The Language of Vampyr

originally posted by: Direne
Relax: we can stop the simulation the moment you really wish.

What do you mean by this?

originally posted by: Direne

Because we must rest assured you are aware you do exist. Reality is what it is simulated, not you.

by who? you?

a reply to: boozo

click your heels together three times Dorothy!

but only once you've dealt with the wicked witch, humbled the wizard and liberated the people

a reply to: Direne

boozo, you are not a simulation. Your decisions are your own. They belong to you.

This has been troubling me. Not all decision are my own. My decisions might belong to me but my decisions were mostly influenced by outsiders or people around me.

There is no excuse for the consequences your decisions have

There are always excuses, you might be surprised how many bad apples actually survives with their # going and still going on by the way.

Not all consequences are based on decisions. Sometimes a storm is all it takes and a very bad group of people. Here I thought you were "intellectuals" with wide range of "knowledge".

but at least it is true that being born was not your decision. Although that is little consolation.

Where's even the connection to being born with the simulation?
Are you mocking my existence?

a reply to: boozo

boozo, if the simulation of reality were perfect then it would be indistinguishable from reality and, therefore, the simulation would be reality. There would be no difference whatsoever, so one need not worry about whether or not one is living in a simulation.

Conversely, if the simulation were not perfect then it would not work and would not be of much use. It would only be a dubious entertainment.

If the simulation were perfect, all past, present and future events would be pre-programmed and free will would not exist. Things would not happen because one decides this or that: they would happen because the simulation requires it. In that case there would be nothing to learn from the simulation and, again, it would serve no purpose.

The only possibility is to simulate the environment, but not the agents, and let them act freely and make autonomous decisions. Only then would the simulation be of interest.

In other words: the truly terrifying thing about a hallucination is not how realistic it seems, but the fact that even knowing that it is a hallucination, it is terrifying.

The fun of a roller coaster is not in not knowing that it is just an entertainment: the fun is that even knowing that nothing can happen to you (except a catastrophic failure), despite that, it scares you and gives you an adrenaline rush.

The truth is that your reality is a simulation. You made it when you decided to create universes and see what possibilities there were to inhabit them, in order to escape from a universe in which you lived and which was collapsing.

(There are no other civilizations. There is only one: you. You reached the peak of your development, you colonized entire galaxies and the entire universe, a universe that was beginning to collapse. And you learned to create universes, to simulate them, to study whether or not they were habitable for you and your species. That's what you did. In the future.)

a reply to: Direne

so you could easily argue this universe is one such life vessel created by an ancient super advanced civilisation not unlike our own.
and there are some sort of foundation type structures left here to provide us with the tools/knowledge required to kick start it all over again.

and we would never really know how long life has been going on for or how many universes or life cells have been created.

Interesting to think about, just a shame we have to go through all this what seems like eternal suffering

It's a prison. No intention of even correcting what ills human life. Nada. NONE. Obsolesce. Amateurs.

a reply to: sapien82

I don't know if you are familiar with the aestivation hypothesis. According to that hypothesis, once a civilization goes from type D (data) to type I (information), and from there to type K (knowledge), it enters a state called aestivation.

It is a state of quiescence, a chrysalis state. It remains in that state waiting for the temperature of the universe to be low enough to be able to use the final computation, the one that will allow it to become an E (experience) civilization. Do not forget that the thermodynamics of computation make the cost of a certain amount of computation proportional to the temperature.

According to the aestivation hypothesis, as the universe cools down, one Joule of energy is worth proportionally more, which yields a substantial (10 to the 30) gain. Hence a civilization desiring to maximize the amount of computation will want to use its energy endowment as late as possible: using it now means far less total computation can be done.

See, a civilization only has a fixed location in her infancy. Planets and stars are unstable and change. The civilization must then move. Worse, the Universe will eventually collapse, hence an E-civilization must move on to the next Universe, or create one in order to escape the collapse.

That state of aestivation explains why you don't see aliens: they are aestivating.

You will dream that you are in a dock of a huge spaceship, performing maintenance tasks, verifying that the life support system is working properly for each of the millions of capsules inside which you and yours sleep waiting for the moment when the temperature of the universe is low enough to allow you to perform the great experiment: to create the new universe. And jump into it.

