Q&A Session with John Lear

You'll also note that john is still not banned, but chose by himself to stop responding to ATS after he was asked tough questions. Questions that could address the truthfulness of what he was saying, instead of questions that just allowed him to continue his story.

John was a guest here, but halfway through his time he realised that not everyone was just going to accept his story 'because he said so'. Apparently he was not interested in that sort of scrutiny. Again I pose the question partykid, would you rather everyone just overlooked the obvious errors in his story and just didn't bother thinking for themselves at all?

Now, it makes no difference that my personal opinion is that the WHOLE POST is knowingly false information - because that is a matter of debate.

But the moon does not have an atmosphere equivalent to 18000 ft on earth.

PERIOD.

Can you prove this beyond doubt?

Sorry but unless you have been there then how can u say you can.

The world is flat you know! oOps we corrected that one did we not.

the thread is titled, 'Q&A session with john lear'. not'the gospel according to john lear'. not 'us against john lear' or 'prove john lear is lying'.

you(valhall, kano, SO) should be ashamed of your harsh treatment of a man with his history. if he is a fool, then you killed an ant with an atom bomb. if he is not, you suppressed the truth using well known 'power of persuasion' tactics.

lies fall apart of there own accord. it's just a matter of time.

the thing is, you are judging his truth through your truth filters. the FACT is, that if aliens are as powerful as he says, they are as gods, and no human could ever prove or disprove their existance. only THEY could.
there could be an atmosphere, for example, and it could have some kind of 'cloaking' mechanism to keep it from being detected from earth. all your specific gravity light bending gravity wells and chemical radio signatures could all have compensating mechanisms. what ever you can think of to 'prove' his story wrong, will have already been compensated for by the aliens. they know what you're thinking. they created you. they put the moon in orbit. and YOU MIGHTY SKEPTICS are going to beat them in a game of logic?

we live in a multidimensional holographic quantum probability and you think you can KNOW anything at all?
my opinion? ....lighten up in all senses of the word.

Yes it could have all that, and I still could be Batman. In fact that claim has gone for so long without being challenged that I think we can all accept it as fact right?

Originally posted by billybob
the thread is titled, 'Q&A session with john lear'. not'the gospel according to john lear'. not 'us against john lear' or 'prove john lear is lying'.

you(valhall, kano, SO) should be ashamed of your harsh treatment of a man with his history. if he is a fool, then you killed an ant with an atom bomb. if he is not, you suppressed the truth using well known 'power of persuasion' tactics.

Now see how john set a bad example? You've proven us right. You're doing it now...stating your bloody close-minded opinion as fact.

Originally posted by Valhall

Now see how john set a bad example? You've proven us right. You're doing it now...stating your bloody close-minded opinion as fact.

you don't know how ironically funny that paragraph is, do you? i've 'proven' that nothing is provable. statistically likely is the most you'll ever get out of this POV.

Originally posted by Kano
You'll also note that john is still not banned, but chose by himself to stop responding to ATS after he was asked tough questions. Questions that could address the truthfulness of what he was saying, instead of questions that just allowed him to continue his story.

John was a guest here, but halfway through his time he realised that not everyone was just going to accept his story 'because he said so'. Apparently he was not interested in that sort of scrutiny. Again I pose the question partykid, would you rather everyone just overlooked the obvious errors in his story and just didn't bother thinking for themselves at all?

Comment: Another point is that John Lear writes things no more off the wall than say the major posting on John Titor. Nothing there can be proved.

Also I was trying to help him input some images so he could offer some supportive concepts on his statements, in chat. Neither he nor I could go to the final posting. What he has is on his hard drive, not a URL directly. He tried uploading a file to his special features menu, then pasting the appropriate URL, but it did not work.

Apparently John ceased the postings not only because of the near flaming of his views in what people here might think was a tactless moderating process, but as it also seems, he did not want to talk to the administrators or others who handle simple help issues.

