If the Illuminati control Masonry I do not care

reply to post by KSigMason


You missed a very important part of what i was saying if they are indeed a secret society within a secret society i'm not so sure they follow the standard rank of what constitutes the by laws of "quote un quote" Masonry, if there looking for the right kind of people for there agenda it would be pretty hard to go by the official laws of Masonry because your choice would be too thin, i'd bet they have there own ranking system with higher degrees then what official Masonry has especially in America...

As far as Europe gos it's much easier to condition Masons from a generational stand point when you factor in royalty and the fact that Masons have more power in government and business in certin euro countries this kind of power attracts more nefarius beings that would fit in well with the alleged agenda.

reply to post by King Seesar

It would be extremely hard for Freemasonry to be controlled by an external group due to its revolving leadership and democratic practices. Someone would've noticed. Like it has been said, they are doing a poor job if they exist.

Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by King Seesar

 

It would be extremely hard for Freemasonry to be controlled by an external group due to its revolving leadership and democratic practices. Someone would've noticed. Like it has been said, they are doing a poor job if they exist.

It's true you could look at it in the spectrum of there doing a poor job but when you factor in the alleged plot Freemasonry is just one small piece of there puzzle and you add in all the other areas where they allegedly have a foot hold in such as politics religion arts and entertainment they might be doing a better job then you think but your point gos back to something David Icke said (like him or not believe him or not) he said these people are smart but not wise....

Also one final point, i wouldn't put it in the terms that the Illuminati control Freemasonry but use them very well..

Originally posted by King Seesar
I'v done plently of reserach into Crowley as a mater of fact when he was supposed to move up in the rankings of the Golden Dawn some of the higher ranking members wanted him to wait but he went to a friend who had the power to move his rank up and he did basically goning over his superiors heads causing alot of problems.

Seesar, with all due respect, you seem to be making a judgement based upon superficial facts. If you took some time to actually study the principles of the Golden Dawn, you would understand why the Adepts opposed Crowley going any further in his studies. It is critically important to have and understand BALANCE within your spiritual Work. Because you are dealing with powerful forces, it can cause serious physical, mental, and spiritual instability. This is the undeniable reason why NO ONE can just "rush through the grades" to gain Adepthood. What causes someone to even try is Ego. Ego is not balance. It is death for those who cannot put it in its proper perspective and containment. It is exactly this point that caused Crowley, in all his brilliance, to descend into madness and corruption of the soul. Crowley serves as a teacher....and a warning....to any serious student of the mysteries.

Originally posted by King Seesar
But like i said i'm againts the occult in terms of a esoteric agenda so i oppose the Golden Dawn along with the Church of Satan...

Yes, and I'm sure that many a medieval peasant was afraid to BATHE as they thought it would bring them sickness or disease. We see where that got them, don't we? There is no "agenda" of the Golden Dawn, other than to give you the tools to control your own spiritual evolution. In fact, once you learn some basic understanding, you will go to your church (whatever church that may be) and see things in a whole new light. Suddenly, the words of Jesus.....sayings like "the way to the father is through me"..... will take on a new, deeper meaning and you will find yourself enlightened and even more deeply spiritually EMPOWERED.

Fear, ignorance, and dogma are not your savior. Open and free your mind, my friend... Knowledge is freedom.

Originally posted by King Seesar
If there are higher ups i'm sure alot of research gos into selecting the person too include in the plot, kind of like the CIA have you ever seen the movie the Good Shepherd they select people whos morals wont get in the way at the job at hand, and judging by your posts they wouldn't select you because you would be too big a risk...

This basically proves my point. Since I am doing what I am doing they would not approve and therefore would have no use for me or anyone else like me.

Originally posted by King Seesar
You missed a very important part of what i was saying if they are indeed a secret society within a secret society i'm not so sure they follow the standard rank of what constitutes the by laws of "quote un quote" Masonry...

Then who would this high ranking cabal be giving instructions to if they are outside of Masonry? Themselves? This analogy severely limits the resources such a goup would have to draw from. If they are not following standards and bylaws then they are not Masons.

reply to post by CIAGypsy


My dear CIAGypsy first one must understand that there is more then one meaning and different kinds of enlightenment, the bible warns to not mess around with magik and Aleister Crowley is a prime example of why not too, the Golden Dawn does not teach the kind of enlightenment i want to obtain for there's a reason John F Kennedy warned against secret society's he seen the evil that man could potentially do to him self and others through the thick vail of covert means, the true path to enlightenment is self taught with the aid of god not going through rituals and having others trap you in a box with there limited understanding of the wrong kind of enlightenment....

As for me i'm very open minded and have done a ton of research on vast amounts of topics and i'v probably seen things that basic science can't explain at the present time but while it's true you should always thirst for knowledge you should also keep your self grounded in the spirit of god...

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by King Seesar
You missed a very important part of what i was saying if they are indeed a secret society within a secret society i'm not so sure they follow the standard rank of what constitutes the by laws of "quote un quote" Masonry...

