Reasons To Believe

reply to post by pye33


I must admit that I am unfamiliar with the Enki or stargates, but I will take a look. its always best to at least be aware of differing views and opinions even if I disagree with them outright.

Hopefully you agree though that the argument against God's existence cannot be as simple as "logic just says so." Many cultures believed first in a God before they ever had a book to give further explanation. There are many different reasons for belief in a god though. Some believe because they think they have seen one or a servant of one. Others look at nature and think there is no way something as complex and beautiful as this happened by chance. Others had multiple gods to worship over every detail in life such as fertility, agriculture, animals, war, etc. Many cultures accept one or more gods because of what they experience in life, not just potentially seeing a ufo or other species they did not recognize.

I must admit, I do not take much about aliens, etc. too seriously, btu have at least been trying to "learn up." There are some who claim the aliens to be angels (not sure I buy that one) and that Christianity and aliens fit hand in hand.

A possibility, but I'm not putting stock in it any time soon.

EDIT: Man, I need to do something else for a while and take a break. Thanks for the thoughts and sincere questions though. If I have missed something you intended for me to see and reply to I apologize. remind me and I'll do my best to answer sometime soon. For now, Peace.

[edit on 17-2-2010 by Mykahel]

Originally posted by Mykahel
reply to post by Nichiren

 

I am saying that those who see Christ as savior do in fact see while the rest of the world is blind, though some claim they can see. I acknowledge that being a leader myself puts me in the same boat as those pharisees concerning my claim to see, the difference is that I believe and they did not.

I do not think I have an ability greater than others concerning this. I have merely believed on the thing that others have rejected.

Sorry, but your are not making sense here. You say that in fact you can see what other's cannot. And in the next statement you say that you don't have a special ability? Could you please explain?

I think we could agree that most people believe in some sort of god or higher power. What if we took the legend and instead of saying they were all blind, they simply were too close to the elephant and only saw one part. That one part they could see was their understanding, but they were unwilling to step back and look at the big picture. This is where a believer in the true God comes in and pulls them back so that they can see that while they had an idea, they were wrong.

This is not to say that they all worship the same God or that it is acceptable, just trying to illustrate in some way.

You are at it again. Not sure if you are consciously doing this or it's just your education/predisposition. In the parable they were not "unwilling" to step back and see. You marginalize the ones that are HONEST enough to say that we are blind (aka agnostic, as in: "not enough data to make a decision"). Are you claiming to know God? That would mean that you are also omniscient! If you don't know God 100% you are faking it and still go by blind faith.

Why is your god more relevant than any other?

Let me put it bluntly and clearly. You are basically an atheist who stopped short of excluding ONE more god. I suppose you don't worship Allah or Krishna? I would like to know why that is. It would be nice if you stopped making circular arguments resorting to Christ and the bible.

reply to post by Mykahel


You can't be serious! You are grossly misinterpreting the essence of Buddhist teaching. Minister, please educate yourself about the basic properties of other philosophical systems or religions.

Gautama Buddha, the historical Buddha, was a prince and lived a life full of pleasures and wealth. Then he selfishly abandons that lifestyle to seek enligthenment and help others? You gotta be kidding me, minister.

I apologize, I did neglect the fact that many Buddhists are caring and loving people that do look after others. What I am saying is that the center of why you even need the eightfold path is selfish. The goal of the Buddhist is to cease to exist, Nirvana, so that the cycle of death and rebirth can end and therefor end the suffering, or life. I know that some act selflessly by choosing to remain among people and teach them to reach enlightenment by postponing their own. They become what are called bodhisattva. I understand enough to understand that it doesn't make sense to me either logically or spiritually. One of the reasons I choose not to adhere to it. There are good teachings in it, as there are many belief systems. Partaking of sinful things and over-indulgence in those that are good is something that many are unable to avoid.

I've got to get going. Hopefully I can respond more at a later date. I meant to get to the issues you raised about my confusing previous post. I blame the confusion on my lack of a sizable vocabulary and the merging of two metaphors using similar terms but having different points. For this I apologize.

Bluntly, I believe in the God of the Bible because the only God I want to believe in is one who is Good. No other god has shown himself to be that. Most of them are just as deceptive and murderous as us human beings. By claiming my God to be good, I am sure I've opened a nice big can of questions for anyone looking at a chance to say "Well what about when your fairy in the sky did this or that?!" I'll respond to those if I have the time and understand.