I think we should hear more on the Q&A, because the basic premise is that what he says is his opinion from the beginning, so disclaimers at every turn to say "in my opinion," ought to be understood. If in this Q&A we can prove for example "the moon's atmosphere is not equivalent to 18k feet of pressure," then we should rebute it with evidence, not require him to prove every point he makes in his meeting here from a continuing internet sojourn.

I do not feel any danger from his inconsistencies, if you will, or "lies," at worst, too seriously. Revamp your rules a little and let topics breathe, especially when someone such as John Lear is telling us his opinion, whether the form of it is "in my opinion," or not. We can distinguish critically what we read here, so at least in a Q&A let the rebuttals flow, not the adminstrative powers and rules. Reset the whole thing on an opinion basis, put the disclaimer there, and let it be. You made up the terms and conditions so you can change things to make things work better. I note also that there were personal attacks on John from non-administrators that are not within our guidelines completely, nor in spirit. Those things came unabated.

I would welcome John back anytime in this Q&A, but I think the administrators need to pontificate less and communicate more. We are now in a state of ignorance about "what could have been."

[edit on 18-9-2004 by SkipShipman]

John is more than welcome to return and continue his question and answer session, no restrictions have been placed on his account.

Originally posted by Kano
John is more than welcome to return and continue his question and answer session, no restrictions have been placed on his account.

Comment: I realize that is possible, but is he going to be hamstrung by the "in my opinion thing," at every turn, or can someone let it be understood that is the premise and there are no "violations," of "terms and conditions?" When he goes into some statement that is "off the wall," we should understand from the beginning that is his opinion, not posting "false information?"

Let me give you an example of something that looks "false," but is not necessarily a mutually exclusive concept in science.

Say the earth is not moving, but the universe and solar system revolves around it?

One could look at it that way, but the celestial calculations are highly more complex than say looking at the sun is the center of the solar system and calculating from that mathematical premise.

The first explanation is not necessarily entirely false, in fact one could look at it both ways if you wanted to do so. I talked about this idea at a planetarium once, the curator said, "yes you could look at things both ways."

Unfortunately the wrong side in the Church had only one explanation in the earth as the "firmament," namely "motionless." It lost the scientific argument, but was it really only wrong in not acknowledging that its way of looking at things was too complicated and mutually exclusive.

Sometimes the way you look at things matters, and reveals provable things when you converse about it. Can you look at the earth as motionless? Yes you can, but it doesn't work for simplified explanations.

[edit on 18-9-2004 by SkipShipman]

Yes it shouldn't be too hard for him to preface his comments with an 'in my opinion' style thing.

Even so, if his opinions are openly flawed, he can still expect questions to be asked as to why he believes this if there is evidence to the contrary.

John is more than welcome to return and continue his question and answer session, no restrictions have been placed on his account.

I don�t think that that is the problem that the members are having it�s the overall moderation of the THRED. The Attack that the Mods laid on John Lear if would have been done by any other member of ATS would have been banned. Then when? About the attack the Mods proceeded to quote the forum rules. That is convenitly overlooked on a regular Basis!! If the rules that the mods used to Attack John�s beliefs were enforced in the same manner that they were in this thread the site would shut DOWN period.

I can in a matter of 5 min go thought ATS and link threads that are ridiculous with out any proof or facts that the mods convintley stayed out of.

This whole site is somewhat about the Unexplaned( IE: No proof or fact)


I DO NOT BELIVE THAT JOHN LEARS STORYS ARE IN ANYWAY TRUE OR HOLD ANY MERRIT BUT THE MODS DROPPED THE BALL HERE PERIOD!!


[edit on 18-9-2004 by Intrested]

Double post

[edit on 18-9-2004 by Intrested]

It is unfortunate what happend here. I will not comment on the politics though.

