Lost Roman Map has ATLANTIS at Eye of Sahara Africa! (Richat Structure)

originally posted by: bluesfreak

20/25 years? So, what did Merer's diary say?

Yeh I’ve read that too, he was in a real hurry wasnt he , to get those stones to Khufu. Such a deadline that they stopped overnight places , Chilled out on the way.
Didn’t sound too rushed , did he?

Ah yes, the constantly reducing number of blocks theory.
Bit of a discrepancy in building terms there- 500,00 - 960,00?
A discrepancy of nearly half there , yet the pyramid remains the same size . Great estimation . Ha ha .
What a joke .


Hint : estimations that are so wildly variant usually mean one thing- ‘we don’t really know ‘.
You cannot claim that half a million blocks discrepancy , or guessing, is acceptable . Hilarious .


a reply to: Hanslune

No the person who made up the 2.3 million number made a volume calculation they did not take into account that the GP was built by incorporating into it part of an existing portion of the limestone ridge, an estimated 23%, he also did not account for the sloppily way the AE slapped together the core stones - lots of space plus and estimated 500,000 tons of gypsum mortar. etc.

Merer dated: They are the oldest known papyri with text, dating to the 27th year of the reign of pharaoh Khufu during the 4th dynasty. So he last at least 27 years but we don't know when he started. So was it finished before he died or after? Unknown? However for his Grandson Menkaure they appeared to have stopped work on the pyramid mid stream.

originally posted by: IAMTAT

Deleted

Your lovely when you pretend your mad to make up for not knowing anything....

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: IAMTAT

Deleted

Your lovely when you pretend your mad to make up for not knowing anything....

My loveliness aside, in addition to my knowing the proper use of contractions, you once again prove how right I am about your obvious insecurities.

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: All Seeing Eye
a reply to: atlantiswatusi

Personally I believe in a Ancient Apocalypse destroying evidence of a culture. But evidence would exist in some form that some one was there. There is no way a planned city like Atlantis is told to have been wouldn't have had something standing.

Now you need to figure out when those were built. We can show hundreds if not thousands of existing habitations and ruins of such around Athens or Sais - that doesn't in anyway magically become evidence that they were existed 11,0000 years ago?

Umm, no I dont. I am not a lab tech that works in a dating laboratory. All I am is a "Observer", and I have observed many things.

Though, I can tell you some of the sites along the ridge north of Tamchekett are dated to 5500 bc. And it seems virtually all those sites to the south are on high ground next to what might have been bodies of water, now extinct.

That 5500 bc date is of great interest because most surveys of the AHP indicate its end at approximately that time.

The "Evidence" so far, can only take us back 7500 years. But that isn't to say the cataclysm wiped everyone out, many may have survived until it was just too dry to continue, weather that was 1000 or 4000 years.

Again, much of the ruins are made of mud brick, not something easily manufactured in a dry desert. So logically, much of it had to come from wetter times. And that, by way of science, had to be pre 5500bc.

The structures buried in the second ring may also, be mud brick, encased in flood mud, with a couple of exceptions. We may be viewing Plato's descriptions in the wrong light as to what the city actually was. Or for that matter, what it may have been in prior times. After all Plato did not see the City with his own eyes, but only retelling what he was told. And no one really knows how many times it was retold before he received it.

Sorry, not my skill set to date ancient ruins. I can at best only offer a ball park figure.

As a example the below image is take in the middle of a salt flat some 18 miles north west of the center of the central Island. It appears, with some imagination, a vegetable garden. But regardless of that, is definitely man made. Knowing salt flats are produced by salt water evaporating would mean at one time this area was at least covered in salt water. I do not know of any cultures that Build under water, or in salt flats, so logically, it must have been put there, before the water. And has laid there undisturbed ever since. I cant give you a date, but I can tell you, it had to be put there before the waters arrived. Maybe some day archeologists will discover the site, and date it, scientifically. And that, is going to be a hoot when it happens.

