Europe Is About To Blow Up

a reply to: strongfp

You really crack me up. Red states bussing immigrants all over the US? You mean Texas. Just say it, CA and NM are sanctuary states. Like all the other feel good virtue signalling BLUE states that are sanctuary states, the magnet for them to come. They want to go to a sanctuary state.

Only now we see that the sanctuary states don't really want them and Texas is the bad guy because they, who never passed sanctuary laws, doesn't want to keep them em Texas.

Do you even hear yourself?

a reply to: MoreCoyoteAngels

The facts are the facts. Texas and Arizona ARE red states, and are bussing migrants to northern blue states, to "protest", agaisnt them.

That's not helping the problem now is it?

a reply to: strongfp

So you feel like only the border states should bear the expense, red or blue?

That's not really fair, when immigration is a federal problem, and exasperated by the sanctuary states that in defiance of US law. The BLUE states.

So bus them all over the place I say. Let those that CAUSED the problem, sanctuary states, PAY FOR IT.

And the great reliable red state of AZ is now purple due to so many damn californians moving there.

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

Yet you still take me out of context and throw me in into a basked "Europeans". I went for the government, you went for the people.

Go for my first post in this thread and scroll down the long quote and also read the initial post of the member I responded to. Then you understand where I was coming from better.

Of course it's Merkels immigration politics, I wrote this like a thousand times here and I am a big critic of the EU, always was. Yet Merkel was responding, she is not the inital reason for the people fleeing their countries. She just made it more probable, which is horrible on it's own.

Take for example Syria. The US government armed rebels to fight Assad and how did that turn out? Afghanistan 2.0.

All that takes money, which is why in the USA we now have such bad infrastructure: we paid for a massive military and neglected our society.

And was that money really spent to protect the US people or US soil? Or was it spent to protect the US government interests? At what point in history except for WW2 was the US in a position it was defending US people or US soil? Since WW2 every damn war was for the MIC and your governments interest, not you the people. Blame your MIC for that.

The notion that scares me is that the USA may, sooner than later, grant the Europeans their wish of less American involvement ... but the EU won't be ready to fill the resulting power vacuum.

These power vacuums are, again, partly the US governments fault by instigating # all over the world, in the name of peace and democracy. It's also the MIC. It is a well known secret that the US gov. needs these wars to keep the machinery going. Support evil people for own interests, then paint them the evil guy they always were, overthrow, go into the country and rebuild. Rinse and repeat.

So, IMHO, when you write "grant the Europeans their wish of less American involvement" and EU not ready to fill the resulting power vacuum, at what point do you acknowledge that these power vacuums are mainly the US governments fault to begin with?

It is not honest to act like "Go fend for yourself, we grant your wish" when the wish is a direct result of the US governments behavior in the past? If we are overgeneralizing already, how about that?

If the world is a town and street US goes to instigate # in street XYZ, on the other side of the town to secure whatever interest street US has, and the rest of the streets neighboring XYZ complain about that to stop... and street US retreats leaving havoc, don't you see that saying "well fend your own" is a bit simple expressed and ignoring all the issues?

Did many European governments rely on the power the US projects? Of course! But then you also have to take into consideration that US abuses many countries in Europe for geopolitics. What would happen if Germany said "no" Rammstein and other bases where the US projects power?

So if you wait for the day the US let's us fend for ourselves, also acknowledge that much of the US power projection onto the rest of the world would fade. How about US missle defense systems on European land? What the US gov is doing with that is putting us into the bad guys scope, too.

It's all a bit one sided your arguing, ommitting a lot of the backbone of US power projection is on Europeans backs and resources. BTW Germany pays almost all costs for your bases here. There are official papers that proof that.

But now we really are far away from where we started, please go take my advice and check out the initial post of mine, before you came in sideways and down your tangent. Then you will understand why I call it a tangent, because you took my words out of context. Not with bad intent though, I do not think that. I rather think you got triggered by reading my comment and not taking the history of my posts here into context.

That's all I have to say about it, admittedly it was a lot.

a reply to: MoreCoyoteAngels

Well yea, sort of, they need their own border policies in place, they can't change their geographic location. Instead of taking suspected illegals and bussing them elsewhere making the problem much more widespread, why not bus them to border security? It's not a hard concept really.

Also the demographic change started a long time ago when people started fleeing places like the rust belt to the sunshine belt, bringing with them voting patterns, which for the most part didn't change much. You can't blame just California.

a reply to: strongfp

I dont feel like you have a good working knowledge of whats going on, or you would not have offered the 'take them to border security' is the solution.

