rape prevention , by " teaching men not to rape " a concept ?

reply to post by oblvion


I agree consent is sexy as sin. I hate it that "slut shaming" is a thing. Sex positivity needs to be taught in schools. I mean kids are already having kids in high school so a qiuck refresher in basic respect wouldn't hurt.

theHattersfolly
reply to post by taoistguy

 

Well sure anything is possible, but it is so highly unlikely that he could not readily rape on a whim. In my mind that excludes him from being capable.

My biggest issue with the concept of "Teaching men not to rape" is that it is insulting and it is impossible to teach someone to have empathy for another person. So it is insulting and ineffective. The issue absolutely is about mental health and making sure people have access to it, in my eyes. I just think the slogan sets a dangerous precedent. and in truth every time someone says it I kind of die a little inside. Generally speaking in my head I say something to the effect of "Noooo gender bashing is bad" Because if said aloud I'd be accused of insensitivity to a serious issue and, to be absolutely honest, I'd be lumped in.

Well, the Hawking thing is that him raping is improbable, but not impossible no matter what your mind chooses to think like.

I know what you mean and how you feel about the phrase, but I choose not to feel insulted due to what I said in a more recent post about men having to do more cos basically women have been trying for ages and I'm prepared for a bit of insulting when matched with the aeons of horrific abuse women have suffered. And yes, some men too, so it can only benefit them AND their children (female and male) in the future.

Mental health? Hmmm... Many of the rapists can be considered to be suffering from a mental health problem, yet many of them will pass present mental health tests. They are respected members of society - fathers, doctors, lawyers, soldiers, police, bankers, nurses, the bin man, teachers, etc. I guess the mental health tests need to be changed?

I don't really care whether increasing empathy is utilised to stop (or lessen) rapes - I just want the rapes to stop. A man can go all his life feeling no empathy for the woman for all I care as long as he makes that choice NOT to rape or abuse.

Gender bashing is bad but in this case it is nothing compared to rape. Whoever thought of the term has certainly been clever cos it's got people and men at least talking about the issue at hand - that thousands and thousands of women are being raped,

reply to post by taoistguy


but thats the thing of it You can't teach someone to feel empathy, and no one who feels empathy rapes it is simple as that so the slogan IS ineffective and it IS insulting making it a fool's errand at best and just plain ignorant at worst.

taoistguy
reply to post by SpaDe_

 

It appears you have added to your initial post.
OK, I re-read. So my question now is: Why do you equate men as rapists with women being sluts?
Do you consider women to be sluts?
And I am very surprised that there is no rape in your town/city due to men not raping.

I equate men raping to women being sluts.

Mike Tyson went to jail for rape, even though it was obvious to everyone who saw them that she was going to do him that night.

Bryant, the famous Laker, same thing, it is a money scheme for a lot of women, sad but true fact as far as rich and famous men go.

Women today walk around wearing NOTHING, to arouse men, and then act like men shouldn't be aroused by it.

They intentionally arouse men, and then walk away, because it makes them feel powerful.

Is it any surprise that those that cant control themselves take what they want, just like they do when they steal a car, or rob a bank?

Women are sluts a lot of the time these days, they have 6 boyfriends, lying to all, saying they are the only one etc...

Women act like there are not real world consequences for screwing with a mans head, but don't seem to have the same hang ups if a guy does the same to them.

If a guy did to a woman what women do to men, then every woman on earth( not really but a lot) would have keyed cars, broken property etc....

Instead, it is ok if the woman does these tings, because few ever get into trouble over it, but men do any of these things, and they are in a world of hurt from the law.

There is a double standard from women that makes absolutely no sense on most of the subjects concerning sex and or relationships.

If women can walk around like a tramp wearing nothing, flirting with every man she sees, a man can talk to any woman he wants anytime he wants without any problems.

Woman don't see it this way though, it is all in their favor, or else.

I mean honestly, you have never known a woman to pull the "rape" card just for revenge?

I have, I knew 2 that did it before I left highschool, just to get back at a cheating boyfriend, like that is even reasonable somehow.

oblvion

taoistguy

luciddream
reply to post by taoistguy

 

It was a rebuttal for assuming "men normally rape" because "teach men not to rape" is essentially saying the same thing.. and it is one of the top phrase feminist use.

So i said they should be appreciative of what i did because i didn't rape them like they claim a man would.

In general, men rape. The number of reported, (meaning this does not include all the unreported rapes), rapes is staggeringly huge. Not to mention failed and attempted rapes, non-rape sexual abuse aloso.
I think the feminists have a very valid point.

"in general, men rape"


Really?

So then by your messed up view of the world, "most" men rape women?

