Get Smart! Epispde 52

a reply to: skyeagle409
Wow holy crap you're right, I can't see 'one single steel column being cut' through that concrete.

a reply to: twitchy

Nor, do you see the bright flashes of a thermite reaction in the windows.

originally posted by: skyeagle409
a reply to: twitchy

Nor, do you see the bright flashes of a thermite reaction in the windows.

Take a good look at
This Picture, do you see the load bearing colummns holding the building up through the window? Do you think concrete floors and walls would make it even harder to see? If I set off thermite behind the concrete wall would YOU be able to see it through the window with that flower in the way?
NO you don't see many bright flashes through walls and concrete.

a reply to: twitchy

You will note that that you do not see bright flashes of light from thermite reactions.

A few years back, Rumormillnews had their entire archives wiped out so some of the original links to their site aren't working but I did a little digging and found this gem on the wayback machine. If your genuinely curious as to how this theory came about, this is a good start....
web.archive.org...://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=25146
Scroll on down to where it says 'EXPLOSIVES MIXED IN CONCRETE ANSWERS ALL OF THE ABOVE', pretty fascinating read and probably something folks need to grab a copy of considering the frequent server attacks on alternative news sites like RMN.

Link isn't working because of the multiple http tags in their address. The original URL of the article is www.rumormillnews.com..., and it looks like you might have to manually search for it here. But it's there for now, enjoy!

a reply to: twitchy

Great thread, nicely done and interesting to read..

Unfortunately for the US government the whole 911 episode is dust to dust..

a reply to: zatara
Here's another pretty interesting read in regards to the actual construction of the WTC..

Source
There were curious mentions of factors like the revised plans for the core not being made available until 2 days before work on the core was due to begin as well as the strange security measures inconsistent with what ordinarily were simply construction processes. This was mostly associated with the rebar having the "special plastic coating"....

The actual slowdown in construction upon discovery of the rebar coating failure, when it was revealed by the government agency constructing, and the videographers had to pry for this information (contractors revealed economic damages from un explained security measures), that there was a special anti corrosion, anti vibration resistant coating on the rebar of the concrete core structure. The coating was flammable and special precautions were to be taken, meaning the government would conduct the butt welding of the 3 inch vertical bar with welders having a security clearance prior to regular crews running the horizontal minor steel that is tied with wire.

Welders working on the main steel couldn't be used because they didn't have security clearances. A special crew with armed escorts standing outside visual screens in the beginning of construction removed the coating from the bars, beveled the bar ends, welded the bar and x-rayed them. The armed guards were removed after suspicions were aroused.

Pretty interesting when you throw a Bin Laden Construction Group into that mix. Check the link out though, that's just a snippet.

An Excerpt from the statement of Robert L. Parish Sr.
On day, as the lead consultant engineer was in my lab talking just about "stuff", I asked him, "Sometime in future, in 50 years or so, how are these Twin Towers are going to be taken down as tall as they were going to be and as tight as land is in a crowded city, without causing fast destruction to other buildings?"
He was standing upright. He outstretched his right arm with his palm down. And said, "Bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam" as he lowered his hand down one imaginary floor at a time. All the way down to the floor. I knew that we had to certify these commutators to be able to operate continuously for 50 years without service or repair as our part of the contract. He explained that as the buildings are being built, explosive charges are being incorporated into the structures at key floor joint locations. So, that when the first charges are set-off at the top floors, they will take that floor down to the next. And the charges at that floor will take it down to the next floor. This will continue all the way down. The Twin Towers will come straight down like a stack of pancakes. When the buildings get old and no longer useful or profitable to have and maintain, all it will take is a phone call to take them down.

No wonder the Port Authority was refusing to give up the blueprints and making people sign agreements not to sue them over the information.

a reply to: twitchy

Pretty interesting when you throw a Bin Laden Construction Group into that mix. Check the link out though, that's just a snippet.

The United States had no ties to Osama bin Laden and in fact, even his family have disowned him.

Family in U.S. Cut Off Ties to bin Laden

This week, in Saudi Arabia, the patriarch of the bin Laden family, Sheikh Abdullah bin Laden, Osama's uncle, publicly denounced him.

"All the family members condemn all violent and terrorist acts, even if Osama is behind them," the uncle told reporters.

"They condemn the act. They condemn terrorism and they disavow any connections to Osama," said Adfil Najam, a professor of international studies at Boston University said.

It is not the first time Osama bin Laden's relatives have distanced themselves from their notorious family member. His relatives also denounced him after the 1998 terrorist attacks on U.S. embassies in Africa — attacks for which Osama bin Laden has been indicted in U.S. federal court.

abcnews.go.com...


