Russia Ukraine Update Thread

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: ISeekTruth101

I’d be interested to hear your theory on how Hypersonic missiles can be intercepted by the US Navy or their Carrier strike groups.

Because I’ve done the calculations, but please Andy do share.

How many hyper missiles do they have, what warhead is on them, what is their range, do they even work as advertised? I think it was estimated after the fall of the USSR that they could only maintain 20% or less of active missile sites we thought were ready, so why is it any different now?

1000KM range using an advanced fuel developed by the Russians.

Can carry a nuclear warhead or conventional. But the kinetic energy at those speeds is destructive enough.

Speed is mach 8 to mach 9 achieved using scramjet.


Everything they learned from the joint venture with Indian on the Brahmos supersonic missile was incorporated into the Zircon hypersonic cruise missile.


They only recently started production on their hypersonic missiles so they dont have a great many but with specs like that it only takes one assuming they have ironed out all the engineering problems regarding navigation at these hypersonic speeds.

Its entered production so I doubt they are arming their ships with these missiles if they dont work lol

They also have a decent amount of Sunburn/moskit missiles which are mach 3 capable and more than enough to cause any navy ship problems.

a reply to: ISeekTruth101

Oh well your obviously correct and there is no defence against hypersonic attack.

Better all just pack up and go back home.

Russia wins ladies and germs. LoL

Maybe learn that the nature of the game, weapon wise anyroad, is that if you produce an offensive weapon, someone else is apt to devise a defence against such.

As to reaction times shooting down something traveling in excess of a mile a second will require computer detection and control.........or the flash, LoL

a reply to: ISeekTruth101

An yet ran out of tires for there APC and cannot supply their troops and/or tanks with adequate fuel or food.

Plenty of hypersonics all the same. LoL

Talk about an enigma.

It is officially the craziest war:

Some wild video in the link below of Chechens (from the Sheikh Mansur Volunteer Battalion) fighting Russians.
Link

The New York Times

Pentagon assessed Russia’s “combat power” in Ukraine: over 150,000 troops massed in Belarus & western Russian prior to invasion dipped below 90% of original force reflecting losses Russia suffered at the hands of Ukrainian soldiers.

Newsweek

After accusing the U.S. of producing bioweapons in Ukraine, the Russian Ministry of Defense has added another feather-ruffling theory to their accusation: That the U.S. is training birds in Ukraine to spread deadly diseases among Russian citizens.
[...]The RIA Novosti broadcast reportedly included maps, documents and photographs of birds bearing the U.S. coat of arms.

DISCLAIMER: last pic is fake... or is it?

About two hours ago it was reported that "On March 24, at the NATO summit, the President of Poland will offer to bring alliance peacekeepers to Ukraine - the Polish media, citing sources in the Ministry of Defense."

This morning I read this on Telegram. I saved it because it was interesting but dismissed it as just someone spouting off.

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: ISeekTruth101

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: ADUB77

Technically they can still be intercepted.

But a swarm attack using multiple different missiles would be another kettle of fish to contend with.

Anyhoo you sink a carrier and you destroy 100s of billions of dollars worth of both man, machine and munitions.

Any nation silly enough to play that game is apt to provoke a response of the tactical nuclear sorts.

I’d be interested to hear your theory on how Hypersonic missiles can be intercepted by the US Navy or their Carrier strike groups.

Because I’ve done the calculations, but please Andy do share.

The capability is there just not for a large amount of them say 20 could easily overwhelm the aegis system. Less than 5 would get splashed. but the problem is finding the carrier is not an easy task for Russia. but lets say an aircraft managed to get off a launch the missile still needs to e guided and dazzlers alone would be quite an effective missile defense cant hit what it cant see. Then there is the SM6 which can intercept hypersonic missiles and in fact is hypersonic itself. However, having said that the system cant handle a large number of them luckily Russia cant afford to make a lot of them.

With all due respect, nothing america has can stop it and they have admitted as such. It travels at mach 8 to mach 9... nothing exists that can catch up at those speeds. Then there is reaction time where it travels 2.8KM a second... so that puts CWIS and Laser at a disadvantage.

