Plane crashes into Austin building

reply to post by triplescorpio


I bet everything our forefathers did was on the up and up.. I bet nobody died then.. Right?

I bet England gave our forefathers this land with no problems right?

What is wrong with you people...

Love this government or leave this country.. You people really need a reality check..

Some should read the constitution sometime.. alot of what this government does does not follow the constitution.. But its cool Love it or leave it.. and I wonder why this country is going down hill.. good work..

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

Originally posted by bonebo64
The thing I find tragic is that he at onetime approached the IRS topic proactively and intellectually by participating in a research group who even went so far as to hire tax lawyers to help translate and understand tax code ( according to his " manifesto " ). It appears he made a sincere and lucid effort to understand the laws and act accordingly, displaying much more effort than most. And then ended this way. Not encouraging, IMO.

I think you need to read his manifesto again.

He didn't spend all that time revewing the tax code in an attempt to understand it. He spent all that time in an attempt to exploit it. And then when he was caught...he cried about it.


There is a big difference between the two. He tried to cheat the system and got burned.

I'm not sure what your defination of exploit is, what I gleened from his words is he and others put some effort into understanding a dense set of rules and act - he thought - accordingly. It seems unfair to me to simply label him a tax cheat.

Originally posted by inbound
reply to post by 4nsicphd

 

yep, already got that from a friend of mine who's a pilot. He could own the plane, but without a valid license(including medical) he would not be allowed to pilot the aircraft. Not that would stop him from jumping in it for a spin. I kinda wonder why the ATC at the airport wouldnt be ontop of stuff like that. Certainly you would have to be cleared for take off, assigned a runway, etc.

The great majority of airports do not have any air traffic control. There is a Common Airport Traffic Frequency by which pilots communicate with each other. There are 12 airports within 20 miles of Georgetown, TX, where the guy reportedly took off. Only one has a control tower, and it's part time.It is entirely possible and completely legal to take off from Willis Gliderport airport in West Palm Beach, FL and fly all the way to Sanderson Airport in Seattle without talking to anyone in air traffic control.

Regardless of the supposed 'value' of this fellow's house, he was clearly bankrupted and was currently in debt. Many in America may own a house worth say $150,000 but if their mortgage and other debt is more than this, they are 'net debters'. Most in America, through easy credit for the purpose to 'indebt' with fractional reserve 'fiat' currency are 'net' debtors by Design. They are beginning to 'realize' this.

This kind of self discovery, can be quite expensive though the Truth may never be repressed for long. It Is, and is therefor a preferred option when 'governing' a people. The Truth is the Law, natural law and it cannot be written. Most written laws have been written to benefit one cartel or another, not the people. What we have today is corporate law since the US is a 'corporation' (hence yellow fringe around flag in the courts) and each citizen is a number in that system complete with social security number whereby labeling that citizen a corporate 'subject' of the State (Federal govt.) of which is owned and operated by international banksters and various illumati members, Not the American people. Hence, "no taxation without Representation" clearly 'applies' as a 'concern' of the perpertrator/victim.

Is this jurispurdent Justice?
Far from it.
So where does one turn if the whole system is corrupted from the core?
Call a congressman, get a message, email a senator, get an 'automatic' reply. There is no accountablility or communication with the people (subjects). Politicians are more interested in toeing the establishment line and collecting their pension and healthcare benefits, at taxpayer expense, after just serving One term in govt. Then, they have to sign non-disclosure agreements upon leaving office before receiving these benefits. This is also 'by Design' though not an 'intelligent' One.

This system is corrupt from the core by design and the 'folks' in folkland are just beginning to see themselves as the 'subject' they were designed to be.

Hope this helps!


[edit on 18-2-2010 by Perseus Apex]

I am just amazed at the ingnorance of some of the posters here. They rant and rave about the innocent peoples lives he endangered, but yet say nothing of the millions of lives the IRS endangers everyday.

And all of those who say he is a loon who is damaging to the cause that most ATS's here support are also ludicruos pansys.

He gave his reasons, the same reasons all of us here comment about, and yet yall call him a "terrorist"!

Although we should really consider the possiblity that this will be used for sure just the way he said it would be.

