Alchemy and The Philosopher's Stone is Real

reply to post by timewalker

Well my understanding is that is actually Isis ans is sometimes depicted with Horus, older than Greek I would presume? What's going on? I don't know. Like I said I was going out on a limb. Crack..

F mentions both Egypt and Greece in Cathedrals.

I will cut to the chase. It is the Eleusinian Mysteries.






Edit:

More from Fulcanelli on the Black Virgins...

The esoteric meaning of our black virgins cannot be better defined. They represent in hermetic symbolism the virgin earth, which the artist must choose as the subject of his Great Work. It is first matter in mineral state, as it comes out of the ore bearing strata, deeply buried under the rocky mass.

It is, the texts tells us, a heavy, brittle, friable black substance, which has the appearance of a stone and, like a stone, can shatter into minute fragments.

Fulcanelli, Le Mystere des Cathedrales

Only Sign00 can really comment on this as I have no experience with the 'black stage'. It seems to me from reading this quote, which is further along in the same chapter from Cathedrals, that it does, indeed, reflect Sign00s suggested regimen but as far as the nature of what is attained I don't know.

Here's a quick grab of the Isis and Horus story translated from a picture from The temple of Luxor. Not that you don't know this already.

In the far left there is a man with a bird's head on him and a long beak, that is the angel or Tehuti (Thoth), the god of wisdom who comes to the person who is going to be mother of God and announces that she is going to get pregnant. In other words, later in the Christian faith you will see this as The Annunciation. She then becomes pregnant and delivers the baby as a virgin, and this becomes the virgin birth. So you have both the Annunciation as well as the virgin birth, and as you move on over in the scene, you have The Adoration where all the wise people are coming around to pay homage to this new king. In other words, the story of the virgin birth, a young saviour, the announcement ahead of time by the angel of the Lord, the wise people coming around to adore, all of this material already appears in the temple of Luxor in the 18th dynasty.

source

reply to post by Frater210

Ok. Google fool here.

Demeter and Persephone...

Thanks for cutting to the chase.

See this is why it gets so difficult, so many things to read.

reply to post by timewalker


No #e, Brother.

Have you ever noticed that these guys were really well educated? It has been said by real scholars of this stuff that F had to have had a 'classical' education, whatever that may mean. We are just not automatically equipped by the American school system to deal with Alchemy. I have even heard that Geometry has been taken out of the standard school curriculum.

It does take a lot of reading and a grounding in the classics of the literature of multiple countries and Mythologies and Folklores from multiple cultures from history. It is a good idea to know the Greek and Egyptian myths and legends.

The Eleusis stuff has always been a giant mystery.




Speaking of Mystery...

What do you suppose would happen if there were, say, a terrible laboratory accident and somehow, maybe by some strange twisting of time and Cold Duck, George Clinton and Fulcanelli were to somehow exchange genetic material, er something, would they be...

Funkanelli?!?

reply to post by Frater210
Careful Fulcanelli might be reading this thread and take offense.

And yeah, American schools not so well equipped, well in any way.

Yes I think they dropped geomancy, I mean geometry.

Frater, your such the N00nut!

reply to post by timewalker

Careful Fulcanelli might be reading this thread and take offense.

I wish he were, I'd be like, "Yo, Fulc! why not just say it was the pee pee, there, mister Liberty, mister Phrygian cap!".

That's what I would say.

I am getting slappy and it is so early.




Edit:

Demeter and Persephone...

Check out Kore which is another name for Demeter and also, Pherepapha which is the name given to Persephone by Plato and he said about her, "she is wise and touches that which is in motion".

The Plato stuff is new to me as well but it sure is evocative.

reply to post by Frater210
Back at Ya!

HERMETIC WRITINGS

Apparently the earliest of the Hermetic class of writings is the Kore Kosmou or Virgin of the World.

It has more connection with the earlier mythology of Egypt than the other works, Isis and Horus are the teacher and taught; Thoth, Imhotep, and Ptah are all named; the mission of Osiris and Isis is recounted; the divine parentage of the kings is described, and Egypt is the happy centre of all the world. As such Egyptian detail is absent from works of the first or second century B.C., it would be reasonable to put this earlier; and the Egyptian forms of the names of the gods imply earlier translation than that of the other works.

sacred-text.com

reply to post by timewalker


You are Quick Draw McGraw. Boy this is stating to take me back. I had no idea what the significance of that text may have been last time I tried to tackle it.

