Russia Ukraine Update Thread - part 2

a reply to: xpert11


I agree with all of that, though I do still see an urgent need for just about any kind of gun platform on the eastern front, even though it's not a good use for the tool, and I don't think Ukraine is capable of being very mobile there yet.

I think defensive depth is the best Ukraine can hope for right now in the east, and a that's pretty good tactic for halting advances when outgunned by a more mobile opponent.

originally posted by: PatriotGames4u
a reply to: xpert11


I agree with all of that, though I do still see an urgent need for just about any kind of gun platform on the eastern front, even though it's not a good use for the tool, and I don't think Ukraine is capable of being very mobile there yet.

I think you are correct concerning the Ukrainian army's requirement for artillery. However, I would add anti-shipping missiles into the mix. So the discussion turns to the appropriate tools for the job. And to some degree, that falls beyond the scope of the topic.

Of course, the supply of artillery and anti-shipping missiles to Ukraine is subject to availability. Unfortunately, Biden's admin's approach toward military aid to Ukraine is an ad hoc lottery. If possible, the continuation of ex-soviet military equipment from Poland or elsewhere to fill the gap is a sensible starting point.

IMO, to what extent Ukraine looks beyond the U.S. and NATO for military hardware will be fascinating to witness. Restrictions on any American supplied components in the related equipment might occur.

Just watching the news and seeing poor sods walking about competing with stray dogs scavenging for food and rations.

Makeshift graves and all sorts all over the place, everything burned-out, looted to bits, and destroyed.



Once they get their act together, they people are going to come for Russia and Putin's ilk in spades.

And they will deserve everything that they get!

Wait till it's Moscow and the Kremlin burning and see how they like them apples.

a reply to: xpert11


All excellent points.

For some reason it seems only 4 countries have been willing to assist Ukraine without coordination/approval by the biden administration.

I hope that changes, biden repeatedly got lost in the Whitehouse bushes.

Other countries really shouldn't be looking for leadership from us this time, and those 4 others have been doing fairly well leading without us.

* - 6 wounded as result of Russian army shelling on Lozova in Kharkiv region

* - Ukrainian airborne assault troops in control of Pripyat town and parts of state border between Belarus and Ukraine

* - Kharkiv, Kharkivska Oblast(12:53). Red Alert: aerial threat. Sirens sounding. Take cover now!

* -European Council President: Shocked by haunting images of atrocities committed by Russian army in Kyiv liberated region #BuchaMassacre. EU is assisting Ukraine and NGO's in gathering of necessary evidence for pursuit in international courts. Further EU sanctions & support are on their way

As a reminder -

Just so people know and understand. Information from war zones can become confusing as there will no doubt be info released from the players (on both sides) involved that might not necessarily be true.

As such take everything as a possibility and NOT as absolute truth.

The very first casualty in a war is the truth and all warfare is based on deception

* - Ukraine official: Draft peace treaty documents between Ukraine and Russia at an advanced stage
click link for video


* - Russia says Crimea is not on tha table for discussion. Oddly enough he did not say the same thing about Luhansk and Donetsk.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Pripyat is a "ghost city" that was founded to serve as an urban area for those working at Chernobyl.

Wonder what the Belarus border guards and army make of the border situation. Seeing the big bear boys retreating their hindsides off can't be good for Belarusian morale.

Cheers

a reply to: Xcathdra

"Ukrainian airborne assault troops in control of Pripyat town and parts of state border between Belarus and Ukraine"


OMG.

Is Ukraine trying to cut off 30,000 rapidly retreating russians?

originally posted by: PatriotGames4u
a reply to: Xcathdra

"Ukrainian airborne assault troops in control of Pripyat town and parts of state border between Belarus and Ukraine"


OMG.

Is Ukraine trying to cut off 30,000 rapidly retreating russians?

Will the phrase Pripyat Pocket be used by future historians? Hmm.

Cheers

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2


A whole lot of russian troops were reported to be rapidly retreating through a route JUST west of there yesterday.

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2


You coined it, proof is here.

originally posted by: andy06shake

Once they get their act together, they people are going to come for Russia and Putin's ilk in spades.

Let’s hope so.

