Covid vaccines may have helped fuel rise in excess deaths

originally posted by: ArMaP

originally posted by: marg6043
Coincidence? you tell me and the numbers of people with more common cancer are alarming.

I already told you: during the CoViD-19 years people stopped being followed by their family doctors and/or stopped having the usual tests. When things returned to normal, all the people that would have been diagnosed with cancer during those two years or so were diagnosed, so, in reality, we are seeing now the accumulated cases for those years.

That is fair, but simply doesn't cut it in the end. The Big Pharma are admitting all this now was causing heart issues.

originally posted by: ksihkahe
a reply to: ksihkahe

I'll just add this that I provided for another vaccine aficionado.

This is ex-CDC chief Redfield explaining exactly what I explained to them the day before the interview dropped.

"If you came down and visited me and interviewed my patients...you'd interview patient after patient after patient that did not have COVID but are very sick. You would say very sick, long COVID patients. And it's all from the vaccine."

"The spike protein is immunotoxic. You get infected, it's immunotoxic. But when you give the vaccine, we make the spike protein."

"When I give you an mRNA vaccine...I don't know how much spike protein you make because I give you mRNA and then your body goes and makes it...You may make it for a week...You may make it for a month."

Full interview
Relevant portions

Thanks for the links.

originally posted by: Terpene
a reply to: andy06shake

Yeah... Could there be natural electromagnetic inferences too?

We can talk about the absence of electromagnetic data, but since we have data there seems to be a correlation.

Doesn't jive with the established world view, but it is what it is...

Here we can agree I think that this is likely something also going on even if we can't agree on the Vax being poisoned.

originally posted by: Justoneman

originally posted by: ArMaP

originally posted by: marg6043
Coincidence? you tell me and the numbers of people with more common cancer are alarming.

I already told you: during the CoViD-19 years people stopped being followed by their family doctors and/or stopped having the usual tests. When things returned to normal, all the people that would have been diagnosed with cancer during those two years or so were diagnosed, so, in reality, we are seeing now the accumulated cases for those years.

That is fair, but simply doesn't cut it in the end. The Big Pharma are admitting all this now was causing heart issues.

And admitting a role in "life expectancy" regressing, instead of lengthening....as it's been doing for decades.

originally posted by: WeMustCare

originally posted by: Justoneman

originally posted by: ArMaP

originally posted by: marg6043
Coincidence? you tell me and the numbers of people with more common cancer are alarming.

I already told you: during the CoViD-19 years people stopped being followed by their family doctors and/or stopped having the usual tests. When things returned to normal, all the people that would have been diagnosed with cancer during those two years or so were diagnosed, so, in reality, we are seeing now the accumulated cases for those years.

That is fair, but simply doesn't cut it in the end. The Big Pharma are admitting all this now was causing heart issues.

And admitting a role in "life expectancy" regressing, instead of lengthening....as it's been doing for decades.

Perhaps confirming our suspicions that Billy Gates did intend to do as he implied with vaccines helping to reduce the world's population. Those useless eaters won't off themselves fast enough for him it appears.

a reply to: chr0naut

Actually the excess deaths during 2020 was the end of life policies and medications they were using to treat covid that were wrong and this has been discussed as well.
Why hating John Campbell for ? For actually showing the evidence?
It’s a bit like grief there’s many stages and one denial and think a lot of people don’t want to see it.

a reply to: chr0naut

Wow well done , but least he’s trying to find the evidence and understand it , what is out governements doing hay?

a reply to: ArMaP

I did not assume you are ignorant. You posted the evidence yourself. Ignorance is a lack of information. Saying there is no evidence when there is a bunch of evidence belies a state of ignorance. Further, stating that threads are not evidence, while admitting to not reading them to see if there is evidence cited... is said from a place of self-admitted ignorance.

