rape prevention , by " teaching men not to rape " a concept ?

projectvxn
reply to post by ignorant_ape

 

That's an entirely ludicrous concept.

I do not need to be taught not to rape women.

Anyone who would need to be taught that concept is already a deraged sociopath.

Who thinks of this crap?

You may not need to be taught. but the millions of people who commit rape DO need to be taught.

Your statement is kind of like saying "well i know fire can hurt, so no one needs to be taught not to play with fire".

Feminists really need to get with the program and join the
world of equality.

How singled out would women feel if we decided yo teach them
not to kill their own children?

Women who harbor unhealthy distaste for men should be treated like
any biggot. As well as be threated with charges of hate crimes when
they publish anti-male propoganda.

MALBOSIA
Feminists really need to get with the program and join the
world of equality.

How singled out would women feel if we decided yo teach them
not to kill their own children?

Women who harbor unhealthy distaste for men should be treated like
any biggot. As well as be threated with charges of hate crimes when
they publish anti-male propoganda.

We do single them out....we just tell them that they shouldnt be a victim. That it is their fault if they dress a certain way and end up getting raped.

Saying men should be taught not to rape is not man hate. Hell, I AM A MAN. What it is is an attempt at a new approach to a hugely out of control problem-a problem that the current approach is not doing a thing about.

captaintyinknots

MALBOSIA
Feminists really need to get with the program and join the
world of equality.

How singled out would women feel if we decided yo teach them
not to kill their own children?

Women who harbor unhealthy distaste for men should be treated like
any biggot. As well as be threated with charges of hate crimes when
they publish anti-male propoganda.

We do single them out....we just tell them that they shouldnt be a victim. That it is their fault if they dress a certain way and end up getting raped.

Saying men should be taught not to rape is not man hate. Hell, I AM A MAN. What it is is an attempt at a new approach to a hugely out of control problem-a problem that the current approach is not doing a thing about.

Who tells them its their fault? I have never heard that in my life except
spewing from the lips of some man-hating feminist.

I didnt post in this thread to argue, only to share opinion. But you quoted
my post and used it as a soap box to push a pro-victim agenda.

reply to post by captaintyinknots


I am sorry, but women who dress and act provocatively share some of the blame if they get raped. Obviously rape is a crime and the man should know better. He should control his urges and act mature. But we dont live in a perfect society, now do we?

I personally HAVE BEEN LEAD ON by attractive women whom were drunk(or under narcotics influence) and politely turned down the offer without being insulting.

If people want respect they have to earn it. It doesnt come free.

Saying its always the mans fault is the epitomy of hypocrisy and intellectual dishonesty.

I am suprised you are even a man with that attitude of yours.

Society has a big problem with rape because we live in dysfunctional times, with broken down homes and children not growing up properly, watching slutty women on tv, watching satanical rock bands, watching lying politicians, parents who have broken up a few times or whom argue constantly, unemployment issues.

If there is an epidemic of something then look for the root causes rather than the symptoms.

EarthCitizen07
reply to post by captaintyinknots

 

I am sorry, but women who dress and act provocatively share some of the blame if they get raped. Obviously rape is a crime and the man should know better. He should control his urges and act mature. But we dont live in a perfect society, now do we?

I personally HAVE BEEN LEAD ON by attractive women whom were drunk(or under narcotics influence) and politely turned down the offer without being insulting.

If people want respect they have to earn it. It doesnt come free.

Saying its always the mans fault is the epitomy of hypocrisy and intellectual dishonesty.

I am suprised you are even a man with that attitude of yours.

Society has a big problem with rape because we live in dysfunctional times, with broken down homes and children not growing up properly, watching slutty women on tv, watching satanical rock bands, watching lying politicians, parents who have broken up a few times or whom argue constantly, unemployment issues.

If there is an epidemic of something then look for the root causes rather than the symptoms.

Dude!

You murdered my arguement.