I saw on the news some of the new toys the US is hooking them up with... like for example, drones that are loaded with explosives and can fit in a backpack, which can just fly around, find the target and then just dive straight for it like a kamikaze.

Sounded pretty impressive to me.

a reply to: andy06shake

I get what you are saying they should be punished , but what you are suggesting is the reason we have generational trauma and people wishing to seek revenge for crimes committed

eye for an eye n that , people should not seek revenge on each other for the acts of their governments
we are being played by them all

we dont want hosilities to continue and no on should seek revenge by destroying Russia and its people
this is how war is perpetuated people openly calling for others to be destroyed.

all the while the politicians and the arms manufacturers making a killing in sales
everyone share prices go up and our wealth is spent on "defense of democracy and our way of life"
and they are all happy as we are divided and easily manipulated

Remember 9-1-1? When the entirety of the USA was screaming for retribution? When it launched ultimately a 2.4 trillion dollar war?

The annals of time can easily cloud minds but that doesn't really stop the knee-jerk reaction which is often much more difficult to stop than to commence.

originally posted by: sapien82

we dont want hosilities to continue and no on should seek revenge by destroying Russia and its people
this is how war is perpetuated people openly calling for others to be destroyed.

You're right, we nor anyone should want this, but i suspect it likely will happen. The one thing that may prevent it is that a lot of Ukranians - a LOT - have extended family in Russia.


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You need look no further than this thread to see that, with or without large defense budgets...

originally posted by: sapien82
we are divided and easily manipulated

originally posted by: alphabetaone
Remember 9-1-1? When the entirety of the USA was screaming for retribution? When it launched ultimately a 2.4 trillion dollar war?

Well, the US got totally hoodwinked with that whole ordeal by bush, who had no interest in taking revenge on the perpetrators and instead was only interested in a vendetta to revenge daddy’s honour by successfully invading Iraq... who btw, had nothing to do with 911 in the first place.

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

The switchblades are rather smart i have to agree.

Come in two types i think, one for tanks and apc, and the other for softer targets.

The whole entire shebang regarding modern warfare is being changed by drones considering there capability and expendability.

Impressive indeed the way humanity devises new and interesting ways kill one another and equipment.

If only we could apply ourselves in other areas in the same manner we do where warfare is concerned the world might be a far better place to exist.

a reply to: sapien82

I understand sapien82, well maybe not understand, but accept and agree in principle as to the majority of what you are saying.

Good luck changing the human condition all the same because our capacity to seek vengeance and/or justice is only matched by our capacity for evil.

End of the day and given Russia's actions, its not really about what NATO nations want any longer, but what Ukraine are willing to do where retribution is concerned.

Its all right to suggest turning the other cheek sapien82, whole different kit and caboodle to actual do so.

Ukraine is not apt to forget Putin nor Russia's antics for a few centuries to come put it that way.

And long after Putin is pan bread people will still continue to pay the price for his invasion antics, that's pretty much a given.

Russia will not be looked upon as an equal among nations for generations to come. The evidence of barbaric savagery being recorded in the wake of the Russian withdrawal will make sure of it.

The armed forces of Russia are an embarrassment of inability. If it weren't for the nuclear arsenal, the threat of these forces would be no more than the rebels of the average African despot.

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

Yea, i agree. Hoodwinked for sure. I know as a fact that GWB had absolutely nothing to do with 911 lol

a reply to: andy06shake

I agree Russia created an enemy on their doorstep and im sure they will be looking for ways to retaliate in the future. Seems Putin all-around has underestimated the response to invading Ukraine. He even managed to break the friendship with India and China. China is refusing to help Russia they keep abstaining in UN votes. but worse the areas they could help they are refusing to for example they refuse to use rubles to buy Russian gas. They refused to supply aviation parts for the planes Russians ceased. The Asian infrastructure investment bank has frozen Russian assets in Russia and Belarus. The people's bank of china could have saved the fall of the ruble and chose not to. What they did was double the trading range between the Chinese yuan and the ruble which allowed the ruble to drop faster and further.

China sees a weak Russia as a huge strategic advantage and China has always wanted to fracture the west and all Russia has done is unite them stronger than ever.