Mayhem Grips Ukrainian Capital

xavi1000

jedi_hamster


EU is a police state.

Yeah, that's why i barely met cop on my travelling across the EUrope last year.People in EU have most individual freedoms in history of mankind.Fact.Your statement is a blatant lie and propaganda.

edit on 20-2-2014 by xavi1000 because: (no reason given)

edit on 20-2-2014 by xavi1000 because: (no reason given)

and that's why in my town a police can give you a ticket for drinking beer in public place half a mile away, and tell you exactly where you bought it and where you were walking with it? CCTVs everywhere.

they don't need armed cops on each corner to have control - and control is a direct result of their laws. control over everything. and it's so transparent most of the time that people accepted it, without even realizing the big brother mess they're getting into. my point is, it may not be a police state in a way that you don't see cops everywhere, but try breaking some tiny silly law by not doing anything bad actually, and they'll show up to give you a ticket, while when you really need them, forget it. they serve the state, not the people. same with politicians.

it may not be a true police state according to your look at it, just because people are so far fine with the way matters are (because of their stupidity), but wait till europeans will decide to rise up and ukraine will look like a child's play when EU will show its true face.

there are some good reasons why our (now dead) ex-president was reluctant to sign the treaty of lisbon.

Melbourne_Militia

jedi_hamster
who was responsible for the ukraine separating from mother russia?

I take offence to that statement.

Russia has "never" been Ukraines "mother", far from it. Russia has been the wicked step-mother that has constantly treated Ukraine with contempt, using and abusing in every way imaginable.

If anyone wants to study History, Kiev was the Kievan state was formed before Russia was formed. Ukraine unbeknown to many has very very old and diverse history.........like ever other external threat Ukraine has encounters over the past millenia and a half, this one too shall be thwarted in the end.

Russia has no business in Ukraine as much as EU . This is not now anymore about EU integration, but more about removing the Russian influence and corruption out of Ukraiian politics once and for all.

SLAVA UKRAIHA!

and to bring even worse EU influence and corruption instead?
i live in poland. i sure as hell would prefer that poland would not be a part of EU, and that our current politicians wouldn't be EU puppets. far more evil than good came out of it.

and if you think that EU (and even USA) doesn't influence the situation in ukraine, you're disilussioned. they always welcome other countries to 'their way of living', by pushing it down their throats. you don't have to look far back into the history to see how those politicians, serving noone but themselves and big corporations, have installed puppet governments in countries willing to protect themselves from 'great western capitalism'.

reply to post by jedi_hamster


Its funny you mention beer, about 3 weeks ago when the protest just began those " pro Europe protesters " where talking about as long as we have food and beer us Ukrainians can do anything.

Funny because if they join the EU, the whole drinking will be taken away from them. Just like their smoking, I can't imagine seeing those people, that they actually know what the EU will make them do or better make them Give up.

Ian Traynor is reporting that after emerging from hours of tense negotiations between government and opposition representatives, German foreign minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier told the Guardian a deal had not yet been reached.

“No result,” he told the Guardian on his way out of the presidential offices. When asked by our correspondent if he was going home, Steinmeier said, “No, not yet.

Link

reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter


Dear Agent_USA_Supporter
From early on when people started to report news in this thread you called them facists.. they were news and reporting what has been written in news doesn´t make them facist.
You even took a time in my wall to call me names like facists two days ago.. i don´t know what button i pushed in you to behave like an idiot.
If you think major news sources like CNN CBS are the only news sources out there where people see these issues reported, you are wrong. There are other journalists from other countries there too, not all from big media companies.
News that i have reported here have been from my country´s news sources not from those mentioned before.

Seeing a reply which is one or two sentences long doesn´t make it a thread or a "subthread".. if i asked you politely to be more specific about where you want my input, you just kept up trolling when you could have easily linked to exact place... simple as that.