And? I mean, I didn't comment on it because it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the topic. Besides that, you have a lot of nerve saying I didn't respond, given the gigantic elephant you left in the room concerning how maritime cultures usually develop ON THE OCEAN. Your opinion of my rudeness doesn't matter here. What matters here is your obvious pretense of an ocean 13,000 years ago 400 miles inland in Mauritania which you simply assume to have existed - ignoring any and all statements I made concerning this ridiculous flaw in your logic. That is called mental masturbation, and I'm not up for a circle jerk.

Nope. Never said any of those things . Go back and check .
I believe the most likely place for Atlantis to exist is the Mid Atlantic ridge .
I’ve already stated I don’t buy the Richat idea at all, for the same reason you state , and its size , and its geographical location pertaining to Plato's description.
So stop jerking to the sound of your own voice for a change and at least be bothered to check out what I wrote , compared to what you THINK I wrote .

Funny

Oh, and ps- no one here needs ‘nerve’ to reply to you. You’re nothing special , just a very blinkered Wikipedia repeater who doesn’t enjoy open discourse, speculation.

a reply to: Harte

You are the joke here. The discrepancy is due to the fact that we can't determine the extent of the hill the Great Pyramid was built over. Simple as that. It has to be estimated, which leads to the range you scoff at while seeming not to understand it.

Ah yes, of course, scientists can guess, but no one else can.
The joke is on you . A half million block discrepancy . Half a million? Half a million ?!!!!!
Quite a significant number to ‘play about with ‘.
I think you’ll find that it was archaeologists who gave us the figures of the block numbers originally.
Thing is, counting the blocks in their millions whether it be 3, 2.3, 2 million leaves those same archaeologists with that difficult answer of time, speed of placement of the blocks etc .
Probably better for archaeologists (of which you aren’t one) if they can bring that number down so that the claims don’t sound so utterly stupid .

I’m fully aware of the hill the pyramid is built on/into.
Estimations aren’t something you can throw at people as if it’s the truth. They are ESTIMATIONS.

a reply to: Harte

I can’t understand the vast scale you are talking about here regarding an inhabited Richat as Atlantis.
How many people do you suppose lived on this Atlantis , at this scale?
It seems like at this scale, you would need so many people to inhabit it.and build it in the first place. It’s huge!
Platos size description seems more consistent with a grand society/power of the time period stated.

I’ve read all your stuff, and as Into Atlantis as you are , which is commendable , of course, i’m also wondering from one speculator to another, how do you equate the position of the Richat geographically to where Plato describes Atlantis ?
Plato basically says that it’s literally straight ahead if you head out of the straights of Gibraltar , you’ll reach a couple of islands then you’ll reach Atlantis.
I’m not here to try and convince you of anything , but I do wonder why Platos geographical description is discounted?


a reply to: All Seeing Eye

a reply to: bluesfreak

Lets first remember the under estimation of past populations as shown vividly in the lidar scans of the Yucatan Mayan ruins.


While this is far more recent as well as on the opposite side of the Atlantic from the Sahara region and was once thought to be many different urban centres before this lidar scan was taken revealing it to actually be one huge urban environment now taken over and hidden by both time and the jungle it shows that past city's even though this is far more recent were once huge and in fact this would have dwarfed even some in China is more recent history.

So it is not inconceivable that during a wetter and more fertile past when this land was conducive to plant's, animal's and human beings it could have had a huge population and may have been inhabited for millennia before natural climate shifts and perhaps cataclysmic events turned it back into a desolate wasteland (that is still inhabited today with may settlements in that desert).

Then there is the misconception about African's that still pervades many even in scholarly circles that being that they were a primitive people living in straw huts and hunting with spears when in fact they were often more advanced than there European cousins throughout much of history, had armoured horse mounted knights, charioteers and well organized army's etc.

Then there are the enigmatic Rhesus negative Berbers that still live in the Atlas mountains to this day, while the blonde hair and lighter skin (Berbers range from very dark full sub-Saharan African to pale blue eyed blondes) may be from slaves as millions of Europeans including Basque's whom were taken in slave raids and the fact that RH negative woman are only likely to have viable healthy children through mating with RH negative men meaning that there descendants would remain more homogenous as a result there is also a possibility that they are are a remnant culture of people once native to that region in the distant past though this would be played on and used by those whom are biased against the idea of a black indigenous super power of the distant past (they would be wrong of course as the Egyptian - both the fair northern and the darker skinned Nubian - society proves.