CWIS has a range of 4km which gives 1.4 seconds reaction time if it knew where it was coming from. And laser has a 2.8 second reaction time.

I believed these systems would struggle against the sunburn ss n 22. Let alone the new hypersonic missile.

Russia says it travels so fast it creates a plasma cloud infront that absorbs electromagnetic energy i.e signal blocking. Can’t see it on radar head on.

The only waynto avoid it is if the missile itself fails to reach its target. There are many engineering problems in navigating a missile that moves that fast and we dont know how the russians solved them

a reply to: ISeekTruth101

Might travel at Mach 8/Mach 9 probably more like Mach 6.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Yes, they are planning to propose it in the upcoming NATO summit that Zelensky should virtually attend.

All over Reuters.

originally posted by: ISeekTruth101

Speed is mach 8 to mach 9 achieved using scramjet.

That video was not mach 8 by a good deal, maybe mach 3, so not so sure it was what people suggest it was.

They only recently started production on their hypersonic missiles so they dont have a great many but with specs like that it only takes one assuming they have ironed out all the engineering problems regarding navigation at these hypersonic speeds.

Lots of "ifs" it seems with it all. People seems to just think these things are pretty quick to be operational. They could still be years away from true operations.

Its entered production so I doubt they are arming their ships with these missiles if they dont work lol

Production and operation are two different events. I'm also not sure if this means a totally different launch system too.

Sigh...
Official Thread Reminder....

This is the topic:

Russia Ukraine Update Thread

Let's please stick to that topic. No trolling, bickering, mud slinging, arguing about Military Nazi numbers, or chest thumping......
Please use the Private Message system for Chit Chat.
Community Announcement re: Decorum





You are responsible for your own posts.
Ignoring this responsibility will include temporary POSTING BANS.




and, as always:

Do NOT reply to this post!!

originally posted by: ISeekTruth101

With all due respect, nothing america has can stop it and they have admitted as such. It travels at mach 8 to mach 9... nothing exists that can catch up at those speeds. Then there is reaction time where it travels 2.8KM a second... so that puts CWIS and Laser at a disadvantage.

CWIS has a range of 4km which gives 1.4 seconds reaction time if it knew where it was coming from. And laser has a 2.8 second reaction time.

I believed these systems would struggle against the sunburn ss n 22. Let alone the new hypersonic missile.

Russia says it travels so fast it creates a plasma cloud infront that absorbs electromagnetic energy i.e signal blocking. Can’t see it on radar head on.

The only waynto avoid it is if the missile itself fails to reach its target. There are many engineering problems in navigating a missile that moves that fast and we dont know how the russians solved them

So a couple of points, active ship radar can detect at the 50 mile range so 30 seconds before impact. With a E-2D Hawkeye early warning radar aircraft, or even an F-35 Joint Strike Fighter in the air that pushes detection to 100 miles or 1 minute before impact. If it is actually flies at Mach 6 and not Mach 8 then that is even more time.

An Evolved Sea Sparrow Missile surface-to-air missile, or a SM-6 missile can engage it even at Mach 8. The US has had 3+ years to think of what can be done too to stop a Mach 8 missile.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: ISeekTruth101

Speed is mach 8 to mach 9 achieved using scramjet.

That video was not mach 8 by a good deal, maybe mach 3, so not so sure it was what people suggest it was.

They only recently started production on their hypersonic missiles so they dont have a great many but with specs like that it only takes one assuming they have ironed out all the engineering problems regarding navigation at these hypersonic speeds.

Lots of "ifs" it seems with it all. People seems to just think these things are pretty quick to be operational. They could still be years away from true operations.

Its entered production so I doubt they are arming their ships with these missiles if they dont work lol

Production and operation are two different events. I'm also not sure if this means a totally different launch system too.

Why do you think production and operation are different?

This has been in the works for a while so they are operational now I believe from what I read. Russia has long had supersonic missiles like sunburn/Moskit. This is merely the next stage in their missile tech.

