The 9/11 Hijackers are Alive and Talking!

Originally posted by Six Sigma
You claim to have e-mailed this website to "check them out." Can you tell us what was discussed?

I asked them specically about the hijacker being alive and the repsonse i was received was that they were going to update the data when they get a chance. since the last update was 2007.

But i am still waiting for an anwer on the fact that there is no DNA evidence proving all the hijackers are dead.

Also the fact that even the 9/11 commission states that several of the hijakcers came into the country on false or faked paperwork.

Originally posted by REMISNE
No a website that data has not been proven wrong, has other sites and research that agree, and can be proven to be legit with some simple research.

Baloney. Your "simple research" is what's leading you to these web sites with questionable credibility to begin with. In your subsequent posts you're admitting these people told you they haven't touched this material since 2007 and they're now changing it to show he's dead. I invite you to prove me wrong now when I say you'll drop this bunch like road kill despite their being "legitimate web site that collects data for the gov't that your simple research brought you to".

Originally posted by REMISNE
I asked them specically about the hijacker being alive and the repsonse i was received was that they were going to update the data when they get a chance. since the last update was 2007.

So, can we agree, Remisne, that the website is not reliable?

But i am still waiting for an anwer on the fact that there is no DNA evidence proving all the hijackers are dead.

Relying only on DNA is a little bit peculiar, I have to say. There were many people on flights 77 and 175 who's DNA was not recovered. There were 100's of victims that were in the towers that died and their DNA was not recovered. This does not make them alive now, does it?

Also, Mr. Remisne, there was a report from the BBC that there was DNA found that matched that of some of the hijackers.

news.bbc.co.uk...

In addition, at the Pentagon, there was a process of elimination with the remains that were found. Most interesting is that DNA was found that confirmed that two brothers were on Flight 77.

Nawaf and Salem Alhazmi were both hijackers on Flight 77 and are brothers.
www.cstl.nist.gov...



[edit on 19-3-2010 by Six Sigma]

Originally posted by Six Sigma
So, can we agree, Remisne, that the website is not reliable?

No we cannot agree, the website is reliable and other sources support the data from the site.

Relying only on DNA is a little bit peculiar, I have to say. There were many people on flights 77 and 175 who's DNA was not recovered. There were 100's of victims that were in the towers that died and their DNA was not recovered. This does not make them alive now, does it?

Oh but according to the official story all the passengers on the planes and people in the Pentagon were identified by DNA.

Even though the DNA testing back then was crude and NIST had to come up with new testing that was not ready untill 2002.

Also, Mr. Remisne, there was a report from the BBC that there was DNA found that matched that of some of the hijackers.

You do understand that some is not all ? I was asking about DNA for ALL the hijackers.

Originally posted by REMISNE


No we cannot agree, the website is reliable and other sources support the data from the site.

I'm sorry Mr. Remisne, perhaps I misunderstood you. You stated that you contacted them with specific questions. Back in 2007, correct? They have yet to respond to your inquiry.

How is this reliable? What on their website is reliable?

Oh but according to the official story all the passengers on the planes and people in the Pentagon were identified by DNA.

My mistake...it was flight 11 not 77.

You do understand that some is not all ? I was asking about DNA for ALL the hijackers.

So, you feel at least SOME of the hijackers are dead? Which ones, please.

Originally posted by Six Sigma
I'm sorry Mr. Remisne, perhaps I misunderstood you. You stated that you contacted them with specific questions. Back in 2007, correct? They have yet to respond to your inquiry.

No the last time that specific data was updated was 2007.

How is this reliable?

Bcause it is supported by other facts and evidence and the data has not been proven wrong to this day.

So, you feel at least SOME of the hijackers are dead? Which ones, please.

Well we do not really know since the hijackers used fake or false IDs.

Also the fact that the new DNA testing that NIST developed was not ready untill 2002, after IDS were made.



[edit on 20-3-2010 by REMISNE]

Originally posted by REMISNE
Well we do not really know since the hijackers used fake or false IDs.