I just finished the book. Fascinating! I skimmed over a couple chapters of the history, but I intend to read it all again.

I'd love to try this experiment. But now is not a great time as I have none of the required items, nor the proper space. Plus I'd want to read and reread to gain a better understanding of the actual process.

I think they did a really great job or explaining the natural processes of nature etc. I must say for whatever it's worth I loved this book. Whether or not any of this can be proven will be up to the experimenter, if they have the patience, but it seems that all the information is there to at least try!

I hope somebody does, and soon.

reply to post by Frater210

The Plato stuff is new to me as well but it sure is evocative.

Plato was the famous pupil of Socrates and, like Socrates, an initiate of the Pythagorean and Orphic tradition, which was Hermetic in origin. It was due to Plato that the thoughts and words of Socrates were recorded and made known. Plato founded the first Academy, in 387 BC, in the Grove of Academus. The main philosophical thrust of the European Renaissance was derived primarily from Plato.

Francis Bacon Research Trust

The principle Orphic deity, Dionysos is killed, dismembered, boiled, and eaten by the Titans. But Dionysos is then reborn due to Athena having saved his heart and given it to Zeus. Dionysos is thus actually "thrice born," as the Orphic's first god, Phanes, who emerged from the Orphic egg wound with the spiral serpent, was also named Dionysos.3

source
Wanted to add this second link is chock full of good stuff.

but as far as the nature of what is attained I don't know.

Hey, Waidaminute.

Did not Sign00 post some images on this thread of his broken alembic from the black stage? I know they are on the BoA forum.

Anyhow, the substance in the alembic sure looks black, brittle and friable to me.

Damn, once again; Sign - 1, haters - 0.

P.S. Please forgive my slowness, I have had so much on my plate the last few months that I had to buy new china.

So this thread is about eating your pee and living forever?

Apparently so!

reply to post by AlRub
So all you have done so far is said what it is not, talk a bunch of crypto hub-bub and post other peoples work as your own. Do you actually have anything to say of what it you think it IS, or just going to recap Sign00's work as you said in your earlier post and ridicule?

I was keeping an open opinion about you, unlike the rest, but now your seeming quite the troll. Not that it probably matters to you but you just lost any credibility you almost gained back.

Fail!

reply to post by timewalker


Hey, TW.

It is starting to look to me as though the only thing that the Kore Kosmous and 'Kore' as an aspect or other name for Demeter, have in common is that the word Kore means 'virgin'.

If there is a connection then I am too dense at the moment to see it.

On the other hand, it is interesting to note that Kore, in some cases, is the name given to Persephone when she lives underground as the consort of Hades. In this aspect she is a 'terrible' Goddess. F gives one description of one of the statuettes thusly...

As for the statuettes of Isis-I am speaking of those which escaped being Christianized-these are even rarer than the black Virgins. Perhaps one should seek the reason for this in the high antiquity of these icons.

Witkoski describes one, which was housed in the St. Etienne Cathedral at Metz. 'This stone figure of Isis,' writes the author, '43 cm. high and 29 cm. broad, came from the old cloister. The high relief projected 18 cm. It represented the naked bust of a woman, but was so thin that, to make use of a picturesque phrase of Abbe Brantdme, ''She could not show anything but the outline". Her head was covered with a veil. Two dried-up breasts hung down from her chest, like those of the Dianas of Ephesus. The skin was coloured red and the drapery covering the figure was black. Similar statues were to be found at St. Germaindes and St. Etienne in Lyons.'

Fulacnelli, The Mystery of The Cathedrals

Anyhow, I am going to stick my neck out here and say that I think that F is referring to the 'Negredo' part of The Work.

reply to post by AlRub

Here I'll save you the trouble.

It¹s not that I do not know your secret Mercury, which is no other than a living, universal and innate spirit, which, in the form of airy vapour, comes down ceaselessly from heaven to earth in order to fill its porous belly, which then is born in the middle of impure sulphurs, and while growing, changes nature from volatile to fixed, giving itself the form of a radical fluid.