Context of 'Shortly After April 9, 1994: Bin Laden Family Publicly Disowns Osama'

www.historycommons.org...

a reply to: skyeagle409

That's a complete load of bollocks.

Osama Bin Laden's CIA pseudonym was Tim Osman. Bush's connections are well known and the Bin Laden family was given a free ticket out of the US on 9-11 when no other commercial air traffic was allowed to fly.

whatreallyhappened.com...
Meeting Riconosciuto and Gunderson at the hotel were two representatives of the mujahadeen, waiting to discuss their armament needs. One of the two was named "Ralph Olberg." The other one was called Tim Osman (or Ossman).

"Ralph Olberg" was an American businesman who was leading the procurement of American weapons and technology on behalf of the Afghan rebels. He worked through the Afghan desk at the U.S. State Department, as well as through Senator Hubert Humphrey's office. Olberg looked after the Afghanis through a curious front called MSH - Management Sciences for Health.

The other man, dressed in Docker's clothing, was not a native Afghan any more than Olberg was. He was a 28-year-old Saudi. Tim Osman (Ossman) has recently become better known as Osama Bin Ladin. "Tim Osman" was the name assigned to him by the CIA for his tour of the U.S. and U.S. military bases, in search of political support and armaments.

Also Bin Laden was being treated in an American Hospital in Dubai just weeks prior to 9-11, and according to several French Papers at the time, was visited by CIA agents there.

www.theguardian.com...
Two months before September 11 Osama bin Laden flew to Dubai for 10 days for treatment at the American hospital, where he was visited by the local CIA agent, according to the French newspaper Le Figaro.
The disclosures are known to come from French intelligence which is keen to reveal the ambiguous role of the CIA, and to restrain Washington from extending the war to Iraq and elsewhere.

Bin Laden is reported to have arrived in Dubai on July 4 from Quetta in Pakistan with his own personal doctor, nurse and four bodyguards, to be treated in the urology department. While there he was visited by several members of his family and Saudi personalities, and the CIA.

The CIA chief was seen in the lift, on his way to see Bin Laden, and later, it is alleged, boasted to friends about his contact. He was recalled to Washington soon afterwards.

Intelligence sources say that another CIA agent was also present; and that Bin Laden was also visited by Prince Turki al Faisal, then head of Saudi intelligence, who had long had links with the Taliban, and Bin Laden. Soon afterwards Turki resigned, and more recently he has publicly attacked him in an open letter: "You are a rotten seed, like the son of Noah".

Bush's Former Oil Company Linked To bin Laden Family
Salem bin Laden, Osama's older brother, was an investor in Arbusto Energy. - the Texas oil company started by George W. Bush. Arbusto means "Bush" in Spanish. Salem bin Laden died in an airplane crash in Texas in 1988. Sheik Mohammed bin Laden, the family patriarch and founder of its construction empire, also died in a plane crash. Upon his death in 1968, he left behind 57 sons and daughters - the offspring he sired with 12 wives in Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon, and Jordan. About a dozen brothers manage Bin Laden Brothers Construction - one of the largest construction firms in the Middle East. Fresh out of Harvard Business School, young George W. Bush returned to Midland, TX, in the late 1970s to follow his father's footsteps in the oil business. Beginning in 1978, he set up a series of limited partnerships - Arbusto '78, Arbusto '79, and so on - to drill for oil. One of President Bush's earliest financial backers was James Bath, a Houston aircraft broker. Bath served with President Bush in the Texas Air National Guard. Bath has a mysterious connection to the Central Intelligence Agency. According to a 1976 trust agreement, Salem bin Laden appointed James Bath as his business representative in Houston. Revelation about Bath's relationship with the bin Laden financial empire and the CIA was made public in 1992 by Bill White, a former real estate business partner with Bath. White informed federal investigators in 1992 that Bath told him that he had assisted the CIA in a liaison role since 1976 - the same year former President George Herbert Walker Bush served as director of the CIA.

Several bin Laden family members invested millions in The Carlyle Group
Interestingly, on Sept. 11, 2001, members of the Carlyle Group - including Bush senior, and his former secretary of state, James Baker - were meeting at the Ritz Carlton Hotel in Washington, D.C., along with Shafiq bin Laden, another one of Osama bin Laden's brothers.
While all flights were halted following the terrorist attacks, there was one exception made: The White House authorized planes to pick up 140 Saudi nationals, including 24 members of the bin Laden family, living in various cities in the U.S. to bring them back to Saudi Arabia, where they would be safe. They were never interrogated.