Why should that make a difference if, as you say, this web site "is very legitimate and is supported by other facts and evidence"? The site specifically said Osama Bin Laden is alive and it specifically said Mohammed Atta, Hani Hanjour, etc are dead. Without looking it up I'll go as far as saying that Majed Moqed is the only terrorist listed as being alive...and you just said they're going to correct it now.

So if the web site is very legitimate then why do you need any further DNA evidence? After all, if you can irrefutably prove two plus two equals four on your fingers then you don't need to prove it all over again on a calculator or an abacus.

Thsi is what happens when you try to defend an undefendable political agenda. You invariably wind up painting yourself into a corner with your own words.

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Without looking it up I'll go as far as saying that Majed Moqed is the only terrorist listed as being alive...and you just said they're going to correct it now.

First, no Moqed is not the only trerrorist listed as alive. Second i did not state the siite was going to correct anything (please do not put words in my mouth) i stated they were going to update the site.

So if the web site is very legitimate then why do you need any further DNA evidence?

There is no DNA evidence that ll the hijackers are dead.

Originally posted by REMISNE
Originally posted by REMISNE
First, no Moqed is not the only trerrorist listed as alive. Second i did not state the siite was going to correct anything (please do not put words in my mouth) i stated they were going to update the site.

You said, and I quote:

I asked them specically about the hijacker being alive and the repsonse i was received was that they were going to update the data when they get a chance. since the last update was 2007.

If this is an "absolutely reliable web site that's corroborated by multiple sources" then what do they need to update about Moqed? Oh, and who else is it saying that is still alive? I just enetered in four hijackers and I got back four deceased, and I'm not going to type in all nineteen names just to humor this conspiracy fantasia of yours.

There is no DNA evidence that ll the hijackers are dead.

Nice attempt at evasion but I must tell you such games don't work on me. I ASKED why you still need DNA evidence when this "absolutely reliable web site" is telling you that many of them I.E. Mohammed Atta, Hani Hanjour, Waleed al-Shehri, etc are dead. Why aren't your own sources enough for you?

[edit on 22-3-2010 by GoodOlDave]

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
I asked them specically about the hijacker being alive and the repsonse i was received was that they were going to update the data when they get a chance. since the last update was 2007.

Yes i stated UPDATE not CORRECT. Do you know the difference?

Why aren't your own sources enough for you?

Oh they are enough for me but not for people like you who do not want to accept any facts and evindece shown. So thats why i keep showing more and more facts and evidence to try to get people like you to finally admit to facts and evidence shown.

Originally posted by REMISNE
Yes i stated UPDATE not CORRECT. Do you know the difference?

No, apparently I don't. Tell me the difference between UPDATE and CORRECT, becuase if they need to update something about the status of the hijacker, it necessarily means that something about the status of the hijacker is incorrect and it needs to be corrected. Unless they're going to change his entity from "person" to "animal" the only thing left to change is the "alive or deceased" status.

Oh they are enough for me but not for people like you who do not want to accept any facts and evindece shown. So thats why i keep showing more and more facts and evidence to try to get people like you to finally admit to facts and evidence shown.

Yeah, fine, but how about answering the question. If this website is "absolutely reliable and corriborated by multiple sources" then why you you need additional proof that most of the hijackers are dead? All you're doing is proving something you already knew to be true. It's like demanding to be given a calculator to prove two plus two really equals four after you've already proved it by counting on your fingers. What additional information could the calculator possibly give you?

Let's cut through these games of yours, once and for all. Your site specifically lists Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour as dead and Osama Bin Laden as alive. Do you accept this as being correct?

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
No, apparently I don't. Tell me the difference between UPDATE and CORRECT, becuase if they need to update something about the status of the hijacker.

They never stated thet needed to update the staus of the hijacker.

PLEASE DO NOT TRY TO KEEP PUTTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH. IT DOES NOT MAKE YOU LOOK GOOD.

Yeah, fine, but how about answering the question. If this website is "absolutely reliable and corriborated by multiple sources" then why you you need additional proof that most of the hijackers are dead?