Then who would this high ranking cabal be giving instructions to if they are outside of Masonry? Themselves? This analogy severely limits the resources such a goup would have to draw from. If they are not following standards and bylaws then they are not Masons.

The thing is they are Masons within Masons who have there own agenda and it's a very few who make there own rules while following the by laws of Masonry through the lens of deceit, but the reasons i say that the Illuminati uses and not controls Masonry really well is because your group is the deterrent they put you on the front lines and while everyone points fingers at Masonry it allows there other endeavors to draw less attention to such things as the Council on Foreign Relations, the Trilateral Commission, the Bilderbergers, the Bohemian Grove Commission and the infiltration of the Vatican and other religious sects, these groups are also a secret society but don't get labeled such and they systematically have Masons in these groups so the blame comes back to you and hence you (Masons) become the main problem in the conspiracy theorists eyes, i'm not to say your blame less but your being used by TPTB to further the agenda....

Originally posted by King Seesar
there's a reason John F Kennedy warned against secret society's

You realize, of course, that JFK was a very active and highly decorated member of the Knights of Columbus, a secret society much in the same nature as the Masons, but comprised entirely of Catholics? When he gave that speech, he was warning against communism. He gave it a week after the Bay of Pigs fiasco. That's all.

reply to post by JoshNorton


Yea but he was warning of communism on a broad stroke from every angle and the fact that it could infiltrate Americas government which to a certin extent is happing right now with TSA and a host of other things and anything under the vail of secrecy can lead to a dictatorship givin the opportunity, also i don't consider the Knights of Columbus a secret society, but to each his own.

reply to post by King Seesar


Well, I would argue that KoC are no more or less secret than the Masons. Would you agree?

Originally posted by King Seesar
The thing is they are Masons within Masons who have there own agenda and it's a very few who make there own rules while following the by laws of Masonry through the lens of deceit...

Once again, if it is only a small minority that is doing this then who are they instructing to do their bidding? There can not be very many of them to take orders from, a very clear case of too many Chiefs and not enough Indians.

...but the reasons i say that the Illuminati uses and not controls Masonry really well is because your group is the deterrent they put you on the front lines and while everyone points fingers at Masonry it allows there other endeavors to draw less attention to such things as the Council on Foreign Relations, the Trilateral Commission, the Bilderbergers, the Bohemian Grove Commission and the infiltration of the Vatican and other religious sects, these groups are also a secret society but don't get labeled such and they systematically have Masons in these groups so the blame comes back to you and hence you (Masons) become the main problem in the conspiracy theorists eyes, i'm not to say your blame less but your being used by TPTB to further the agenda....

Then I posit they (the Illuminati) are still doing a very bad job of controlling Masonry to furtehr their own aims since you can look up online, and various other mediums, all of the groups that you mentioned and easily determine most, if not all, the membership of several of them.

reply to post by JoshNorton


Masonry is supposed to be a secret society but i see were your getting at, with the wealth of info on the by the books by laws of Masonry all over the place now it's not so secret anymore but the Knights of Columbus never was a secret society....

Originally posted by King Seesar

My dear CIAGypsy first one must understand that there is more then one meaning and different kinds of enlightenment, the bible warns to not mess around with magik and Aleister Crowley is a prime example of why not too,

Not exactly. The Magi are celebrated in the Bible. And Magian/occult symbolism fills the Bible.

As for Aleister Crowley, outside of some of his more humorous rhetoric, he often had some very important things to say. While I do not recommend his work to beginners for various reasons, any mature and educated student of the mysteries can point to him as a benefactor.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by King Seesar
The thing is they are Masons within Masons who have there own agenda and it's a very few who make there own rules while following the by laws of Masonry through the lens of deceit...

Once again, if it is only a small minority that is doing this then who are they instructing to do their bidding? There can not be very many of them to take orders from, a very clear case of too many Chiefs and not enough Indians.

...but the reasons i say that the Illuminati uses and not controls Masonry really well is because your group is the deterrent they put you on the front lines and while everyone points fingers at Masonry it allows there other endeavors to draw less attention to such things as the Council on Foreign Relations, the Trilateral Commission, the Bilderbergers, the Bohemian Grove Commission and the infiltration of the Vatican and other religious sects, these groups are also a secret society but don't get labeled such and they systematically have Masons in these groups so the blame comes back to you and hence you (Masons) become the main problem in the conspiracy theorists eyes, i'm not to say your blame less but your being used by TPTB to further the agenda....

Then I posit they (the Illuminati) are still doing a very bad job of controlling Masonry to furtehr their own aims since you can look up online, and various other mediums, all of the groups that you mentioned and easily determine most, if not all, the membership of several of them.

