Rendlesham Forest…, A Christmas Story from 1980 - Can We ‘Let it Be’?

originally posted by: ctj83
a reply to: KilgoreTrout

I think Keech explained it as telluric currents creating radio waves through quartz deposits behind the array.

I would need a more detailed description to know how and why that would do anything with anything. I'm not even sure in what context Keech would imply that would have an affect. However, could that 80 acres of aluminium netting, linked up to a copper box (tank?) be a Telluric Battery? Is that how they powered the array? Salt marsh would appear to be conducive to such a system, and, as I recall, when Cobra Mist was active, they were shipping in water, because the local water is very hard. I did wonder if the airmen, Burroughs in particular, was drinking the tap water. That could have helped exacerbate the effect of whatever affected him. Either way, telluric currents, are of interest, given the salt marsh, combined with water logged heath around the bases, I am just not sure what quartz has to do with anything...and it is probably worth noting that the only quartz deposits in the area, I think, are in the form of flint.

a reply to: KilgoreTrout

I'm assuming they powered the array from Sizewell, like the Duga was powered by Chernobyl (enough for 250,000 houses if I remember correctly).

Interesting point regarding the flint, and also the general nature of the area.

I do, however, think that Cobra Mist / Cold Witness has nothing to do with the RFI.

I'd propose we scratch off:
- Satellite retrivals
- OTH Radar

as primary contributors to the RFI.

originally posted by: pigsy2400
Stanford Research Institute (SRI International)

That's, effectively, a branch/division/"friend" of the DoD isn't it though? The SAC investigation committee had both British and US, as well as industrial partners. The technology, I am sure, was broken down into seperate areas of R&D subsequent to the "failure" of Cobra Mist, SRI would most certainly have been involved in that.

originally posted by: pigsy2400
Yes, an OTH radar system being in the vicinity is an interesting addition to the story arc considering how it works and atmospheric effects etc especially the effects of it that was des, my posts quite a few page back confirm my interest in this in the wider spectrum of the area and the RFI itself.

The issue is that we cannot attribute Cobra Mist to the incident itself, the timelines just don't match up. I am not disagreeing in the strategic significance of the area, just that the timelines within itself don't match.

If they left equipment there though, on the provisio that it could later be utilised as a "test bed", and if in fact "tests" of some kind were being performed in the vicinity, then the location and the material that was not cleared in the break down, would be relevant. As would the selection of the site in the first place for such an array. In terms of the Rendlesham incident the path and behaviour of telluric currents may be a factor, and if they were known to be "harvestable" in that area, and hence why Orfordness was selected as the test site for Cobra Mist...maybe...perhaps...I consider it a factor that hasn't been adequately explored. In a number of ways.

But, ya know, that's just me.

a reply to: ctj83

I am not, repeat not, proposing that OTH radar has anything to do with it. Ionospheric sounding, perhaps, but not anything fixed, array wise, in the way in which Cobra Mist was. Tests would/could have utilised mobile units. It's more a question of how, and indeed if, the site has any effect on the overall behaviour of the environment, which may or may not lead to an amplification of excitation processes. Telluric current activity in the area adds a dimension of possibilities to the situation that I hadn't previously appreciated. Either way it's interesting.

I'd really like to know what the wire mesh is about, telluric battery is the best explanation I've had so far though, so I'll stick to that until otherwise corrected. Ta very much.

a reply to: KilgoreTrout

Interesting KT!! Do you mean that you think the battery effect may have played a role in the RFI or do you mean that it played a role in stopping Cobra Mist working?

I also wonder what environmental impact the structure may have left

In relation to Cobra Mist there is a document from the UK National Archives - DEFE 71/48 that contains some interesting information. Although not the sole reason for discontinuing the operation of Cobra Mist, advances in satellite technology meant that Cobra Mist was not really cost effective.



There are also comments about a radar station constructed at Orfordness. The operations of which might cause electrical side effects and effect heart pacemakers.



It also discusses radio hazards of short duration from that might cause damage to MF/HF band receivers.



Cobra Mist was dismantled but you do wonder about the residual research based around it.

a reply to: ctj83

Golly, I am completely sure that I do not know enough about telluric batteries to say one way or another, I'm just settling for an explanation of something that I can't otherwise explain, that wire mesh, the more I read up on it though, the less satisfied I am that that is the answer. Or all of it.