Do yall not see he has pushed the crediblity of the US government into the front of our faces and we will really soon see once again that he is right. They will jump on this as a reason to strip even more rights and civil liberties away, and soon at that!

" I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are."

Stop being knobs saying he is wrong for endangering lives, by trying to help the whole of the rest, by showing us what is really going on!

Jeez



[edit on 18-2-2010 by rougeskut]

Originally posted by Rising Against
reply to post by thomasblackraven

 

His targets were the civilians inside of that building.

I have to ask how you know this?

I read a post earlier from somebody who lived in the area saying that there is a much larger IRS building 15 miles from there, which has many more IRS workers in it. If this is true, and he has so many problems with the IRS, why wouldn't he hit that building instead? Many more IRS workers would have been killed.

Of course, the damage he caused to the building, plus the first, will be a great deal of monetary damage to the IRS, which may have been his intent to begin with.

Just something to think about. If killing IRS people was his intent, from what I hear, 15 miles away there was a much bigger target.

reply to post by gwydionblack
My post was not a sarcastic reaction against another post. And this post is not sarcastic either.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by jam321

 

I don't know something feels very virulent about this manifesto and how its spreading like wild fire among the social networking sites.

Historically when things happen like this it produces a memetic epidemic of madness and hysteria. Bleeding Kansas and John Brown's raid on Harper's Ferry are good examples of this.


Nothing good will come of this.

[edit on 18/2/10 by MikeboydUS]

It's absolutely crazy. This guy goes off the deep end, and decides to take matters into his hands by comitting what is basically a suicide attack. Unfortunately this will cause the government and the IRS to take further measures against such in the future which will push others further toward such in the future. Unless the powers that be just continue as they have been doing, there will only start a vicious circle that will lead to nothing but grief for all involved. I have no doubt that today is the day that the insanity begins, perhaps not perceptually at first, but there will be a ramp up to it.

Other than he's an idiot for doing it, I don't know what else to really think about it.

Ok, it seems like the talk of conspiracy is pretty much over in this thread (which is sad) as I don't think that we are done gathering information and comparing data.

Should we create a new thread that is void of personal feelings about the event?

I mean, theres a lot of stuff we still haven't figured out; and time is ticking on this.

Conspiracy or not, evidence is disappearing from the net already and we've entered a stage of lollygagging. I don't care about how this event effects us all just yet, as I'm still unclear as to what the event really IS. It still needs to be confirmed. Was this guy real? Or was it a plant? Where is all of the video footage? Where are all of the tweets? Let's get these things into this forum before some corp hits a keyword and a mass delete button, removing all images and text messages created within that area.

Originally posted by ThichHeaded


Some should read the constitution sometime.. alot of what this government does does not follow the constitution.. But its cool Love it or leave it.. and I wonder why this country is going down hill.. good work..

Senseless acts of violence, driven by personal anger at being caught cheating the system is not what this or any other country needs. We are a better country now that one more dangerous, self absorbed nutbag is no longer with us.

He was a coward and will be remembered as such forevermore.

WOW! I just came across this guys manifesto and I'm posting it for everyone and....JUST KIDDING. Anyway, I wanted to say that we should approach how we feel about this whole thing carefully. Is it part of a script? What will become of things after this? Who benefits, who loses?

reply to post by jcjace


o so i should buy a plane and use it as a weapon against random civillians this guy was crazy not a freedom fighter good luck in your revolution.
i cannot beleive you would even propose that its better to kill people then encourage real change.
george washington would not look well opon your opinion the people our four fathers faught for are the same people(civilian hard working americans) that you want to see killed by domestic terrorists you support the oklahoma bomber too really odd that any one would even say this guy is correct.

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by gwydionblack

 

You are wrong, however, that this "won't do anything". It has already done quite a bit. It hasn't even been more than a couple hours and already people are getting behind him. Imagine a day, a week, a month. People are waking up and they shall continue to do so.

IMO, people will get behind him, but very few will follow him.

People are, well.. too dependent on government.

This wasn't about government as much as it was about the impact of Wall Street's ownership of our government. People want and need strong government, since when it works as it's supposed to work, it is the only real protection available for the average person beset by powerful corporate interests.