I need to get more information to find the truth of what happened, i use more then 1 soure, and to try to convince people like you that there are facts and evidence that contridicts the official story.

Let's cut through these games of yours, once and for all. Your site specifically lists Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour as dead and Osama Bin Laden as alive. Do you accept this as being correct?

NO not yet because we do not all the facts, thats why i use more then one source to verify information and to prove to people like you who do not want to accept contridicting facts and evidence.


[edit on 23-3-2010 by REMISNE]

Originally posted by REMISNE

They never stated thet needed to update the staus of the hijacker.

PLEASE DO NOT TRY TO KEEP PUTTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH. IT DOES NOT MAKE YOU LOOK GOOD.

I'm simply going by what you told me, that you contacted them in reference to this hijacker and they said the material hasn't been updated since 2007 and they will be updating it soon. What else would they be updating, the spelling of his name?

NO not yet because we do not all the facts, thats why i use more then one source to verify information and to prove to people like you who do not want to accept contridicting facts and evidence.

Geez, dude, getting a straight answer out of you is like trying to nail jam to the wall. All this time you have been fighting tooth and nail insisting this web site was "absolutely reliable" and now out of the blue you're saying "we don't have all the facts" and the material "needs to be verfied by other sources". You specifically said the reason the web site was absolutely reliable was becuase it was already verified by other sources, so why do you need to verify it by other sources any more?

You ALSO said, "a website that data has not been proven wrong, has other sites and research that agree, and can be proven to be legit with some simple research. " Some simple research from other web sites show Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour are dead:

Mohammed Atta is dead (marked as reliable)

Hani Hanjour dead (marked as reliable)

So, after listening to your own words, following your own advice, and using your own criteria, we see this web site has now been proven correct- Atta and Hanjour are dead. There, do you believe they're dead now?

The problem isn't that I'm trying to put words in your mouth. The problem is that your own words are coming back to haunt you and you don't know how to get out of the corner you painted yourself into.

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
What else would they be updating, the spelling of his name?

\

It simply means they are updating the information on the page, it does not mean they are updating the status of the hijacker.

You specifically said the reason the web site was absolutely reliable was becuase it was already verified by other sources, so why do you need to verify it by other sources any more?

I was not talking about this specific page on the site that needed to be verified anymore, since i have already done that.

Some simple research from other web sites show Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour are dead:

But what about Majed Moqed, can you show any research form other web sites that show he is dead?

Originally posted by REMISNE
I was not talking about this specific page on the site that needed to be verified anymore, since i have already done that.

Okay, now you're changing your story. Before, you said this was "a very legitimate website that tracked the information for the gov't", and you said what made it legitimate was that "they verified their information with other sources". You even insisted that "disclaimers do not make the data unreliable". I don't understand why you're lecturing us to use this very legitimate web site to "do our research" when you're now turning around and saying the information can't be trusted. Please, explain that to me.

...and you still haven't answered the question- not only does this "very legitimate site" show that Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour are dead, it has been verified by other sources that Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour are dead. This satisfies BOTH of your criteria for credibility, so I will ask again- do you believe Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour are dead, as the very web sites you're recommending for us to use to "do our research" say they are?

But what about Majed Moqed, can you show any research form other web sites that show he is dead?

Yes I can, actually:

Majed Moqed dead (marked as reliable)

So it turns out you were right after all- we really do need to verify the information from this web site with other sources first. It's little mystery what it is that the web site operators are going to change on his record, now that you brought it to their attention.

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
I don't understand why you're lecturing us to use this very legitimate web site to "do our research" when you're now turning around and saying the information can't be trusted. Please, explain that to me.

The information can be trusted because i have verified it through other sources.

This satisfies BOTH of your criteria for credibility, so I will ask again- do you believe Mohammed Atta and Hani Hanjour are dead, as the very web sites you're recommending for us to use to "do our research" say they are?

So what if they are dead that 2 out of 19, it still does not answer my point that there is no real evidence like DNA that all the hijakers are dead.

Yes I can, actually:

Majed Moqed dead (marked as reliable)

Well i do not see a date on the site.

Also what other sources have you used to verify the information on this site?