Ignorance is an inevitable state that we all suffer from. I don't see an issue with me making a factual statement based on the information you yourself have provided. I'm ignorant of many things, which I try to alleviate by asking questions from people that know more than me or consuming information. I don't live in denial of my ignorance, it's actually a wonderful motivator. I would gladly provide you evidence if you tell me what exactly you need or will accept, but you've already said you won't accept it from threads. I told you what is already available here on these very pages and though you haven't read it or asked for links to it, you told me that threads are not evidence. Shall I send you a certified letter? Where else might I be able to direct you to links or citation of evidence if not in threads? Where else am I going to provide links to supporting evidence or explain evidence through the lens of public health best practices?

Your standards for evidence to support your own statements seem rather loose. You're claiming that increases in cancer incidence, which I have highlighted is most alarming because it is rare cancers in young people, has been confirmed by your personal observation to be from screening delays. I would welcome your correction to this, but I very much doubt you know anybody under 50 getting routine screenings for rare cancers. If so, kudos to Portugal for having the most proactive healthcare system in the history of the planet. How is a couple cases indicative of what's occured in different places with different conditions? Have you looked at any data from highly vaccinated areas that didn't have harmful and unnecessary delays? This is totally independent of excess mortality. It should probably be greatly concerning that they seem to refuse to allow vaccine status, which many governments lobbied to make required ID or already have, as part of every investigation into the rising mortality.

Its also leaving out key details to claim that anybody can put things into VAERS unconfirmed without including that the CDC then reviews that information and has an existing process to deal with the uncertainty. The same way they have for many years until COVID vaccines were forced on millions and millions of people. The system exists to track adverse events and prevent this kind of disaster. It is meant to provide the people taking these products assurances that they are safe. If the CDC protocols for assessing these show no adverse events it would be great news for vaccine promoters. Have you read the CDC output from that system after their evaluation or endeavored to understand how they evaluate it? If you haven't, then maybe you should before trying to explain it away. This nonsense that has been propagated about it is entirely due to the fact that this vaccine cohort has managed to outstrip all extent vaccines in adverse events reports... combined. Suppression of information harmful to vaccine perception was admitted by the ex-CDC chief in my other reply. If you want to understand it, then you'll need to go deeper than what you have and evaluate the history of VAERS and the expectations for the CDC in handling it.

For over a year they failed to provide transparency on the processed data and insisted that there were no serious adverse events. It was a flat out lie and the processed data obtained after extensive pressure exposed that lie. If you haven't seen it then you should probably ask why your sources didn't find it important, while you were being led to believe that they had no serious risks and that your risk from COVID was greatly exaggerated. I'm sure it has nothing to do with politicians, agency personnel, and information providers making billions of dollars on pharmaceutical revenue. Royalties, stock options, grants, and sponsorships.

It's irrelevant if you watched the TV or whatever else. Your sources of information were clearly lying to you, failing to provide you accurate information, or failing to provide complete information, because you said there's no evidence and have made several statements that miss critical context. I have seen lots of evidence, it exists... no it will likely not be clear just from a YouTube video, but many do provide you sufficient information to explore the evidence yourself. If you don't understand why it's evidence, why it excludes things you may have thought would explain it, then you will have to take initiative to educate yourself. The main source of this false information was government, paid pharma orgs, and the press. That your information seems to have significant portions drawn from that is the primary issue. It doesn't matter where you get bad information. It is intentionally propagated and those are the primary sources from which it all rolls downhill. Flavor, spin, whatever, doesn't matter.

It was clearly not all directed specifically to you as we've never interacted in these threads, which you have admitted to not even reading. I very accurately gave a retrospective of exactly what happened. You missed evidence that was posted and, even when it was posted, it has been deemed insufficient by people that have no idea what they're talking about. You have provided me no reason to believe you won't do exactly the same when you make the claim, sight unseen, that threads are not evidence. Nothing is evidence if you don't look at it. I've posted graphs and tables and links to various sources of information from sources that nobody really disputes as credible. What they typically do is craft an explanation, which doesn't actually explain the data they way they think it does, or they repeat something they were told. Case in point, you didn't understand that screening delays are not relevant in explaining years long increases in rare cancers that people don't routinely get screened for, or that the unconfirmed VAERS reports are not used just as raw data to make assessments.

