There Are LOADS Of Jobs Out There, But People Don't Want To Work!

reply to post by DrEugeneFixer


Thank you for linking that reply. I missed it. I would have surely replied to that answer otherwise.

Most likely they find that it is ineffective and counterproductive, overall... no mystery there... Individual bargaining pits one worker against his neighbor and is contrary to the cooperation implied in the union movement.

Of course, for the individual who finds individual bargaining effective and productive then this clearly answers your question as to why that individual would have a problem with collective bargaining. Here's the deal, sport. I, as an individual, do not, in my individual bargaining, make demands that the collective be shut out of bargaining. If someone wants to make a separate bargain with a collective, and still honor my individual bargain with that someone, this is fine with me, but this is not the case at all with labor unions, is it?

In regards to your claim that I have not answered your question as to what my problem with collective bargaining, I did answer your question, even if it was in the form of a question, and if you need further clarification, consider this that. The collectivist have deemed their collective the authority on who gets to make a bargain in certain industries. They, in their bargaining, insist as a part of that bargaining, in shutting out the individual who would operate outside of the collective in terms of bargaining. I don't like bullies, and I certainly do not like groups of bullies, no matter how well read they insist they are.

I commend all these people for building their own houses and all that. it's something I've always wanted to do. I had once invested in 3 acres of property to do just that one day but it fell through when things took a bad turn... but i won't get into all the personal details of being targeted and hounded by multiple people in the entertainment business.

I will say i'd like to try again... but the real question is WHERE?

seeing as how in a few years this probably isn't even going to be considered the United states of America anymore.

What is it with all these people who think so much of the damn dollar they don't even pay attention to what is going on in the world? You could spell certain current events out to people and read it to them like childrens book and they would still stick their fingers in their ears and say "money, money, money... that's all that is important"

So much for being up on current events. Apparently that's against some unspoken rule.

reply to post by getreadyalready


It has changed drastically since the 1990s. I actually drove down the same area that I took in 1997 where I was able to get a job in one day. I found only 2 signs where there used to be 20. One sign had a web site and I applied; no call yet.
The other sign said accepting applications not now hiring. I used to work in retail there is a big difference. Do you need proof here? This is my reality in my area. Maybe some areas are doing better than others?

Originally posted by dreamseeker
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

It has changed drastically since the 1990s. I actually drove down the same area that I took in 1997 where I was able to get a job in one day. I found only 2 signs where there used to be 20. One sign had a web site and I applied; no call yet.
The other sign said accepting applications not now hiring. I used to work in retail there is a big difference. Do you need proof here? This is my reality in my area. Maybe some areas are doing better than others?

I shouldn't have said things haven't changed. This is a terrible economy, and some parts of the country are doing very poorly. However, one of the worst places in the country is Detroit, and a friend of mine here in Florida just got hired by a company in Detroit and moved there, LOL! Imagine, being here in Florida, where the economy is doing really well, and taking a job and relocating to Detroit. Why aren't Detroit people relocating here to Florida? That makes more sense.

Anyhow, I'm sure there are areas where things are really, really tough. But I don't believe there are any areas that are hopeless. It just takes R and I to quote Stephen Covey. Use your Resourcefulness and Initiative.

By the way why would a psychology major work at McDonalds? I am willing to work in retail again or work in management but I have no experience in fast food or fruit picking.(LOL). I have applied for jobs that was only remotely related to psychology. To teach online courses I need a psychology related job. I am not sure how I can relate washing dishes or working at the drive thru back to psychology. Sure you may work with people but that has little to do with my major.
Besides my psychical disablity makes it immpossible for me to do jobs that are labor type jobs.

I started a business with limited capital. There were no jobs available in the PC tech field in my area at the time, so while working for 10.50 an hour at a grocery store, I opened my own business. That was 5 years ago.

Here are the facts in that time.

For two years I ran the business part time with the grocery job to finance it. I was unable to get any grants or loans because I did not have the ability to pay loans at the time due to bills, and grants are usually offered only to businesses that employ others and military veterans, neither of which I qualified. So I made due.