I don't think that Cobra Mist did stop working, I think it worked too well and other technology needed to be developed before that potential could be fully exploited. In terms of Rendlesham, for me, any potential source of EM is of interest. Given that the incident occurred at night time, telluric currents themselves, directly, seem unlikely to be involved, but then again, much would depend upon what influence those telluric currents have on the environment, what other natural systems utilise and depend upon them. Likewise, now we have man-made sources of EM interacting with those, what effect might those create through boundary interactions, particularly in areas where range drift might occur.

a reply to: mirageman

It is interesting that in the publicly released statement, made on 26th February 1971, they amend the phrase "the accidental operation of electronically initiated explosives" from the document that you post, to read "The spontaneous operation of certain kinds of electrically initiated devices which are normally carried only by commercial and military vessels and aircraft." I suppose if you shouldn't be carrying explosives you don't deserve fair warning...does make one wonder if there were any near misses though...or indeed, actual explosions...

...but that is probably irrelevant to Rendlesham, other than demonstrating that "they" are quite happy to take risks with people's health as long as "they" can maintain plausible deniability...or even implausible deniability in many cases, this one included.

a reply to: KilgoreTrout

This may interest you. I believe some of the equipment was taken in Broadhaven in Wales to be used for submarine communications due to the nature of the bedrock there.

originally posted by: ctj83
a reply to: KilgoreTrout

This may interest you. I believe some of the equipment was taken in Broadhaven in Wales to be used for submarine communications due to the nature of the bedrock there.

Interestingly there was a famous UFO case there too at Broadhaven Primary School and the farm incident not too far away...

a reply to: pigsy2400

It certainly was.

In fact that was the subject of the first ever thread I pulled together on here

The Broad Haven School UFO Incident Wales - 1977 Part 1

One of the original witnesses even turned up to comment.

I also wonder why I added Part 1 onto the title. I never intended to do a Part 2 LOL!

a reply to: mirageman

Shame it didn't get more traction mm as looks like a very interesting thread/story and really cool a witness joined the conversation too.

Whatever the phenomenon is, it's clear there is evidence that it can possibly be manipulated/created (didn't want to use the word summoned but oh well)through the use of advanced radar systems, their effect on the local area and manipulation of atmospheric conditions.

Due to the number of sightings including RFI that are in close proximity to military installations and experimental radar equipment, it does to me at least suggest that we need to research more sightings to see if the hypothesis that radar and similar military systems could initiate the phenomenon.

a reply to: pigsy2400

I believe it was at Ripperston farm that someone saw the entire bay (water I assume) vibrate.

a reply to: ctj83

I am interested in that, thank you, particularly in light of the subsequent posts by pigsy and mirage man.

a reply to: mirageman

Aren't kids great?

The descriptions, and drawings, remind me of the earliest witnesses from Hessdalen where, increasingly, what is seen meets the expectation of what will be seen, and yet, when stripped down of such projections, show a certain degree of consensus as to the phenomenon's behaviour. Especially day-light "sightings", in my opinion. David Davies' drawing, focusing more of the where than the what, shows the basic, "cigar shape" but also describes, in his statement, it "tugging" from the bush, I really liked those details and being able to compare them.

Nice thread, thanks for linking to it. I also enjoyed the Kettering one, linked in that link. I thought it quite pertinent to this thread in the respect of John Burroughs commenting that it was "comet-like" on the night of the Rendlesham incident.

The phantom helicopters, also linked, also has it's moments.

Cheers.

This story has been hanging around a few days now. I don't really think it justifies a new thread so I'll post it here as it does have some relevance here. I believe these files were ones John Burroughs discovered had not been released in 2013 despite MoD proclamations that they'd emptied their filing cabinets.

Operation UFO: Britain's race to beat Russia to alien weapons REVEALED in secret files

BRITISH spies planned to capture a flying saucer and use its alien technology to build superweapons, secret files reveal. Even after the Cold War, there were fears that the Soviet Union or China had impounded a UFO and were harvesting its secrets to develop superfast warplanes that could hover in mid-air and be invisible to radar...

The dossier, obtained by British XFiles expert Dr David Clarke, reveals the Government was running two UFO desks.

The public UFO desk was only set up to gather reports of sightings...

