Penn and Teller lies about Autism to cover big pharma

I have no problem with vaccinations, and am pro-vaccination, and as well am glad that the most recent science around the subject is indicating a safe vaccination base for our kids.

The problem I have is this, and it is a problem with the future of all aspects of health, medicine and food:

1. Moms and dads ARE the field observation base here, not the corporations, labs or scientists. The latter simply are not in the field enough. If we immediately bash and deride parents who express a health concern, and use fake sskeptics like Penn & Teller to subtly deliver the message that you have nothing to say on the subject, we have violated a basic set of human rights. This is wrong, ethically, morally, and scientifically. I do not care that someone representing the other side made mistakes in their report - that is simply one person. This trick is played by SSkeptics all the time. There is not just ONE bigfoot film. I trust moms and dads first before SSkeptics. ASD's have skyrocketed over the last 30 years, and no, it is not because of being over-diagnosed.

Science, industry, government, health agencies, doctors ALL report to US. If moms and dads raise a concern, THEY are in charge. Not Penn & Teller. Penn & Teller need to put a lid on it and throw in a healthy pinch of humility; because the fact is - they do not represent parents or science. There was some doubt on this issue originally and the science was, for some unknown reason, incomplete. I am happy with the outcome, but it just as well could have gone the other way. This does not exonerate Penn & Teller or the others in the SSkeptic Cabal from the crime of suppressing ethical dissent. Eventually they will be wrong, the mom's and dad's will be correct, and the damage done through bashing, propaganda and obfuscation will be enormous. I bear no respect for this type of pseudoscience and propaganda.

2. Why did we wait until NOW, 60 years later, to do the real science? Just as in the case of the original Saban polio vaccine which infected millions with a cancer causing viral agent, doing the science AFTER the fact because a bunch of people started yelling to their congressmen - is not science. Penn & Teller cannot defend this as they took their position BEFORE the science was even in. Are they psychic? The fact is, they were paid to take their position. I hold no respect for this, it is not ethical, and it is not in any way indicative of intelligence.

3. ASD's continue to skyrocket. My best friend from grad school has two of this three kids who are disabled with autism to the point that they will never hold jobs. He is desperate to find a way to make enough money so that he can establish a means for them to live off of after he is gone.

I have sat with him late at night, with a couple beers as he will confide in me and cry - literally sobbing - over his fear for his children.

He researched his family history - both sides - back 9 generations. No incidences of Autism in the slightest - ZERO................

ZERO.........................folks.

The simple fact is, that the fake skeptics and institutionalists need to step out of the way and quit pretending to represent science, rationality and correctness. There is a cause for this, and the voices are growing in direct proportion to the rise in ASD incidence.

I am happy for the outcomes which are showing for vaccinations, but this aura of propaganda and media campaigns attempting to make concerned parents look like idiots and whacko's is simply wrong. And trust me, Penn & Teller have been forced to temper this last propaganda video, the previous ones were much worse.

As an ethical skeptic I will never support a heavy handed propaganda approach, foisting entertainment for pseudo-intellectual angry 14 year olds, to act as a masquerade managing our health science. Never.

Originally posted by nik1halo
reply to post by Rubinstein

 

Thanks for the education, I did not know that. So in a way, you're saying that it should be the family GP's respoonsibility that the infant is healthy enough to withstand the immunisation, or just have the three seperately? It is obviously insane to not be immunised at all, as the side afects are just as bad for these deseases.

#

The GP doesn't get much say in the matter, there are effectively used as a puppet by Big Pharma, if they try to break free from their strings they will be struck off. Your doctor is at risk of getting struck off if he/she does not give you the advice which comes from Big Pharma, they cannot tell you what they really believe, or they risk losing their license. Your GP also makes money per vaccine administered, so they have a financial incentive to vaccinate as many people as possible; it's not about health, it's about money.

Unfortunately there's a lot of evidence that Big Pharma have been abusing vaccines, they have been caught red-handed giving out contaminated vaccines, we could have let them off once, but it happens again and again e.g. Cancer Viruses, Bird Flu, HIV, Hep B, so they are actually spreading disease which they can then profit from. This is how they increase the size of their market, through sowing the seeds of disease through vaccines.

