Now you are FORCED to buy health insurance, what will you eliminate to afford it?

It's an annual fine for not having health insurance I believe. Why would you not want health insurance anyways? Medicaid will be easier to get if you can't pay for it, and it's going to be much more affordable if you can afford it. This is a dumb argument. Thumbs down to all of you throwing a tantrum over this. You're also required to have car insurance. Don't forget to complain about that.

reply to post by mkross1983


You need to wake up to what this bill really contains.

Well, here's a list of new offices, boards, bureaucracies, committees, councils, exchanges, programs, etc. created in the health care “reform” bill.

1. Grant program for consumer assistance offices (Section 1002, p. 37)
2. Grant program for states to monitor premium increases (Section 1003, p. 42)
3. Committee to review administrative simplification standards (Section 1104, p. 71)
4. Demonstration program for state wellness programs (Section 1201, p. 93)
5. Grant program to establish state Exchanges (Section 1311(a), p. 130)
6. State American Health Benefit Exchanges (Section 1311(b), p. 131)
7. Exchange grants to establish consumer navigator programs (Section 1311(i), p. 150)
8. Grant program for state cooperatives (Section 1322, p. 169)
9. Advisory board for state cooperatives (Section 1322(b)(3), p. 173)
10. Private purchasing council for state cooperatives (Section 1322(d), p. 177)
11. State basic health plan programs (Section 1331, p. 201)
12. State-based reinsurance program (Section 1341, p. 226)
13. Program of risk corridors for individual and small group markets (Section 1342, p. 233)
14. Program to determine eligibility for Exchange participation (Section 1411, p. 267)
15. Program for advance determination of tax credit eligibility (Section 1412, p. 288)
16. Grant program to implement health IT enrollment standards (Section 1561, p. 370)
17. Federal Coordinated Health Care Office for dual eligible beneficiaries (Section 2602, p. 512)
18. Medicaid quality measurement program (Section 2701, p. 518)
19. Medicaid health home program for people with chronic conditions, and grants for planning same (Section 2703, p. 524)
20. Medicaid demonstration project to evaluate bundled payments (Section 2704, p. 532)
21. Medicaid demonstration project for global payment system (Section 2705, p. 536)
22. Medicaid demonstration project for accountable care organizations (Section 2706, p. 538)
23. Medicaid demonstration project for emergency psychiatric care (Section 2707, p. 540)
24. Grant program for delivery of services to individuals with postpartum depression (Section 2952(b), p. 591)
25. State allotments for grants to promote personal responsibility education programs (Section 2953, p. 596)
26. Medicare value-based purchasing program (Section 3001(a), p. 613)
27. Medicare value-based purchasing demonstration program for critical access hospitals (Section 3001(b), p. 637)
28. Medicare value-based purchasing program for skilled nursing facilities (Section 3006(a), p. 666)
29. Medicare value-based purchasing program for home health agencies (Section 3006(b), p. 668)
30. Interagency Working Group on Health Care Quality (Section 3012, p. 688)
31. Grant program to develop health care quality measures (Section 3013, p. 693)
32. Center for Medicare and Medicaid Innovation (Section 3021, p. 712)
33. Medicare shared savings program (Section 3022, p. 728)
34. Medicare pilot program on payment bundling (Section 3023, p. 739)
35. Independence at home medical practice demonstration program (Section 3024, p. 752)
36. Program for use of patient safety organizations to reduce hospital readmission rates (Section 3025(b), p. 775)
37. Community-based care transitions program (Section 3026, p. 776)
38. Demonstration project for payment of complex diagnostic laboratory tests (Section 3113, p. 800)
39. Medicare hospice concurrent care demonstration project (Section 3140, p. 850)
40. Independent Payment Advisory Board (Section 3403, p. 982)
41. Consumer Advisory Council for Independent Payment Advisory Board (Section 3403, p. 1027)
42. Grant program for technical assistance to providers implementing health quality practices (Section 3501, p. 1043)
43. Grant program to establish interdisciplinary health teams (Section 3502, p. 1048)
44. Grant program to implement medication therapy management (Section 3503, p. 1055)
45. Grant program to support emergency care pilot programs (Section 3504, p. 1061)
46. Grant program to promote universal access to trauma services (Section 3505(b), p. 1081)
47. Grant program to develop and promote shared decision-making aids (Section 3506, p. 1088)
48. Grant program to support implementation of shared decision-making (Section 3506, p. 1091)
49. Grant program to integrate quality improvement in clinical education (Section 3508, p. 1095)
50. Health and Human Services Coordinating Committee on Women’s Health (Section 3509(a), p. 1098)
51. Centers for Disease Control Office of Women’s Health (Section 3509(b), p. 1102)
52. Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality Office of Women’s Health (Section 3509(e), p. 1105)
53. Health Resources and Services Administration Office of Women’s Health (Section 3509(f), p. 1106)
54. Food and Drug Administration Office of Women’s Health (Section 3509(g), p. 1109)
55. National Prevention, Health Promotion, and Public Health Council (Section 4001, p. 1114)
56. Advisory Group on Prevention, Health Promotion, and Integrative and Public Health (Section 4001(f), p. 1117)
57. Prevention and Public Health Fund (Section 4002, p. 1121)
58. Community Preventive Services Task Force (Section 4003(b), p. 1126)
59. Grant program to support school-based health centers (Section 4101, p. 1135)
60. Grant program to promote research-based dental caries disease management (Section 4102, p. 1147)
61. Grant program for States to prevent chronic disease in Medicaid beneficiaries (Section 4108, p. 1174)
62. Community transformation grants (Section 4201, p. 1182)
63. Grant program to provide public health interventions (Section 4202, p. 1188)
64. Demonstration program of grants to improve child immunization rates (Section 4204(b), p. 1200)
65. Pilot program for risk-factor assessments provided through community health centers (Section 4206, p. 1215)
66. Grant program to increase epidemiology and laboratory capacity (Section 4304, p. 1233)
67. Interagency Pain Research Coordinating Committee (Section 4305, p. 1238)
68. National Health Care Workforce Commission (Section 5101, p. 1256)
69. Grant program to plan health care workforce development activities (Section 5102(c), p. 1275)
70. Grant program to implement health care workforce development activities (Section 5102(d), p. 1279)
71. Pediatric specialty loan repayment program (Section 5203, p. 1295)