truth-out.org...:ties-between-the-bush-family-and-osama-bin-laden
Ties Between the Bush Family and Osama bin Laden
The Bushes' private links to the bank passed to Bin Mahfouz through Texas businessman James R. Bath, who invested money in the United States on behalf of the Saudi. In 1976, when Bush was the head of the CIA, the agency sold some of the planes of Air America, a secret "proprietary" airline it used during the Vietnam War, to Skyway, a company owned by Bath and Bin Mahfouz. Bath then helped finance George W. Bush's oil company, Arbusto Energy Inc., in 1979 and 1980.
When Harken Energy Corp., which had absorbed Arbusto (by then merged with Spectrum 7 Energy), got into financial trouble in 1987, Jackson Stephens of the powerful, politically-connected Arkansas investment firm helped it secure 25 million dollars in financing from the Union Bank of Switzerland. As part of that deal, a place on the board was given to Harken shareholder Sheik Abdullah Taha Bakhsh, whose chief banker was BCCI shareholder Bin Mahfouz.
Then, in 1988, George Bush Sr. was elected president. Harken benefited by getting some new investors, including Salem bin Laden, Osama bin Laden's half-brother, and Khalid bin Mahfouz. Osama bin Laden himself was busy elsewhere at the time - organising al Qaeda.
The money BCCI stole before it was shut down in 1991 - somewhere between 9.5 billion and 15 billion dollars - made its 20-year heist the biggest bank fraud in history. Most of it was never recovered. International banks' complicity in the offshore secrecy system effectively covered up the money trail.

www.mafhoum.com...
www.globalresearch.ca...
www.prisonplanet.com...
www.rense.com...
tvnewslies.org...
noliesradio.org...


*SNIP*

At 4:20 or so in this 1964 The Jetsons episode, appears the basis for a very
successful 1977-1984 show, Fantasy Island.

This shows how life can be imitating art intentionally rather than
by coincidence as someone obviously ripped off the Jetsons' idea.


www.youtube.com...

a reply to: djohnsto77

originally posted by: skyeagle409
The United States had no ties to Osama bin Laden

www.abovetopsecret.com...
15). Posting: You will not Post any material that is knowingly false, misleading, or inaccurate.

I think most of us typically try to abide by that, it is possible that maybe you just never heard of James Bath etc. Glad I could educate you on the subject though.

Also, from YOUR own link...

Shortly after the Saudi government publicly disowns bin Laden (while privately continuing to support him) (see April 9, 1994), the bin Laden family follows suits and publicly disowns him as well. Bakr bin Laden, the chairman of the Saudi Binladin Group, the main bin Laden family company, signs a two-sentence statement. Osama bin Laden has 25 brothers, 29 sisters, and more in-laws, aunts, uncles, and so forth. Der Spiegel will later report that in the years bin Laden lives in Sudan, Saudi intelligence minister “Prince Turki [al-Faisal] sent Osama’s mother, Hamida, and his brother Bakr to the Sudanese capital, Khartoum, several times to convince Osama to abandon his terrorist activities. The visits were so frequent that Israel’s intelligence agency, the Mossad, believed at the time that Osama was a Saudi spy.” Vincent Cannistraro, former head of the CIA’s Counter Terrorism Center, will say, “I tracked the bin Ladens for years. Many family members claimed that Osama was no longer one of them. It’s an easy thing to say, but blood is usually thicker than water.” Michael Scheuer, former head of the CIA unit specializing in hunting bin Laden, doubts that the entire bin Laden family has severed ties with Osama. In a 2005 interview he will say, “I haven’t seen anything in the last 10 years that’s convinced me that would be the case.”

1997: Bin Laden Family Financial Connection With Osama Continues Until At Least This Year
In 2004, Osama bin Laden’s half brother Yeslam Binladin admits that he and other bin Laden family members share a Swiss bank account with Osama bin Laden from 1990 until 1997. The account was opened by brothers Omar and Heidar bin Laden in 1990 with an initial deposit of $450,000. By 1997, only two people are authorized to conduct transactions on the account: brothers Osama and Yeslam bin Laden. The bin Laden family claims to have disowned Osama bin Laden in 1994 (see Shortly After April 9, 1994), and the US government officially designated him as a financier of terrorism in 1996. Yeslam had previously denied any financial dealings with Osama at this late date until evidence of this bank account was uncovered by French private investigator Jean-Charles Brisard. In December 2001, French authorities will open an investigation into the financial dealings of the Saudi Investment Company (SICO) run by Yeslam Binladin...