Think carefully about any specific vaccine which interests you, there are some which are harder to debunk than others, however the risk of vaccinating is far greater than the risk of not vaccinating. Think about it this way, if the vaccines really do work, then let the herd protect you, over 90% of people are getting vaccines, so allow that herd to protect you with their immunity. If illnesses are still spreading around, then vaccines aren't working, so it's not going to help you to get one. Big Pharma keep a lot of dirty secrets about vaccines, they don't allow honest university scientists to look through their science, it's all a secret.

Look into why the MMR scientists are currently suing Merck for fraud over the MMR tests.

The trust is gone, we cannot trust these people, instead we should trust our immune system as it knows a lot more than any scientists do.

I understand the debate on the subject of autism and vaccines. There shouldn't really be a debate on this.

Autism in vaccinated kids is 1 out of X

If austism in unvaccinated kids is 1 out of X, then vaccines do not cause autism. If unvaccinated kids have autism at 1 out of X-Y, Then vaccines not only stop a bunch of other bad diseases but they also help fight autism. Finally if unvaccinated kids have autism at a rate of 1 out of X+Y. Then vaccines cause autism.

I find it hard to believe that their isn't enough kids in a world wide pool, to compare the vaccinated kids vs nonvaccinated kids to answer this question.

Every thinking person will want to think twice about vaccines, don't be like the majority of Penn and Teller fans who make assumptions without investigation.

Here's a collection of links I've put together to show exactly the reasons why we should all think very carefully before vaccinating, the main problem is that the trust is gone. How can we trust companies with a history of intentionally damaging our health then profiting from the damage caused, how can we trust them to put substances inside our bodies? They have a huge conflict of interest, as they profit when we have disease. They cannot be trusted, Big Pharma are the biggest threat to the health of your family. The links below show that:-

Firstly we have the former Merck Vaccine Chief Dr Maurice Hilleman admitting that the Cancer causing SV40 is in vaccines
www.youtube.com...

Bayer knowingly sold HIV contaminated Vaccines
www.youtube.com...

The independent and internationally renowned Cochrane Collaboration warned that there are no studies showing that the flu vaccines are safe or effective
www.medicalnewstoday.com...

Then we have Cot Death, which ceases to exist when you stop vaccinating under-2's
www.vierascheibner.org...
www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com...

Was young Max really going to become Autistic, he seems to be doing well beforehand, until he had his MMR. We here the same story again and again, $Trillions of compensation would have to be paid out if it were ever admitted.
www.youtube.com...

A doctor has evidence that all vaccines are causing mini-strokes
vactruth.com...

Next we have the risk of inducing Diabetes Type 1
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

The old person's flu vaccine causes dementia/Alzheimer's
www.whale.to...

There is evidence that UNICEF sterilize under the guise of vaccination in third world nations
www.lifesitenews.com...

And we also have the the so-called 'conspiracy theorists' who point out evidence of the Swine Flu vaccine being used to get the population down by damaging developing ovaries with Polysorbate 80. organichealthadviser.com...

The 'conspiracy theorists' will also point to the fact that those who live near to the Hepatisis B vaccination stations in Africa are the most likely to have HIV
www.originofaids.com...

There is even evidence that childhood illnesses such as Measles make us stronger, grow taller, and less likely to go down with various Cancers
tv.naturalnews.com...

Here's an interesting survey - Survey Results: Are Unvaccinated Children Healthier?
www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com...

Interesting vaccine quotes for those interested
www.vaclib.org...

It's deliberately not studied as Big Pharma don't want to pay out an incredible sum of compensation, nor do they want to lose future sales.

Look at the Amish community, they do not vaccinate, they have only ever had three cases of Autism, all of whom were adopted into their community having been vaccinated before joining.

Originally posted by thinline
I understand the debate on the subject of autism and vaccines. There shouldn't really be a debate on this.

Autism in vaccinated kids is 1 out of X

If austism in unvaccinated kids is 1 out of X, then vaccines do not cause autism. If unvaccinated kids have autism at 1 out of X-Y, Then vaccines not only stop a bunch of other bad diseases but they also help fight autism. Finally if unvaccinated kids have autism at a rate of 1 out of X+Y. Then vaccines cause autism.

I find it hard to believe that their isn't enough kids in a world wide pool, to compare the vaccinated kids vs nonvaccinated kids to answer this question.

Originally posted by Rubinstein
Look at the Amish community, they do not vaccinate, they have only ever had three cases of Autism, all of whom were adopted into their community having been vaccinated before joining.

You really should not post urban myths as fact - it is so easy to debunk!

autism-news-beat.com...