It’s funny we all poke at russia being inferior yet the US has relied on their rocket technology for a long time to send assets into space ?

I think a lot of people are sleeping on russian missile technology in comparison to the west.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Sounds like this was a done deal from the start even if unplanned in reality but knowing how things would pan out. Poland gets back original Poland / west Ukraine and Russia gets back its east and south Ukraine.

a reply to: ISeekTruth101

First that's simply not true your facts are all wrong one you don't have to catch the missile you just have to get in its way. This was the testing they did with the SM6 which can reach out hundreds of km by the way. Next Russia didn't perform some magic trick here you make it sound like they performed a miracle.

Russia’s Kh-47M2 Kinzhal (or Dagger) is neither a hypersonic boost-glide vehicle nor is it a scramjet-powered cruise missile. Instead, it’s little more than the first stage of a 9K720 Iskander short-range ballistic missile married to a new targeting apparatus and mounted on the belly of a MiG-31 (or carried inside Tu-22M3 bombers). The Russians don't have the tech or the money to produce a real hypersonic this was patched together Russia can’t afford to repair its single, ailing aircraft carrier, has struggled to fund its standing Su-57 orders, and has yet to find a way to finance large-scale production of their advanced T-14 Armata tank (among a long list of other unfunded or underfunded programs). Russia needs foreign buyers for platforms like their new Checkmate fighter in order to be able to afford to build their own in any real numbers. The same can be said for advanced missile systems they don't have it in anywhere near the quantities to even be useful.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: ISeekTruth101

With all due respect, nothing america has can stop it and they have admitted as such. It travels at mach 8 to mach 9... nothing exists that can catch up at those speeds. Then there is reaction time where it travels 2.8KM a second... so that puts CWIS and Laser at a disadvantage.

CWIS has a range of 4km which gives 1.4 seconds reaction time if it knew where it was coming from. And laser has a 2.8 second reaction time.

I believed these systems would struggle against the sunburn ss n 22. Let alone the new hypersonic missile.

Russia says it travels so fast it creates a plasma cloud infront that absorbs electromagnetic energy i.e signal blocking. Can’t see it on radar head on.

The only waynto avoid it is if the missile itself fails to reach its target. There are many engineering problems in navigating a missile that moves that fast and we dont know how the russians solved them

So a couple of points, active ship radar can detect at the 50 mile range so 30 seconds before impact. With a E-2D Hawkeye early warning radar aircraft, or even an F-35 Joint Strike Fighter in the air that pushes detection to 100 miles or 1 minute before impact. If it is actually flies at Mach 6 and not Mach 8 then that is even more time.

An Evolved Sea Sparrow Missile surface-to-air missile, or a SM-6 missile can engage it even at Mach 8. The US has had 3+ years to think of what can be done too to stop a Mach 8 missile.

Assuming the missile can be detected on radar. Even if it could be detected the problem is not the early warning.

If you stood with your back towards me and I had a gun pointed at you, and gave you early warning that I would pull the trigger it wouldnt help you. You aint dodging that bullet.

Even if sea sparrow and the CWIS and the laser knew which heading the Zircon was coming from it would still need a lock.

And achieving a lock takes time, for AEGIS perhaps 15 seconds absolute best. But how is it supposed to achieve a lock against a target that blocks all signal comms? Same way a space shuttle reentering the atmosphere loses communication .

Laser and CWIS haven’t a chance in hell in reacting or achieving a signal lock in the time they have. And then what happens when the Zircon make an course correction? At these speeds and distances all calculations and bets are off.

As for the ESSM how do you expect it to intercept zircon?

Again if a super fast bullet is travelling towards you and you have a slower bullet to intercept it you better hope the calculations are extremely accurate trajectory wise, because the slightest change in course correction from Zircon and you need a supercomputer for real time changes- this isnt a ballistic missile... its a cruise missile... you cannot plot its course so easily. I highly doubt the ESSM is capable of such feats. I’d bet money if Zircon works as it says on paper ESSM has no chance to defend against such a weapon.