The Nile one of the so called cradles of civilization was not the only river that flowed through the Sahara and once greater rivers may have flowed deep in what is today barren desert, in fact some of them may still flow but swamped and buried beneath the sands and up to several thousand years ago the Sahara was also once home to a vast inland sea, the largest in the world by far at that time.

The past population of the Sahara including the region in question therefore may have been much greater than is understood today.

originally posted by: bluesfreak
I never said anything about ‘teams build by bringing up one brick at a time’ where did you get that from?!

Your comment that they would have had to lay one block at certain intervals to get the whole project done in 20 years. Laying "one block every 3 minutes" looks very inefficient, doesn't it?

Now think of it this way: If they are moving 2 blocks at once, then it's 6 minutes to shovel a block into place.

If they're moving 10 blocks at once, then it's an average of 30 minutes to move a block from the staging area into place at the "one block every 3 minutes" pace.

A lowball estimate of the number of workers is 20,000 people. They had groups of a thousand men divided into cohorts of 100 and subgroups of 10, which could easily be moving 100 blocks at a time (the "average" is still 3 minutes per block but notice that because we're moving 100 blocks it's actually taking 5 hours or so per block.)

Given a 10 hour workday (sunup to sunset with a noon break) and 150-200 blocks per day.... does it really look so impossible now? That's a thousand in 8 days or so. And the stones get lighter and smaller the higher up you go.

originally posted by: bluesfreak

20/25 years? So, what did Merer's diary say?

Yeh I’ve read that too, he was in a real hurry wasnt he , to get those stones to Khufu. Such a deadline that they stopped overnight places , Chilled out on the way.
Didn’t sound too rushed , did he?

They didn't sail at night... too dangerous with the currents and so forth (all river navigation everywhere in the world had this problem.) So yes, they tied up overnight and dealt with officials and loading mechanics at ports.

originally posted by: Harte
] The Richat Structure is one of several known examples of an eroded dome and was absolutely not flooded by any sea level rise associated with the end of the last Ice Age.
Its elevation (400 feet above sea level) is FAR too great, and the distance to the ocean is 300 miles from the site.

Correct. Not sea rising, but ice melting from Comet impact like in the scablands in the US, as shown by Randall Carson.

Your comment that they would have had to lay one block at certain intervals to get the whole project done in 20 years. Laying "one block every 3 minutes" looks very inefficient, doesn't it? Now think of it this way: If they are moving 2 blocks at once, then it's 6 minutes to shovel a block into place. If they're moving 10 blocks at once, then it's an average of 30 minutes to move a block from the staging area into place at the "one block every 3 minutes" pace. A lowball estimate of the number of workers is 20,000 people. They had groups of a thousand men divided into cohorts of 100 and subgroups of 10, which could easily be moving 100 blocks at a time (the "average" is still 3 minutes per block but notice that because we're moving 100 blocks it's actually taking 5 hours or so per block.) Given a 10 hour workday (sunup to sunset with a noon break) and 150-200 blocks per day.... does it really look so impossible now? That's a thousand in 8 days or so. And the stones get lighter and smaller the higher up you go.

It’s the logistics of placing a block in place every three minutes I have trouble with . If you’ve ever tried to shift anything that weighs just one tonne , you’ll appreciate how difficult this task can be.
It’s the last bit of moving a stone into place that may be the most difficult. Unless you have a crane (which they didn’t ) the final positioning of a heavy object is where the trouble often starts .

I can see it taking way longer than three minutes personally, having moved many heavy machines with rollers and manpower.
Also inside the GP are those giant granite slabs , brought about 200 ft up somehow .

You see, Egyptologists like to say how things were done, without saying how they were done.
If you are happy that a block can be placed in situ every three mins you better have a good explanation of HOW.
What was the system for lifting blocks?
What was the system for lining up the blocks one after the other for placement?
What was the system for manoeuvring the blocks so quickly?
What was the actual logistical method needed to achieve this efficiency ?
How would Houdins spiral ramp theory affect the above compared to your offering of building all four sides simultaneously ?
Egyptology doesn’t explain these things very well,I’m afraid.
a reply to: Byrd

a reply to: bluesfreak

I’m not here to try and convince you of anything , but I do wonder why Platos geographical description is discounted?