There's a small group that in my opnion is meant to keep the Masons as part of the fold but they have these operatives strategically placed in varius other out lets to keep them in the fold too and not everyone knows everyone you keep in contact with the operatives your asigned too that's how they have there foot hold in politics religion and a bunch of other endeavours Masonry is just one small piece of a big big puzzle, but you guys are put out there too hide other elements and you make a easy target, look i go back to what David Icke said "there clever but not wise" if they were wise we would of never found out about the fact that the US government poisoned there own people during probation times also we would of never found out that America infected Guatemalans with syphilis as part of a experiment, MK-Ultra would of never leaked and we would of never found out that America staged a false flag to start the Vietnam war and that's just the secret government of the United Sates slip ups not to mention the other countries that are supposed to make up the New World Orders nefarious dealings...

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by King Seesar

My dear CIAGypsy first one must understand that there is more then one meaning and different kinds of enlightenment, the bible warns to not mess around with magik and Aleister Crowley is a prime example of why not too,

Not exactly. The Magi are celebrated in the Bible. And Magian/occult symbolism fills the Bible.

As for Aleister Crowley, outside of some of his more humorous rhetoric, he often had some very important things to say. While I do not recommend his work to beginners for various reasons, any mature and educated student of the mysteries can point to him as a benefactor.

Aleister Crowley was a very evil man VERY EVIL and yes i feel bad for the way he was brought up his parents were crazy but he had his own free will to make the right choices in life and he didn't.....

>

But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.


Mosses didn't practice magik it was power givin to him by god there is a difference it may seem a sorcerer and a prophet or someone givin a gift from god are the same thing trust me there not......

Originally posted by King Seesar


Aleister Crowley was a very evil man VERY EVIL and yes i feel bad for the way he was brought up his parents were crazy but he had his own free will to make the right choices in life and he didn't.....

Actually, he wasn't "evil" at all. He was just a very provocative author.

Mosses didn't practice magik it was power givin to him by god there is a difference it may seem a sorcerer and a prophet or someone givin a gift from god are the same thing trust me there not......

Moshe was an Initiate of the Egyptian Mysteries, and an Adept of the Sacred Knowledge. (Acts 7:22)

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by King Seesar


Aleister Crowley was a very evil man VERY EVIL and yes i feel bad for the way he was brought up his parents were crazy but he had his own free will to make the right choices in life and he didn't.....

Actually, he wasn't "evil" at all. He was just a very provocative author.

Mosses didn't practice magik it was power givin to him by god there is a difference it may seem a sorcerer and a prophet or someone givin a gift from god are the same thing trust me there not......

Moshe was an Initiate of the Egyptian Mysteries, and an Adept of the Sacred Knowledge. (Acts 7:22)

First off anybody who kills a cat like Crowley did and after it was dead put it through more gruesome acts to quote un quote take away its 9 lives is the act of a potential serial killer also he called him self the anti-christ and meant it the man did alot of bad things the fact you can't see this is puzzling...

As far as Acts 7:22 that's before he found the true power of Yeshua which in turned crushed the Egyptians false gods.........


The only thing i can say to you my friend is that if your gonna practice the arts be aware that your treading on dangerous grounds all i can do is warn you, i don't believe in using magik i rely on god for my power and trust me i'm no saint so don't take it as i'm getting on a high horse and preaching to you take it as someone whos seen enough in there life time to make that choice....

Originally posted by King Seesar

First off anybody who kills a cat like Crowley did and after it was dead put it through more gruesome acts to quote un quote take away its 9 lives is the act of a potential serial killer also he called him self the anti-christ and meant it the man did alot of bad things the fact you can't see this is puzzling...

This is what I meant by Crowley's weird sense of humor. The cat story has a high probability of being make-believe.

As far as Acts 7:22 that's before he found the true power of Yeshua which in turned crushed the Egyptians false gods.........

I think you may have missed the point. Moses discovered true knowledge of the True God in the Egyptian Mysteries, as did Joseph before him.

The only thing i can say to you my friend is that if your gonna practice the arts be aware that your treading on dangerous grounds all i can do is warn you, i don't believe in using magik i rely on god for my power and trust me i'm no saint so don't take it as i'm getting on a high horse and preaching to you take it as someone whos seen enough in there life time to make that choice....

The Magi also rely on God.

reply to post by King Seesar


Seesar,

I, too, find my strength and devotion in the same God as you (most likely). Practicing magick doesn't change that in the least. In fact, angels (especially the archangels) play a very prominent role in most of my rituals, as does the various names of God (Hebrew, Latin, etc...). Ritual and ceremonial magick is nothing more than a tool. It does not define your beliefs. It can be used for both good and evil. As with any tool, it is based upon the intent of the magician. If you learn the symbolism and meaning behind so many aspects of ritual magick, you'd probably be surprised at how much of it is used in the church you already attend. I bet I could go into any church and ask the majority of the parishioners if they understand the meaning behind various aspects of their service and I'd almost guarantee that they'd have no clue. They don't understand why Christ offered up his body and blood. What these two things actually mean and signify. Or why the priest swings a censer, etc...

There is much that can be learned from esoteric knowledge.