Crasselame - The Light coming out of the Darkness

reply to post by Frater210
Interesting. Kore Kosmou does translate to Virgin World. Some think it's Cosmos, but from what i can dig up it's World.

Persephone (also Kore) was abducted and raped by Hades and allowed to come back up from the underworld for half the year to her mother only to have to return for the other half. Seems quite a "chaotic" life. As in Prima.

Maybe your right. I wonder, being in the catacombs (base) if there are other correspondence of colors, white swan, peacock (stained glass), red (pelican), phoenix (color)??

Or just correspondence in general?

Sorry sign00, we have Shainghai'd the thread, but it is 'Alchemy and the Philosopher's Stone is Real'..

The research is a lot of fun. A giant rubik's cube.

"Observe how I describe the regimen to you! Prepare it with the urine of boys, with water of the sea, and with permanent clean water, so that it may be tinged, and decoct with a gentle fire, until the blackness altogether shall depart from it, and it be easily pounded." -Turba Philosophorum (Do you use the urine of "boys" and sea water too?)

"Take, therefore, one part of the most intense white gum; one part of the urine of a white calf; one part of the gall of a fish; and one part of the body of gum, without which it cannot be improved; mix these portions and cook for forty days." -Turba Philosophorum (Urine from a white calf and a part of the gall of a fish?)

"Take living chalk (quicklime), according to the quantity of the substance. Pour on it a good amount of urine. Let the lime slake in it; after it is slaked, let it settle, and pour it off above." -Johan Isaac Hollandus (Do you use quicklime too?)

"One can do just as well with pure, old urine, as with vinegar." -same (Do you believe this?)
"A great many students make a mistake at the very outset by performing this calcination on a wrong substance-borax, or alum, or ink, or vitriol, or arsenic, or seeds, or plants, or wine, vinegar, urine, hair, blood, gum, resin, etc; or they choose a false method, and corrode instead of calcining the metallic bodies on which they operate." -Philalethes (is he being envious?)

"Hence we conclude that Mercury alone is the true Key of our Art; for it is in truth the dry water described by the Sages, which, though liquid, does not wet the hands, nor anything else that does not belong to the unity of its substance. Mercury is our doorkeeper, our balm, our honey, oil, urine, may-dew, mother, egg, secret furnace, oven, true fire, venomous Dragon, Theriac, ardent wine, Green Lion, Bird of Hermes, Goose of Hermogenes.." -Philalethes (maybe our self proclaimed adepts of urine can enlighten us on this : why does he call this agent "our urine", "our dew", "our oil", "our green lion", as i have previously explained being images of one substance who's identity is never revealed)

"This kindles the fixed blood which is sprung from it, the spirit of the salt of the Sages imparts strength and firmness, though the spirit of tartar and the spirit of urine together with true vinegar, have great virtue. For the spirit of vinegar is cold, and the spirit of lime is intensely hot, and thus the two spirits are found to be of opposite natures. I do not here speak according to the customary manner of the Sages. But I must not say too openly how the inner gates are to be unlocked." -Basile Valentine (lime? vinegar? and urine?)

"This supernatural Fire, my Son, the Philosophers have hidden in their books in parabolical expressions, naming the same by innumerable names, and especially they term it Balnem Maria, a moist Horse-dung, Menstruum, Urine, Milk, Blood, Aqua vitae, and the like. Fire, saith Bernhardus, make a vaporous Fire; continual, digesting, not violent, subtle, airy, clear, close, incombustible, penetrant and vital: and thereupon he speaketh further, Truly, I have told thee all the manner and circumstances of the Fire, which only performeth all, and therefore he bids the Reader, to consider well and often the words he said concerning the Fire. Consequently, he that is wise will easily perceive thence, that those words are not to be understood of a common, but of a supernatural Fire; which also Mary the Prophetess doth hint, saying, that the Element of Water doth dissolve the Bodies, and make them white. And concerning this Fire (which he calleth Menstruum) and its preparation, Raymond Lully speaketh in his Testamentm Novisimum, in Codice, in Anima Metallorum, Luce Mercurorium, Liber Mercurorium, de Secretis Naturae, de Quinta Essentia, & in Elucidario Testamenti, c. 4 saying, that it is not Human but Angelical to reveal this Celestial Fire, and that it is the greatest secret of all, how to attain to the knowledge of it. And moreover he saith in figurative expressions, that this Fire is composed of Horse-dung and Calx vive." -Hydropyrographum Hermeticum