When a good mathematician creates a equation he will spend a great amount of time perfecting it. He might even take pride in his work, sharing among colleges. He may do this out of self satisfaction, or just something that needed to be done. But the difference between a good, and great mathematician, is one of them can graciously admit error, and correct it when pointed out.

Plato wasn't a mathematician, he was in this respect a story teller. And since there were no others around to correct any discrepancies, the story stood, for thousands of years. But to basics, he was a man, and from what I read a very honorable man, not one to make up fables or create myths. A Man like all others who is susceptible, to error. In short, he did the best he could, with what he had. He, was a Man, not a god..

Plato stated the Ringed City and Atlantis was on the other side of the Pillars of Hercules.
Let me begin by observing first of all, that nine thousand was the sum of years which had elapsed since the war which was said to have taken place between those who dwelt outside the Pillars of Heracles and all who dwelt within them; this war I am going to describe.

Context: The people within the Pillars had little to no knowledge as to what actually laid outside their contained world view. In the times he speaks of very few were actually educated, if at all. And if technology was seen by the average person it would be seen as the WWII Cargo Cult people did. Even during Plato's times. Or, as a divine appearance.

The Atlantis as described by Plato was a region of Earth given as a "Allotment" to one of the gods. Other regions were also given in the same manner, tho named differently, with a different capital city. One of the problems with Plato's description is that it tends to merge the Allotment in with the Capital city. People outside the United States may think the Capital, Washington, was the entire country. More confusion arises from the concept of sinking. People tend to then think it must be in the Atlantic because Plato said so. Well, no he didn't. He did not tell us the exact location of the capital city, only that Atlantis was on the other side of the Pillars. So basically, he never told us where, the capital, ringed city was.

The confusion starts to get out of hand when then Plato tells us the way to this city is blocked by thick mud. If you want to stick to the words then where in the Atlantic does thick mud stop you from going? It wouldn't really matter anyways because mud will not stay mud for very long. It will either dry up, or get washed away. Unless it fills in a low area, drys out, and becomes a desert.

The point is Plato's story naturally had holes in it. Not because he forgot or was somehow mislead, but because of the amount of time that had transpired. And if you ask me, it was truly a divine act that we were fortunate enough to even hear the fragmented parts (As you know the second half of the story is missing) we did. Again as I said, Plato was a man, a man prone to error, just like all the rest of us. Especially, when we only have half the story to go by. And there is a old saying "A half truth, is a whole lie".

For scale I would put in today's scale of countries. By the way, the Islands of the west coast also have ancient ruins, one under water.

So I would say, Plato was a great story teller, and would accept the corrections and clarifications. What great man wouldn't?

From the number of ruins I would guestamate, just in and around the Richat, a population of 100,000, at minimum. Add in the Army, navy and the out lying areas, 1- 2 million? Just a guess.


Again, don't confuse the Ringed City, for the Allotment of Atlantis..

Some great points there Labtech.
yes those LiDAR scans are a real eye opener for sure , really fascinating.
I agree that populations may have been different to how we perceive them , and also the wetter Sahara stuff is real food for thought regarding how our world has changed in the last 10,000 years or so.
I still can’t get away from Platos description of WHERE Atlantis was situated compared to the Richat. a reply to: LABTECH767

Just like Rodney King said "Can't we all just get along?"

originally posted by: bluesfreak

And? I mean, I didn't comment on it because it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the topic. Besides that, you have a lot of nerve saying I didn't respond, given the gigantic elephant you left in the room concerning how maritime cultures usually develop ON THE OCEAN. Your opinion of my rudeness doesn't matter here. What matters here is your obvious pretense of an ocean 13,000 years ago 400 miles inland in Mauritania which you simply assume to have existed - ignoring any and all statements I made concerning this ridiculous flaw in your logic. That is called mental masturbation, and I'm not up for a circle jerk.

Nope. Never said any of those things . Go back and check .
I believe the most likely place for Atlantis to exist is the Mid Atlantic ridge .
I’ve already stated I don’t buy the Richat idea at all, for the same reason you state , and its size , and its geographical location pertaining to Plato's description.
So stop jerking to the sound of your own voice for a change and at least be bothered to check out what I wrote , compared to what you THINK I wrote .