[edit on 25-3-2010 by REMISNE]

Originally posted by REMISNE
The information can be trusted because i have verified it through other sources.

...and I just verified that Mohammed Atta, Hani Hanjour, etc are dead through other sources. Does this mean you acknowledge the ones listed as dead by this site are in fact dead? I asked you that three times already and I still can't get a direct answer out of you.

So what if they are dead that 2 out of 19, it still does not answer my point that there is no real evidence like DNA that all the hijakers are dead.

...and I will ask again- who else does this site list as still being alive? I entered in four hijacker names and they were all listed as dead. You're the one who's saying that others are listed as still being alive, so it's your obligation to prove it.

As for the DNA, how does that help your assertion one way or the other? You're not trying to prove he wasn't there. You're trying to prove he's still alive. I absolutely guarantee that the DNA of George Washington and Kaiser Wilhelm won't be found at the Pentagon attack site, but I can still guarantee they're dead.

Also what other sources have you used to verify the information on this site?

I use the fact that the Saudi gov't acknowledged that the list of hijackers from Saudi Arabia...which included Majed Moqed...is correct, and their families have been notified of their deaths. This by definition means that death certificates have been issued and that they are legally dead.

Saudi gov't acknowledges 15 of 19 hijackers are Saudi citizens

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Does this mean you acknowledge the ones listed as dead by this site are in fact dead? I asked you that three times already and I still can't get a direct answer out of you.

Where are your sources?

So now you just need to show all the rest of the hijackers are dead with proper sources.

...and I will ask again- who else does this site list as still being alive?

You really should have done a little more research.

Mohammed al-Qahtani
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Incarcerated
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 23 Jan 2004
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

Ahmed Ibrahim A. Al Haznawi
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

Ahmed Alnami
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

As for the DNA, how does that help your assertion one way or the other?

DNA evidence would prove one way or another if they are dead.


[edit on 25-3-2010 by REMISNE]

Originally posted by REMISNE
Where are your sources?

So now you just need to show all the rest of the hijackers are dead with proper sources.

What the heck do you mean, Where are my sources? My sources are YOUR sources- trackingthethreat.com, which you said is "very reliable". I already told you that. Go look up on the web site and see for yourself that it says Mohammend Atta and Hani Hanjour are dead if you don't believe me.

Good grief, you dance around more than Fred Astaire. I'm not askign for your mother's bra size, dude. All I'm asking you is if you trust your own sources when they say they're dead. A simple "Yes or No will do.

You really should have done a little more research.

Excuse me?!? This person-

Mohammed al-Qahtani
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Incarcerated
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 23 Jan 2004
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

...wasn't one of the hijackers. He was a fighter captured in Afghanistan and is being held at Guantanamo. Noone ever said he was dead so it is completely dishonest of you to include him on this list.

What, did you think I wouldn't check what you were telling me? You told me to "do more research" and I'm doing it.

DNA evidence would prove one way or another if they are dead.

I just showed you THREE sources (including your own trackingthehtreat.com site) that showed they were dead. If your own "very legitimate sources" aren't enough for you then why the heck would DNA evidence be enough for you? Explain to me why you wouldn't just come up with some other convenient excuse why you shouldn't have to accept it just like you're doing with everything else that disagrees with what you want to believe..including the sites YOU told ME to go to.

I will ask ONE MORE TIME...it was YOUR OWN site who said Mohammed Atta, Hani Hanjour, etc are dead. Do you accept they are dead? You've been fighting tooth and nail telling us how legitimate and trustworthy this site is so if you're now going back on your word and are now saying "we can't trust it until we see the DNA evidence", then I don't see why I should believe anything else you tell me.

Originally posted by GoodOlDave
...wasnt one of the hijackers. He was a fighter captured in Afghanistan and is being held at Guantanamo.

Funny how you ignopred the other 2 hijackers that are stated to be alive. Nice dance around the facts again.

I just showed you THREE sources (including your own trackingthehtreat.com site) that showed they were dead.

But i have more sources then just that website. So again please show DNA sources that all the hijackers are dead.