AGENT PROVOCATEUR!!!

Darnit!

EarthCitizen07
And women share the responsibility many times because they dress and act inappropriately.

^^^^ This right here, does not, EVER give anyone the excuse to rape. No means no. If she's not saying saying yes then take it as a no. Simple really.

If you dont want attention then stop seeking it.

If you cant control yourself, remove yourself from the situation.

Or the sexual harrassement lawsuits with barely any substance. Someone has a grudge against their boss and they want to slander him.

Different story.

Feminist topics and their pov are somewhat amusing.

There's that word again. We are discussing attitudes to rape and suddenly, its a "feminist" topic. I think THATS amusing.

Interesting thread, and some have posted my thoughts already. I think a simple issue would be "teach people not to be selfish aholes and that would stop a lot of detestable behavior. As to those saying millions of men don't rape everyday is true; however, there was an interesting questionnaire put out in my college of Sociology and it anonymously asked the male students some questions. They could fill it out, drop it in a box later and no one would have any clue who gave the answers.

What was revealed on this little questionnaire was that over 85% of the males said "yes" to, if they were out on a date and knew with 100% certainty that they could have sex with their date and not get into trouble would they even if she didn't want to have sex... ie rape her.

This was a real eye opener for the women in the collage and I can imagine caused some real coolness of attitudes for some time. I think it does come down to are we talking violent snatch and grab just for sex, violent abuse and torture and possibly murder, too much to drink and the couple starts playing around and right at the height of passion the woman says "no" and he just can't seem to stop himself, they do have sex, she regrets it and remembered saying "no" at first then complying so she convinces herself she was raped?

We have a sickness of soul / heart and it is showing by the way we disrespect one another in small and big ways.

SearchLightsInc

There's that word again. We are discussing attitudes to rape and suddenly, its a "feminist" topic. I think THATS amusing.

Because feminists tend to make all rape cases black and white. Sometimes it is and sometimes it is not.

Thats why cases go to court and the jury or judge determines the verdict.

If you are a women whom is rightfully concerned about getting raped, then its best to error on the conservative side. It prevents people from getting a mixed "yes-no" message!

MALBOSIA

captaintyinknots

MALBOSIA
Feminists really need to get with the program and join the
world of equality.

How singled out would women feel if we decided yo teach them
not to kill their own children?

Women who harbor unhealthy distaste for men should be treated like
any biggot. As well as be threated with charges of hate crimes when
they publish anti-male propoganda.

We do single them out....we just tell them that they shouldnt be a victim. That it is their fault if they dress a certain way and end up getting raped.

Saying men should be taught not to rape is not man hate. Hell, I AM A MAN. What it is is an attempt at a new approach to a hugely out of control problem-a problem that the current approach is not doing a thing about.

Who tells them its their fault? I have never heard that in my life except
spewing from the lips of some man-hating feminist.

I didnt post in this thread to argue, only to share opinion. But you quoted
my post and used it as a soap box to push a pro-victim agenda.

So, youve never heard a woman being told that they should not dress a certain way, or act a ertain way, because it invites rape? Thats called victim blame my friend. The idea that women should prevent themselves from being raped is blaming the victim.

'pro-victim'? Are you kidding me? Are you 'anti-victim'?

Just asinine.

EarthCitizen07

SearchLightsInc

There's that word again. We are discussing attitudes to rape and suddenly, its a "feminist" topic. I think THATS amusing.

Because feminists tend to make all rape cases black and white. Sometimes it is and sometimes it is not.

Thats why cases go to court and the jury or judge determines the verdict.

If you are a women whom is rightfully concerned about getting raped, then its best to error on the conservative side.

Prime example of victim blame.

Frankly, most rape IS that black and white. Did a person say no? Then its rape. No ifs, ands or buts about it.

reply to post by EarthCitizen07

I am sorry, but women who dress and act provocatively share some of the blame if they get raped. Obviously rape is a crime and the man should know better. He should control his urges and act mature. But we dont live in a perfect society, now do we?