Where ever there is civil unrest there are hidden supporters too, it has been always been so throughout the history even in american history, there are always opportunists and arms manufacturers etc behind the scenes. Both parties have their supporters its not even surprising. If it would be found out that EU and US support protesters providing arms etc so it is same in the other part too Russia and perhaps even middle east and China. Unless these are out open we can again just speculate about it.

reply to post by dollukka


we don't have to 'just speculate'.
all that's needed is taking a look at recent history lessons. Libya, Egypt, Syria, amongst many others.

when it gets reported by mainstream media, it is almost never about people's best interests. it's usually just a propaganda to push further one or another's side agenda.

'but people are dying there'? do you really think they care?

wake up, people.

There still seems to be a very tense situation in Independence Square. One can only hope the announcement of new elections will end this mayhem.

Optimism In The Streets As Elections Are Annouced

Sparkymedic

There is, in my eyes, an infinite amount of stupidity behind protest. As there is no means to an end.

I don't care what anyone thinks of these people and their orginization, but they hit the nail on the head. And the protesters in Ukraine ARE fascists!


The KEY to what she said is: people have to WORK towards change. Not FORCE or COERCE or MANIPULATE...WORK. Anything else is futile and will eventually fail, because it will be built on lies and illusions.

So your line of logic is that no protest ever works, is futile and people should bow their heads and bend over? You certainly have no knowledge of what a revolution is as a notion and why history is filled with them. Tell you what my fellow canadian. We do live in a great country, technologically advance but people over here never raise up, despite the increase in taxes, oil prices (totally unjustifiable) and the corruption of politician. And you know why? Because they think like you!!! So be a good boy and:



At the end of the day you "worked" for that.

reply to post by jedi_hamster


As long as there is no facts and proovs and evidence on a table its only speculation. If justice system would work by speculations and verdicts done just by a hunch where it would leave us ?

According the local news ( not cbs cnn .. )
President Yanukovych has promised that presidential elections will be brought forward in the end of this year, also constitutional law which would cut presidents power will come in action. He says that country will start preparations for new parliament.

Three EU foreign ministers discussed the whole night for political solution to the crisis, President Yanukovych and opposition.
The president and the opposition are trying to find a political solution to the crisis in Ukraine with EU and Russia. The opposition has not yet adopted the draft agreement.

European officials say Ukrainian protesters have agreed to a deal with Ukraine’s president on defusing a deadly political crisis.

Germany’s Foreign Ministry tweeted Friday afternoon that the Maidan council, which has been leading the protest movement, “has decided that opposition leaders can sign the agreement.”

An opposition spokeswoman in Kiev said opposition leaders were heading to the president’s office and had agreed to a deal.

It is unclear whether the protesters are putting any conditions on the deal.

reply to post by Telos


Great assuming you do there - try and read/ understand an entire post before you go off the handle. IF anything were to get as bad as it has in Ukraine, here in Canada, and if I am forced to defend my life and the lives of my loved one's I will do what is necessary. But to reiterate what I said before, and what you clearly skipped over is; if people WORK towards change and WORK away from corruption, then there would never be a need to rehash the same old same same old you get from protesting. There is NO WAY in hell that the "protesters" who were firing guns at cops have any REAL solutions other than to remove the tumor. Their problems are systemic, not superficial like who runs the government. The fact that it is set up the way it is, is the problem. I hold the same feelings towards the OWS protests. They were at the very least a missed opportunity to effect change through the hard WORK of educating people about the reality of what the problem is. You will NEVER find a solution to a problem if you cannot identify the problem itself.

I am POSITIVE this is not the first demonstration like this in Ukraine, and sadly won't be the last. But their failure to adopt something that is REAL and functional, basically something different than what has been repeating itself for more than 1000 years, has yet to come into fruition from protesting. The same goes with everywhere else on this planet that has adopted this strategy of protest, remove tumor, keep doing it the same way as how the tumor got there in the first place, thinking that is change of some sort.