continued ......

72. Public Health Workforce Loan Repayment Program (Section 5204, p. 1300)
73. Allied Health Loan Forgiveness Program (Section 5205, p. 1305)
74. Grant program to provide mid-career training for health professionals (Section 5206, p. 1307)
75. Grant program to fund nurse-managed health clinics (Section 5208, p. 1310)
76. Grant program to support primary care training programs (Section 5301, p. 1315)
77. Grant program to fund training for direct care workers (Section 5302, p. 1322)
78. Grant program to develop dental training programs (Section 5303, p. 1325)
79. Demonstration program to increase access to dental health care in underserved communities (Section 5304, p. 1331)
80. Grant program to promote geriatric education centers (Section 5305, p. 1334)
81. Grant program to promote health professionals entering geriatrics (Section 5305, p. 1339)
82. Grant program to promote training in mental and behavioral health (Section 5306, p. 1344)
83. Grant program to promote nurse retention programs (Section 5309, p. 1354)
84. Student loan forgiveness for nursing school faculty (Section 5311(b), p. 1360)
85. Grant program to promote positive health behaviors and outcomes (Section 5313, p. 1364)
86. Public Health Sciences Track for medical students (Section 5315, p. 1372)
87. Primary Care Extension Program to educate providers (Section 5405, p. 1404)
88. Grant program for demonstration projects to address health workforce shortage needs (Section 5507, p. 1442)
89. Grant program for demonstration projects to develop training programs for home health aides (Section 5507, p. 1447)
90. Grant program to establish new primary care residency programs (Section 5508(a), p. 1458)
91. Program of payments to teaching health centers that sponsor medical residency training (Section 5508(c), p. 1462)
92. Graduate nurse education demonstration program (Section 5509, p. 1472)
93. Grant program to establish demonstration projects for community-based mental health settings (Section 5604, p. 1486)
94. Commission on Key National Indicators (Section 5605, p. 1489)
95. Quality assurance and performance improvement program for skilled nursing facilities (Section 6102, p. 1554)
96. Special focus facility program for skilled nursing facilities (Section 6103(a)(3), p. 1561)
97. Special focus facility program for nursing facilities (Section 6103(b)(3), p. 1568)
98. National independent monitor pilot program for skilled nursing facilities and nursing facilities (Section 6112, p. 1589)
99. Demonstration projects for nursing facilities involved in the culture change movement (Section 6114, p. 1597)
100. Patient-Centered Outcomes Research Institute (Section 6301, p. 1619)
101. Standing methodology committee for Patient-Centered Outcomes Research Institute (Section 6301, p. 1629)
102. Board of Governors for Patient-Centered Outcomes Research Institute (Section 6301, p. 1638)
103. Patient-Centered Outcomes Research Trust Fund (Section 6301(e), p. 1656)
104. Elder Justice Coordinating Council (Section 6703, p. 1773)
105. Advisory Board on Elder Abuse, Neglect, and Exploitation (Section 6703, p. 1776)
106. Grant program to create elder abuse forensic centers (Section 6703, p. 1783)
107. Grant program to promote continuing education for long-term care staffers (Section 6703, p. 1787)
108. Grant program to improve management practices and training (Section 6703, p. 1788)
109. Grant program to subsidize costs of electronic health records (Section 6703, p. 1791)
110. Grant program to promote adult protective services (Section 6703, p. 1796)
111. Grant program to conduct elder abuse detection and prevention (Section 6703, p. 1798)
112. Grant program to support long-term care ombudsmen (Section 6703, p. 1800)