The real work was being done by experts from Defence Intelligence.

But by 1997, the word had come down from Whitehall that the security services investigating “X-files stuff such as alien abductions” had become “a diversion from their main duties”...A review was ordered to confirm the desk should be shut down, but also to determine whether anything had been learned over the years which could be useful to military...

The dossier reveals the RAF were “particularly interested in any novel technologies which might be useful to their programmes”...

They were held back from the UFO records earmarked for transfer to the National Archives as part of the Open Government project from 2008 to 2013...


Full story : www.express.co.uk...

Interesting that it says there were two UFO desks. One to answer phone calls and letters and be nice to the press. The other one to chase down ET hardware.

I wonder if Nick Pope will now 'adjust' his stories accordingly about his role at the UFO desk (or head of the UK's UFO Project as he tells Americans).

a reply to: mirageman

I'd like to expand on that Mirage, with something I like to call "The Clarke Files"

Over the past few months, Dr David Clarke of Sheffield Hallam has does some excellent work that I feel hasn't received enough coverage. I also think that it may lead to the same set of files that the RFI experiencer John Burrough's has been pursuing.

Whilst always an excellent investigator, in the past decade, Clarke has become more known for being the representative of the UK National Archives Open Government project, specifically, the UFO files. Clarke has always maintained a rational, conservative viewpoint although I've long suspected that his private views may differ.

I'll point out that there have also been a few cases where I've found Clarke's assessments or conclusions unusual. He's also known for an ongoing spat with Nick Pope.

What Clarke has revealed in his last 3 or 4 blog posts have been nothing short of revelatory. What is even more telling is the tone of the pieces. Dr Clarke is clearly aware of something that has irritated him beyond anything I've seen. What this is, I have no idea.

I strongly recommend that you read his blog posts. The key matter here is that he has early access to the last set of files to be released (due soon) and Clarke himself states that it is clear that the authorities have been trying to delay these files with good reason.

In his 2018 blog posts Clarke has revealed:
- Much more about the background to Project Condign
- How Condign was designed at the outset to close the public facing UFO desk
- His most recent post shows there was a public UFO desk and a private UFO desk
- This second desk, contained spies, although I'm not sure if this is dramatic flair on the part of Dr Clarke
- The Calvine Triangle UFO photographs went missing and the press did not publish them due to a UK 'D Notice'
- Proof of the existence of ASTRA / Aurora

Clarke has also revealed more details if you read between the lines.

I strongly suggest that everyone pay attention to the excellent work that Dr Clarke is doing.

One thing really caught my eye. According to the files, the Daily Record (Scotland) had the Calvine UFO photos returned to them two week after they were taken.

The Daily Record staff have no memory of the UFO, the photographs or them being returned.

Yet, Clarke has uncovered evidence of the 'D Notice' given to them.

Clarke finds this very odd, as do I. I can suggest only two options:

- The event never occurred and is carefully orchestrated hoax
- The event is far more buried than we can imagine.

It's hard not to wonder as to the nature of this second desk, how it operated and more importantly why.

I’ll just add a few small updates.

- Why hasn’t Clarke published a blog post, as opposed to news paper articles, on this second desk?
- Has any proof, in terms of photographs been shown of this second group
- are these the documents John Burroughs spoke of?

Does Burroughs have access?

It seems, from Clarke’s research that Condign was designed to shut down the public desk and the plasma angle was never considered likely.

Where does this leave Pope?

a reply to: ctj83

Call me crazy but I still believe the plasma angle is an important part of the overall puzzle. Whether by dint of what's known about the mysterious phenomena and/or that these concepts have been theoretically weaponized and made their way through the M.I.C.

If Condign is a red herring I'll catch on eventually enough, but EM-related subjects is where much of the black budget stuff has been going on for thereabouts 70-yrs and seems to remain germane to the UFO subject as well.

I admit that the theory as presented in Condign about how the image of black triangles was produced, for example, was a lot of crap, but what I didn't think was crap was the government's interest in plasma and EM-effects as related to the phenomena and for potential weapons breakthroughs.

a reply to: The GUT

Until, or if, Dr Clarke, or Nick Pope responds (which I expect soon), it's hard to say why two UFO Desks were running. Or why in 1996 it was decided to create a report that would be expected to recommend closing down Nick's UFO Desk / Project.