Abortion and Responsibilties That Follow

a reply to: retiredTxn

that is my major problem with schools doing crap like this, I would be afraid something would go wrong and well it would leave the uninformed parents in the dark too long and cause major damage or death to their kid. Heck with the parental right to deny the girl an abortion or birth control, or whatever else many seem to find offensive. they are risking the health and well being of the child by not informing the parents of some major medical treatment that they provided the kid!

Ok, so what we have here is a bunch of broken record "Do as I say, because my morals trump yours!"

Nawp, it doesn't work that way, unless you want to take full responsibility for the aftermath of forcing your morals on others. That means taking full responsibility for the babies no one wants or can/should have medically. That's the bare bones of it, people. If you're going to take the freedom of choice from someone because you don't like their choice, you're also stepping up to the plate to takeover as parent if they desire not to be or cannot be. There is no way around that in a logical debate, because it is the logical course of action that should follow. "You don't want it, but we want it to be alive, so we'll take that baby, kthxbai." That's how abortion opponents SHOULD operate. Then again, knee-jerk reactions don't always pair up with logic, do they?

If you're going to meddle in the private affairs of someone else, you damn well better be willing to be more than just a mouth piece.

a reply to: beezzer
so let's assume that the majority can be separated safely and both can live happy lives...
does that mean that we should try to preserve all of them even when we know that by doing so in some cases we are condemning some who would live otherwise to die?
in those cases where only one can be saved, how do they chose which one it is? do they go about it by deciding which one is the strongest and more likely to survive? and well are their rights considered equal if they do this?

Like I said before fellas.
Nowt to do with us.
Maybe we all should let the ladies decide everything about abortion.
They are the ones who can do it or not.

Solutions... let me see here:

Close the border, kick out the illegals. Spend tax money on the unwanted babies.
End foreign aid. Spend tax money on the unwanted babies.
Disband the IRS, Homeland Security, US Dept. of Education, TSA. Spend tax money on unwanted babies.
Bring manufacturing jobs back to the US. Get people off the welfare bandwagon. Spend tax money on unwanted babies.
Quit blowing billions on failed companies like Solyndra. Spend tax money on unwanted babies.

I mean, we've got all the tax money in the world to spend on the 11 million illegal immigrants and their children in the US. But nope, who's going to pay for the 1 million aborted children? Because we sure can't afford that.

The solution is clear. Just abort them. They're all unwanted anyway.

a reply to: EternalSolace

heck if they did just a few things in that list, they'd probably make alot of unwanted babies wanted!!!

a reply to: EternalSolace

Do you spend tax money on forcing the women to carry out the pregnancy?.
Camps maybe?.

a reply to: EternalSolace

Just a few questions because your solution seems to be fatally flawed.


Will it not cost a lot of tax money to close the border and kick out all of the illegals?

If you disband the IRS where are you going to get the money to kick out the illegals, close the border, and pay for the unwanted babies?

a reply to: grimpachi

Would it cost more tax money to close the border and kick them out than it would to continually support more and more illegal immigrants in the long run?

Abolishing the IRS is not equivalent to abolishing taxes. Is there really a need for a 74,000 page tax code? No. Not when a flat tax or something similar would do.

The only thing that is flawed is the picking apart of any solution that's offered except to abort.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: EternalSolace

Do you spend tax money on forcing the women to carry out the pregnancy?.
Camps maybe?.

I sure didn't spend money to force any women to go out and have sex either. I'm pretty sure not engaging in intercourse is an option too.

a reply to: EternalSolace
but I kind of think that maybe, just maybe that it might be more effective to make it more pleasant for making women want to keep their unborn children instead of forcing them to carry it and then penalize them for over 18 years for the kid's support. so well why do women not want to keep these babies to begin with?

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: EternalSolace
but I kind of think that maybe, just maybe that it might be more effective to make it more pleasant for making women want to keep their unborn children instead of forcing them to carry it and then penalize them for over 18 years for the kid's support.

Agreed.

so well why do women not want to keep these babies to begin with?

No idea. Ill-prepared? No desire or lack of maturity to be responsible for another human life? I've really no idea.

a reply to: EternalSolace

If you abolish the IRS who collects the taxes? Would you create another agency to collect them or will it all be on an honor system?