Many of the people being bussed out of Texas were just released from 'border security' who they said the proper words to, about asylum, from the card they were given by activists. Once magic words are spoken, border security issues them a court date and other papers and releases them to a migrant housing facility or a hotel. From there, they get to go where they want. They are now legally in the US.

So here come Gov. Abbott and an offer for a bus ride to a sanctuary city. Well, they don't want to stay in a border town in Texas, no work! Too many immigrants! So they agree to get on the bus to the sanctuary state!

THat is exactly what is going on. Stay in Texas is bullcrap. They are free to roam about the country. Texas is just helping them.

a reply to: MoreCoyoteAngels

No, I do know what's going on down there. And you're making it out like they're scooping up illegals and shipping them around. So I suggested, as per your emotional rant to take them to border security.

The Biden admin made a promise to Venezuelan people they could seek asylum, those are the people who are being shipped around, and instead of them slowly trickling into the nation and being spread thin to assimilate quicker or get back on their feet to go back home one day, they're being rounded up and dumped in large groups in specific spots, where they'll just band together and not assimilate in their own separate paths.

All other illegals up until a few months ago couldn't even argue for asylum or refugee status because of article 42. I'm sure you've read my other posts ITT to see my arguments.

a reply to: ThatDamnDuckAgain

Your country has been subdued for over a century now. A once proud people now a shell of what they once were.

So bland. A mighty people forced to walk on eggshells for eternity.

As long as Germans remember to start each sentence with entschuldigung, they'll be "fine".

a reply to: strongfp

I didnt say a word about 'illegals'. I described to you what is happening in Eagle Pass Texas, El Paso Texas, San DIego CA, and various other Processing Centers.

The migrants are turning themselves in to 'border security'. You don't know that? Some are coming in by coyote, i.e. a cartel member is smuggling them, in a truck, or better even, in the fast pass lane and then they turn themselves in to 'border security'.

Some are just here the traditional, walk thru the desert and disappear way. Swim across the Rio Grande River way. But most are actually turning themselves in. Wearing wrist bands. Issued by the cartels. Color coded to show what they owe to the cartels.

My gosh you are clueless. Until you go around talking, get educated. Come to the border, I will show you the wall.

a reply to: strongfp

Do you know the town I was born and raised in has been declared a disaster area for a while now?

Because there are so many newly released migrants. In the shelters. In the hotels. Using the services. That Americans were using. Homeless or senior AMericans. It turns out that the us govt pays more for a hotel for a new asylum seeker than a poor senior. So seniors are being turned out in the street.

I stay in desert hotels alot. It is not unusual to see immigrants hanging around the hotels rooms and the pool and then before dawn, get on the bus and go someplace.... in CA, in AZ in NM. Same hotel, same bus... all over the SW.

How the hell is my little hometown near the border of 80,000 people supposed to house a 100,000 newcomers?

Please answer that in your fairy tale version of how things ought to be.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: MoreCoyoteAngels

The facts are the facts. Texas and Arizona ARE red states, and are bussing migrants to northern blue states, to "protest", agaisnt them.

That's not helping the problem now is it?

this IS helping the problem, because now the sanctuary states/cities like NY are crying foul and saying this is a bad idea.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Coelacanth55

Supporters of Niger's ruling junta hold a Russian flag at the start of a protest called to fight for the country's freedom and push back against foreign interference in Niamey, Niger, Thursday, Aug. 3, 2023. The march falls on the West African nation's independence day from its former colonial ruler, France, and as anti-French sentiment spikes, more than one week after mutinous soldiers ousted the country's democratically elected president

Seven coups in Africa in the last three years, and they all have the same markers and similar stories of how they started.

Where do you think all the refugees will want to go from the conflicts?

thehill.com...

wow.
everyone should read this.
thanks much for the linque.

The Niger coup represents another overthrow of democratic governments by army officers who are clearly connected to Russia through arms sales or ties to the Wagner military corporation, which we now know is directly subsidized by Putin and the Russian government. The coups in Niger, Sudan, Burkina Faso and Mali display an astonishing resemblance to each other.

a reply to: Coelacanth55

Suddenly the good Americans in NY are concerned about rampant unvetted immigration like the good Americans in the SW have been for decades.

