The Confederate flag should be taken down and burned.

a reply to: beezzer

I don't think it should be

There

originally posted by: zazzafrazz

originally posted by: beezzer


I'm simply trying to find an equivalent that focuses on why people want to ban the confederate flag.

You think a play and a flag of representation over a government building are equivalent ?

It is a novel that has been the subject of banning because of it's reflection of slavery, it's use of certain words.

It, in itself, does not enslave people.

Neither does that flag.

It, both, are simply symbols and reflections of history.

a reply to: jimmyx

Exactly. Sometimes people that want to use labels and slurs against a group of people and are unable to, use the excuse of the rise of PC (politically correct).

They just don't want to concede the fact that their language (as in example) is offensive to certain groups, hence the reason why they use it.

Yes, a majority of black people find the confederate flag offensive. Lindsey Graham had a remarkable moment of clarity, when he suggested removing it and placing it in a museum (where it should be).

People don't realize that the South did not want to get rid of the institution known as slavery, not all at, so they seeded from the nation. Yes, they did it because of money but if they were willing to free and pay their employees at that point, this nation would have had a vastly different course of history.

The confederate flag is a symbol of failed fledgling nation hell bent on keeping a group of people in perpetual bondage due to it's reliance on the same group for it's economic power and prosperity.

a reply to: beezzer

It's not brandished at a legislative building either.

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

Interestingly enough...not to burn the flag would be a sign of disrespect. Even the Stars and Stripes...if it is taken down to be disposed of, should be burned. Flag etiquette, dontcha know?

That's not the kind of burning we're talking about here, and you know it.

I don't give two s# about "flag etiquette". My point is that while these idiots are out burning flags, the problems we have go unaddressed. All it does is make the burner feel better about himself. Yippee. More emotional self-gratification that accomplishes nothing.

But. Go ahead and nitpick the "flag rules"--an equally disappointing waste of time.

a reply to: beezzer

That doesn't tell anyone they are equivalent.
That tells me they have connections to slavery, as did 3/4s of Charleston, should that then include all the plantation homes, the market place, the docks... everything now becomes and equivalent of the confederate flag?, i.e. a flag is a representation of ideology and governance.
NO
They are NOT the flag of representation of policy and ideology of a state flown over a government building.

There is no equivalence between them, one is a historical record, one is a representative of the states current ideals and identities of who they represent.

originally posted by: zazzafrazz
a reply to: beezzer

That doesn't tell anyone they are equivalent.
That tells me they have connections to slavery, as did 3/4s of Charleston, should that then include all the plantation homes, the market place, the docks... everything now becomes and equivalent of the confederate flag?, i.e. a flag is a representation of ideology and governance.
NO
They are NOT the flag of representation of policy and ideology of a state flown over a government building.

There is no equivalence between them, one is a historical record, one is a representative of the states current ideals and identities of who they represent.

Not sure I understand.

So anyone who doesn't want to ban the flag is racist?

originally posted by: Darkmind
a reply to: yuppa

No, slavery did not 'suck'. That word does not even come close to summarising the kind of life that a slave led. They could be beaten on a whim, killed at the drop of a hat, sold at a moment's notice, worked to death over time, have to put up with having their spouse or children dragged away and sold.... the list is endless. When people try to equate modern life and federal overreach with the kind of slavery that existed before the Civil War they have no idea what they are talking about.

I say "SUCKED" because i cant use anything really terrible here on ATS. You do know there were plenty of White slaves too right?

DO NOT FORGET MOST SLAVES WERE SOLD BY THEIR OWN ETHNICITIES AND THEY DID THE CAPTURING AND BRINGING THEM TO MARKET.(caps for emphasis only) SO africa needs to give up its flags too. Oh and dont forget the British and Arabians. Its just a peice of history and not meaning anything not depicted.

a reply to: beezzer

Not sure I understand.

So anyone who doesn't want to ban the flag is racist?

How do you get that from my words?

Anywhere in there...at all does it say that....

Anywhere?

Nah you don't see it in that post because you made it up , kinda what people do when they run out of arguemnt,

I'll explain again.
One is a historical document not plastered over a government building as the representative "flag" of ideology of the government and the people they govern.

