Russia Ukraine Update Thread - part 2

originally posted by: JinMI

We backed off? Source required.

We're not engaged in theatre in Ukraine. All the source you need.

originally posted by: JinMI

Yea, I know. So we should just go ahead and level moscow then, right?

No. We should threaten to level Moscow if their aggression spills over even a little into NATO member states.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Russia's army has shown their cards and they are total #. They already lost the war in Ukraine and most likely will back off and stabilize the area they have been fighting a proxy war in these last 8 years.

I don't get how they can be so lost that they still get to control the same regions in Ukraine that they have been.

Personally, I'm curious as to the status of Mariupol and Odessa.

Putin took Crimea because he wanted to secure the naval footprint there, whatever else he said was just an excuse.

Agreed and would like to apply the same logic to the land bridge to Crimea that has yet to be relinquished.

originally posted by: JinMI

Agreed. The chitty thing is, civilian casualties are a uniform effect.

Yep, a lot of people will die, and a lot of people died in Crimea too. My point is that we need to stop looking at all this as to whether Ukraine is NATO or not. We are already pumping billions of dollars in high-tech weapons to them from Poland right now and Russia just doesn't have any match to it all. If Putin doesn't pull back take his losses and a smaller area of land it will bleed into Poland soon than later.

So the big question is what are we willing to do then that we are not willing to do now?

a reply to: alphabetaone

We're not engaged in theatre in Ukraine. All the source you need.

15 Billion reasons to suggest otherwise.

No. We should threaten to level Moscow if their aggression spills over even a little into NATO member states.

I think they also know that. Trump shared your sentiment.

However Ukraine is not NATO. There's where my positions stem from.

a reply to: Xtrozero

My assumption, prediction is that "smaller area of land" is all pootin actually wants.

Fully open to being wrong. It makes more sense than pootin being an unhinged, insane madman, deranged by visions of grandeur, which may have some merit, but not in strategic remedies.

originally posted by: JinMI

I don't get how they can be so lost that they still get to control the same regions in Ukraine that they have been.

They lost because if they push for all of Ukraine it will be their forever war. I guess Putin really believed his own hype that the people of Ukraine would cheer his troops as they marched to the capital unopposed...lol

This war hasn't even started to get ugly. Wait until the drones come into play and anything Putin moves is killed or destroyed. America and EU have been playing real war for 20 years, I don't think it is a good time to go up against them.

a reply to: JinMI


So russia invaded and fought a costly war just to get back to where it was an hour before the invasion started, but with russia cancelled by the planet, Ukraine destroyed, and lots of humans killed?

I think you have a strange definition of 'win'.

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Xtrozero

My assumption, prediction is that "smaller area of land" is all pootin actually wants.

Fully open to being wrong. It makes more sense than pootin being an unhinged, insane madman, deranged by visions of grandeur, which may have some merit, but not in strategic remedies.

I really think he went for it all and is ending up with the booby prize that is going to cost him more than he knows.

originally posted by: JinMI

15 Billion reasons to suggest otherwise.

What the hell are you talking about? 15 billion what? We are not currently engaged in combat theatre in Ukraine. Period. Full stop. We, the USA, nor NATO has fired a single shot nor put boots on the ground in Ukraine.

originally posted by: JinMI

I think they also know that.

There's a difference between knowing it, and having it pointed out directly to them.

originally posted by: JinMI

Trump shared your sentiment.

Yea. No, he definitely didn't. He's far too busy asking Putin for favors to bother with eccentricities like denouncing autocrats.

originally posted by: JinMI

However Ukraine is not NATO. There's where my positions stem from.

This will not stop with Ukraine, left unchecked. No one suggested Ukraine is NATO.

a reply to: alphabetaone

I think he's referring to humanitarian aid dollars.

a reply to: Xtrozero

They lost because if they push for all of Ukraine it will be their forever war.

I'd argue that this was never their strategy. It seems a fools errand and the rest of your post shows why.

From my point of view, that is the land bridge, it seems to fit. It is/was similar to the Crimea annexation. Now you could argue that this has taken much more time and the goal has already been achieved, to which you'd be correct. I'm not sure what goes on behind closed doors so varying reasons could be elusive on that at this time.

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Probably right. Then he should be asking the right questions that he doesnt know about, like "what is theatre"?

a reply to: JinMI

I'm not seeing much ""strategy"" from Russia if im honest.

They cant even do columns never mind Blitzkrieg ffs.

Plenty of surprise all the same.

Never mind discombobulation in spades.

What they are after is remorse and an apology.

I don't think Putin is a big enough man all the same if im honest.

a reply to: alphabetaone


He used it to imply we have been arming Ukraine for a decade in another thread.

originally posted by: JinMI

I'd argue that this was never their strategy. It seems a fools errand and the rest of your post shows why.

From my point of view, that is the land bridge, it seems to fit. It is/was similar to the Crimea annexation. Now you could argue that this has taken much more time and the goal has already been achieved, to which you'd be correct. I'm not sure what goes on behind closed doors so varying reasons could be elusive on that at this time.

So why is he pushing from 6 different directions? He doesn't want to remove the Government and put his own puppet in? If not then why is he leveling everything right up to the capital city? Why is he pushing to the capital for 30 days when he could have stopped on day 2.

There is no logic in what he is doing if he didn't want to take the capital.

a reply to: alphabetaone

What the hell are you talking about? 15 billion what? We are not currently engaged in combat theatre in Ukraine. Period. Full stop. We, the USA, nor NATO has fired a single shot nor put boots on the ground in Ukraine.

Whatever helps you sleep at night. Arms, ammo, aid etc etc oh, and cash of course beg to differ.

There's a difference between knowing it, and having it pointed out directly to them.

It's almost like they already know by their actions......
Again, whatever helps you sleep at night.

Yea. No, he definitely didn't. He's far too busy asking Putin for favors to bother with eccentricities like denouncing autocrats.

“They're all saying oh he's a nuclear power, it's like they're afraid of him,” Trump said in a recording of the phone conversation with Daly. “You know, he was a friend of mine, I got along great with him. I say, Vladimir, if you do it, we're hitting Moscow. We're going to hit Moscow. And he sort of believed me like 5 per cent, 10 per cent - that's all you need.” “He never did it during my time John, you know. They were all talking about it, 'Why didn't he do this during the last four years?' Because he knew he couldn't.”

This will not stop with Ukraine, left unchecked. No one suggested Ukraine is NATO.

By your guys' own logic, he can't even take Ukraine. So what do you mean? Can't be both.

a reply to: Xtrozero

There is no logic in what he is doing if he didn't want to take the capital.

That would be an unwise assertion. Instead I would try to find the logic being used.

originally posted by: PatriotGames4u
a reply to: alphabetaone


He used it to imply we have been arming Ukraine for a decade in another thread.

False.

a reply to: JinMI


"Whatever helps you sleep at night. Arms, ammo, aid etc etc oh, and cash of course beg to differ."


What exactly is your problem with helping the non threatening neighbor defend itself and rebuild after russia invaded and started destroying cities and killing humans?

There is nothing at all improper about that.