Funny

Oh, and ps- no one here needs ‘nerve’ to reply to you. You’re nothing special , just a very blinkered Wikipedia repeater who doesn’t enjoy open discourse, speculation.

a reply to: Harte

I think readers here see you defending this ridiculously stupid Richat BS, then backing away when you have to explain how a maritime culture develops 400 miles inland.
Your idea of discourse is a rational person's idea of verbal diarrhea.
To you, anyone that knows anything at all about a subject you carelessly pick up and run with is a "blinkered wikipedia reader."

Harte

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
It actually blew my mind to see how big the formation was, and I don't think there's any other formation like it on Earth. You can also see that entire area has been washed out by a flood or similar disaster. Scientists believe that flooding occurred some time around 12 thousand years ago, which is right around the Younger Dryas period, a time sea levels rose rapidly.

The Richat Structure is one of several known examples of an eroded dome and was absolutely not flooded by any sea level rise associated with the end of the last Ice Age.
Its elevation (400 feet above sea level) is FAR too great, and the distance to the ocean is 300 miles from the site.

Harte

Ok show me where else around the world has a naturally eroded dome looking like a distinct concentric circle?
I've already explained it all here around this time last year, this is the lost city of Atlantis.
Poseidon designed it, gave it to his first son named Atlas and gave one to his twin brother in Cadiz so there are 8 more smaller ones to be found somewhere in the Atlantic ocean.
And although not mentioned directly about Atlantis, Homer's Odyssey gave away plenty of clues about what part of region Atlantis was located and what it looked like possibly after a pole shift disaster or a severe crustal movement that destroyed much of the region and when Odysseus was traveling the sea it was already many millenia afterward and was witnessing the remnants or descendants of Atlantian survivors from the aftermath.
Poseidon, Atlas, daughters of Atlas, phaeax, etc..
They all have close connection with each other as well as the lost islands and the continent.
Many islands sunk deep into the ocean but concentric designs were all built toward the inland.
One in Sahara, one in Gades, other 8 more possibly were built on the sunken continent that once existed in the Atlantic ocean.
Just by looking at location of the Eye of the Sahara and one in Cadiz, they were only flooded thankfully not being on the part of the lost sunken continent in the Atlantic ocean. Continuous flow of water makes sand and desert.
The first piece of puzzle of concentric islands is found, now let's move onto the next one located in cadiz.

a reply to: Dumbdowned

It wouldn't matter if we found a domed city still intact from that era. Atlantis wasn't a domed city, it was an island made up of concentric rings.

a reply to: Hanslune

The massive flood that ensued across the Sahara most likely removed a few kilometers off much of the surface of the flow path. Atlantis was directly in the way. Jimmy showed how the timeline is correct because it flowed over and cut through the lava shield of a volcano that was proven to have erupted prior to the flood, not to mention the mile wide separated ripples of the sand in the path created by the super tsunami type headwater that was more than a kilometer high. The artifacts of what was Atlantis is in the Atlantic ocean in the documented land slide off the coast of Mauritania.

The evidence is starting to be overwhelming, and this is now moving into the realm of reality that will change a great deal of history and the retirement of many of the old school geologists that have stood in the way of innovative research. I think that Jimmy should be commended for what he had revealed and the odds of this scenario being anything but what he has illustrated, look real good in a statistics study.

We have never witnessed anything even close to this kind of catastrophic occurrence, so an open mind is all you need at this juncture. The previous work by Carlson and Hancock on themes like this were so ballyhoo'ed and ridiculed.... yet today they are emerging as superstars, as they rightfully are. They walked the walk and talked the talk right through all of the main stream science that tried to destroy them. Mainstream Science is not laughing now.

The part of his video where he mentioned the "Trans Sahara Sea Way" was interesting.

The fossils in the seaway place it in the Cretaceous. But if it were something that comes and goes sometimes, and were present at the time of Atlantis, then it would mean that West Africa was, indeed, a separate continent at that time, from East Africa. So calling "Atlantis" a continent would not be inaccurate.

www.tumpik.com...