They are not equivalent.

a reply to: beezzer

Anyone that supports restrictions of flag display (to put it nicely) cannot truly support free expression, in my humble opinion.

Before I forget - this is beneath you

I think

a reply to: yuppa

DO NOT FORGET MOST SLAVES WERE SOLD BY THEIR OWN ETHNICITIES AND THEY DID THE CAPTURING AND BRINGING THEM TO MARKET

Yes... therefore completely justifying BUYING them and keeping them in chains, forcing them to do manual labor, beating them, whipping them. It's all okay because their own kind sold them in the first place... /s

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

I'm doubtful myself because I think that anyone that supports flying that flag or any variation thereof at government buildings doesn't truly support freedom. Tradition seems to matter more.

There is a process in which the people of a given state can address their grievences and get the flag removed.

Perhaps that should be attempted.

Personally;

I'm against banning of flags.
I'm against banning of books.
I'm against policing of free speech.

It's father's day and I'm going to retire from this joyful little thread and read a "book" before someone dislikes it and tries to ban it. (It's in a series)

Have a great day.

:-)

Using this same logic every Native American tribe in the US could demand the United States flag be taken down. It represents a government that treated them as subhuman, slaughtered many of their people and removed them from their historical lands.

Why is it the Native Americans can get over that but others can't get over the Confederate flag?

People equate this Confederate flag business with poking a hornet's nest with a stick.
It's just one more distraction to keep us arguing while the control grid goes up all around us.
TPP or Jade Helm anyone? Eurozone bail-ins? Greek default?

We really should be focusing on the larger problems at hand, imo of course.

ATS fathers I wish you all a happy father's day!

a reply to: zazzafrazz

Huckleberry Finn was a novel written by Samuel Clemens, also known as Mark Twain. It's the story of an Irish-American boy named Huckleberry Finn, and a former slave named Jim...and their adventures. It was a sequel of sorts to Tom Sawyer.

It very accurately portrayed the language, and societal mores of the post civil war South.

It's one of the books that appears on many a "these need to be banned" lists. It happened not too long ago here where I live...it failed spectacularly. Thank God...

Hope that helps?

a reply to: beezzer

There is a process in which the people of a given state can address their grievences and get the flag removed. Perhaps that should be attempted.

Is that not what people are doing this very moment while you sit there and state that it's wrong of them to do so?

a reply to: Kali74

m doubtful myself because I think that anyone that supports flying that flag or any variation thereof at government buildings doesn't truly support freedom. Tradition seems to matter more.

Absolutely. There was no mistaking that allusion

When people start attacking your patriotism - you know what comes next

This isn't about freedom of speech - it's a duck blind

No respect or tolerance for that kind of BS - none at all

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

South Carolina will, without a doubt, have this discussion over the next few months. As they've done in the past.

Who knows, it might even make it onto the ballot, or the legislature might have the two-thirds votes necessary to remove it.

That's the way it should work. Not just a knee jerk reaction. Do it the right way...

How is asking for that an attack on patriotism? Or a duck blind?

It is reminiscent in a way of ISIS destroying ancient artifacts and archaeological sites they find evil. or book burning, the flag means different things to different people.

Doesn't mean anything to me, but it does remind me of ISIS, or burning rock and roll records back in the day.

a reply to: seagull

Thank you.
Believe it or not, in OZ we had it in our reading curricular at school.

But it still doesn't have an equivalent to a flag of ideological representation over state building no mater the explanations I'm getting

I have never thought on the banning of the book, have no opinion other than of course not.
I do however feel the following pertaining to this thread:

A flag is a piece of fabric with a distinctive design that is used as a SYMBOL of government, military unit or group.

What does the confederate flag symbolize then?
Some say state rights, but none can disagree that a component of that was the protection of slavery.

What is a government building? It is where the state representatives govern from.

Does the confederate flag represent the constituents? Remembering a component of ideology behind the confederate flag does represent pro slavery.

Should people have it on their pickups or house...couldn't care less.

Should the people I vote in to represent me be able to fly it over a government building. No.