I beg of you read this. Stop the drama...

Originally posted by Draves



I asked because I am talking from my heart. I want my thoughts to be heard. Really we all want that. This is my chance.

I want to say my word. This thread will die. So will I. So will you. It sucks. There isn't any reason we cannot make this world better for us in the meantime. Yeah, we'll die but we can make this reality better in the meantime...

But no universal healthcare? Hmmm.........

[edit on 9-11-2009 by Icerider]

All together now!

Kum by ya, my lord

Kum by ya ...

They must have changed something in the U.S. water supply.

I just finished reading the totally narcissistic "I'm leaving America" thread, And now there's this one that seems to basically say we all need to be like Gandhi and let them kill as many as they can before they give up and then we can live in peace.

You first!

Originally posted by centurion1211
All together now!

Kum by ya, my lord

Kum by ya ...

They must have changed something in the U.S. water supply.

I just finished reading the totally narcissistic "I'm leaving America" thread, And now there's this one that seems to basically say we all need to be like Gandhi and let them kill as many as they can before they give up and then we can live in peace.

You first!

Well the way I look at it, these illogical people can believe whatever they like, it is their right. But when it comes down to it, when the wolves attack the sheep, they need people like us to defend them. These people can try to change the world through this peaceful appeasement BS, and I wish it worked that way. But when it comes down to it, there are wolves everywhere and a thread like this is equivalent to the wolves smelling blood. The wolves want as many pacifists as possible. Makes their goals easier to achieve.

reply to post by LiveForever8

The OP's wishes are laudable and I don't doubt that they are heartfelt. But closed hearts cannot be pried open and those who are entrenched in power and privilege are not going to surrender in the face of passive resistance.

Remember Tiananmen Square, Draves? The protesters protested and the tanks rolled. Do you really think that your own power elite would not do the same to you?

They would. And they *have*. Research the happy fate of WWI vetrans protesting in Washington during the Great Depression. I'm not sure how many/ if any were killed, but I know they changed nothing.

It would be wonderful if your method was viable, Draves, but it isn't. I'm not writing this with the intention of disrespecting you.

Heh, those crazy star-crossed lovers, what have they done???

But yeah, passive resistance Gandhi-style - to a point. But how do you passively resist a Pneumonic Plague outbreak, or a Nuclear Missile, I wonder.....?

It was a good thread OP. If only people saw that so much can be done without the need for violenece, but tv and things we grow up around all change our perceptions on whats right in life. i like you am a hopeful who wants people to see past the material and division, but even if we stood together like you said there will always be that conflicting ideal or yin to the yang if you will. all species goes through it even Sol 3 is going through its own conflicting issues.

Your speak of change is inspiring, it all comes down to beliefs though. No matter how much you want to opens people minds up to thinking outside the box, it all is up to what they believe or depend on to be true. just circumstances of life. I will always take the initiative to try and spread peace but in this world doing the good thing feels like the bad thing and vice versa. just stay strong and grounded one day hopefully everyone will see past those things and unite, but face mars would have to attack for that to happen lol.

Well it still is a good thread.

A couple of people feel it is their need to "discredit" the op due to his views. Ghandi was a very enlightened man. He saw Truth and expressed it. In todays world people are different and dont think the same. They are more risk taking and careless about anothers life. Thus is why we cannot all be passive.

What the op is saying is dont go shooting, start talking. Start standing up for your freedoms. Start voicing. (Can you really talk without arguing? Well i sure hope you can... otherwise you need to "grow up" )

What many are failing to realize are the keypoints of the Op's Post.

Passive-
Truth-
Change-

NO HATE
NO BEING WALKED ON
& most important NO IGNORANCE (ignor-ants!)

