Why should I go to hell?

reply to post by ahnggk


I already have the holy spirit, I've had it since I was conceived in my mothers womb.

You cannot live without the spirit, it is the essence that makes us us. You don't need to believe Jesus died for our sins to obtain the holy spirit. To be born again of water and spirit is to be born of your mothers water and the spirit/soul that everyone obtains at conception. I was born again the moment my mom gave birth to me.

I have a different understanding of what Jesus meant in his teachings, that doesn't mean I am wrong, in fact my interpretation is based solely within reality, not fiction. No offense to you.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by ahnggk

 

I already have the holy spirit, I've had it since I was conceived in my mothers womb.

You cannot live without the spirit, it is the essence that makes us us. You don't need to believe Jesus died for our sins to obtain the holy spirit. To be born again of water and spirit is to be born of your mothers water and the spirit/soul that everyone obtains at conception. I was born again the moment my mom gave birth to me.

I have a different understanding of what Jesus meant in his teachings, that doesn't mean I am wrong, in fact my interpretation is based solely within reality, not fiction. No offense to you.

Please read my post contained on page 8 (it's the last post on that page).

reply to post by amrith777


The miracles Jesus supposedly performed coincide with completely natural phenomena, so there is no reason for me to believe he actually did those things. They are only metaphors used in order to make Jesus seem more miraculous than he actually was.

Until there is proof that people can walk on water or feed thousands of people with two fish and five pieces of bread, I will continue to believe they are myths thought up in the mind of man.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by amrith777

 

The miracles Jesus supposedly performed coincide with completely natural phenomena, so there is no reason for me to believe he actually did those things. They are only metaphors used in order to make Jesus seem more miraculous than he actually was.

Until there is proof that people can walk on water or feed thousands of people with two fish and five pieces of bread, I will continue to believe they are myths thought up in the mind of man.

So be it.I respect your right to believe what you choose.Thank you for your reply.

reply to post by amrith777


You're welcome. I respect your opinion as well.

I can see some lies you are posting now. You cant know if the Holy Spirit is in you, spirit maybe but not Holy Spirit.
Where is your evidence
Irrespective the rules God has laid at foundation teach that everyman, believe it or not, has committed sin deserving of death.
You didnt write the rule book, you just play the game.
Like it or not, argue as much as you like, The rules are there.

You dont have to believe them, Christians didnt write them. Jesus taught them
Ignore away, dont blame us if you end up in hell.
Oh and why do you say hell is eternal?

reply to post by borntowatch


You will only end up in Hell if you are living it now. There is no end when you will be judged. The judging can only be done by you. If you judge then you will be judged.
If you critize and dislike what appears to you, you will be living a hellish life.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by Awen24

 

That's the whole point of religion in general, to disconnect us from god on a mental level. It seems as though you have fallen for the trap. You are not disconnected from god, 'he' is always with you, no matter who you are or what you believe.

Deuteronomy 31:5-6
Be strong and courageous. Do not be afraid or terrified because of them, for the LORD your God goes with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you.

The problem with your reply, and all of the verses you've quoted (which I've deleted only for the sake of brevity), is that they're written to BELIEVERS; in this case, Joshua, in others, David, or the state of Israel, or Christians. None of the verses you've referenced refer to the unbelieving world.

Scripture is quite clear that mankind HAS been separated from God, and that Christ is the solution to that problem. In fact, you only have to go three chapters into the Bible to see this very thing exemplified.

Mankind "ate from the tree of the knowledge of Good and Evil", so God "sent him forth", placed cherubim with flaming swords at the entrance to Eden, and so on.

Adam had a relationship with God where God would literally "walk in the garden in the cool of the day" with him, and yet his sin literally, physically separated him from God's presence. Could it be any clearer?
Your verses, taken out of context, purport to show that God is always with man. However, they directly conflict with the verse I quoted (from Isaiah 59) which states "your sins have separated you from God". In my experience, if Scripture appears to conflict with itself, then the problem is simple. It's me. I haven't read enough, I haven't studied enough, I've neglected an important point somewhere... that's what the problem is. Scripture doesn't conflict with itself, because God does not change, and He knows everything!

In this case, the Bible is very clear. In fact, the entire book of Romans is written to show us that "all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God", yet that "while we were still sinners, Christ died for us". Make no mistake, we are not all "in God", nor do we all have His Holy Spirit. Rather, Jesus commanded His disciples to "go, and wait for the comforter, whom I will send to you."

You quote Scripture, so clearly you value it. I'd challenge you... if you honestly want to prove me wrong, please do so. Read the book of Romans and then send me a U2U... I'll most certainly reply.
After all, the Bereans mentioned in Scripture were commended not because they believed what they were taught, but because they "went away and searched the Scriptures to see if these things were so."

I'd encourage you to do the same.

reply to post by Awen24


God is here, right now, in presence/as presence (present time).
Humans are not here - they are always there. Humans imagine another, another time and another place and they live there. No one can live where there is no light (light of consciousness) so they are the walking dead.
Only when you stay in presence (present) will you walk with God.
It is actually impossible to be out of presence (present) so you are never not walking with God, it is just that you cannot feel the presence because you are looking at the past or future or 'other'.
There is no 'other'.

When you believe in 'other', another time or another place or other people, you are worshipping another God.
God is not mean when he says you should have no 'other' gods, he is just saying that if you are delusional you will suffer. Only the truth shall set you free from your delusional mind.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


Well, you might as well go to hell for a while. It makes you stronger. I don't really think there is any way you would end up somewhere like that for eternity, that's just silly.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
I was born again the moment my mom gave birth to me.

I have a different understanding of what Jesus meant in his teachings, that doesn't mean I am wrong, in fact my interpretation is based solely within reality, not fiction. No offense to you.