A bigger load of crap, I have never read. So if you wear a speedo, are you to blame if you get raped?

I personally HAVE BEEN LEAD ON by attractive women whom were drunk(or under narcotics influence) and politely turned down the offer without being insulting.

And?

If people want respect they have to earn it. It doesnt come free.

Are you seriously saying that a woman has to EARN enough respect to not be raped? Thats vile. Just vile.

Saying its always the mans fault is the epitomy of hypocrisy and intellectual dishonesty.

Rape is ALWAYS the fault of the person that forced themselves onto someone else. How can you argue that it isnt?

I am suprised you are even a man with that attitude of yours.

Lots of people are surprised when they meet a man who understands rape culture and the truth behind it. Education will help you get over the surprise.

Society has a big problem with rape because we live in dysfunctional times, with broken down homes and children not growing up properly, watching slutty women on tv, watching satanical rock bands, watching lying politicians, parents who have broken up a few times or whom argue constantly, unemployment issues.

Well then, I guess rape is fine and dandy.

If there is an epidemic of something then look for the root causes rather than the symptoms.

Yet you choose to still blame the victim. Its a cultural cause. It needs a cultural solution.

It MAKES NO DIFFERENCE WHAT A WOMAN WEARS; again women are blamed for the rape and violence against them. Rape IS violence.
If a couple are having sex at home and the parents walk in the man will stop immediately - by saying he can't control himself is ridiculous. A woman should be able to walk around completely naked and be absolutely safe, but in reality ceretain men would see her as a target.
But even with a clothed woman, no matter what she wears these men will choose a target, maybe they hide in a bush in a park, or choose a family member, such men are sick and anyone who excuses such behaviour and says it's an evolutionary trait is indirectly reinforcing the idea that rape is ok.
No wonder the feminists are bloody angry!!!
It seems to me taht until a lot of men grow up and think seriously about this nothing will change.
Or until their wife/girlfriend/daughter/sister gets raped will they turn to her and say, "you are a slut and asked for it"?

There are still people in this thread banging on about "a class"; they either haven't read the thread or just don't get it or understand the concept being explained to them. I despair.

captaintyinknots
Here's what people are missing here. Women are taught to think about how not to get raped every single day of their lives. That is what rape prevention is. It is the idea that a person should consider EVERYTHING they do, every day, and how it 'invites' a rapist.

Men are told "rape is bad" and thats that.

See the difference?

Perhaps if men were taught to think about it, every day, just like women, less would do it.

Either way, I still find it downright disgusting that people are okay with rape and rape culture, and believe the current course is just fine.

Downright pathetic.

I want to be very careful in my response to you because some twisted mind might read this and do exactly the opposite of my intention here. I will simply say that there is a lot of "entertainment" that has rape fantasy played out in it. There are women who enjoy being taken by a beast of a man and it turns them on. Some men love the idea of overpowering a woman and feeling their strength and some just reading my words are getting turned on by them as images flash before your eyes and tickle your darker side.

Lots of abused woman have rape fantasy and can't really get off during sex without that little scene playing in her mind imagining being taken, but truly would be horrified if some stranger were to take her in such a fashion, it's a F A N T A S Y.

I have known men in the BDSM community who have lots of girls. One of my male friends told me how he worked for months to set up the perfect "scene" and actually involved a cop friend of his. I won't go into the details, but to say that his "girl" signed a legal document that at some point in the future months a "rape scenario" would play out and she was a willing partner in it. He did this to cover himself should some other cop show up and /or should she decide to scream rape.

My point is that this is not a rare as some might think it is. That these are knowing and willing partners, but that doesn't mean that a lot of men have not been poisoned in their minds and hearts watching tons of rape porn, reading stories of it, and thinking women (particularly those scantily clad and dressed seductively who flirt so openly) really want it.