As far as immigration it costs tax money to kick them out and even more to keep them out. ATM it costs 12 billion, but as you know it doesn't stop immigrants from illegally crossing so how much more it would cost to actually put an end to it I can only imagine. You have considered that correct?

BTW as you said we already have about 11 million immigrants so after you kick them out within 11 years of extra births we will have 11 million extra children to feed at the point we will break about even but 6 years down the line we need to prepare for the unwanted births of that first generation so instead of taking care of 17 million it will start increasing. Maybe even faster than that with some of the 15 years olds.


Have you really thought any of this through or are you just hoping for the best of all possible situations?

a reply to: EternalSolace
oh and you don't think that loss of earning power plays into it in any way?

a reply to: EternalSolace

Maybe just spend decent money on education all around I think.
Feck it raise taxes to give all our kids a better education and that includes sex education Iam willing to pay a couple of pence per pound to go towards better education.
Free condoms free contraceptives also.
But we should never outlaw abortion for those who need it.
It is their choice you just can not force anyone to go through a pregnancy, at least let them have it in a safe environment with educational services provided.

a reply to: grimpachi

Now you're just nitpicking and trying to detract from the topic at hand.

Fine, I'll play along one more time. I couldn't bother to find an up to date number. But Best Places to Work has the IRS workforce at around 75,000 in 2015. Sure, you can't abolish the entirety of the IRS. But I'm willing to bet that workforce could be cut by two thirds with a simplified tax code. But alas, this off topic.

11 million immigrants and around 700,000 coming each year. Half are female the other half male. Each couple has a child. 11,550,000. Plus 700,000 in ten years = 18,550,000.

1 million babies each year for ten years is 10,000,000.

I'm too tired to figure in all the exponential increases. But even without it, it doesn't take much to see the illegal immigrant route costs more.

All that said, at least I'm attempting to come up with solutions that doesn't include aborting unwanted children because their parents were irresponsible. What's your solution?

a reply to: boymonkey74

I can agree with you on most of what you've posted. I don't mind my tax money being spent toward a child's education, including sex education either. Free condoms and free contraceptives... sure, why not?

What I cannot agree with is abortion as a form of birth control.

You claim that it's their choice not to go through with a pregnancy. On the flip side, it was their choice not to engage in a sexual activity that runs the risk of pregnancy. The unborn shouldn't be punished as a result of something they had no choice in.

originally posted by: EternalSolace

No idea. Ill-prepared? No desire or lack of maturity to be responsible for another human life? I've really no idea.

Maybe this has something to do with it.



PEW Research

9% of children raised in single parent households in 1960, primarily women as the head of household.
34% of children raised in single parent households in 2013, again, primarily women as head of household.

Without abortion being an alternative, regardless how you or I feel about it, what would that number be today? How many of these women would be destined to live a life where they are paid less, have to pay more for childcare, and lose the ability to raise the children they already have?

a reply to: retiredTxn

What it comes down to is the destruction of the family unit and the shift from sexual intercourse as a tool to procreate to a tool for recreational pleasure. Why should the unborn be forced to give up their life for the mistakes of their parents? What do they know of paychecks, childcare, and siblings? It's irresponsibility at its finest.

a reply to: EternalSolace

Now you're just nitpicking and trying to detract from the topic at hand.

No, I am being serious about this. This is a complicated issue that if there is a solution needs to be well thought out.

Your solutions create even more problems.

You say close the borders well that easier said than done. In fact that has been an issue for quite a while and needs a solution yet you are not offering any solutions to it. You act like it is simple as puting up a sign that says "stay out" however it is anything, but simple.

If you are not willing to actually explain how your so-called solutions will work then you are simply giving lip service.

Kicking out immigrants doesn't seem like it will solve the problem of unwanted children, but I am willing to hear you out if you have a viable solution to both taking care of the children and removing the illegals.

If there was an easy answer we wouldn't be on page 15 with me still asking for solutions.

All that said, at least I'm attempting to come up with solutions that doesn't include aborting unwanted children because their parents were irresponsible. What's your solution?

I already gave a solution. Raise taxes and build more orphanages. We would also need to build more prisons and juvies as a result, but it is doable.

Your solutions would cause even more complications in every sector and we would still need to build more orphanages, prisons, and juvies.


Edit

We will need more schools and quality teachers or we are certain to need even more prisons, juvies, and orphanages.