Nowdays, the "private sector" has convinced us that our own government is the enemy, and that their consortium of big corporations is our only salvation. Then they poison us and cheat us out of our 401K savings, they gamble our portfolios away on a 4 quadrillion dollar derivatives Ponzi scheme, and send all our jobs to 3rd world countries, as we rail against the government that they stole from us and that they set up as the fall guy for all that they do to us.

We need to take our government back from Wall Street and eliminate the corporate contractors who litter the Senate and run the federal agencies that were designed to keep the largest corporate firms honest. Tea Partiers need to focus their rage on Wall Street, and ferret out the hired guns that those corporate predators have installed within our State and Federal government. Not just the politicians, but the bureaucrats as well. Especially the bureaucrats, since they have life-long immunity to do as much damage as possible.

Here is the Travis County Tax Assessor website....with information on the pilot:

www.traviscountytax.org...

Here is a link to photographs of his house fire:

galleries.statesman.com...

All public information...just have to dig.

I don't feel sorry for this guy....apparently he was better off than me!

[edit on 18-2-2010 by Aggie Man]

This is the beginning of something new. People will start to act and make examples.

"I can only hope that the numbers quickly get too big to be white washed and ignored that the American zombies wake up and revolt; it will take nothing less. I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are. Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasn't so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer. The cruel joke is that the really big chunks of # at the top have known this all along and have been laughing, at and using this awareness against, fools like me all along."

It surely is not the popular reaction to this event, but I applaud this man. Go ahead and flame me, warn me, ban me - do what you wish. But he is right: violence is the only answer.

Nothing will change unless we stand up and defend ourselves. These criminals will continue to strip us of our individuality, our freedom, and our lives unless we stand in their way. We need to fight fire with fire, otherwise we will end up at the very same point we began.

We need a worldwide armed revolution to hunt down and punish those responsible for the current state of the world. The innocent people who have suffered, are suffering, and will suffer at the hands of these pieces of # deserve nothing less.

reply to post by grimreaper797


Of course he was trying to kill civilians AS WELL otherwise why did he fly into a building FULL OF CIVILIANS.

From reading his backstory and the type of building he hit it becomes pretty clear what his true motives were, and that was to cause as much damage as possible and he was clearly willing to take people down with him.

But also who say's this was a well planned atack??

Who say's he thorouhgly thought about this attack??

Maybe he just snapped and wanted to cause some serious damage.

But hey who know's what was going through his mind, i certainly don't and im sure not many here don't as well.

I'm still stumped at how people can try and defend this terrorist!

[edit on 18-2-2010 by Rising Against]

reply to post by ThichHeaded


to bad he didnt fly the plane into your wife or mothers job maybe you would think clearly not like a psuedo freedom fighter. the four fathers lost many of there own duh of course we fought for the land but do you no how many years we petitioned peacefully against the british only as a heart wrenching last resort did war develope.
I suggest you read John Adams diaries before suggesting such ignorance as a solution

[edit on 18-2-2010 by triplescorpio]

From the pilots supposed online "suicide note."

"I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different," the online message says. "I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, let's try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well."

Very interesting words. It seems rather odd to me that a suicidal man would take the time to quote Einstein and Shakespeare?

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


I said before that I don't want to be anonymous. I'm not going to hide anymore.

What is more, I have SAID that I was going to do anything and people would be hard pressed to prove otherwise. I'd like to see somebody try to take me on something I said or my so called "plans" because they wouldn't have a case. I've said before that I'm not stupid and I stand by that. Let somebody come and try to take me in for nothing. For what? Sympathizing with Joseph Stack? For predicting a violent revolution? They could come to me home and wouldn't even find a gun.

Government clamping down is overrated. Most people don't realize, and the government seems ignorant of this fact, that the more you clamp down, the more people resist - the more problems they have. It would be even worse for them to attempt to clamp down on anyone for something like this and in my opinion they are smarter than that. I mean, I could be wrong, but it will be a short battle for the good side if I am. I don't expect it to be an easy fight.


reply to post by technical difficulties


Say what? OK. I wasn't being sarcastic either.