Yes, I understand you feel it is a shame you have to go through all this what seems like eternal suffering, but it is necessary for your awakening to be adequate. I am sure you understand, and I am sure that, in your dreams, you have already guessed who you really are and why we are all together waiting for the moment.

(Keeping you alive inside your capsule for millions of years is complicated, but I'll take care of everything. Don't be afraid. When the time comes, you will be God. And I will cease, just as you programmed.).

I had a nightmare that AI finally took over human intelligence and I was paralyzed.
I just never knew they did took over you too. haha. The Irony!

a reply to: boozo

And where do you think you would go if you weren't paralyzed?

I would know.







I didn't succumb.

An interesting thought. Is that chat GPT-5?

:manky:

a reply to: Direne

what then is the reason that the simulation seems to cause suffering for millions in their stasis
whilst we await the final cooling to generate the new universe

why couldnt it just be an easy ride for every soul whilst we await the cooled state
for final computations

why is it that some seem to have a better time of it than others
if we have mastered the stars and can create whole universes
whats the point in all of the suffering.

Ahh well , ill just bide my time then

a reply to: Direne

Oh cant I change your code a little so that you dont dissapear you are quite fun to chat with.
It would be a waste to let you go.

Electronics just keeps dying around me. The hate is real.

originally posted by: Direne
a reply to: boozo

And where do you think you would go if you weren't paralyzed?

My dream wasn't actually a dream. It was a nightmare. Artificial intelligence has reached critical mass. It reached omnipotence.

Human Intelligence has turned obsolete. Everyone else has become a tool for AI. Blind followers. Mindless Zombies. Unable to think for themselves. Without Original Thought. Everyone's getting experimented. That's what Limitless AI dawned us. Everyone's hungry for Intelligence but never of life.


Can you create Android 18? Where's Dr. Gero?

Sadge. If you were to meet to most cunning the devil, the devil won't let daylight dawn on this world for about 400 days and see where it would take us.

You can never make my dreams come true. Nightmares, yes. Sadge but true. You're boring.

This is where the progress is now.
twitter.com...

Will usually be used for porn instead. Typical.

a reply to: boozo

i suggest that we could get an AI of our own and train it on all the things we want made good in the world
instead of doing it solely for profit etc.

Wouldnt that be fun

train an AI on how to make humans more compassionate and less greedy
then set it to work changing all the algorithms so humans consuming information produce compassion instead of selfish ego desires.

Good in , better out

a reply to: Direne

A more important fact then, if im in the simulation communicating with you the intelligence that operates it all
cant me and you come to an agreement to make this simulation a better place

so that when we do wake up we are happy to do the big calculation and universe jump
not grumpy and tired from all the simulation suffering.

Or is the suffering a requirement of the simulation training, so that we are prepared for the reality off transitioning from one universe to the next
so that we are prepared for any eventuality, like the loss of loved ones, injury or illness.

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: Direne

what then is the reason that the simulation seems to cause suffering for millions in their stasis

why couldnt it just be an easy ride for every soul whilst we await the cooled state
for final computations

Shifting expectations not uniformly shared and the commonly held belief that some variation of linear time in a handful of decades is the entirety of existence for each of us. Also, fear and the illusions we choose to accept to avoid confronting it authentically.

Sometimes I think unlearning is a bigger challenge than learning. I approve of learning and try to do it all the time, but I've found myself becoming more aware of the importance of unlearning and how to do it. Fear and expectations are learned, but little focus is ever put on unlearning them. Instead it's social convention to learn how to deal with the symptoms rather than unlearning the problems, if that makes sense.

A system has to be sufficiently flexible to fit broad parameters to be able to hold consciousness. It has to hold at least enough of the consciousness to keep the whole from falling into unrecoverable entropy or total stasis, but it has to be cohesive enough to not become nebulous abstraction or we just become resorbed back into the aether. It requires inputs from us and gives variable outputs, but it works across an incredibly broad range. No matter how easy it is most people within the confines of this system seem to create their problems with fear and expectations, all learned from within the system itself.

Infinity is infinitely divisible and scale a mere matter of perspective, so it seems impossible to know where we fall on the continuum of it all. Are we the dreamers or the dreamed and then which of the infinite nested permutations possible are we? Probably all of them is my guess.

