Why are atheist so angry with God?

originally posted by: neoholographic
Here it is again...

Like joecroft said, they never cited any verses. They replied to GoShredAK in regards to my post about the book of Job.

You seem to still be missing the point, a parent doesn't have to hire or arrange for shady characters to interact with their kids to teach them.

originally posted by: daskakik

You seem to still be missing the point, a parent doesn't have to hire or arrange for shady characters to interact with their kids to teach them.

When a dad puts their kid in accelerated courses or sports leagues, that challenge is considered a good thing. The result is a more capable soul. We are not put through trials that are beyond our means to prevail.

God is omniscient. The more we embrace the flow of this omniscience, the more river-like (effective and graceful) we become.

originally posted by: cooperton
When a dad puts their kid in accelerated courses or sports leagues, that challenge is considered a good thing.

Again, missing the plot hole because putting your kid in accelerated courses or sports leagues is not knowingly placing them in the hands of someone that you think needs to be destroyed.

If someone even heard a rumor that a teacher or coach was questionable they would take their kids out of there pretty quick.

Also, if the kid doesn't do that well they don't disown them. No loving parent would do that.

originally posted by: daskakik

Again, missing the plot hole because putting your kid in accelerated courses or sports leagues is not knowingly placing them in the hands of someone that you think needs to be destroyed.

You never played travel/AAU athletics then... the challenge of going against better competition is much more beneficial than being unchallenged.

The point isn't to destroy the kid, it's to challenge them. Unless you know a verse where God desires to destroy His children? (There isn't such a verse)

If someone even heard a rumor that a teacher or coach was questionable they would take their kids out of there pretty quick.

A bad coach will not challenge their players enough.

Also, if the kid doesn't do that well they don't disown them. No loving parent would do that.

If a kid is unrepentantly addicted to drugs there's nothing a Dad can do, granted the child maintains their free will. How many times can a Dad give their drug-addicted son money until they have to cut the tie??

originally posted by: cooperton
You never played travel/AAU athletics then... the challenge of going against better competition is much more beneficial than being unchallenged

A bad coach will not challenge their players enough.

In my example I was hinting more of sexual scandal type bad with the kids, not just not challenging them enough.

If a kid is unrepentantly addicted to drugs there's nothing a Dad can do, granted the child maintains their free will. How many times can a Dad give their drug-addicted son money until they have to cut the tie??

It is telling how in your coach examples the coach, which in the bible is satan, seem to be ok people and here the kid is a drug addict.

You don't hire a known pedophile to babysit your kids and them blame the kids for being molested.

originally posted by: daskakik

In my example I was hinting more of sexual scandal type bad with the kids, not just not challenging them enough.

What did Jesus do?

a reply to: cooperton
According to the story, he, along with the father and the holy spirit, let it all happen before coming to earth.

You don't need to put your children in the hands of a demon to have them learn basic life lessons. Life is challenging enough for most people to take away a lot of understanding.

That wasn't enough for the writers of Job because they wanted to tell those going through a rough patch to not lose faith because they will prosper in the end even when god sets satan loose on them. Maybe the intention was good but the plot has a hole in it because no loving parent would do that. It isn't rocket science.

a reply to: daskakik

You said:

You seem to still be missing the point, a parent doesn't have to hire or arrange for shady characters to interact with their kids to teach them.

You keep making up things and then say it's a plot hole because a God that people say doesn't exist doesn't act like you think He should act. Can't you see how illogical that is?

You said God and satan were best friends.

You said God should have felt betrayed like you would feel betrayed.

You're now saying God hired someone.

You haven't provided one verse to support what you're saying.

How is it a plot hole because God doesn't react like you would? That makes no sense.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: cooperton

You don't need to put your children in the hands of a demon to have them learn basic life lessons.

What if your kid chooses the step-dad over his real Dad? The kid is choosing the demon over righteousness. The kid puts himself in the hands of a demon by his own free will

originally posted by: neoholographic
You said God and satan were best friends.

No, I said they chit chatted like they were friends

You said God should have felt betrayed like you would feel betrayed.

No, I said the bible says satan was cast out off heaven and is going to end up into a bottomless fiery pit. Seems to me god felt something similar to betrayal, otherwise why the punishment, but before that he chit chats with satan.

How is it a plot hole because God doesn't react like you would? That makes no sense.

That is your bias not letting you see what I have pointed out.

a reply to: cooperton
The kid didn't choose the step dad that was the mom and it doesn't necessarily make the guy a demon.

Technically we don't even know if demons exist, it is just part of your story and I'm telling you why I think that part doesn't make sense unless you are a human writer trying to scare some people to bend to your will and that isn't all that far fetched, taking into account human history.

a reply to: daskakik

Again, you're saying the plot hole is that God didn't react in the way that you would react. Here's what a plot hole means:

plot hole
Learn to pronounce
noun
an inconsistency in the narrative or character development of a book, film, television show, etc.

Tell me, how is there a plot hole because God doesn't act how you would react?

That's not a plot hole.

originally posted by: neoholographic
Again, you're saying the plot hole is that God didn't react in the way that you would react.

