Abortion and Responsibilties That Follow

originally posted by: Seamrog
a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Nope, whine all you want - my point stands with or without God.

You have no consideration for the right of a defenseless child to breathe.

I do.

Ah and here you are on your moral soapbox. Does it feel good up there?

Pretending you know what my thought processes are, or how I morally stand. Nope, I support a woman's right to choose. So I'm an evil harlot speaking from my serpents tongue. Hey, I have this apple here. Wanna take a bite?

We're done talking. I have no more desire to spend any effort executing keystrokes directed at you. From this thread, to threads on marriage equality, to threads on transgenders, you've proven time and time again that you're a woman-hating, holier-than-thou, mouth breathing bigot with absolutely nothing of value to add to any conversation you participate in other than parroting what a preacher or Fox News told you.

People like you make me long for an ignore button.

Your flimsy set of morals that somehow praises the killing of gays and heathens, and you think YOU have the moral authority to tell me what I can do with my own body? Hah. I'm glad men like you don't run the Country. You're so afraid of a Caliphate in the middle east that you're blind to the one you wish would happen here. Only, it would have a different name.

Good bye.

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: Seamrog
well according to "God's Law" women are to be subservient to the men, so well where do you get off saying that the women shouldn't be having sex if she didn't want to have kids....

You are either not educated on the rest of the verse, or you are purposely ignorant of it.

Assuming the prior, husbands are commanded to love their wives as Christ loves his Church.

Do you understand what that means? Do you have any idea?

a reply to: Seamrog

so how do you propose that we determine which is a matter of convenience and which is valid????
or are you just saying that it's such a small minority they don't matter?
it's the women's body, it is them that is being asked to make the greatest sacrifice to bring this new life in the world...
who in hades name are you to decide if that sacrifice is too great for them or not, or the government's, or a court.

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun

Ah and here you are on your moral soapbox. Does it feel good up there?

When it regards defending human life, yes, it feels good. I cannot imagine how it must feel to defend and celebrate the 'right' to murder children.

Good bye.

Good riddance.

a reply to: Seamrog

lol....oh ya...
but for some reason today...
many seem to see love and sex as being the same!!!
and well, tell me where in the bible does it tell the women that she doesn't have to be this subservient, obedient creature when the man has a temporary setback of selfishness and well demands what he wants instead of what is best for his wife?

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

great point.
youre too young to consent to sex but since you had it and got knocked up, now you MUST carry it to term so your parents can raise that child as well.

Since no one has come up with any sensible solution to take care of unwanted children that would come from a ban on abortion then I guess we are stuck with the same ole same ole.


The only thing I could come up with was raise taxes and build more orphanages, but I don't think that many of the people who would make laws against abortion would go for it.

a reply to: grimpachi
ya, cutting off the social security from the elderly could be a more pleasing option to them but well the gov't already depleted their reserves...
hey I know we could bring back child labor and force the kids to start being productive around six years of age,

This is solely my opinion and in no way should be taken as anything but...

As always, I base my arguments on the premise of two consenting adults that decide to engage in sexual activities. I don't have the answers to rape or children who are pregnant for whatever reason. It might make me hypocritical in that I separate those circumstances out and a fetus is a fetus. That's fine and I accept that. I'm not trying to detract from the importance that rape, incest, and child pregnancies play, but those circumstances occur far less when compared with consensual adults.

When two adults of the opposite sex decide to engage in intercourse, they inherently take on the possibility that the female may become pregnant. Outside of sterility or infertility, there is never a way to completely remove the chance of a pregnancy. Yes contraceptives are very effective, and condoms as well, they are not fool proof. Regardless of the measures taken prior to intercourse, the possibility of it resulting in a pregnancy should be taken into consideration.

Should intercourse lead to a pregnancy, it's no longer about the man or the woman. They have created a life that deserves the right to life regardless or the irresponsibility of the parents. It's not about a woman's right to choose anymore. The woman had the choice to not engage in sexual activity just as the man did. This whole topic is about more than just women's rights. This is about the right to life of the unborn. The unborn does not know of their parents irresponsibility. The unborn do not know of actions and consequences. Why allow the unborn to pay with their life because of the actions of their parents?

I've seen the question come up a few times about who should be forced to care for the child if the child is unwanted. The solution is simple. In the same way a parent can be held liable for child support, child support can be required of the parents to go to the state or the child's foster parents.

Long story short, there are too many options available outside of abortion. To be blunt, our apathy towards those with no voice is rotting us from the inside out.

a reply to: grimpachi

I've posted the solution twice in this thread, one just a moments ago. I've also said the same solution in several other threads over the past couple of years.