Interesting, I don't think I have shared my opinion on this yet. If I may quote some verses, I think you're familiar with this:

John 3:3-7
"Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” 4 Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?” 5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’"

This is my understanding of the 'Water and the Spirit"

The 'Spirit' is pretty obvious but what about the 'Water':

John 4:14
"but whoever drinks the water I give them will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give them will become in them a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

John 7:37-39
" On the last and greatest day of the festival, Jesus stood and said in a loud voice, “Let anyone who is thirsty come to me and drink. 38 Whoever believes in me, as Scripture has said, rivers of living water will flow from within them.”[c] 39 By this he meant the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were later to receive. Up to that time the Spirit had not been given, since Jesus had not yet been glorified"

I think these are the only times Jesus gave special meaning to water. It's too obvious here what water means - Truth and/or the Spirit.

It's impossible to be the same person after you have truly believed the Truth and received the Holy Spirit for what it is, it will change you.

The change is so dramatic as to be called 'born again'. Even my Christian parents don't 'know' me anymore, they think I've gone cult!

reply to post by ahnggk


"It's impossible to be the same person after you have truly believed the Truth and received the Holy Spirit for what it is, it will change you."

The truth does not have to be believed.
And i would say that one has to die first before being reborn as spirit..

Awww Op.....

All any of us, including you, have an opinion based on perception and experience. No one person has the Truth of all Truths.

There is zero people here on ATS that knows whether or not your love and or works will keep you or any of us for that matter from going to hell.

We have texts ( if not manipulated by man) that speak of ONE man KNOWING God and what God is and what God is capable of and where we are going when we pass from this life to the next.

Then we have an interpretation by MANY who perceive different what the texts actually say.

From there are MANY denominations of the Christian Religion beginning with Catholicism and then Lutheran and so on. Who is right?

From the conception of man it is plain to see ALL the different beliefs over time. Who is right?

In regards to Jesus via the Bible...

Jesus taught that " God is Love".

He also taught...

Its better to turn the other cheek than to fight, love your neighbor as yourself, seek and you will find, pray/meditate, believe in him, he is the way, he is the son of god, not hold onto or love wordly things, and so on. He also tells us he is preparing a place for us.

Is Jesus real?

I think he is if you believe in him.

If you take nde into account then both Jesus and hell are real. Jesus went to hell the Bible says. Why did he go there? Is this where negative energy is dumped? I have no idea. The ancients believed in an " underworld".

Is it a mind over matter type of thing, whereas whatever you truly believe about yourself and where you are going is where you will end up?

What does the scientific community say about this creation we call reality here on Earth and in space?

There are different dimensions ....perhaps where heaven and hell are located? Possibly.

Lots of energy including " dark" energy that we cannot see. Is this what effects our brains to act in one way or another? What about all the magnetisicm? Are we actually magnetized to the earth and when our souls transform we go back to the light of source ( free)....or go to hell where its dark and away from God where all of our fears are experinced because we couldnt let go and fear not?

Its my belief we may experience a hell after this life to dump whatever it is that keeps us from the light. Once this is done we are free to go back where we came becuase its also my belief we have lived MANY times before just as Jesus has.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

The only difference between me now and me while I was Christian is that I do not believe Jesus died on the cross or was resurrected three days later. I do not believe he walked on water or turned water into wine with a wave of a hand.

This right here. You believe he didn't die for your sins. No blood of the Lamb on you = you're not saved and you probably never were or you couldn't come to that conclusion. What you have is salvation by works which is a catholic teaching. You should learn more about mosaic judaism, then you might rethink not accepting the Lamb's sacrifice. Prophecies all through the OT proclaim he would die for our transgressions. Are you one of those people who think the OT is irrelevant? That's the only way i think you could come to postulate such an absurdity.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by truejew

 

No, god does because he was the one who created hell in the first place. Why make it if he never wanted his children to go there?

If you do not belong to Christ you are not his child. It's that simple. If not his child then you belong to Heylel and Heylel's children are going to the fire.

If you do not believe Christ died for your sins and resurrected and sits at the right hand of Power, then your sins have not been paid for.

Genesis 22 and Exodus 12 are direct prophecies of the Lamb's sacrifice.

In Genesis 22 Abraham made Isaac carry the wood he was going to be sacrificed on, when Isaac asked Abraham "where is the sacrifice?" Abraham replied "God will provide a sacrifice of his own". This was the prophecy.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


Have you been saved? Do you now live in paradise?

If you do not believe Christ died for your sins and resurrected and sits at the right hand of Power, then your sins have not been paid for.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


And what if you believe he sits on Gods left side?

Come on now....

We ALL make sacrifices and some of us indeed sacrifice our lives for others just as Jesus did.

According to the Bible our " sins" are paid for the day he died on the cross.

We all bare crosses, unfortunately.

IF Jesus was the first man (Adam) then he according to law would have to come back and sacrifice himself for mankind. IF he was not Adam or the same lineage his soul was evolved enough to correct the law of death. According to the law Jesus dying saved us all. For those who dont believe then they will when they see him as we will have to " go through him to get to the father".

Soooo many perceptions that are egotistic. Why think your way with your reasoning is right?

The Bible is interpreted many other ways by your own Christian brothers. Its a divider and clearly wrong to think your way is the only way and you have to do this, this, and that in order to enjoy everlasting life.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

Have you been saved? Do you now live in paradise?

I am taken care of. I am just waiting for this body to die.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

Have you been saved? Do you now live in paradise?

I am taken care of. I am just waiting for this body to die.

So you are waiting. Isn't that purgatory?
Is it your belief that you are not there......... yet?