It takes much less time for me to simply point out the glaring errors, outright lies, logical fallacies, and ignorance of people that try to play defense for a product that I know is harming innocent people for no reason other than profits and protection from liability. If some people believe in ridiculous things like 5G nanobots and some of the ludicrous things that lack evidence of even a known mechanism to occur, I don't really care at this point. They aren't going to regret not getting one of these dangerous garbage products, but I'll own it if somebody does. They can run right out and get one with my sincere apologies. I hope that you and the people you care about never suffer adverse events. If you are confident in your sources being accurate and complete, then I hope they serve you well. If you promote anything I know to be false, provide incomplete information, or don't provide full context, I will point it out for others if I happen by.

Mercifully, for both of us, I have run out of space.

originally posted by: chr0naut
a reply to: ksihkahe

So things like VAERS aren't completely accurate, and the immunizations aren't 100% effective, therefore we should ignore the stuff we do know, and instead, in some sort of knee jerk reaction to made up doom-porn, we should abandon attempts to protect ourselves, and just die quietly, or maybe live, who knows?

I don't even understand what you're accusing me of saying, but I have no doubt that it bears no resemblance to what was actually said.

A statistically significant rise in cancers is not doom porn, it is observed to be happening in young people that get no clinical benefit from vaccines because they were never at any significant risk of serious illness from COVID. It is happening and I have never made up ridiculous claims about some inflated number. That you don't understand what constitutes an extreme deviation in the incidence of an illness isn't me making up doom porn. What appear to be small deviations in whatever selective time-frames your pharma propaganda sources use (to support the raft of bs that you've been promoting about adverse events being lower than one in one million, as a small concession to your previous bs that they don't exist at all) are not a reflection of their impact over time.

That you accuse me of doom porn while continuing with this ludicrous and totally discredited idea that were all risking our lives by not taking a vaccine that doesn't prevent illness or transmission is typical wetbrain nonsense from you. The overwhelming majority of direct deaths from COVID were in people past their projected lifespan or with significant comorbidities. If not for the fact that flu deaths magically disappeared during the first year of COVID they were all at high risk for dying from that if they caught a bad case.

That you don't understand population demographics in public health or statistics isn't my problem. Plenty of people that aren't self-appointed experts seem to have no problem understanding you don't harm kids or expose them to unknown risks "because we have to do something" when the very elderly or otherwise infirm are at high risk of endemic diseases. COVID is endemic, as I told you it would be three or more years ago when you persisted with the "lockdowns will prevent the spread", which wasn't even auggested by the jackasses that ordered them.

Just months ago you were lying about the vaccines having much lower risk than Ivermectin. You had an opportunity to defend or explain that lie and failed to do so. If you think being caught telling lies and then running away hasn't removed any sensible person's inclination to take you seriously, you are mistaken.

Save your generic doom babbling and emo crap for the walls of the rubber room you're going to end up in when this all finally finishes falling apart. You aren't a serious person and I don't really have any respect for people that aren't willing to own what they say. You've proven that you'll say whatever you think will advance your dysfunctional ideology of medical authoritarianism or defend those that promoted it. You can take all the magic spike juice (that totally doesn't produce the same toxic effect as the evil natural spikes) you want. Nobody is stopping you. They don't prevent illness or transmission and no matter how many people take however many shots you will remain at risk. Get over it or don't, but these facts are not changing.

a reply to: Justoneman

I don't know it being deliberately poisoned seems like a logistical nightmare to assure the right people are poisoned.

Rushing past human trials, a technology that hasn't even passed animal trials, might cause some havoc.

We shouldn't so much focuse on the covid "vaccine" but the actual mrna technology behind it.... It's nothing like we've ever had before and has the potential for a disastrous outcome. It's not a simple immunotherapy as is the case with vaccines.

We are basically saying we can create immunity on a genetic level by mimicking the natural process.

We are genetically meddling in systems we don't fully understand....
what could possibly go wrong?

If you've taken the new mrna "vaccine" you've effectively become a GMO...

originally posted by: WeMustCare
And admitting a role in "life expectancy" regressing, instead of lengthening....as it's been doing for decades.