I swear, reading these posts makes me afraid. I am a criminal justice major and I will help serve true justice as best aloud by the Laws YALL VOTE ON. If you have a problem with them shut up and change them. Its pretty simple. If you dont like the way cops do something change it. But dont make their dangerous jobs more difficult. Because when I step outside of the door as a cop. Im taking the risk of never being able to reopen that door again. I will risk my life for Justice and Truth, and sadly it will probably be taken by people who are so nutty and lost to the nature of truth that, my belief in doing somthing for others will be waste due to the extreme amount of ignorant people in this country and world.

My 2 Cents

Rj-Out

Originally posted by johnny2127
reply to post by Draves

 

Just so you know, encouraging others to not pay taxes is a felony. I understand you wanting to change the country and can respect the intent. However, just so you know, you are encouraging others to break the law, and in doing so you are breaking the law as well. You comfortable with that?

Just so yo know... The founders of the Constitution, and the Declaration of Independence were breaking the law. The Monetary System isnt owned by the Government.

One very interesting fact that we learned in our Criminal Justice class...

well two now that i think of it.

History is written by the winners...

And The Criminal Justice system in place is in place to protect the powerful that established it, not protect the justice that is supposed to be ensured.

Rising to the occasional truth means doing what you know is right vs what is told to you is right. Discerning truth is not an easy task, and it is not meant for the weak minded.

reply to post by rjmelter

Nicely said RJ!
We don't know how to be passive!
Besides that's for woosies!
We know war though!
Here, George explains it well:

Ooops, potty talk warning kiddies!

reply to post by Draves

Research Gandhi. He freed India.

You're forgetting one important fact.
Ghandi was assassinated.
Give it a try, and see how far you get.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by Draves

 

Research Gandhi. He freed India.

You're forgetting one important fact.
Ghandi was assassinated.
Give it a try, and see how far you get.

All free thinkers or people who sought equality or some type of change to peace all met the same fate. But they were all assassinated for being RIGHT in their actions just the evils' that be will try their best to stop, and im sure most liberators expect or at least have some type of knowledge to know the fate that seems inevitable in that field, its the fact that they knew this and still pursued what was right that makes them heroes. I wish i could have that boldness to be able to die for a just cause unselfish of my own desires.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


The man died... But the spirit lives on. For people who believe in nothing but money it really is a hard concept to grasp. Its very interesting but I guess my point is this. How come such a dumb indian freed his country and turned it into a better country? A simple dead guy who got assasinated! He's important for you to discredit due to his death? Hes important enough for you to make a very ignorant 3 lined post.

Idealogy is what got the forefathers to sign those important papers... If they were to sign them they would then be assasinated yet they did anyways... Due to their beliefs most of them lived!

Abraham Lincoln... a very important man was assasinated.
Kennedy was assasinated... because of his ideals.
WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE?
I would love to know your point... please share.

You really want to shaft the system? Try moving to barter and trade for everything you need, it's the only form of tax evasion that won't land you in jail(Ed Brown found out the hard way). Vote out incumbants and press for 1 term limits on all of congress. Become self reliant, it's the closest to free you can realistically hope to get given the circumstances.

You can't expect people to throw themselves under the bus by quitting their jobs in protest, people barely get by as is now. Work on the individual level first before attempting to destroy a society, because to invoke the proposed "changes" you have to break it all down then build from scratch and let me tell you it won't be peaceful, fun or without bloodshed and suffering -no task so monumental in scope ever is.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by rjmelter

A simple dead guy who got assasinated! He's important for you to discredit due to his death? Hes important enough for you to make a very ignorant 3 lined post.

If everyone that disagreed with the way things were going, and were assassinated, then those you disagree with would be the only ones left. My post was not ignorant, but pure logic. BTW, why not learn to spell assassination? Maybe then, YOUR ignorance would not be so obvious.

The only real change that can and only will happen is simply on the level of mind.
As the state of one's mind is the inherent cause and the world of form and physicality in time and space is essentially the effect.
At the end of the day without such understanding one is simply moving the furniture around the inside of a burning house.
So then;
To have peace one must be at peace.


[edit on 9-11-2009 by Epsillion70]