Plane crashes into Austin building

Originally posted by AshOnMyTomatoes
I was at the University of Missouri: St. Louis this morning walking between classes at about 12:15pm CST. The campus is very close to Lambert Int'l Airport.

While I was outside, I noticed a fighter jet flying in a tight loop over the vicinity of the airport. I watched it for awhile; it flew out of my sight briefly (although I could hear it), then it circled back again and I saw a jet of some kind (passenger plane size) coming in for a landing along the normal flight paths, as I see them every day, except the fighter escorted it all the way to the ground. The fighter did not land, it continued past the runway (I could only hear it at this point), but then it circled around again and escorted another plane down. I personally witnessed at least 2 planes landed in this way.

The first thing I thought was, "oh man, something's up." Then I heard about this story on the way home.

Your thoughts on this?

Although it would look like it, what you saw was probably not a fighter escorting the passenger jet. It was much more likely the fighter and the airliner flying parallel approaches to the three runways at STL that are nearly parallel (12L,-30R,12R-30L, and 11-29. 204.108.4.16... There are 3 Air National Guard squadrons there and Mcdonnell Douglas has a huge factory there for F-15s, F-18s and FA=18s.

Originally posted by Fakshon


I am not an expert at FAA regulations but isn't a flight plan always required before taking off?

Would a plane of that size actually create the amount of damage that was shown (I can say they are a good size and the fire seemed to affect the whole building.)?

And is it possible for a "supposedly sane person" (according to his friends) to snap and flip a switch causing him to fly a plane in to a building traveling at that rate of speed?

Now I do live in Austin and I did work in the Echelon Buildings (glad I don't any more) but I do have friends that still work there. And I am glad that none of them were directly injured or affected by this. I won't justify this issue as a course of action, justifiable, crime, or terrorist act. It's too soon to name, and I can say that knowing Police Chief Acevedo well that he is not wording the press conference material as a terrorist act because he doesn't want to alarm the community and he wants to be 100% sure before pointing the finger. I am sure the FBI had a lot to say in the matter, but if you watched the live press conference as I did here on a local channel in Austin you would have seen that Acevedo and the Fire Chief didn't follow FBI suit and shout nix at the questions and story. All of the local emergency offices in Austin should be commended for their expedient actions and the only offices which never answered questions were the federal divisions. Thank God for the Texas spirit that has blessed our police chief and fire chief in saying screw the fed's idea of shouting nix. I only wish more public figures had the spirit.

No flight plan is required unless the weather is below VFR minimums or you are crossing an Air Defense Identification Zone or the flight is international.
The Pier Dakota can carry 84 gallons of avgas (100 Low Lead) which has 110X10e8 joules oThat works out to about 8 MJ per cup of gasoline compared to 2MJ of energy per pound of high explosives. so 84 gallons of gas is equivalrny to 1344 pounds of high explosives. The most common bomb used in war is the Mark 82 500 pounder. Drop 3 of those into a glass facade building and measure the damage. The modern GBU-28 Bunker Buster only has 647 pounds of high explosives.
Sanity is a temporary state and can be undone by many things. Like reading the same "manifesto" 50 times in this thread. I'm not sure I have ever really met a truly sane Texan. Isn't Texas the place where Texas hospitality means being nice to other Texans?

Originally posted by Letmypeoplego
reply to post by OutKast Searcher

 

I dont think his intent was murder and he wasn't insane, he was fed up, there is a difference. If this country is going to change we are going to have to break a few eggs and I dont mind. Sounds like you would rather live as a slave then lift a finger to fight back. Imagine how bad the IRS and the Gov't came down on him to make him do what he did. I think lots of us feel the same way alot of the time, and yes, we dont go flying planes into buildings, but atleast he stood up and said ENOUGH!!

Much more than I can say about the cowards around here.
(no offense everybody)

[edit on 20-2-2010 by Letmypeoplego]

I really don't understand how I am a slave...could you explain?

What am I not free to do?


If I choose to do so...I can move to another country...not something you would think a "slave" would be allowed to do.

And yes...call my silly...but I consider anyone who flies a plane into a building of innocent people to be insane.

He wasn't an innocent victim of the IRS...he tried his whole life to cheat the system and failed.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

What am I not free to do?

I totally agree. In my 36 years I've never been told that I couldn't do whatever it is that I wanted to do...save for my mother and my wife...both of whom have given me "no, no rules" at some point in my life

Oh, except for police officers telling me I can't speed....fascist pigs

Originally posted by DukeOfDorch
Take a look at this:
Flight History

Click on "Past Flights".

Can somebody tell me why this plane flew from Georgetown to Vance Air Force Base in 2008?

It actually looks like he didn't. If you read the entry carefully you will notice "tracking ended early. Fboweb, now called Flighywise, only tracks aircraft with IFR flightplans while they are still on that flightplan. If I had a software client in Okeene, OK, and was going to fly there, I might file IFR to Vance and when I got near, I would get a clearance to descend to the MSA (Minimum Safe Altitude, and when under the clouds cancel the IFR and proceed VFR to Christman airport which has no IFR approaches. Of course, he alo might have had a family member or friend at Vance or in Enid he wanted to visit and got permission. And if he wanted to land at Enid's Woodring airport, he might file to Vance since Woodring is inside Vance's Class D airspace.
Of course, this is only rank speculation but that seems to be the order of the day.

It is very hard to leave the US and 'move' to another country...without MONEY. Usually a LOT of it, and skills to boot. Most countries aren't like the USA where they just let anyone in that is willing to come and work and learn basic skills.

I was talking to several 14 year old guys this weekend and they are all extremely distressed by the daily 'news' - you know, these guys saw 911 when they were 6, and it's been nothing but terror, terror, terror, fear, fear, we need more money when every child already owes 50k on the deficit before he's out of highschool - and THEY know it.

I hope that someone UP there in govt. is not just knee jerking, but thinking about this. I'm older and hopefully a little less hot headed - the guy that flew his plane into the IRS was in his 50's....I guess they BETTER be happy our youthful men are lullified with X-Box. Once they start losing their video games and escapes and see how bleak the future is getting for them, it might be heck to pay.

Oh, and what are you NOT free to do? ha! Try to build an extension onto your front porch without a 'permit.'

Try to keep just 3-4 chickens so you have healthy free eggs - in a lot of the country - you CAN'T.

Try to be a pagan chaplain in the military. haha

Geez, how long you want this thread to be? I have to ask myself, when people ask that question - What are you not free to do in the US? - if those people have ever really tried to do anything to be self sufficient -FOR THEMSELVES.

[edit on 22-2-2010 by hadriana]

Fly fly baby, here i come