You see the results (or lack there of) everywhere, there are no results...just the same old BS. WTF is an election really going to do anyway? Let the power struggle change hands? You yourself admitted that our Canadian version of all this is BS anyway, so why protest? Why not work to change it? Feel free to protest if you have a solution to this BS, but don't protest just to spin the wheels with an assumption that protest bring positive changes...that is ultimate insanity.

If you don't like things the way they are, please do us all a favor and find a solution. I have solutions, but they are usually shot down by almost everyone I talk to them about, because it's likely that they aren't able to comprehend what a society would look like without people in government and no need for money/currency. I am sure that comment right there just made your head spin.

reply to post by Telos

 

That cartoon is so retarded in not only it's implication but in it's overly simplistic attempt at making any real sense.


I am Free to Get a job if I so choose
I am Free to Go to Work if I so choose
I am Free to Get Married if I so choose
I am Free to have Children if I so choose
I am Free to Follow or NOT Follow fashion if I so choose
I am Free to Act Normal if I so choose, Most of the time I don't
I am Free to walk in the street and get flattened by a Truck if I so choose
I am Free of TV, I chose THAT one a long time ago
I am Free to disobey the LAW and suffer the consequences at my own peril if I so choose

and finally

Saving money for my old age sounds like a really stupid idea?

reply to post by dollukka

IMO this isn't over.
The first goal in the mission of putting down Yanukovich is now finished. There are dead civilians.
Mark my words now - not long from now Yanukovich will be indicted in front of Hague Tribunal for crimes against humanity.

Ukraine president, opposition sign EU-brokered agreement on ending crisis

Ukraine's President Viktor Yanukovich and opposition leaders have signed an EU brokered agreement on ending the political crisis in the country.

The agreement followed an announcement by Yanukovich to hold early elections, to form a national unity government and relinquish some of his presidential powers. The agreement was witnessed by EU foreign ministers who brokered the deal.

DETAILS TO FOLLOW

This is somewhat concerning... Emphasis on EU-brokered agreement...
So expect that when the next elections come Ukraine will be joining the EU... Russia will be agitated.

SLAYER69

reply to post by Telos

 

That cartoon is so retarded in not only it's implication but in it's overly simplistic attempt at making any real sense.


I am Free to Get a job if I so choose
I am Free to Go to Work if I so choose
I am Free to Get Married if I so choose
I am Free to have Children if I so choose
I am Free to Follow or NOT Follow fashion if I so choose
I am Free to Act Normal if I so choose, Most of the time I don't
I am Free to walk in the street and get flattened by a Truck if I so choose
I am Free of TV, I chose THAT one a long time ago
I am Free to disobey the LAW and suffer the consequences at my own peril if I so choose

and finally

Saving money for my old age sounds like a really stupid idea?

Slayer is this really you or someone has hijacked your account? You are one of the last persons in this board that I'd expect such a reply. At least you should have been able to see the real meaning in this picture. But what do I know anyway, to each is own.

The deal has been signed

We are about to sign. Good compromise for Ukraine. Gives peace a chance. Opens the way to reform and to Europe. Poland and EU support it.

Link

reply to post by MessageforAll


Hmm there were negotiators from all parties, President of Ukraine, opposition, EU and Russia send negotiators too.. so how can this be only EU?
What i see wrong in the news is how can they possibly start preparing a new parliament before presidential elections are done. In here elected president choose the "prime minister " who does the preparations of the parliament. something fishy here.

Sparkymedic
I am sure that comment right there just made your head spin.

Oh you have no idea what I've experienced in my life, seen and been subjected too. So the least of the things is getting my head spin form such comments or even ideas. Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion. I stick to my previous remark. Rebuttal ain't going to change the way things are or how they can change. So I'll leave it at that.

reply to post by dollukka

In here elected president choose the "prime minister " who does the preparations of the parliament. something fishy here.

Prime minister is actually the president of the government, not the parliament.