113. National Training Institute for long-term care surveyors (Section 6703, p. 1806)
114. Grant program to fund State surveys of long-term care residences (Section 6703, p. 1809)
115. CLASS Independence Fund (Section 8002, p. 1926)
116. CLASS Independence Fund Board of Trustees (Section 8002, p. 1927)
117. CLASS Independence Advisory Council (Section 8002, p. 1931)
118. Personal Care Attendants Workforce Advisory Panel (Section 8002(c), p. 1938)
119. Multi-state health plans offered by Office of Personnel Management (Section 10104(p), p. 2086)
120. Advisory board for multi-state health plans (Section 10104(p), p. 2094)
121. Pregnancy Assistance Fund (Section 10212, p. 2164)
122. Value-based purchasing program for ambulatory surgical centers (Section 10301, p. 2176)
123. Demonstration project for payment adjustments to home health services (Section 10315, p. 2200)
124. Pilot program for care of individuals in environmental emergency declaration areas (Section 10323, p. 2223)
125. Grant program to screen at-risk individuals for environmental health conditions (Section 10323(b), p. 2231)
126. Pilot programs to implement value-based purchasing (Section 10326, p. 2242)
127. Grant program to support community-based collaborative care networks (Section 10333, p. 2265)
128. Centers for Disease Control Office of Minority Health (Section 10334, p. 2272)
129. Health Resources and Services Administration Office of Minority Health (Section 10334, p. 2272)
130. Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration Office of Minority Health (Section 10334, p. 2272)
131. Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality Office of Minority Health (Section 10334, p. 2272)
132. Food and Drug Administration Office of Minority Health (Section 10334, p. 2272)
133. Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services Office of Minority Health (Section 10334, p. 2272)
134. Grant program to promote small business wellness programs (Section 10408, p. 2285)
135. Cures Acceleration Network (Section 10409, p. 2289)
136. Cures Acceleration Network Review Board (Section 10409, p. 2291)
137. Grant program for Cures Acceleration Network (Section 10409, p. 2297)
138. Grant program to promote centers of excellence for depression (Section 10410, p. 2304)
139. Advisory committee for young women’s breast health awareness education campaign (Section 10413, p. 2322)
140. Grant program to provide assistance to provide information to young women with breast cancer (Section 10413, p. 2326)
141. Interagency Access to Health Care in Alaska Task Force (Section 10501, p. 2329)
142. Grant program to train nurse practitioners as primary care providers (Section 10501(e), p. 2332)

continued..........

I do not intend on giving up anything for the health care scam being forced down our throats....This bill is nothing but a big wet kiss to big pharma and the insurance racket....Come and arrest me ..Put me in prison...Lock me away and throw away the key. I will not submit and I will not comply!

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
What passed doesn't do any of that. It just forces people to buy insurance.

Why would they need to pass a bill, now, for something that is already written into law?

See here: FORCED Healthcare as signed into law.

This thread is a conspiracy, as are others I've seen like it.

Flags to this thread for it being a HOAX about how this bill made it FORCED when it already was FORCED.

Originally posted by nh_ee

We might be forced to pay for healthcare but...

It certainly beats no healthcare at all. Which is what many Americans are facing as they are laid off from their jobs and as they retire..