In Portugal that had a good side-effect, the reducing of the retirement age, as the age is based on life expectancy.

a reply to: ksihkahe

Good rant, see why Darko likes you. So here we are with some globalists wanting to cull the population. We can say no, as for the rest wrapped up in the psychological war going on? I support self determination. If someone wants to take 20 years off there life, that is on them.

How informed consent has been bastardized, starts to blur the line of a civil/dictatorial agenda.

InfoWars - Exclusive - Globalist Coup Against America Happening NOW, Special Operations Army Colonel Dr. Pete Chambers Warns - 6-02-2024

I tried finding the video of Pete talking to Fauci on his way into some congress hearing. Nuremberg stuff.

originally posted by: ksihkahe
a reply to: ArMaP

I did not assume you are ignorant.

That's not what I referring to, sorry for not being clear about it, I was referring to your mention of being "lied to by people that literally are beneficiaries of pharmaceutical company profits" and of parroting "the things told to you by those who have been suppressing any attempt to provide evidence for four years" and that I "refuse to look at the heaps of evidence available".

Further, stating that threads are not evidence, while admitting to not reading them to see if there is evidence cited... is said from a place of self-admitted ignorance.

Threads are not evidence (I said facts). Saying that there are "threads on what the vaccines do to specific cancer suppression functions in the body" doesn't say if those threads have confirmable facts in them or not

I don't live in denial of my ignorance, it's actually a wonderful motivator.

I agree, that is also my point of view.

I would gladly provide you evidence if you tell me what exactly you need or will accept, but you've already said you won't accept it from threads.

I never said that.

I told you what is already available here on these very pages and though you haven't read it or asked for links to it, you told me that threads are not evidence.

Threads are not facts (or evidence) in the same way a blog or a book are not facts or evidence, their content may ormay not be factual or have evidences.

Unfortunately I don't have much free time (I'm writing this while at work, don't tell my boss) to look for evidences in unidentified posts in unidentified threads on a subject that is not at the top of my priorities.

If you give me links I may be follow them (like I did with that American Cancer Society report), unless they are for videos, I hate videos, as they force me to spend my time at the rate they want.

Your standards for evidence to support your own statements seem rather loose. You're claiming that increases in cancer incidence, which I have highlighted is most alarming because it is rare cancers in young people, has been confirmed by your personal observation to be from screening delays. I would welcome your correction to this, but I very much doubt you know anybody under 50 getting routine screenings for rare cancers.

Your mention of rare cancer cases in young people was made after my post, so I wasn't, obviously, talking about them. Also, as you do not mention what those rare cases are I cannot know if they are part of the screening process in Portugal or not.

How is a couple cases indicative of what's occured in different places with different conditions? Have you looked at any data from highly vaccinated areas that didn't have harmful and unnecessary delays?

I have always stated that I speak only of what I know personally, and I know of several cases of people under 50 that were diagnosed with cancer too late because of the delays caused by the CoViD-19 crisis.

Have you read the CDC output from that system after their evaluation or endeavored to understand how they evaluate it? If you haven't, then maybe you should before trying to explain it away.

I confess I haven't read it, but the fact that I am able to make a credible report in VAERS makes me doubt the quality of the data available.

It's irrelevant if you watched the TV or whatever else. Your sources of information were clearly lying to you, failing to provide you accurate information, or failing to provide complete information, because you said there's no evidence and have made several statements that miss critical context.

I never said there's no evidence, I said only "but where are the evidences" of the vaccines causing the excess deaths. Saying is possible or even likely is not evidence that it did happened.

That your information seems to have significant portions drawn from that is the primary issue. It doesn't matter where you get bad information. It is intentionally propagated and those are the primary sources from which it all rolls downhill. Flavor, spin, whatever, doesn't matter.

As I said, I got it from personal experience.

I've posted graphs and tables and links to various sources of information from sources that nobody really disputes as credible.

That's what you should have written instead of "there are threads on".

I hope that you and the people you care about never suffer adverse events.

Thanks.

If you are confident in your sources being accurate and complete, then I hope they serve you well.