"Consequently it s necessary to know this blessed Water, and its preparation, which Water is a hot, fiery, piercing Spirit, the Philosophical Water, and the hidden Key of this Art (...) This Virgin and blessed Water the Philosophers have named in their Books with many thousand names; they call it Heaven, Celestial Water, Celestial Rain, the dew of Heaven, May-dew, Water of Paradise, parting Water, Aqua Regis, a corrosive Aquafort, sharp Vinegar, Brandy, Quintessence of Wine, growthful green Juice, a growing Mercury, a viridescent Water, and Leo Viridis, Quick-Silver, Menstruum, Blood, Urine, Horse-piss, Milk, and Virgins Milk, white Arsenick, Silver, Lune, and juice of Lune, a Woman, Feminine Seed, a sulphureous vapouring Water and Smoke, a fiery burning Spirit, a deadly piercing Poison, and Basilisk that killeth all, a venomous Worm, a venomous Serpent, a Dragon, a Scorpion devouring his Children, a hellish Fire of Horse-dung, a sharp Salt, and Salt-Armoniack, a common Salt, sharp Soap, Lye, a viscous Oyl, Ostrich’s Stomach which doth devour and concoct all, an Eagle, Vulture, Bird of Hermes, a Vessel and Seal of Hermes, a melting and calcining Furnace, and innumerable other names of Beasts, Birds, Herbs, Waters, Juices, Milk, Bloods, &c. And they write figuratively in their Books of this Water, to be made of such things, whereas all the unwise, which sought it in such like things, have not found the true desired Water. Know therefore, my dear Son, that it is only made of Mercury vive, and of no other heterogeneous thing in the World; and that the Philosophers therefore gave it so many Names, that it might not be known to the unwise." -Hydropyrographum Hermeticum (Now isn't this crystal clear...)..
Urine is but one of the many images given to this metallic quintessence, crude sperm of metals, which, in THE BEGINNING of the work, must dissolve silver and gold OF THE PHILOSOPHERS (not gold and silver themselves, but what they were primitively composed of).

"Likewise when the Philosophers saw the substance of this Art dissolved, they called it Salt Armoniac, and when it was putrefied they said our Stone was base, and is found on a dunghill, and many have dug and laboured in the dunghill and have found nothing. And when it is converted into water, then both poor and rich have it, and it is found in every place, at any time, and in every thing, although the searching aggravates the searcher. And when it was white, they called it Arsenic, and by the name of every white thing, and also Virgin's MiIk, and when it was red they called it Sulphur, Jacinth and Blood, and by the name of every red thing.
Gratianus: ASHES may be made of EVERY THING, and OF THOSE ASHES, SALT may BE MADE, AND OF THAT SALT may WATER BE MADE, AND OF THAT WATER IS MERCURY MADE, and OF THAT MERCURY BY DIVERS OPERATIONS is SOL made." -Rosarium Philosophorum
The Spiritus Mundi is thereby liberated from its calcinated body, and is a PREPARED (read "philosophical") product, artificial to find, and outside of the vulgar mineral/metallic bodies continuously sublimated together by the mercurial agent in the work. Does urine's salt come from the ashes of a previously calcinated mineral body?


But whatever, i respect your search for the Stone in urine itself + vulgar gold+silver.. you may as well look for it in dung, human semen, blood, hair, oil, calx vive, sea water, antimony, and so many other materials who hold their place in the works of the philosophers..against so many predications, i wish you guys luck with this enterprise in the attempt to produce real medicines.

P.S. Timewalker, The light coming out of darkness, who's latin original title is my signature since i'm here, is a tract i've read and studied a few times and is not the easiest. Quoting it, in the light of urine, besides numerous other valid ideas in theory, just shows you're at the very beginning of this quest and are credulous enough to wholly believe the first loudmouths in this field where you are far from specialized. So keep your scores, but always remember when you do so, that you may be fooling yourself.