Ever look at the costs for An emergency room visit ? Or a basic overnight hospital visit ?

Just the basic costs of An ambulance to get there ?

God forbid you or your significant other acquires a life threatening disease like breast or prostate cancer ?

[edit on 22-3-2010 by nh_ee]

FYI Yes...I have looked at the costs. My two year old ...who has insurance..had a medical emergency around christmas.

Emergency room visit...about 1200 all in. Overnight stay..3200 ...ambulance ride 650...and BC/BS does not cover ambulance rides...at all...in any of thier policies.

It beats my wife who had an appendectomy...and had no insurance due to a pre-exisiting condition...that ran me 50k+ out of pocket.

Originally posted by belial259
I was talking to some American's on another site and they're all under the impression it's going to be free.

I can't wait to see the look on their faces.

I don't understand how not many people got how this bill would be terrible. Making the people that didn't have health insurance because they couldn't afford it get health insurance.

Most of the young people I talk to ( I am 19 yrs old myself ) are truly misguided and distracted by the campaign propaganda or shall I say 'Obamaganda'
I can't believe how misled the people have been in this healthcare vote alone.
It seems that too many people are under the impression that 'more govt is good'
They are saying 'FREE MONEYS? WHERE??' and do not even realize or seem to notice the enormous corruption flat in their faces.

We will NOT GIVE UP as human beings. Yes I am an American, and as Americans we inherit its history. I am not nationalist, I believe we are all equal. Yet there now is a fight for our human rights as natives to Earth. We must defend our basic human liberty! I also am not on the 'right' nor on the 'left' - to me it's all bull just created to separate and divide WE THE PEOPLE - to divide our power. We must realize that our power lies in our cooperation, our harmony with each other and nature. The natural laws of creation are mostly ignored or unknown in our sad temporary artificial society but it's time to break our of this matrix, one by one people are waking up. In their own personal paths people are awakening, some are spiritually awakening to their true potential.. finally!
We do not need to be dependent on govt. to hold our hand and walk us thru life, what the hell! don't allow them to trick you into this trap! STAND UP FOR YOUR FREEDOM PEOPLE! GOD HELP US! (and I am not religious, god is an infinite force manifesting within every wave and particle)


[edit on 22-3-2010 by orazio]

Originally posted by MrAndy
It's an annual fine for not having health insurance I believe. Why would you not want health insurance anyways?

It's a choice.
Further, in case of emergency, even without insurance, you can receive medical treatment in a hospital. Some people feel it's better to gamble on good health than it is to pay money each week that they may need for other things.

Medicaid will be easier to get if you can't pay for it, and it's going to be much more affordable if you can afford it.

They are not reducing the premiums for people that already have insurance -- so it will not be more affordable for us. "Us" meaning those of us already with insurance.

Here's the thing: Medicaid is already broke. No money. None. So, by adding even more people into the Medicaid group will do what? Cost more money, right?

Further -- who do you think pays for those Medicaid receivers? Oh yeah -- the taxpayers. Which, they are not, since they are on Medicaid and don't make enough money to contribute to the same tax funds.

You're also required to have car insurance. Don't forget to complain about that.

You only need car insurance if you CHOOSE to have a car. See the difference? Owning a car is not mandatory and in fact, we pay tons of taxes to provide PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION just so people DON'T need a car.

142. Grant program to train nurse practitioners as primary care providers (Section 10501(e), p. 2332)
143. Grant program for community-based diabetes prevention (Section 10501(g), p. 2337)
144. Grant program for providers who treat a high percentage of medically underserved populations (Section 10501(k), p. 2343)
145. Grant program to recruit students to practice in underserved communities (Section 10501(l), p. 2344)
146. Community Health Center Fund (Section 10503, p. 2355)
147. Demonstration project to provide access to health care for the uninsured at reduced fees (Section 10504, p. 2357)
148. Demonstration program to explore alternatives to tort litigation (Section 10607, p. 2369)
149. Indian Health demonstration program for chronic shortages of health professionals (S. 1790, Section 112, p. 24)*
150. Office of Indian Men’s Health (S. 1790, Section 136, p. 71)*
151. Indian Country modular component facilities demonstration program (S. 1790, Section 146, p. 108)*
152. Indian mobile health stations demonstration program (S. 1790, Section 147, p. 111)*
153. Office of Direct Service Tribes (S. 1790, Section 172, p. 151)*
154. Indian Health Service mental health technician training program (S. 1790, Section 181, p. 173)*
155. Indian Health Service program for treatment of child sexual abuse victims (S. 1790, Section 181, p. 192)*
156. Indian Health Service program for treatment of domestic violence and sexual abuse (S. 1790, Section 181, p. 194)*
157. Indian youth elemental health demonstration project (S. 1790, Section 181, p. 204)*
158. Indian youth life skills demonstration project (S. 1790, Section 181, p. 220)*
159. Indian Health Service Director of HIV/AIDS Prevention and Treatment (S. 1790, Section 199B, p. 258)*