Believing in God...
...helps me understand how we got here.
...helps me understand my purpose in life.
...helps me understand where I am going.

No other God does these things and maintains His holiness and righteousness. That is why I believe in Yeshua.

[edit on 17-2-2010 by Mykahel]

[edit on 17-2-2010 by Mykahel]

We don't know a millionth of one percent about anything.
Thomas A. Edison (1847 - 1931)

reply to post by davesidious


Can I ask you what you do belive in so that I may inderstand where you are comming from...

reply to post by Mykahel


I can sense a warm feeling from your post; I truly respect your faith in God. I have many friends that come from all walks of religion, so may I say we all have our own way of feeling that harmony that you so describe.
I am Native from the Aboriginals of the North Continent. We have people that have turned from our traditional beliefs to believe in another way. That happens within all walks of race. But to purge ones religion as being the sole answer is taking away someone else’s harmony. It doesn’t matter the only one that matters is where you as an individual are with yourself.
I wish we would all stop bashing, this creates negative energy and that is destructive to everyone. Your prayers or what ever method you use, this is where you perhaps could share those thoughts or questions.

reply to post by randyvs


Ancient man exsisted before christ, these men who worshipped the sun or a beast was normal back in those days. as time flew by, man still living in clans or tribes decided to have the need for certain belief system it helped to define who they were. Things changed as time flew by. I am not getting into that like the great flood because that is not my intention I have my own thought on that.

Where to even begin on such a topic? We need to go back to the beginning. Everything in our lives has been spoon fed to us from the dawn of time, by the Government.

The Bible is nothing more than an Astrotheological Literary Hybrid, just like all the other myths that came before it.

"The Christian religion is a parody on the worship of the sun, in which they put a man called Christ in the place of the sun, and pay him the adoration originally payed to the sun." Thomas Paine (1737-1809)

Christianity is nothing more than a Roman story, developed politically.
Jesus was only a mythical figure; it was the political establishment that sought to historize the Jesus figure for social CONTROL.
Christianity, along with all other theistic belief systems, is the FRAUD OF THE AGE. It serves to detach the species from the natural world, and also each other. It supports BLIND submission to AUTHORITY. It reduces human responsibility to the effect that "God" controls everything, and in turn horrible crimes can be justified in the name of the divine pursuit.
Most important of all, it empowers those who know the truth, but use the myth to manipulate and control societies.
The religious Myth is the most powerful device ever created.
A myth is an idea, while widely believed, is still FALSE. In a religious sense, a myth serves as an orienting and mobilizing story for people. Focused not on it's relationship to reality but on its function. A story cannot function unless it is believed to be true in a community or a nation.

"Religion can never reform mankind, because religion is slavery."
Robert G Ingersoll (1833-1899)
Open your eyes. There's so much information out there.
WWW.ZEITGEISTMOVIE.COM


[edit on 17-2-2010 by Xpose.the.lies]

People can choose the interpretation the people like to experience. If the people like to experience things like the interpretation they believe in that would make sense.

Seriously, I feel awkward to know that some people push responsibility of life and being alive on Religion and God and Jesus. These are a series of ideas that may help people begin to think and understand they should think about things for themselves.

How is a new word created?

The actions that people may take are the choices of each person and the reaction or no reaction would be the responsibility of any person that disagreed. If society is committing horrible acts or crimes then it is not logical to start blaming;It is not Religions fault, God did not make people do it, seriously we celebrate Jesus on a the Cross how can he help us at this point?

I think the intention of the bible is to help people think and move forward. I do not think it is going to explain every problem for us today...

I think people should think about robots lest choose a mindless robot.

What is choice? Do you have it? Do you choose to make choices?

I think people should solve the problems we encounter for ourselves, with the help of Religion, God, and Jesus. All of the ideas associated with these ideas are at the interpretation of the people.

For the People By the People Of the people For the People

reply to post by Xpose.the.lies


Wow, that's an... interesting idea though definitely not original.

I don't buy the whole government/religion connection with Christianity. Maybe some of this New Age mumbo-jumbo that has us praying to the spirit that is in everything and saving the planet because humans are evil and so on so forth.