I have never, and do not know a single man who has, raped a woman.

I didn't even have sex with my wife if she wasn't into it, even though she would say ok, I knew she didn't want to, so I rolled over and went to sleep, or if the want was bad enough went to the bathroom and masterdebated.

Sorry to burst your bubble here, but from my experience, most men want the woman to want it, or it is not worth doing.

I only enjoy it if they do, even in the midst of "congress", if I can tell she isn't enjoying herself I will just stop.....whats that old saying about getting off on her getting off?

It happens, man wants "some" wifey doesn't, man roles over goes to sleep, tries again tomorrow

Before you start insulting me again I said men rape. So you change it to me saying most men rape?

You claim to not know any man who has raped? I know there are many men who havew raped and then move area and make new friends but keep quiet about the rape.

Just as released peadophiles are on a list and living in our neighbourhoods, you don't know about it until you see the list. As for your sexual ethics - great. Wish more men behaved like that.

reply to post by theHattersfolly


Ahhhh I see what you are saying. You just want awareness about it to spread!!! Ahhh we entirely agree then, I'm just a stickler for the details ya know? I mean truthfully I feel really hurt by that statement as I try my hardest everyday to be the best person I can be to EVERYONE and it seems like no because of my gender I get stereotyped as a rapist because of something other people do? You can't tell me to accept that.

theHattersfolly
reply to post by taoistguy

 

but thats the thing of it You can't teach someone to feel empathy, and no one who feels empathy rapes it is simple as that so the slogan IS ineffective and it IS insulting making it a fool's errand at best and just plain ignorant at worst.

Who said "teach men empathy"?

Basically, it's trying to get men to think about it and sort it out, cos as I've said, woman have had enough.

reply to post by taoistguy


It is a matter of empathy just as it is said in my previous post. No one who feels empathy rapes.

Merlynn
reply to post by SpaDe_

 

So in the room next to the men being taught not to rape will there be a course for women on how not to be sluts? I mean if we are to assume that all men are rapists, then we must also assume that all women are sluts.

You would have to include guys as sluts, they are much sluttier than women.

You do realize that the person who came up with this idea was raped. After she was raped she probably heard a lot of the stupid things that come out of peoples mouths after a life altering event like this. "You shouldn't have been there", "Did you fight", "You should have had a gun", fill in the blanks. She may have even had to take (along with other women) a rape prevention course. These courses and peoples stupid words often make the victim feel more of a victim.

I still believe women should be informed so they know how to protect themselves, but I think this idea is a good idea. There are a lot of males that do not have good role models and treat women like they are not people. So, yes men, in general, should have to take courses too, after all it's their bad behavior that is causing the problem.

So then, because a very small percent of men, rape, all of us should have to take a mandatory course on not raping?

Yet women shouldn't have to take a course on not showing so much skin, and enticing the rape prone men into action in the first place?

Who are the women that get raped most often?

Those that are dressed "provocatively", and most of all, those that have "guy friends" they know they have no interest in, yet still keep him around hoping, even though they know he wants them but cant have her.

Maybe women should be taught that they need to act respectfully, to themselves and men in general, thus avoiding these situations all together.

I guess that asking that is too much though right?

Is rape that common there?

or is this just a woman who feels like all men are evil

shame shame

reply to post by oblvion


I take it back. I don't wish more men were like you.
God help women: for wearing and behaving in a way that people like you label them as a slut and imply they deserve to be raped.

Men can't control themselves???
Sheesh. :\

In order to begin to start teaching boys/girls, teen-boys/teen-girls, & adult men/adult women...HOW NOT TO RAPE...We first must teach the teachers how to teach this RAPE issue...For instance...I was once drugged and raped by a patient in a mental hospital...I came out of this drug induced haze in the middle of it...This RAPE issue happens under the watch of those professionals that are deemed to have a Degree in this sort of thing...human behavior...so even under the watchful eye of these professionals/teachers... RAPE happens right under the teachers nose...So may I suggest a TIME MACHINE...that would be money better spent...think of the cures one of those little babies could fix...

Truly,

shells4u

shells4u
In order to begin to start teaching boys/girls, teen-boys/teen-girls, & adult men/adult women...HOW NOT TO RAPE...We first must teach the teachers how to teach this RAPE issue...For instance...I was once drugged and raped by a patient in a mental hospital...I came out of this drug induced haze in the middle of it...This RAPE issue happens under the watch of those professionals that are deemed to have a Degree in this sort of thing...human behavior...so even under the watchful eye of these professionals/teachers... RAPE happens right under the teachers nose...So may I suggest a TIME MACHINE...that would be money better spent...think of the cures one of those little babies could fix...