My sources are personal observation of the people around me that I know took the vaccine, some with only the first dose (one or two injections), some with one booster, some with two.

If you promote anything I know to be false, provide incomplete information, or don't provide full context, I will point it out for others if I happen by.

I never promote any thing, even things I agree with.

originally posted by: Terpene
I don't know it being deliberately poisoned seems like a logistical nightmare to assure the right people are poisoned.

Some people say some batches are the bad ones, causing problems to those that took them.

I think it was one year ago I saw a table showing batch numbers and death rates, with some of the batches having much higher death rates associated with them.

originally posted by: G1111B1234
a reply to: chr0naut

Wow well done , but least he’s trying to find the evidence and understand it , what is out governements doing hay?

The simple fact that excess mortality in 2023-2024 is lower than in 2019 proves that all the rubbish about the vaccines causing ongoing harm is entirely false.

Excess mortality: Deaths from all causes compared to average over previous years

Weekly number of excess deaths in England and Wales from January 2020 to January 2024

Annual excess deaths recorded in Europe from 2017 to 2023

Campbell used estimates of future trends drawn from incomplete and partial data (which always oscillates in the short term) to support his anti-vax agenda and has not made mention of the current statistics

It is clear from the data that the high excess mortality began in 2020, a year before the immunizations, and by 2023 (when the pandemic was over) had resolved itself. If anything, the statistics show that the immunizations and weakening of the strains of the virus had combined to effectively end the pandemic and excess deaths.

The WHO in recent evaluations post-pandemic has estimated that there were 14.9 million deaths due to COVID-19, which fully explains the excess mortality statistics far better than mis-associating the disease caused mortality to the cures.

14.9 million excess deaths associated with the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020 and 2021

The pandemic is over. The vaccines have been proven to be safe and effective, despite the hue-and-cry of the anti-vax rabble.

a reply to: PrivateAngel

Covid vaccines may have helped fuel rise in excess deaths

that and and everything that killed people who were infected with covid.
like car wrecks, gunshot wounds and drive by's, falling out windows, drowning, and the list goes on and on and counted as a covid death

originally posted by: ksihkahe

originally posted by: chr0naut
a reply to: ksihkahe

So things like VAERS aren't completely accurate, and the immunizations aren't 100% effective, therefore we should ignore the stuff we do know, and instead, in some sort of knee jerk reaction to made up doom-porn, we should abandon attempts to protect ourselves, and just die quietly, or maybe live, who knows?

I don't even understand what you're accusing me of saying, but I have no doubt that it bears no resemblance to what was actually said.

How would you know?

A statistically significant rise in cancers is not doom porn, it is observed to be happening in young people that get no clinical benefit from vaccines because they were never at any significant risk of serious illness from COVID. It is happening and I have never made up ridiculous claims about some inflated number. That you don't understand what constitutes an extreme deviation in the incidence of an illness isn't me making up doom porn. What appear to be small deviations in whatever selective time-frames your pharma propaganda sources use (to support the raft of bs that you've been promoting about adverse events being lower than one in one million, as a small concession to your previous bs that they don't exist at all) are not a reflection of their impact over time.

Please post your sources.

That you accuse me of doom porn while continuing with this ludicrous and totally discredited idea that were all risking our lives by not taking a vaccine that doesn't prevent illness or transmission is typical wetbrain nonsense from you.

The immunizations reduce illness and transmission. They don't prevent them. No medicine or vaccine is 100% effective, in all people, every time.

The pandemic is over, and the most administered medicine against the disease were the immunizations. Go figure?

The overwhelming majority of direct deaths from COVID were in people past their projected lifespan or with significant comorbidities.

That is true for nearly every disease. COVID-19 also did kill otherwise healthy adults, children and babies. So, there's that.

If not for the fact that flu deaths magically disappeared during the first year of COVID they were all at high risk for dying from that if they caught a bad case.