John Lear, if you can hear me, I thank you very much, for sharing your knowledge and insight about aliens. I am always very keen to listen to anything related to the ET phenomena. I have a lot of research myself into the matter, and now I am convinced beyond an iota of doubt, that ET's are here with us. I would like to share some thoughts with you on your postings:

Your stance on this matter is very much the anti-thesis of Steven Greer's stance. You purport the aliens are a malevolent, imperialist, and enslaving force, while Greer considers them benevolent. You also liken the human race to a primitive ant colony. I think you both take to the extrremes.

What are aliens?

Aliens, are peoples/civilizations from other places in the universe. We are no different. We are also people, and aliens to others in the universe. I had to demistify the term "alien" because it is too extreme of a generalization for the uncountable inhabitants of the universe. Now look at it again, but this time say, space peoples, and you remove this psychological barrier you have erected for yourself; this, us and them attitude.

Peoples can be of positive/creative or negative/destuctive disposition, individually and collectively, and that alone is the proof of free will(something you contested earlier) free will is an act of consciousness, and this positive/negative polarity, no doubt, is true for the peoples of the universe. There are positive and negative aliens.

Perhaps, you have only encountered negative alien beings. That is probably because, aliens of positive disposition, are not abducting, mutilating, supplying technlogy or collaborating with the government. Yet, what they could be doing, and what you are not seeing, is keeping the negative aliens in check - status quo. Free will is key here. Neither, the positive, or negative aliens, have enforced there agenda, the agenda has been chosen by ours leaders. As you said: "The government sold us out "

If I was a positive alien species, I would respect the universal rights of an intelligent species, to choose their own destiny. Non-interference is another key here.

You said, jesus was planted by these aliens to pacify us, and make us believe in God, and to astonish us with miracles of advanced technology, to keep us in our "farm" Jesus/Krishna/Buddha's teachings, miracles, and the belief in God, is not oppressing, but liberating and empowering, and it has given us impetus to grow and build a more cohesive, enlightened and loving society. If the aliens merely created us as a slave race, for their menial jobs and to harvest us for our genetics, why give us so much inner-power?

I think you have all the wrong ideas for the reasons the aliens are here. I will not even comment on the tower on the moon theory.

Finally, I would like to ask you, what is the spirituality and philosophies of these aliens? This matters more to me, than the secrets of some exotic propulsion device.

[edit on 18-9-2004 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by johnlear
For anybody who thought my postings on ATS concerning UFO's, the moon, Souls etc. where fact and that I could back them up with evidence I hereby state that with very few exceptions there is not a shred, not a shred of evidence. Everything I talk about is sheer speculation. When I talk about Bob Lazar and what he saw at S-4 this is what Bob told me. I didn't read it at S-4. When I talk about souls being zapped back and forth from the moon. I did not see one being zapped back and forth, nor can I prove that this is happening. My speculation is that it is happening but thats only my speculation. If you have been inconvenienced by believing that all I have said is fact, please accept my apologies. Any further posts I make are to be considered sheer speculation unless I note otherwise. Thanks. *********

I thought he made it pretty clear when he said "any further posts I make are to be considered sheer speculation." Guess some didn't get it.
I think instead of saying: The following are my opinions.... post, next post, next post.... They wanted him to start EVERY post with a disclaimer of opinion, eh?

Now the problem is, the thread needs to be closed.

How can the Mods close it? There would be Mass chaos, and ranting.

He said he isnt going to post anymore in here, so lets close it. This is just ugly.

[edit on 18-9-2004 by SpittinCobra]

I argee that it needs to be closed

To bad that it got out of hand! But it was not John Lear that made this ugly!
It was the Mods

John Told what he thought to be true, and the facts as he saw them.
He never tried to FORCE anything apon anyone that I saw!! Just told his story and stated many times that he NOTHING to prove it.

It will never happen but an apolige is in order


The mods could not handle his claims so they attacked him in a manner that broke their own rules (Go figure)

As I recall SO asked him, repeatedly, about something that could be verified, what Lazar was like at a particular time. This would have gone a long way towards credibillity but it was ignored. See both sides folks. As for closing this thread, it's would be prudent as it is just mod bashing now but can you imagine the outcry.