If we can require that child support be paid by a father or mother to the parent that has custody, child support can be paid to the state to render care until adoption.

a reply to: EternalSolace

you do know that millions of dollars worth or child support does NOT get paid every year even though it is required.

perfect example of why these solutions really wont work.

we will just force them...just like people are forced to pay child support.

thats a crock. there are dudes out there that dodge work. work under the table. do anything possible to avoid paying what they are ordered to pay. license suspensions....

so forcing them to pay or care for their kids, really does not do anything to solve the problem

so john doe dead beat had a court order to pay support. but
he does not work. maybe he mooches off his new momma. whatever.
what is the solution to that problem?

a reply to: EternalSolace

Great idea

How is that child support going with the current cases? Are they all living up to their responsibilities?


What do you propose happen for the ones who don't pay? If you say prison then try to keep in mind that would cost the taxpayer more money than paying for the upbringing of a child and there would still be the cost of the child.

What are your solutions?

a reply to: grimpachi

there is the dreaded license suspension.

there is even ways around that.
i know in this state they run a forgiveness day twice per year. it is printed in the paper.

for all the people who have had their licenses suspended for not paying, on this special day all they have to do is make 1 payments equal to 1 months obligation, plus 1 dollar and they get their license back.

i never did understand that.

even with the license suspensions. in the end it does nothing to help and just costs more time and money cause people drive anyway. then they get popped for it and go to court. then they are ordered to pay x amount in fines and they dont. then they still drive.

yeah, great solution

and if the pregnant mom happens to be working in a job that she will not be able to do while pregnant and ends up losing it, will the dad have to pitch in financially to replace at least half of the money she has lost? heck, I don't know maybe she is a printer and can't be around the ink fumes!

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun
a reply to: beezzer

Talk all you want about how horrible a person I am. I don't care.

I just want you to answer the question the OP posed. What do we do with all these unwanted children?

Why should it be my decision?

Just because someone doesn't want the responsibility, it automatically becomes MY RESPONSIBILITY?

Why not stop passing the damned buck and become responsible, endorse responsibility?

Some people view abortion as the responsible thing to do considering their financial status and wellbeing. You decry people being irresponsible then advocate for taking their choices away.

Justifying murder doesn't take away the fact that it's murder.

Paint a f###ing flower on it and call it art, it's still murder.

that's your opinion, not the law of the land. a fetus is not a separate human being. it is attached inside directly to it's mother, as a part of her own body.....look to the tumultuous arguments of Roe v. Wade

originally posted by: EternalSolace
a reply to: grimpachi

I've posted the solution twice in this thread, one just a moments ago. I've also said the same solution in several other threads over the past couple of years.

If we can require that child support be paid by a father or mother to the parent that has custody, child support can be paid to the state to render care until adoption.

your going to need bigger jails

originally posted by: jimmyx

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun
a reply to: beezzer

Talk all you want about how horrible a person I am. I don't care.

I just want you to answer the question the OP posed. What do we do with all these unwanted children?

Why should it be my decision?

Just because someone doesn't want the responsibility, it automatically becomes MY RESPONSIBILITY?

Why not stop passing the damned buck and become responsible, endorse responsibility?

Some people view abortion as the responsible thing to do considering their financial status and wellbeing. You decry people being irresponsible then advocate for taking their choices away.

Justifying murder doesn't take away the fact that it's murder.

Paint a f###ing flower on it and call it art, it's still murder.

that's your opinion, not the law of the land. a fetus is not a separate human being. it is attached inside directly to it's mother, as a part of her own body.....look to the tumultuous arguments of Roe v. Wade

Siamese twins are attached, but they are separate individuals.

a reply to: beezzer

and quite often one is sacrificed so that the other can have a chance at a life of decent quality!

a reply to: dawnstar

There are health risks using an IUD, not sure about concerns with other conditions causing problems. With HIPAA laws, could they even consult the child's doctor? The parent's knowledge of the IUD is ZERO. No consent, no information. Even if they gave the child info about side effects to watch for, would an 11 year old really pay that much attention?

Of course the parent's will bear the responsibility, and the schools will have their lawyers to explain away any culpability on their part. Even an abortion for an 11 year old without parental consent, is way too risky to allow. My hope is this would never be allowed, but I'm not convinced this would be too far to go by some.

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: beezzer

and quite often one is sacrificed so that the other can have a chance at a life of decent quality!

YAY!

And quite often they are separated and both get to live!

Or some stay conjoined forever.

But both are independent humans with full rights.