Any proof that the whole Christianity thing is a Roman method of control? No. If so there wouldn't have been the persecution against them that was so strong in the early years of the faith. If it was a method of controlling the people, it was to paint the Christians as the bad guys and make them suffer for the issues involved with a falling government. Gotta love Nero right?

I'm sorry, most of the time I try to be respectful but your post just really frustrated me because not only do you spit in my face but you do so with no reason and no proof to back up your claims. They are baseless and are the very lies and falsehoods that me and those of my faith have to put up with on a regular basis.

Oh well, I guess they don't have people thinking we are cannibals ans such like they did back when the Romans were in charge. You know, back when they crucified Christ and later destroyed the Temple around 70 AD. Not a very effective way of controlling people. Killing the savior of one faith and destroying the Holy Temple of the other.

Who am I to complain.

Originally posted by Mykahel
I apologize, I did neglect the fact that many Buddhists are caring and loving people that do look after others. What I am saying is that the center of why you even need the eightfold path is selfish.

No need to apologize. What about the Decalogue? Heck, eight is less than ten LOL

The goal of the Buddhist is to cease to exist, Nirvana, so that the cycle of death and rebirth can end and therefor end the suffering, or life. I know that some act selflessly by choosing to remain among people and teach them to reach enlightenment by postponing their own. They become what are called bodhisattva. I understand enough to understand that it doesn't make sense to me either logically or spiritually.

Maybe if you had a better understanding of the concept of Expedient Means, you would understand that Nirvana is not what you think it is. Don't let the Reader's Digest version of Buddhism fool you.

The Lotus Sutra states in chapter 2:


45. I (Buddha) show Nirvâna to the ignorant with low dispositions, who have followed no course of duty under many kotis of Buddhas, are bound to continued existence and wretched.

One of the reasons I choose not to adhere to it. There are good teachings in it, as there are many belief systems. Partaking of sinful things and over-indulgence in those that are good is something that many are unable to avoid.

Fair enough.

I've got to get going. Hopefully I can respond more at a later date. I meant to get to the issues you raised about my confusing previous post. I blame the confusion on my lack of a sizable vocabulary and the merging of two metaphors using similar terms but having different points. For this I apologize.

No need to apologize.

Bluntly, I believe in the God of the Bible because the only God I want to believe in is one who is Good. No other god has shown himself to be that. Most of them are just as deceptive and murderous as us human beings. By claiming my God to be good, I am sure I've opened a nice big can of questions for anyone looking at a chance to say "Well what about when your fairy in the sky did this or that?!" I'll respond to those if I have the time and understand.

If you are talking about the murderous, revengeful, angry, racist god of the OT you have indeed just opened a can of worms.

Believing in God...
...helps me understand how we got here.

Ask your parents ... Also, Darwinism would be a good starting point.

...helps me understand my purpose in life.

Can't wait to hear that answer.

...helps me understand where I am going.

Can't wait to hear that one, too.

No other God does these things and maintains His holiness and righteousness. That is why I believe in Yeshua.

Hold on. Do you believe in Jesus, but not in the god of the OT or are they (plus the Holy Spirit) all the same? Again, can't wait to hear your answer.


BTW: thanks for being a good sport and answering my posts

reply to post by NorthStargal52


I appreciate the compliment, but how can it be true that I can believe what I want and be ok in the end and you can believe what you want and be ok in the end? One of us will end up being wrong. What are the consequences of that?

Nobody has every explained to me how every single faith can be right and that it only matters that you yourself are improving because of whatever faith you may have. Can somebody please explain this to me,?! I see no logical way that it can be done.

There is a right way, and there are many wrong ways. Not all paths lead to God.

Thanks again for the compliment. I am glad you are experiencing some form of harmony, but I will pray that the harmony you have experienced leads you to the truth.