No, I'm saying that one part of the bible says he reacted one way and another shows the opposite and that is a perfect fit for the definition you posted.

It has nothing to do with how I would react.

ETA: Of course, I have also made the comparison to how human parents act with their children. Logically a more "perfect" parent would act even better but even us flawed humans don't act like this.

a reply to: daskakik

You did. You said:

No, I'm saying that one part of the bible says he reacted one way and another shows the opposite and that is a perfect fit for the definition you posted.

You made the claim that God and satan were best friends. You said:

You said the serpent in eden was satan, created by god and, apparently a close friend. He is tasked with tempting the new creation and they fail.

I have to post what you said because you're now lying about it.

You're saying there's a plot hole because God and satan were close friends and God should have felt betrayed like you would.

How is a plot hole because God doesn't react like you think He should react?

a reply to: neoholographic
Close friends isn't best friends and it is a euphemism implying they are working together.

You are trying so hard to play down this simple fact.

a reply to: daskakik

Again, you're just making it up as you go.

Where does it say they were close friends and working together? What verse?

You can't see how illogical this is? You're saying it's a plot hole because you conjured up in your mind a scenario where God and satan were close friends who were working together so God should have felt betrayed by satan. It makes no sense.

You're making up a scenario that has no basis in fact and saying a God, that people say doesn't exist, should respond a certain way according to your make believe scenario and if He doesn't it's a plot hole.

a reply to: neoholographic
No man, I noticed it 36 years ago.

God allowing satan to temp humanity to separate the wheat from the chaff isn't satan working for god?

In the story of Job god even lays down the rules. Do whatever you want but don't touch him so he killed his sons and daughters. No biggie right, its satan and he told him what he could and couldn't do, so it is all okie dokie.

You're making up a scenario that has no basis in fact and saying a God that that people say doesn't exist, should respond a certain way...

No, I'm saying that other parts of the bible says he is a jealous god and that he acts a certain way and in this book he sits with the being who in other parts of the bible is depicted as his mortal enemy but just shoots the breeze with him and makes a friendly wager, at the expense of Job.

I'll cop to saying that by decent human standards that move was an a-hole move by god.

You don't like it? What can I say it is what it looked like to me then and still looks the same way today.

a reply to: daskakik

Again, you said it was a plot hole.

This is why you tried to make it look like God and satan were close friends working together. So God should feel betrayed.

Where's the plot hole?

All you're saying is God did something you don't agree with but so what? That's not a plot hole. Why should God react and behave according to the way you think?

You said:

God allowing satan to temp humanity to separate the wheat from the chaff isn't satan working for god?

What verse says that God is allowing satan to tempt humanity to separate the wheat from the chaff?

a reply to: neoholographic

Originally posted by neoholographic
Again, you asked and it was answered. The NIV says a lot of different things and it leaves stuff out. This is why I included the very next verse. Paul was talking to Christians.

1 Peter 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

He's specifically talking about afflictians. He's telling them to be steadfast in their faith because other Christians are going through the same thing.

But my question about the “plot hole” isn't talking about people being psychically afflicted…You’re answering with a straw man solution…and thereby totally bypassing the question…

My question is about Satan being aloud to Roam around the Earth and deceiving people with lies, which in turn affects peoples Souls…which includes Atheists…and most likely some Christians as well…

Those verses that you initially brought up …i.e. 1 Peter 5:8…uses the word “whom”…and NIV version uses the word “someone”… which clearly suggests that’s it’s not just talking about Christians, that Satan is looking to devour…

If that verse was just talking about believers and Christians, they would have made that clearer in the verse.

And just for the record, I never brought up any verses Pryor to my last post…I only responded too and quoted those verses (1 Peter 5:8) that you initially brought up…

Originally posted by neoholographic
This is why I talked about Paul and the thorn in his flesh.

Does satan seek to devour atheists in the same way? No and in the context you mentioned, he was talking about Christians being afflicted. Why would satan afflict Richard Dawkins in the same way he does a Christian? He wants Dawkins writing more books and getting into more debates trashing God.

Again…the context of my question isn’t about psychical afflictions being dished out by Satan…

The context is about Souls being deceived and how they are at risk…Hence why I used the phrase “Souls are on the line”… the context couldn’t be any clearer..

Here’s that part of my post again just for reference…

Originally posted by Joecroft
The “plot hole” is that Satan is supposedly being aloud to roam around freely harming people. Peoples Souls are on the line!...

The thing is, people’s souls could still be on the line with free will (freedom) choice still being present…without the need for some big evil entity making things worse…God is all about saving Souls…but supposedly lets this evil entity roam around freely to devour souls and tempt people etc…

Also it kind of gives people an out…”Satan made me do it“..for example…

- JC

originally posted by: neoholographic
All you're saying is God did something you don't agree with but so what? That's not a plot hole. Why should God react and behave according to the way you think?

No, I said it was inconsistent with what we are told his reactions are in other parts of the story.

God allowing satan to temp humanity to separate the wheat from the chaff isn't satan working for god?

What verse says that God is allowing satan to tempt humanity to separate the wheat from the chaff?

What was the point of satan testing Job or tempting Jesus?

Are you implying the tempter of the world, satan, isn't doing his job?