“The idea that the Amish do not vaccinate their children is untrue,” says Dr. Kevin Strauss, MD, a pediatrician at the CSC. “We run a weekly vaccination clinic and it’s very busy.” He says Amish vaccinations rates are lower than the general population’s, but younger Amish are more likely to be vaccinated than older generations. Strauss also sees plenty of Amish children showing symptoms of autism. “Autism isn’t a diagnosis – it’s a description of behavior. We see autistic behaviors along with seizure disorders or mental retardation or a genetic disorder, where the autism is part of a more complicated clinical spectrum.” Fragile X syndrome and Rett Syndrome is also common among the clinic’s patients.

pediatrics.aappublications.org...

onclusions: The reasons that Amish parents resist immunizations mirror reasons that non-Amish parents resist immunizations. Even in America's closed religious communities, the major barrier to vaccination is concern over adverse effects of vaccinations. If 85% of Amish parents surveyed accept some immunizations, they are a dynamic group that may be influenced to accept preventative care.

That's not the case, it's more Big Pharma lies, they're trying to cover up that the non-vaccinated Amish community are a lot more healthy than the rest of us

I have not seen autism with the Amish," said Dr. Frank Noonan, a family practitioner in Lancaster County, Pa., who has treated thousands of Amish for a quarter-century. "You'll find all the other stuff, but we don't find the autism. We're right in the heart of Amish country and seeing none, and that's just the way it is." In Chicago, Homefirst Medical Services treats thousands of never-vaccinated children whose parents received exemptions through Illinois' relatively permissive immunization policy. Homefirst's medical director, Dr. Mayer Eisenstein, told us he is not aware of any cases of autism in never-vaccinated children; the national rate is 1 in 175, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. "We have a fairly large practice," Eisenstein told us. "We have about 30,000 or 35,000 children that we've taken care of over the years, and I don't think we have a single case of autism in children delivered by us who never received vaccines. "We do have enough of a sample," Eisenstein said. "The numbers are too large to not see it. We would absolutely know. We're all family doctors. If I have a child with autism come in, there's no communication. It's frightening. You can't touch them. It's not something that anyone would miss." Dr. Jeff Bradstreet, a Florida family practitioner with ties to families who homeschool their children for religious reasons, told Age of Autism he has proposed such a study in that group. "I said I know I can tap into this community and find you large numbers of unvaccinated homeschooled," said Bradstreet, "and we can do simple prevalence and incidence studies in them, and my gut reaction is that you're going to see no autism in this group."

www.whale.to...

reply to post by Rubinstein



This may be the case, but you can't deny that there are no longer cases of blindness due to measels, or deseases in children from mothers with rhubella. These deseases have virtually been obliterated, at least here in the UK.

Measles only causes problems in the malnourished, if they get Vitamin A they are safe. Measles in not a problem in the well-fed first world.

Everyone used to get Measles back in my day, we used to have Measles Parties. We were all fine. If were were starving we wouldn't have been, but vaccines are also dangerous in the malnourished, so that wouldn't have been a solution. Vitamin A is the solution, that's why the WHO give out Vitamin A supplements in the third world.

As for Rubella, see below



The current vaccine schedule is leaving us with MS, Non Hodgkin Lymphoma, Asthma, Diabetes Type 1, Lupus, Epilepsy, Autism, ADHD and a lot more, this is bringing in huge profits for Big Pharma, who are always thinking of the next excuse to inject us with another vaccine and add another obscure substance (e.g. mouse brain, aborted fetuses) which will cause yet another disease and bring in yet more profit.

Originally posted by nik1halo
reply to post by Rubinstein

 

This may be the case, but you can't deny that there are no longer cases of blindness due to measels, or deseases in children from mothers with rhubella. These deseases have virtually been obliterated, at least here in the UK.

Originally posted by texasyeti
I find it pretty sad Penn and Teller said there was no connection to Vaccines and Autism. That's Big Pharma paying them to say that. The brain of a child younger than 18 months has no sheath over their nerves its just forming, so when you pump a young child up with huge amounts of shots at one time for various things the mercury goes directly to those nerves and stays there. Its hard to get the mercury out of your system. So as the child's brain develops a sheath is formed over the nerve centers in the brain causing Autism. EVEN THE CDC Chief admits that it causes Autism! How many families lives does this have to destroy before they ban it! Penn and Teller also defend Monsanto, Flouride in water, and GMO crops. All of which are dangerous. Monsanto puts viruses in crops that infect people! Get a grip!