Flu deaths didn't disappear. It simply took time to collate the statistics, and anti-vaxxers such as yourself went off half-cocked. You are still repeating the same inanities after having been presented with the details several times. Here it is again:

Past Seasons Estimated Influenza Disease Burden

That you don't understand population demographics in public health or statistics isn't my problem. Plenty of people that aren't self-appointed experts seem to have no problem understanding you don't harm kids or expose them to unknown risks "because we have to do something" when the very elderly or otherwise infirm are at high risk of endemic diseases. COVID is endemic, as I told you it would be three or more years ago when you persisted with the "lockdowns will prevent the spread", which wasn't even suggested by the jackasses that ordered them.

In several countries (Italy for example), the lockdowns worked to reduce the spread to the point where the medical resources could keep up with the prevalence of severe cases. In New Zealand, three times, outbreaks were eliminated from the general population. The lockdowns worked, but only where people actually did isolate properly. The other thing is that where they worked, they worked within weeks.

Where they didn't work there were mass-protests, sports events, political rallies, and other similar super-spreader events, and also a few refused to comply - and it only takes one bad apple to spoil the barrel!

Just months ago you were lying about the vaccines having much lower risk than Ivermectin. You had an opportunity to defend or explain that lie and failed to do so. If you think being caught telling lies and then running away hasn't removed any sensible person's inclination to take you seriously, you are mistaken.

I did explain myself, but you clearly refuse to admit it. Here, once more:

Toxic Effects from Ivermectin Use Associated with Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19

Poison Control Centers Are Fielding A Surge Of Ivermectin Overdose Calls

Ivermectin | Toxicology Section - ACEP

Serious adverse reactions associated with ivermectin: A systematic pharmacovigilance study in sub-Saharan Africa and in the rest of the World

This is an official CDC HEALTH ADVISORY

Save your generic doom babbling and emo crap for the walls of the rubber room you're going to end up in when this all finally finishes falling apart. You aren't a serious person and I don't really have any respect for people that aren't willing to own what they say. You've proven that you'll say whatever you think will advance your dysfunctional ideology of medical authoritarianism or defend those that promoted it. You can take all the magic spike juice (that totally doesn't produce the same toxic effect as the evil natural spikes) you want. Nobody is stopping you. They don't prevent illness or transmission and no matter how many people take however many shots you will remain at risk. Get over it or don't, but these facts are not changing.

If the immunizations were causing more cancers, why are we seeing the following statistics showing a steady decline in incidence and mortality in yearly figures?

To quote USA Facts, "The cancer mortality rate in the US has consistently fallen year over year since 2000".

US cancer rates and trends: how have cancer rates and mortality changed over time?.

Cancer death rate, 1950 to 2021

Cancer Facts & Figures 2024 - American Cancer Society

There is no clear data that supports the doom-porn. Slight oscillations in short period statistics are no good basis for determining overall trends.

originally posted by: Terpene
a reply to: Justoneman

I don't know it being deliberately poisoned seems like a logistical nightmare to assure the right people are poisoned.

Rushing past human trials, a technology that hasn't even passed animal trials, might cause some havoc.

We shouldn't so much focuse on the covid "vaccine" but the actual mrna technology behind it.... It's nothing like we've ever had before and has the potential for a disastrous outcome. It's not a simple immunotherapy as is the case with vaccines.

We are basically saying we can create immunity on a genetic level by mimicking the natural process.

We are genetically meddling in systems we don't fully understand....
what could possibly go wrong?

If you've taken the new mrna "vaccine" you've effectively become a GMO...

Well, if some of them are filled with the mRNA and some are not, then that makes it like "Russian Ruolette". Your turn is a chance to get the real bullet. Talking about dodging one, I can say by me not taking that, nor a flu shot in ever has kept me from getting more than allergies. Allergies likely caused by my being in the Army and getting shots from the Pharma companies. We were and still are Guinea pigs while in military service.

a reply to: BernnieJGato

That worked both ways. Remember all the "dropping like flies cos of the vaxx," threads?

a reply to: Oldcarpy2

That didn't change anything did it? Of course, you are right that they both happened. The facts are both of those things are true and they speak ill of Fauci and the medical establishment taking Tyrannical controls world wide during that period. These facts are both bad for the established story they pushed down our throats like the assholes they are.