Hmmm, wonder how much $$$$$ that leaves for any actual health care.

In 2008, the average wage for 1.9 million federal civilian workers was $79,197, which compared to an average $50,028 for the nation’s 108 million private sector workers

For feds, more get 6-figure salaries Average pay $30,000 over private sector

159 more new offices, boards, bureaucracies, committees, councils, exchanges, programs with no telling how many additional federal employees! Even if each new office, etc. had ONLY 1 employee at the average federal salary that would be $12,592,323. And if there are 5 employees in each new office/etc. $62,961,615.00. And that's if they are just paid the average salary!

Seems to me like this HealthCare Reform is more about creating more government jobs that providing health care for people.

reply to post by Cabaret Voltaire


Put a ban on Hollywood There's enough money in that old odd town going around to pay for Health Care for the whole of the US


I live in a country where everybody has Health Care and everybody pays a basic fee, if you want x-tra's your monthly HC-bill will get up. Although I understand that IF you do not have much money to begin with it can be hard to pay for your HealthCare.

On the other hand .... I believe it's not more then fair that everybody pays their bit ..... even people who have social security money do pay for their HealthCare, at least here in my country.

I think lots of people who cannot even afford a car, do own one often payed by the bank. And people do live in houses they 'buy' which belong to the banks...

We choose to have NO car and live in a rental house. I would choose that and be able to pay for my HealthCare above owning a car and / or a house any time!

Guess life is full of choices ......

Already have insurance and had it for years. Mine is fine, how about yours.

reply to post by inthesticks


you know we did perform genocide on Native Americans for over a century dont you? Better health care is the least we can do.

Originally posted by rusethorcain
reply to post by Genfinity

 

If I quit cigarettes chips and soda I can buy health insurance for a few people. It doesn't start until another four years anyway so there is plenty of time to plan.

At least when you spend the money required in four years you are going to get something for it.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by rusethorcain]

You're willing to shell out $900 a month minimum for a family of 5? It was close to $200 a month just for him. My husband was quoted that a couple of years ago through his employer insurance. Here I'm just holding on to my house with a mortgage of $640 with utilities and basic TV and internet.

You can't tell me getting rid of my TV and internet will help any, since that adds up to less than $100 a month. Neither do I have a cell phone, so there are not other costs to cut.

If I can't afford to pay my school loan, and don't have enough money to cut back on, how the heck will I be able to afford insurance? Even after my husband lost his job, and I was only making minimum wage, I still couldn't get medicaid through welfare.

There are plenty of people in my situation, and millions more headed towards it, if the economy keeps getting worse. I don't see the government saying they are going to open up medicaid further. I hear about how they are going to cut back on medicare for seniors.

My state has a CHIP program, which it is easy for kids to get on. My kids are covered. My husband and I qualify for the adultBasic, but thousands of people have been on that list for a long time, and some 20+ years.

I for see more house foreclosures, more bankruptcies, more unemployment, many small businesses going under, more people being paid under the table just to get some work done, and more people and families moving to the streets to live.

How is the government going to enforce fees for those living on the streets and in tents? I still remember news stories about growing tent cities in various places where the housing market hit the hardest. I bet they don't even file taxes. What is the government going to do, arrest them as soon as they are released from the hospital?

The government has a big problem that is going to get even bigger. I feel for those who think they will receive free insurance, and who think their insurance premiums are actually going to go down.

I'm sure the insurance companies will do a token reduction of $10 per person if everyone is lucky. If the insurance companies do slash $100 or more, be prepared in the next couple of years for insurance to go back up to where it use to be or worse.

You know how they do with the gas prices. It went up to $4.00 a gallon. Everyone got outraged. Then it came back down to around $2.00 a gallon, and there was a collective sigh of relief. Now it is back up close to $3.00 a gallon, and no one is really speaking out against it.

