California wants Midwest Water

a reply to: JAGStorm

California has nothing to offer, so the threat of no help from them is an empty one.

Hell no, you can't have our water! Go F yourselves. You wasted what was given to you. Now reap the rewards.

Maybe if California wasn't so sanctimonious while telling the rest of us how perfect they are and completely ignoring their own third world status ...

a reply to: TerryMcGuire

To me it seems easy to put all the blame on California but what was built in California on unsustainable practices was also built in Arizona and Nevada. Just because California is a predictable blue state and Arizona and Nevada swing states makes no difference on the expansionist building that has gone on there.

It's that whole region, also Colorado.

My relative just went to Las Vegas. The bottle of water in his room was $25 bucks. I don't know if that was a hotel scamy thing or just a Las Vegas thing.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Any supermarket chain with a DC is doing it, that's the model used for some time. Don't kid yourself that they are buying local, it costs much more.

Do you live here? No ok, then how would you know? I guarantee you corn bought and sold locally (yes even in grocery stores) is cheaper than anything shipped in.
I don't believe it is legal for them to label something locally grown if it is not.

originally posted by: ketsuko
Maybe if California wasn't so sanctimonious while telling the rest of us how perfect they are and completely ignoring their own third world status ...

EXACTLY. Maybe that is where some of the "hate" comes from.

Environment this, no gas mower that, battery cars, save this, save that etc, while they are swimming in olympic sized pools sipping Evian water. Then they want to tear up half the US trying to suck our fresh water. Screw them!

a reply to: TerryMcGuire

Is Arizona and Nevada wanting to get the US government to decimate other ecologies so they can decimate their own easier? If so, they can keep their hands off as well.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: JAGStorm
Do you live here? No ok, then how would you know?

Because supermarket chains would be unable to compete with others if they operated outside the existing model. I don't need to live there to know that they all have the exact same sourcing and distribution models as the ones in Tennessee or Wyoming.

I guarantee you corn bought and sold locally (yes even in grocery stores) is cheaper than anything shipped in.
I don't believe it is legal for them to label something locally grown if it is not.

Some locally grown corn is not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about all the produce NOT grown there which is going to be most of it. The product is kept in warehouses with inert gases which are then systematically 'ripened' when they need blueberries, tomatoes or bananas for example. You aren't getting locally grown fruit like that in Wisconsin during the winter, where do you think it all comes from?

If you want to understand how this came to be and why it is 100% the mainstream than pick up this book: The Secret Life of Groceries: The Dark Miracle of the American Supermarket.

a reply to: TheRedneck


I live in a desert climate twice as a child. I told my husband I absolutely will not live in the desert.
I'll deal with freezing cold winters.

All these places (California, Arizona, Colorado, Nevada)
are talking a Big game about the water crisis but are any of them actually doing anything?

www.azcentral.com... /

“We need significant action,” state Water Resources Director Tom Buschatzke said, “really significant action.”

Already, because of a federally declared shortage on the river, the Central Arizona Project is pumping only about two-thirds of what it once did through its canal to the Phoenix and Tucson areas. Forecasts for continuing declines in river storage at Lake Mead and Lake Powell suggest even deeper cuts over the next two years.

You will give up your water AND like it.

a reply to: JAGStorm

We have locally grown produce here as well. It comes from local small farmers. Individual store managers can allow a certain percentage of produce to be sold from local sources with corporate approval.

Ours is not really cheaper, though; it usually sells at a premium because people are willing to pay more for fresh food. The local hot sauce is worth it, btw.

TheRedneck

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

You aren't getting locally grown fruit like that in Wisconsin during the winter, where do you think it all comes from?

Did you see my other comment about how eating locally and SEASONALLY is probably the most environmentally correct thing we could do. Just because we aren't doing it now doesn't mean it isn't what we should be doing.
Do we really need Dragonfruit in the middle of winter in Wisconsin. NO and it's probably not healthy either.

Last time I was in California you had to pay for a glass of water when you're at a restaurant.

originally posted by: JAGStorm
Did you see my other comment about how eating locally and SEASONALLY is probably the most environmentally correct thing we could do.

I did, but guess what? No one GAF, that's why supermarkets exist in Wisconsin (and elsewhere) that need cheap produce from places not called 'Wisconsin' to survive.

People don't want to pay more for local or alter their diets to a seasonal one. Americans have been spoiled with the trifecta of abundance, convenience and low price. Try changing that mindset.

originally posted by: 1947boomer
a reply to: JAGStorm

It would make much more sense to pipe water from Alaska to California. This was studied in 1992 and is feasible but expensive. Alaska's governor at the time, Walter Hickel proposed it. Alaska has about 1/3 of all the runoff water of the entire US.
“Although there is no current or near-term demand for expensive water from Alaska, the possibility that such water might eventually be needed cannot be completely dismissed,” they wrote."

maybe this will help
interestingengineering.com...

newfangled tunnel / boring gadget

Using a high-speed configuration, Earthgrid says it can tunnel up to 1 kilometer (0.62 miles) per day, which is approximately 100 times faster than existing systems. As a point of reference, Elon Musk's Boring Company does roughly 0.24 km (0.15 miles) daily with its porpoising Prufrock mechanical tunneling machine. However, the Boring Company has stated it aims to eventually bore approximately 1.13 km (0.7 miles) per day with Prufrock.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus Americans have been spoiled with the trifecta of abundance, convenience and low price. Try changing that mindset.

Why?
Exactly why?

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

People don't want to pay more for local or alter their diets to a seasonal one. Americans have been spoiled with the trifecta of abundance, convenience and low price. Try changing that mindset.

Guess what, things change and we adapt.
I grew up at a time where you could have an open beer in a car and not wear a seat belt, heck some cars didn't have seat belts. People smoked everywhere including at work inside!
Things change, some people will grumble about it. Sometimes changing the mindset isn't up to us, it is something we just have to deal with. This will probably be one of them. Ps. I love the smoking bans, hated indoor smoke so much!!!

My guess is some people will move out of those regions. Some things will be done to conserve and restrictions will be in place (some already have them) and there will probably be reaches for water from other places. It's probably not a one solution thing. It is just my opinion that robbing Peter to pay Paul isn't a good thing.

originally posted by: burntheships
Why?
Exactly why?

Why what?

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Why do you have to insult people to get your point across? Leave the name-calling out of it.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Why are Americans "spoiled" as you claimed?
Why should they change, as you chided?

originally posted by: JAGStorm
I grew up at a time where you could have an open beer in a car and not wear a seat belt, heck some cars didn't have seat belts. People smoked everywhere including at work inside!

That's nice but I don't see the relevance. Buying local, and I try to buy as much of our food locally as I can, is not cheap and it's often not as easy.

People like the convenience of going to one place, loading up on everything they want (not need) and pay as little as possible for it. That isn't changing because of feelz.