Truly,

shells4u

So sorry to hear of your assault. Don't listen to anyone who calls you a slut or says you asked for it cos of the way you were dressed. You are right. Rape seems to be institutional. LOve to you .

taoistguy

HomerinNC
reply to post by taoistguy

 

Again, as I asked you before, are you saying youre a potential rapist as well?

OK, you want me to repeat myself?
Yes, I am a potential rapist as I outined and defined what that meant in a previous post of mine. Did you not understand? All men are potential rapists in the sense of their anatomy and power (muscle/politics/dynamics).


ADDED:
Doesn't mean I have or will rape, but that there is the potential.

edit on 27-9-2013 by taoistguy because: (no reason given)

Well by this fallacy of logic, we are all potential terrorists, rapists, murderers, thieves, gangsters, hell even the next hitler isn't out of the question here at this point.

You honestly don't see your idiocy here?

reply to post by taoistguy

Don't listen to anyone who calls you a slut or says you asked for it cos of the way you were dressed. You are right. Rape seems to be institutional. LOve to you .

Thank you for the I love you part!!!

taoistguy


I take it you haven't read my post(s) that suggest reading my previous posts where myself (and others) have already explained and answered your questions about the phrase and about "all men"? :

And I disagree that Hawking in incapable of rape.
Also, I'd like to ask you a question: If a man inserts a finger or some other objetc into a vagina against the woman's permission, would you consider that rape?

From my studies in college, 50% of rape cases are not involving the penis. Many women are brutalized via objects during rape, and this is why rape is not a crime of sex, but control. I do think there is a difference in date rape where things got out of hand verses this sort of situation. I also believe the courts do have different charges for the various sorts of rape.

In some states what you are describing would be labelled molestation which can have equally devastating consequences for the victim.

oblvion

taoistguy

HomerinNC
reply to post by taoistguy

 

Again, as I asked you before, are you saying youre a potential rapist as well?

OK, you want me to repeat myself?
Yes, I am a potential rapist as I outined and defined what that meant in a previous post of mine. Did you not understand? All men are potential rapists in the sense of their anatomy and power (muscle/politics/dynamics).


ADDED:
Doesn't mean I have or will rape, but that there is the potential.

edit on 27-9-2013 by taoistguy because: (no reason given)

Well by this fallacy of logic, we are all potential terrorists, rapists, murderers, thieves, gangsters, hell even the next hitler isn't out of the question here at this point.

You honestly don't see your idiocy here?

Yes, we are. We all have the potential for that. We are also potential programmers or potential doctors. Police walk around and see us as potential criminals.

BTW, feel free to continue insulting me.
You are going over old ground by refering back to those old posts and you are not moving on or learning a damned thing.
You think you are logical?

So, would you think this is appropriate for school? Now granted some of these images are not at a school, but I have seen exactly this sort of attire at some high schools:

my-funspace.com...

acidcow.com...



So, put them at a party, twerking and grinding and they are suddenly surprised when a boy thinks they want sex? Granted, she should be able to be left alone, but I won't let my girls dress like this, and they are well aware of what putting oneself into a compromising situation could cause. Some of you seem to think the world will change, and yet I know all the positive thinking and beliefs won't change the fact that many of these girls who do this will find themselves in trouble and yell they are victims without taking one iota of responsibility for putting themselves into the situation that allowed it to happen.

Welcome to the Varsity twerking team

rlv.zcache.com...

UnifiedSerenity

taoistguy


I take it you haven't read my post(s) that suggest reading my previous posts where myself (and others) have already explained and answered your questions about the phrase and about "all men"? :

And I disagree that Hawking in incapable of rape.
Also, I'd like to ask you a question: If a man inserts a finger or some other objetc into a vagina against the woman's permission, would you consider that rape?

From my studies in college, 50% of rape cases are not involving the penis. Many women are brutalized via objects during rape, and this is why rape is not a crime of sex, but control. I do think there is a difference in date rape where things got out of hand verses this sort of situation. I also believe the courts do have different charges for the various sorts of rape.

In some states what you are describing would be labelled molestation which can have equally devastating consequences for the victim.

edit on 28-9-2013 by UnifiedSerenity because: (no reason given)

Absolutely. It's problematic that rape is treated differently in different places. I guess this is why a lot of men are confused and need a bit of education.

reply to post by taoistguy


Communication is best. I don't think any men need to be told that snatching a stranger and forcing sex is wrong. Women need to take control of what they want and communicate it openly so as to not confuse the men, and the same with men. If a guy thinks buying me dinner and taking me out means he just bought me, then he's got a whole lot of re-thinking to do.

I prefer blunt open communication and then go from there, but I have never been accused of being obtuse or not saying what I mean or want.