It's all a myth. Open your eyes. That's the problem with people whom "believe" and have "faith". It's all fed to us to keep us all in line. Could you even COMPREHEND what the world would be if people didn't brainwash others into "believing" that we were all going to hell? That's how we all fall in line. Don't ever question your government, don't ever question your God. Please. Put the faith aside and your hurt feelings away and look at the bigger picture. Of course it all goes hand in hand. Religion, government. Yup, that's our lives. Keep on believing that "God" is going to save you. That's exactly what they want. Sheep. BAAAAAAAHHH

reply to post by Mykahel


And there is, of course, a frightening alternative:

reply to post by Watcher-In-The-Shadows

Originally posted by Mykahel
reply to post by NorthStargal52

 

Nobody has every explained to me how every single faith can be right and that it only matters that you yourself are improving because of whatever faith you may have. Can somebody please explain this to me,?! I see no logical way that it can be done.

You already forgot about the elephant story

There is a kernel of truth in every religion. Some got closer to it than others I suppose, but not a single one hit the bulls-eye yet.

Let's not forget that the Abrahamic religions have a common ancestor. Darwinism is at play here as well. In order to survive religion had to mutate and adapt. There would be no Christianity and Islam without the Jewish tradition.

I posit that in a thousand years, after Rahel Jones came to visit us in 2528, Joneism will build on the NT, but eventually become more influential and replace Christianity. The story never ends ...


[edit on 17-2-2010 by Nichiren]

reply to post by Nichiren


You're quite welcome. Thanks for maintaining a respectful attitude. They seem so rare today.

If you could, please elaborate on Nirvana for me. It really does seem to me like the point of living, as a Buddhist, is to cease your living permanently via ending the cycle. This to me sounds like a very sad and discouraging mindset.

Hopefully we can avoid the can of worms for now, as I do believe in the Trinitarian understanding of God that I have no way of being able to explain adequately. The OT God is the same as the NT. Maybe another time and thread? There is probably already oen for it considering how popular it is to bring up the OT actions of God as an attack against His righteousness. Anyway, getting sidetracked...

How we got here:
I know about the birds and the bees. Actually going to become a very proud father in the next couple of months.

I currently accept the literal 6-day creation of Genesis as the basis for creation, though I have been putting serious thought and research into the support for the "Gap Theory" and "Theistic Evolution." Personally, I think the evolution is a bunch of bologna, but again that's been discussed in many other threads I am sure.

Purpose in Life:
Love God and Love people. Many Christians would say it is to serve God. This is true. Serving means obeying. God's greatest command is to love. The book of John says repeatedly that we love God by obeying. Since that ends up being circular (obey means love, means obey...) We are left with loving our neighbors. Cheesy? Simplistic? Perfect? Who can complain with a life goal of loving everyone you meet and doing your best to improve their condition? Spread the good news of this great and wonderful savior, and look forward to an eternity of life with no suffering at all. Purpose.

Where I am going:
Many Christians are dead set on Heaven as their final destination. Hate to break it to them but its not biblically accurate. The Bible says that the current Heavens and Earth are going to be destroyed and that God is going to make a new creation for hHis children to inhabit as He dwells among them as their God. Immanuel, God with us, the very thing that Christ was when he came the first time only now there is no suffering or pain. A perfect creation under the rule aof a perfect and loving King. That is what I am looking forward to.

Yes. I believe in Jesus the Son (Yeshua), the Father and the Holy Spirit. Three in one. Can;t explain it really, don;t know that anyone can. Probably one of those God things that we simply can't understand with our finite experience and understanding. Or, as many would simply say, perhaps I am just dumb. I prefer not to believe that, but my wife does say I'm pretty weird...

reply to post by Nichiren


Yes, I like the elephant story, but even in that story there is still only one elephant that so many are trying to understand. They may have it wrong, but somebody somewhere is going to see the elephant for what it is. They just weren't included in the story. Anyway...

reply to post by Xpose.the.lies


You've yet to contribute anything of significance to this thread. I hate to label people, but you should know that the typical word for someone making posts similar to your own is a Troll. I dont get it, dont ask me. I just know that the majority of people dont believe in Hell at all. Many Christians dont (and wrongfully so). If so many people do not believe in Hell, how is it being used to control the masses? You are regurgitating the junk that you yourself have been spoon fed and it is stinking up the thread. Please stop.

Can you tell I'm getting flustered? *Shakes his head*

Going to bed. G'night and God Bless.

[edit on 17-2-2010 by Mykahel]

Originally posted by Mykahel
Actually going to become a very proud father in the next couple of months.

Congratulations! (Life will never be the same again. I have a seven-year-old.)