Funny, then, how incindences of autism have increased dramatically after the mercury was removed from vaccines.

Harte

Originally posted by nik1halo
reply to post by Rubinstein

 

This may be the case, but you can't deny that there are no longer cases of blindness due to measels, or deseases in children from mothers with rhubella. These deseases have virtually been obliterated, at least here in the UK.

I think the last two things pharmecuticals have cured are polio and erectile dysfunction. The money is in the treatment, not the cure. Consider what would happen to all those breast cancer charities if it were suddenly cured by a single pill. Think of all the money that wouldn't be spent on chemo or radiation therapies.

Don't get me wrong, there is a lot of great medicine out there. But if pharmecutical companies need Congress to pass a law giving them immunity from lawsuits over their vaccines, what does that tell you about their confidence in their own product?

I don't think it is the mercury so much that is causing the problems. It has been the adjuvants they used in the past or other chemicals used to disperse the vaccine. I can't see making vaccines mandatory because that automatically seals some people's fate. Everyone has an allergy, metabolic sensitivity, or genetic problem that makes one medicine or another not suitable to them. It seems that we should have an inalienable right to not take something that we may be allergic to.

I can wash my hands in battery acid, most people can't. I am allergic to propylene glycol. If I am forced to wash my hands in propylene glycol then everyone should be forced to wash their hands in battery acid. Seems only fair to me.

reply to post by texasyeti


Penn Gillette is a menace to a peace-loving humanity. His modus operandi seems to be to cause outrage and controversy, much like what lawyers do, with the exception that he works in the publicity arena rather than the legal arena. Teller's not much better, but at least he has some manners.

If you want to know what Penn and Teller think without having to sit through the occasional obvious hit-piece or banal boobage, just look for what the CATO Institute says. It's the source of their research and the funding of it happens to align pretty well with what they support. www.sourcewatch.org...

I happen to like some of their positions because they can be eloquent when they want to, and can be correct, but even when they're correct they can be right for the wrong reasons. I enjoy people who attempt to debunk pseudoscience, but I can't turn a blind eye to their misdeeds just because they only fudge # 20% of the time. To some degree it bothers me even more because people will buy everything they say because they're taking up the skeptic flag, even though that's the antithesis of what being a skeptic is about.

There've been terrible abuses and tremendous successes with vaccinations. There will be more of both in the future. Anyone expressing only one side of that coin is trying to sell you something, physical or otherwise. A real skeptic, confronted with a soon to be injected syringe, will always want to know what exactly is in it every single time. There's no real resolution to this false dichotomy you get presented with because in the context it has been framed, vaccines are in a superposition of good and bad.

Penn & Teller definitely do NOT strike me as guys who would take a payoff in order to sell a lie.

reply to post by texasyeti


I fail to see why anyone would take medical advice from Penn and Teller. I don't go to the grocery store and ask the butcher about the stock market...so why would I listen to a magician on whether I should vaccinate my children or not?

Originally posted by White Locust
Penn & Teller definitely do NOT strike me as guys who would take a payoff in order to sell a lie.

I agree, actually. To play devil's advocate, I might bring up that their life's work has been selling lies; There's no reason they couldn't use those skills to tell truths. Still, that clouds the issue with regard to their actual character.

Without playing devil's advocate now, you still have to worry that they may have themselves bought a lie as truth before selling it to you.

reply to post by TheEthicalSkepticHe researched his family history - both sides - back 9 generations. No incidences of Autism in the slightest - ZERO................

ZERO.........................folks.



Did he ask if his family has a history of 'retards' or 'idiots' ? Cause that's what they would have called people with autism 50+ years ago...

Originally posted by VictorVonDoom

Originally posted by nik1halo
reply to post by Rubinstein

 

This may be the case, but you can't deny that there are no longer cases of blindness due to measels, or deseases in children from mothers with rhubella. These deseases have virtually been obliterated, at least here in the UK.

I think the last two things pharmecuticals have cured are polio and erectile dysfunction. The money is in the treatment, not the cure. Consider what would happen to all those breast cancer charities if it were suddenly cured by a single pill. Think of all the money that wouldn't be spent on chemo or radiation therapies.

This is a common argument that always fails to address one thing... If a single company had a cure for cancer, it would make more money than all the Chemo companies combined. Therefore it would be more profitable for them to be the ones selling their product while their competition folds by the wayside.

Perhaps you should learn to base decisions about your children's health on scientific evidence,
instead if stuff that you've read on conspiracy forums...