Look at the arc degree at these ranges off by a fraction of a degree and you’re hitting nothing but air... Zircon diameter is 60cm lol.

How... just how would you intercept that?

originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: ISeekTruth101

First that's simply not true your facts are all wrong one you don't have to catch the missile you just have to get in its way. This was the testing they did with the SM6 which can reach out hundreds of km by the way. Next Russia didn't perform some magic trick here you make it sound like they performed a miracle.

Russia’s Kh-47M2 Kinzhal (or Dagger) is neither a hypersonic boost-glide vehicle nor is it a scramjet-powered cruise missile. Instead, it’s little more than the first stage of a 9K720 Iskander short-range ballistic missile married to a new targeting apparatus and mounted on the belly of a MiG-31 (or carried inside Tu-22M3 bombers). The Russians don't have the tech or the money to produce a real hypersonic this was patched together Russia can’t afford to repair its single, ailing aircraft carrier, has struggled to fund its standing Su-57 orders, and has yet to find a way to finance large-scale production of their advanced T-14 Armata tank (among a long list of other unfunded or underfunded programs). Russia needs foreign buyers for platforms like their new Checkmate fighter in order to be able to afford to build their own in any real numbers. The same can be said for advanced missile systems they don't have it in anywhere near the quantities to even be useful.

The Zircon isnt the Khinzal, maybe you are mistaken? Why did you think they were the same?

* - Russia is likely to respond to failures to suppress Ukrainian revolt in occupied cities with increasingly "violent and coercive measures: British Defense Intelligence Russian efforts to manipulate media and install pro-Kremlin puppets have "failed" so far, UK assesses

* - The Biden administration is preparing new sanctions on most members of Russia's State Duma, the lower house of parliament, as the U.S. continues its crackdown on Moscow over its ongoing war against Ukraine

* - Ukraine's CERT team has published a report today detailing yet another data wiper aimed at its systems. This one's called DoubleZero and comes after other wiper attacks such as: -WhisperGate -HermeticWiper -IsaacWiper -CaddyWiper

* - Clashes and artillery shelling in Trostyanets, fires burning

* - 3 missile strikes today in Rivne region - head of regional administration

* - Russian aircraft and artillery struck at Avdiivka. "Russian fascists killed 5 residents of Avdiivka today, 20 wounded", said Pavlo Kyrylenko, head of the Donetsk Regional State Administration

* - The Russian Foreign Ministry: The decisions of the International Criminal Court on Ukraine are a desire to contribute to the anti-Russia hysteria

* - Following-up yesterday's EU Foreign Affairs Council in a VTC within the WeimarTriangle: FMs @ABaerbock, @JY_LeDrian and @RauZbigniew discussed intensively, among others, further sanctions and coordinated distribution of refugees from the war in Ukraine

* - Russia's nuclear posture - "We haven't seen anything that would lead us to conclude that we need to change our strategic deterrent posture" - says @PentagonPresSec. Calls Kremlin's nuclear rhetoric "dangerous". "It's not the way a responsible nuclear power should act"

* - Russian military fired on Kyiv. A truck and two buildings were on fire. As a result of the shelling, one person was killed and three others were injured. This was reported by the Kyiv Military Administration

* - Ukraine increasingly taking the fight to Russia - "We have seen indications that the Ukrainians are going a bit more on the offense now. Particularly in the south, near Kherson" per @PentagonPresSec

* - Russia launched 5 missiles this morning at Odesa region, only material damage caused - Head of Odesa regional administration

* - Macron denounces Russia's use of "explosive weapons" against civilians

* - Tsihanouskaya: We receive information about a possible invasion of Belarusian troops into Ukraine. I addressed Belarusian military personnel, stressing that those giving and following such orders will be brought before the tribunal. Those who will refuse – will be exempted from liability

* - Footage on Telegram this evening shows what appears to be several cruise missile launches from a Russian ship in the Black Sea

* - Russian army halted assault on Izium after heavy losses

* - Sullivan: President Biden will announce new sanctions against Russia and discuss the long-term deployment of troops during his visit to Europe

As a reminder -

Just so people know and understand. Information from war zones can become confusing as there will no doubt be info released from the players (on both sides) involved that might not necessarily be true.