I'm guessing a major slash from the insurance companies will come only after they raise the prices during the 4 years before everyone has to obtain some type of insurance. That slash will probablly bring down the prices to close to where they are now.

If prices actually go down as much as some think it will, I will be extremely surprised. Anyone thinking the government saying affordable and/or prices will be reduced so much that you only have to pay $25 a person per month is sadly mistaken.

Originally posted by dzonatas

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
What passed doesn't do any of that. It just forces people to buy insurance.

Why would they need to pass a bill, now, for something that is already written into law?

See here: FORCED Healthcare as signed into law.

This thread is a conspiracy, as are others I've seen like it.

Flags to this thread for it being a HOAX about how this bill made it FORCED when it already was FORCED.

You linked an article about California mandating that parents that are able supply healthcare for their children and you are calling us ill-informed?

Greetings Carabet Voltaire,

Originally posted by Cabaret Voltaire
Now that you are FORCED to buy health insurance, how will you afford it?

It will cost me my freedom.

I intend to violate and disrespect the [unconstitutional] obamacare socialized medicine law. I'll refuse the national ID card, and I'll refuse the mandatory chip implant.

Therefore, I'll end up in the gulag (5 years incarceration, as mandated by obamacare) as a political prisoner.

Well, of course, I'll put up a fight as will any other concerned citizen will, but imprisonment is a key component of obamacare, and that's probably what will end up happening. Guess I'll get medical care in prison (ie. sodium penethol).

For those who choose to obey the illegal obamacare law, you might want to read this: Letter from the Globalist

Originally posted by guidanceofthe third kind
reply to post by inthesticks

 

you know we did perform genocide on Native Americans for over a century dont you? Better health care is the least we can do. [/quote

What I listed are just NEW offices, programs, jobs, etc. that will be created by the health care bill. NOT the actual health care. That is one of the problems with this bill. Just think of how much health care for the Indians, poor, elderly, etc. could be paid for with all the money that will go to pay for the salaries that these new government employees will be paid.

I think allot of people Here and in our country, really need to study the constitution. I think liberty is important, I think our founders had a great idea, I think those that pioneered our country, never thought about living in a country where they were forced to have health care, their only concern was being free, that is why they came. Now America, just does not sound like it did before. Is it wrong? I think it may be on the wrong side of right I think it brings us closer to what we were against in the infancy of our country. I think most people do not understand what America, was founded on back in 1776, yet at the same time I also understand I am a minority in my thinking and one who could be attacked or insulted for knowing what country I live in, or at least understand what my country was founded on. I do not think we should hate each other as far as a side, I just think people need to understand the history without the haggle of what America, the United states of America, is suppose to mean. The railroads were not built this way, the west was not pioneered this way, inovation was not made this way, our philosophy is what made America, what it was, and now a change like this nullifies the concepts and idea's of what a country that gives all the freedom, to succeed from hard work. I cannot imply how important it is to study the history of all things to understand or give those the wisdom to try to understand the future of such.



I must say thou this will be a worthless idea, unless people have work so they can pay for their manditory healthcare, or this great idea will become one hell of a dicotomy..

I wonder which bracket most of the proponents of this thing will fall under??

Premium subsidies would be available for individuals and families with incomes between 133 percent and 400 percent of the poverty level, or $14,404 to $43,320 for individuals and $29,326 to $88,200 for a family of four.
The subsidies would be on a sliding scale. For example, a family of four earning 150 percent of the poverty level, or $33,075 a year, would have to pay 4 percent of its income, or $1,323, on premiums. A family with income of 400 percent of the poverty level would have to pay 9.5 percent, or $8,379.

from msn.com

Hmmm... think ill get rid of life insurance. Test this obamacare.

Not giving up anything, might leave to the forests soon, never to be seen or heard from again! Leaving before the SHTF is the safest route, and the S-is-HTF. I'll be back in 2015 if you're all still around

Nah, I'll be here... why miss the show? I think it's off to an interesting start. Can't wait to see how it plays out... but you know immigration will tie into this if it does pass... if we want health care for all, then ultimately we have to deal with the illegals, and that will be next.

Yep going to the woods sounds better every day.

Last time needed to see a doctor = 12 years ago.
Last time used natural healing methods = 1 year ago.
Next time I'll pay for HC Insurance = NEVER!