independent mental issue of many. Their trans condition and how people deal with them can influence the level of depression, but if they magically were transported into a real female's body they would still be depressed.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: quintessentone

I think this battle will be the battle of the scientific empirical evidence and the mix of people on the jury.

Adults leading an underage person down a nonreversible path will end up 100% in favor of the underage person if a jury gets a hold of it. If adults encourage a kid to drink, smoke, or do drugs would go the same path with a jury crucifying the adults.

Exactly, then Layla's family doctor, the first set of psychologists, and the mother will all blamed because the first three set of doctors at the hospital refused treatment to Layla, but Layla with her mother's insistence and the file folders full of psychological proof of self-harm is what and who pushed for the transition. But, hey, one never knows how a jury will decide.

ETA

I forgot the transgender person influencer that Layla was in contact with online before the transition wheels of motion started. I have no facts how this interaction may play into the case.

originally posted by: linda72

originally posted by: Topcraft
a reply to: linda72

Hard to debate a machine, isn’t it.

Still winning-

!!!!!

They haven't made any reasonable n strong arguments in any of the threads- it's just denial n pretending to be skeptic- but reality proves them wrong -this is a scandal involving the removal of body parts in the name of gender ideology n gender confusion inflicted by this ideology-

Debate can't be properly had when only one side of the story is out there and without any back up proof and when closed-minded people refuse to read evidence when provided, so never use the word debate in any exchange most people have with each other on this site. It is all just opining so get over it.

I am not arguing anything in this thread, I was asking if Layla was suicide-prone, which nobody could answer nor give any facts, it is all just opining. I subsequently offered the court document with facts and Layla indeed was suicide-prone and that may be a key issue in this whole case because suicide-prone patients are handled very differently in GD cases.