Awareness of the problem is indeed the first step to change and resolution.

a reply to: MoreCoyoteAngels

You can give me all the personal stories in the world of what's going on down there. The bigger picture is what's causing it. And you clearly don't want to hear it. So here we are.

a reply to: Coelacanth55

It is a bad idea. And it's irresponsible, sanctuary states and cities will gladly take people thorugh normal processes, not have thousands dumped on their laps. It's honestly not their problem they don't live on the southern border, at least they're stepping up to lessen the blow.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Coelacanth55

It is a bad idea. And it's irresponsible, sanctuary states and cities will gladly take people through normal processes, not have thousands dumped on their laps. It's honestly not their problem they don't live on the southern border, at least they're stepping up to lessen the blow.

so at least you admit this uncontrolled influx is a problem.
if we'd built Trump's wall and said NO to these aliens, neither red nor blue would have a problem.

a reply to: ThatDamnDuckAgain

Hi Duck,

I can only partially agree with your comments. Yes, the USA has been involved in various military operations since World War II. But not all instigated by the USA. We didn't, for example, make North Korea invade South Korea in 1950, and, more recently, we didn't make Russia invade Ukraine. Again, I think you are broad-brushing here and downplaying the failures of Europe, in general, and Germany, specifically.

Sure, Angela was free to respond to a migrant crisis. But again, no one made her adopt the specific choices she opted for. Her response was extreme, which is kind of amusing, because the German government regularly condemns what it chooses to consider extreme politics.

Not sure how the EU not being ready for the "world stage" is the fault of the USA. Look: The EU has had a third of a century to react to the changes in the world since the end of the Cold War. The EU's reaction to that was unimpressive, and, as I mentioned, unrealistic. All that is on the EU and the European governments that are EU members ... not the USA.

BTW, the location is 'Ramstein' Saying 'no' to Ramstein would trigger a relocation of air assets and probably investment somewhere else in Europe to base air transport aircraft. Since we're on the topic, do Europeans resent the U.S. Navy keeping the world's shipping lanes open for commerce? I mean, honestly, if the EU wants to step up, they could build larger navies, select portions of the shipping lanes that interest them, and tell Washington, "we got this". Like I said, a third of a century to react ... and what-- it is all America's fault? I don't believe that.

As far as being 'on Europe's back', that notion is questionable. I can't speak for today, but I know during the Cold War, the U.S. forces were very serious about trying to avoid damage to German property, and when it occurred, the damage was compensated, with the process overseen by officers of the Bundeswehr. Add to that millions of Euros (probably tens of millions) of rent paid by U.S. personnel in Germany (at higher rates than Germans would have paid for the same property, but okay) ... and one sees the relationship is not so one-sided as some in Germany (I don't mean you) would like to depict.

Yes, you are correct, we are far off-topic. My initial comments were in response to the migrant situation in Europe being "mostly" a result of USA's foreign policy. Agree that may have been a precondition (in some cases), but the manner in which the challenge was met by Europe's leaders and policy makers was not driven by the USA.

FWIW, I am not of the opinion that 'Europe deserves' the migration crisis. What ordinary Europeans deserve is far better governance than they've gotten in the last 30-odd years.



Cheers

a reply to: Coelacanth55

There really isn't much of "influx" beyond what's the usual.

It's more to the point that right wing fear mongering doesn't seem to care about the influx of people wanting to live in the sunshine belt and then wanting cheap service jobs to cater to them causing a large influx of migrant workers.

Until we can agree that there's a humanitarian crisis down there, the former is just regular business for most American company's and corporations.

originally posted by: strongfp
a reply to: Coelacanth55

There really isn't much of "influx" beyond what's the usual.

www.cbsnews.com...

The number of migrants apprehended by U.S. immigration agents after crossing the southern border illegally has soared to near-record levels in September, posing a major test to the Biden administration's migration strategy, unpublished federal figures obtained by CBS News show.

Border Patrol agents apprehended roughly 140,000 migrants who crossed the U.S.-Mexico border without authorization during the first 20 days of September, an average of about 6,900 each day, according to the internal agency data. That represents a 60% increase from the daily average of 4,300 in July.

The agency is on track to record more than 210,000 migrant apprehensions this month, which would be the highest level since December and May 2022, when Border Patrol reported over 220,000 apprehensions, the current all-time monthly highs. During those record-setting months, Border Patrol apprehended more than 7,000 migrants each day, a level September's average is close to matching.

the numbers say the illegal immigration is higher than ever
as a result of Biden's open border policey.

a reply to: strongfp

I can tell you what is causing it. The SPANIARD government in Mexico keeping the native people of Mexico poor.

I suspect much the same has happened in the rest of Latin America as well. That tiny little border between Latin America and Mexico? They could close that little border easily. Why don't they?

It's not a US problem. Except at the border. Where poor come, and VERY VERY BAD come too.

Unless you are one of those that object to borders of any kind at all.

One world government with all the people free to roam about the world?

Whatever.....