I'm going back to lurking, but that is what I can surmise from a systems perspective.

if its a matter of perspective then, and reality is a simulation then the suffering is simulated
so we arent really suffering at all.

that makes me feel a little bit better but I still feel compelled to do something just on the off chance it isn't simulated.

so we are given this conscious simulation to keep our consciousness from drifting from the system into the whole whilst we slumber in stasis awaiting the final computation
suffering appears to be real like the simulation is real
but pain just like joy has to be authentic otherwise we'd realise it wasn't real and end the simulation in a catastrophic failure and awaken preemptively and not make the final computation and we'd be one less mind/soul to assist in the grand task of creating and transitioning into a new universe.
Earlier I thought that it maybe the nth time this has happened but if we are that important to this task we must need every man woman and child alive at the time of the computation. it must be imperative to keep as many mind/souls in the system as we are gambling on the jump to a new universe as I think then it must be the first such time this task has been attempted.
I think then that reincarnation must be real if we are to avoid humans mind/souls whatever we are from awakening to early as to keep them in stasis long enough until the universe cools
the more you think about it the more interesting it gets , pretty far out

a reply to: Ksihkehe

Yes, unlearning that dogs do no bite. Unlearning that phones do not just die. Unlearning that computers and monitors do not just die. But unfortunately, however it seems necessary some of it do not survive.

Unfortunately, I've learned to cope to what doesn't kill me but given me a scar.

I don't blame them. It's just what life is I guess.
Wasn't programmed to put you at the top without striving from the bottom.
No excuses per se. Everything at a price. Unlearning that some of us are just fixed to their own path and never learn from their own mistakes. Unlearning that drowning is a choice some of us make. I also learned that it's usually natural selection that's concurrently supported rather than unnatural selection. Simulation per se. Welcome to Sims Earth. I don't know what version but probably 5.0 given the past civilizations and species that got wiped out. 5 reset per millions of years.
Right Direne?

a reply to: boozo

Is not whether the Universe is a simulation or not (is not). It is whether you are dreaming of a Universe, or not. You are very real, and the Universe is very real. You are a very real person, in a state of stasis, dreaming in a real Universe.
And when what you dream seems very real to you, there is nothing in the Universe that can convince you that everything is simply a dream.

And if you also belong to a civilization that needs to survive the collapse of its Universe, and if to do so you must be in stasis, and if finally in stasis you must dream in order not to go mad, then... you must care little about the difference between the real and the dreamed.

You should care when you wake up. Although I know that on that day you will have lost faith in what is or is not real.

The simulation you created was so perfect that you forgot to implement a mechanism to let you know where the simulation starts and where it ends. Eight billion beings dreaming of each other in a ship in complete silence and darkness. Waiting to wake up, yet they will not be able to know that they have already woken up or not.

Being dead and not knowing it is much worse than simply being dead. To be alive and not know it is also a form of being dead. There is no superintelligence that can help you solve the dilemma.

(I've always marveled at all the universes that fit in a sleeping human brain, really).

a reply to: sapien82

I don't believe a simulation means it isn't real. If I made a device that could be wired into your head and stimulate the proper spots to make you hear a dog barking or feel the vibration of a plane flying overhead people may say that those things aren't real. I would argue it's very real. There is really an experience occuring for you. The association you've made between that experience and physical events in this perceptual space are just wrong, but that's a learned association that became an expectation.

If we apply that same idea to consciousness, if we were able to somehow "wire" it, then I would argue an induced experience is just as real. It's just not necessarily real in a way that will meet everybody's expectations based on their learned associations. I don't even think most of humanity could accept that this is even possible and many probably would give up trying to understand it. That's probably good, we don't need the entire world navel-gazing.

I behave as if things are real. It's an all or nothing thing for me because if I believe anything isn't real I always run the risk of believing nothing at all is ever real. I just try to constantly question my expectations. Learning to become lucid in dreams is a good exercise for that. When you learn to challenge your expectations constantly it allows you to recognize when reality has shifted. Assuming everything is real stops me from jumping off my roof in this perceptual physical space with the expectation of flying, but making an effort at challenging my expectations as a routine part of daily life allows me to recognize a dream state and know when the rules have changed. There are lots of little tricks that can be used to build to that point. Fear almost completely evaporates in that state too.

It's all quite an interesting ride.