Knowing all of this is why women need to take responsibility. Sure, you should be able to go down the street drunk, naked and not get raped, but would you recommend your 18 yr old daughter go off to college and go to some frat party by herself, drink all night and be around 60 some odd sexually charged men or would you recommend she not go off drinking or be alone with men? I think we know the answer because in reality she will most likely find herself in very unfortunate circumstances?

Just for the record, I was a little sister to Sigma Nu, was never accosted, but I always comported myself as a lady and had my ADPi sisters with me at all parties.

reply to post by UnifiedSerenity


So your example involves cases of consensual sex that might be a little rough? Sorry, but that is irrelevant. In fact, it is the exact OPPOSITE of rape.

Nice try though.

captaintyinknots
So, youve never heard a woman being told that they should not dress a certain way, or act a ertain way, because it invites rape? Thats called victim blame my friend. The idea that women should prevent themselves from being raped is blaming the victim.

'pro-victim'? Are you kidding me? Are you 'anti-victim'?

Just asinine.

So, if your 16 year old wears hoochy clothes is grinding all over my 18 year old son, slipping her hand down his pants and riding him like the pony express and as they start to get it on she feels some guilt and screams rape, that makes him a rapist?

Yeah, right.

UnifiedSerenity

captaintyinknots
So, youve never heard a woman being told that they should not dress a certain way, or act a ertain way, because it invites rape? Thats called victim blame my friend. The idea that women should prevent themselves from being raped is blaming the victim.

'pro-victim'? Are you kidding me? Are you 'anti-victim'?

Just asinine.

So, if your 16 year old wears hoochy clothes is grinding all over my 18 year old son, slipping her hand down his pants and riding him like the pony express and as they start to get it on she feels some guilt and screams rape, that makes him a rapist?

Yeah, right.

If she tries to stop, or says no at any point, then yes it is. There is no way around it. Throw on top of that that your 18 year old son, in most states, would already be guilty of statutory rape, whether she said no or not.

Sounds like you support the idea of 'she asked for it'. Victim blame, friend. No means no, even if it comes mid-coitus. Get it?

It is truly scary to me that there are people who think its not, and some of you are prime examples of people who need this education being discussed in this thread.

This thread well demonstrates what I said early on: that the definition of rape is not exactly standardized.

And the guy who said he took a humanities class that basically extended the definition of rape to nearly everything -- I have encountered that as well, and I considered it profoundly bad for culture and both genders (but especially women obviously) when that happens.

And the idea that anyone saying "no" means rape "just as much as" any other situation is damaging polarization for sure. Makeout sessions that go up to the Nth degree before a 'no' that may or may not turn to yes is ignored should not in any way be treated the same as some stranger attacking a woman in a parking lot at night or someone drugging a woman at a party.

I think part of the problem that culturally we seem to have with getting a sane and balanced handle on this is our culture's inability to handle spectrum/gradient subjects in general; we do tend to be one or extreme or the other.

And the other issue of course is that everyone considers rape a problem OF the male and FOR the female. In our society, these genders need to work together. It is a problem of and for both, in various ways. It is just as injust to ruin a man's life and incarcerate him for years over a disagreement on how that makeout session should have gone. That's another kind of rape. The issue of "definition" and "degree" needs to be considered or it is still both crime and injustice but not always toward the woman.

reply to post by RedCairo

And the idea that anyone saying "no" means rape "just as much as" any other situation is damaging polarization for sure. Makeout sessions that go up to the Nth degree before a 'no' that may or may not turn to yes is ignored should not in any way be treated the same as some stranger attacking a woman in a parking lot at night or someone drugging a woman at a party.

A girl saying no, and a guy trying to convince her to say yes is not ok. The first 'no' is all that matters. That men think its ok to try and convince a girl to change her mind is the exact point of this thread.

Many of you think rape is just fine. And its sad.