As such take everything as a possibility and NOT as absolute truth.

The very first casualty in a war is the truth and all warfare is based on deception

* - Russian army shelled areas in Kyiv region 20 times today

* - General Staff of Armed forces of Ukraine: Russia has conducted 80 sorties today, including 29 from Baranovichi and Babruisk in Belarus

* - Polish Deputy Foreign Minister: Russia is bombing residential areas and hospitals in Ukraine and it must stop

* - Civil defense removed UXOs at Heolohiv settlement in Kherson

* - Russian army continues to shell Kharkiv with heavy weapons

* - One killed as result of shelling that targeted Obolon district in Kyiv

* - Ukrainian forces shoot down Russian plane bombing the city. The plane was taken down by Ukrainian military at 4:45 p.m. on March 22, Mariupol City Council reports (so much for the "reports" that Mariupol was taken by the Russians).

* - Pavlohrad-2 railway station was completely destroyed in a missile strike. 15 freight cars derailed. 1 killed

* - Russian Ministry of Defense claims control over Verkhniotoretske

* - As result of shelling that targeted Lozova town in Kharkiv region, 8 civilians wounded. About 20 private houses destroyed

* - Photo: debris of a missile shot down yesterday near Mykolaiv

* - Russian military has released journalist Victoria Roshchina. Shr is located in the territory controlled by Ukraine and goes to Zaporizhzhia - hromadske

* - Emergency Service: Russians shell children's hospital in Severdonetsk, Luhansk Oblast. The hospital's roof caught fire. Seven children and 15 adults were evacuated, the State Emergency Service reported on March 22

* - Explosions reported in Pavlohrad, Dnipropetrovsk region

* - 2 missile strikes targeted Lozova, Kharkiv region

* - Russian Iskander cruise missile was shot down in Vinnitsa region - the head of the Vinnitsa regional administration Serhiy Borzov

* - Photojournalist Maks Levin disappeared on March, 13 between Moshchun and Huta Mezhihirska, where heavy battle took place on that day. He drove on his car to Huta Mezhihirska and went with his camera on Moshchun direction. Last message is on 11:23 am

* - Russian planes dropped two heavy bombs on the city of Mariupol

* - NATO spokeswoman: The alliance has strengthened its defense presence in the eastern part with more forces, aircraft and ships

* - Strong explosions are also heard in different districts of Kharkiv

* - Russian troops used tear gas to disperse protesters in Kherson

* - Interception over Bilhorod, Russian channels claim that the Russian ADs intercepted an Ukrainian missile

* - Poland's president @AndrzejDuda after the meeting with Bulgarian president: Russian leadership behaves in Ukraine like Hitler, like the SS during the World War 2 in Poland. These are unprecedented massacres

* - Russian army shelled Mykolaiv sea port. Badly damaged, but no casualties

* - Location of Russian firing positions seen on @Maxar imagery from yesterday, in a field NW of Irpin

* - Moschun village near Kyiv was fully cleared of Russian troops

* - Russian artillery increased shelling of Kharkiv and suburbs, 84 shelling recorded in 24 hours - head of Kharkiv regional administration

* - Russia shells Zhytomyr Oblast, 3 houses destroyed, 10 damaged. Buildings near Malyn were shelled by Russian troops, Ukraine's State Emergency Service said on March 22

* - Russian troops shelled petrol station in Mykolaiv. 3 killed, 1 woman injured - official

* - The mayor of Boryspil urges civilians to leave the city

As a reminder -

Just so people know and understand. Information from war zones can become confusing as there will no doubt be info released from the players (on both sides) involved that might not necessarily be true.

As such take everything as a possibility and NOT as absolute truth.

The very first casualty in a war is the truth and all warfare is based on deception