It's usually wise to read through your own sources before post them in support of your contentions.

a reply to: twitchy
I couldn't get the link to work and I imagine most folks aren't going to go throught he trouble of putting the URL into wayback's search engine so I took a couple screen shots of the pertinent text. Chemistry isn't one of my strong points though so I'm hoping someone with a little more knowledge in that area could weigh in on this...

a reply to: twitchy

He was standing upright. He outstretched his right arm with his palm down. And said, "Bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam" as he lowered his hand down one imaginary floor at a time. All the way down to the floor. I knew that we had to certify these commutators to be able to operate continuously for 50 years without service or repair as our part of the contract. He explained that as the buildings are being built, explosive charges are being incorporated into the structures at key floor joint locations. So, that when the first charges are set-off at the top floors, they will take that floor down to the next. And the charges at that floor will take it down to the next floor. This will continue all the way down. The Twin Towers will come straight down like a stack of pancakes. When the buildings get old and no longer useful or profitable to have and maintain, all it will take is a phone call to take them down.

Thank you.

This is a good find and it does support what scientist know. And it depicts what we all watched on the News footage as the WTC were coming down.

The fact is, there was way to much energy involved when the Towers collapsed, thousands of tons of steel beams were ejected over 600 feet in every direction at 60 miles an hour.

a reply to: twitchy

There were no connections between Osama bin Laden because the CIA had orders to hunt him down at that time.

The fact is, there was way to much energy involved when the Towers collapsed, thousands of tons of steel beams were ejected over 600 feet in every direction at 60 miles an hour.

Demolition explosives are not capable of ejecting huge steel columns hundreds of feet. Case in point, how many structural beams do you see being ejected during this demolition operation?



.

a reply to: Informer1958

From the link.

He was standing upright. He outstretched his right arm with his palm down. And said, "Bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam" as he lowered his hand down one imaginary floor at a time. All the way down to the floor.

That was determined to be the floors pancaking down on one another, not from explosives.

a reply to: twitchy

From your link.

1997: Bin Laden Family Financial Connection With Osama Continues Until At Least This Year In 2004, Osama bin Laden’s half brother Yeslam Binladin admits that he and other bin Laden family members share a Swiss bank account with Osama bin Laden from 1990 until 1997.

Now, for rest of the story.

Binladin family disowned Osama bin Laden

Binladin, who says most of the family uses that spelling, is one of 54 children born to wives of the late Mohammed Bin-Awad Binladin. The family disowned Osama bin Laden in 1994, and Binladin says they have no connections with him.

usatoday30.usatoday.com...

In addition:

Report: Clinton Targeted Bin Laden

Capturing Osama bin Laden had been an objective of the United States government since the presidency of Bill Clinton.

Shortly after the September 11 attacks it was revealed that President Clinton had signed a directive authorizing the CIA (and specifically their elite Special Activities Division) to apprehend bin Laden and bring him to the United States to stand trial after the 1998 United States embassy bombings in Africa; if taking bin Laden alive was deemed impossible, then deadly force was authorized.

www.cbsnews.com...

originally posted by: skyeagle409
a reply to: Informer1958

From the link.

He was standing upright. He outstretched his right arm with his palm down. And said, "Bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam" as he lowered his hand down one imaginary floor at a time. All the way down to the floor.

That was determined to be the floors pancaking down on one another, not from explosives.

How about the rest of it sky..

He explained that as the buildings are being built, explosive charges are being incorporated into the structures at key floor joint locations. So, that when the first charges are set-off at the top floors, they will take that floor down to the next. And the charges at that floor will take it down to the next floor.

a reply to: Informer1958

I strongly advise anyone looking into the events of 9-11-2001 to do their own research. Don't rely on anything posted by myself or anyone else for that matter. We are, for all intent purposes, anonymous to one another here on ATS. For all you know I could be some angry mujahideen operative, or you could be working at some desk on the CENTCOM payroll, so don't take anything for granted. Vett your own information and sources, ask questions and then find the answers to them on your own. There is no statute of limitations on murder cases, and killing thousands of Americans is a very serious crime with global implications... if elements of the US Government, or any of the cronies pulling the strings thereof, were indeed involved in the WTC destruction, then they aren't going to stop trying to discredit the 'truth movement', ever.

originally posted by: twitchy
a reply to: Informer1958

I strongly advise anyone looking into the events of 9-11-2001 to do their own research. Don't rely on anything posted by myself or anyone else for that matter. We are, for all intent purposes, anonymous to one another here on ATS. For all you know I could be some angry mujahideen operative, or you could be working at some desk on the CENTCOM payroll, so don't take anything for granted. Vett your own information and sources, ask questions and then find the answers to them on your own. There is no statute of limitations on murder cases, and killing thousands of Americans is a very serious crime with global implications... if elements of the US Government, or any of the cronies pulling the strings thereof, were indeed involved in the WTC destruction, then they aren't going to stop trying to discredit the 'truth movement', ever.

Yes very good advice....

Demolition explosives are not capable of ejecting huge steel columns hundreds of feet. Case in point, how many structural beams do you see being ejected during this demolition operation?

Have you not yet figured out comparing a conventional demolition to the wtc is pointless and irrelevant..