It's amazing that I read all 14 pages only to have the thread come to this. I too see both sides.

John you really need to learn how to fade the heat better. No offense but you really should have hung around. I appreciate you discussing this with us.

SO, this is the first and only time I have seen you blow it. Remember the big picture. Mods moderate a post to allow everything to go smoothly and continue in a inteligent manner with the key word being continue.

Anyone who follows JL knows that what he says can't be proven. If he could prove it he would be disposed of instead of talking about it here. You just have to take it all with a grain of salt.

That said I agree this should be closed. What a shame

I have been reading this whole thread with absolute fascination. Id like to clear up a few points.

First of all, William, Newton wasnt the first to accurately predict the orbit and phases and tides of the moon. Many ancient peoples did the same thing, and they supposedly knew # all about gravity.

Stu.......your assumptions that at advanced spiecies would have no interest in us is absured and really blind ignorance. Look at our own planet. We, the supposedly superior spieces, spend billons of dollars world wide studying lesser creatures. We study animal behavior constantly, with no sympathy of what we might be doing to our lab rats, test bunnies, and monkeys. We simply deem them incapable of human emotions and terror, we do as we please with them. Thus a spiecies involved in interstellar flight finds a habitable planet for a life form experiment, then creates subjects because they have very high advanced technology, then monitor for hundreds of thousands of years to study how sentient life evolves. So what if its hundreds of thousands of years? To our puny brains, its inconcievable, but to them....could be simply a long term project of interest.

From all the reports and evidence I have seen, the aliens appear to be just that: disinterested scientists observing inferior creatures with a total lack of regard about the suffering or anxiety thier research causes.

Gravity is not what we think. Just recently, many astronomers, who have been studying anomolies in space, are rethinking thier views and theories on gravity. They have seen things that violate what they understand.

A gravity phone? Sounds far fetched, but the principle isnt that strange. Scientists are baffled about a phenominal, which they call dark matter. They still dont know jack about it, but are trying to learn about it.

As for reverse engineering from alien technology? The vast technological jump in the past 50 years cannot be totally the work of a few scientists. I still put money on # confiscated from UFOs.

Anyway.........as for Mr Lear, I respect his ideas and own philosphies. I dont agree with all of them, like atmosphere on the moon. (the reason moon dust fell so rapidly because there was no air to catch minute particles, this no resistance, so the dust falls quite easily.

My dad used to live in Pahrump, I used to visit him. He took my on a trip down 375 (wasnt the ET highway yet...) But he had listened to Art Bell alot, and took me about as close as we could get to area 51. We waited for a little bit, saw sosmething flying around, then saw an aproaching vehicle, immedietely jumped in the car, and took off. The vehicle followed us, then seemed to stop and turn around. maybe security chasing us off.....who knows?

Anyways, thanks for the contributions of your opinions. I am especially curious about the soul tower. traditionally, the moon in mythology has been associated with reincarnation, death, birth, ect. Interesting the the most babies are born during the full moon, aint it?

I saw a similar concept playing a video game, Final Fantasy 9. Anyone who played the game knows what I mean. The red planet Tera, sucking the souls of Gaians through the Ilfa tree, to use the souls to revive the commatose population who died out from a disaster.....

Anyway, glad to see such discussion!

Stu.......your assumptions that at advanced spiecies would have no interest in us is absured and really blind ignorance.

call it bitterness since he did not answer my original, thought provoking, philisphical questions...

indigo child sums up my feelings pretty well, i just cant say it like he does...

i am far more interested in their philosophys, outlook, moral standings(or lack there of) of the universe. they can teach us to bend gravity, harvest souls, and fluxuate space time. what is more important is how they progressed, evolved, and have come to the point they are at. if they show us a new way to gather knowlegde, a better means of communication, then that is far more valuably then any one peice of technology they present. philosophy molds civilazation into what it is and what it will become!


[edit on 18-9-2004 by sturod84]