I soon realized that even in my rural area, the problem with a small business is advertising, especially when you have big business competitors nearby such as Best Buy and Staples and cheap arse computer purchases from Walmart. A month of advertising in the newspaper for a text only add up to 30 words was $300 per month. A radio spot started at $1200 for the smallest package. Local newsletters charged $50 per week for a business card sized add, and weekly adverts charged $50 per month for a 20 word text ad. A sign to hang out at the road? $2000. $4000 for a light up variation since I was open mostly evenings and nights.

Now already someone should be saying to themselves, well how the hell is someone making 10.50 an hour, fending for himself, supplying this business - going to afford any of that advertising? I didn't. I made flyers and I scraped a few adverts in here and there and for the first year I managed to pull in 1 customer a week, tops.

Then I lost my job and try as I might to get another one, it just wasn't happening so I was forced to go at the business full time - with no income to go to it. Now how does one do that exactly? He doesn't. He simply hopes.

And I have been doing a lot of hoping the past 3 years. Through fliers I manage to rake in enough business to pay office rent, car insurance, gas, and still have enough left over for the necessities. If I didn't live with family I would be homeless. There would be no business. If I had to purchase all my food, I would starve.




Now keep this is mind, I have a simple office business, in a midtown-rural area. Prices for advertising here are WAY cheap in comparison to city and in-town prices. I am located in a perfect busy intersection where people can take notice, I offer low prices and faster service than any of the corporate entities around, and that is how I maintain a customer base - and yet without the huge chunk of money that I never had to do my initial advertising I am, and will forever be floating in nowhere land with a business, and so will anyone else who has one.

If a business was just as simple as starting up and people will start begging you for service, then everybody would have one. But it isn't. You have to pay people to notice you and then you have to convince them that you are somehow better than the corporations that offer the same service in a more professional manner, and you also have to convince them that you are qualified enough - with you as the only witness, to do whatever task it is your business focuses on.

Without money, there is no successful, competitive business in this market. That is simply the truth and I am living breathing proof of that and let me tell you - I have given months upon months of my life to try other methods that didn't involve the green gold, and it just ends up wasted each and every time.

That is the reality of the situation.

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Originally posted by dreamseeker
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

It has changed drastically since the 1990s. I actually drove down the same area that I took in 1997 where I was able to get a job in one day. I found only 2 signs where there used to be 20. One sign had a web site and I applied; no call yet.
The other sign said accepting applications not now hiring. I used to work in retail there is a big difference. Do you need proof here? This is my reality in my area. Maybe some areas are doing better than others?

I shouldn't have said things haven't changed. This is a terrible economy, and some parts of the country are doing very poorly. However, one of the worst places in the country is Detroit, and a friend of mine here in Florida just got hired by a company in Detroit and moved there, LOL! Imagine, being here in Florida, where the economy is doing really well, and taking a job and relocating to Detroit. Why aren't Detroit people relocating here to Florida? That makes more sense.

Anyhow, I'm sure there are areas where things are really, really tough. But I don't believe there are any areas that are hopeless. It just takes R and I to quote Stephen Covey. Use your Resourcefulness and Initiative.

or better yet why is a Detroit company hiring someone in Florida when they could give one of the unemployed in DETROIT a chance?

but that is nothing compared to some of the screwy crap i am hearing companies do these days.

reply to post by getreadyalready


It is the whole attitude of the employers how they can fire people at will and outsource jobs etc. The problem is so much bigger than us. It may not be hopeless but there is no way to really suceed fincially speaking in our economic system. It was made to bleed the poor and feed the rich.
That is why as a kid I made the wisest choice to be a writer that way I can write a few books and be set for life I just have to get that far. I am still working on that.

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
I did answer your question, even if it was in the form of a question, and if you need further clarification, consider this that. The collectivist have deemed their collective the authority on who gets to make a bargain in certain industries. They, in their bargaining, insist as a part of that bargaining, in shutting out the individual who would operate outside of the collective in terms of bargaining.

That is not an aswer at all. You have merely noted that collective bargaining agreements between an employer and a union exclude individual bargaining... But of course, that is only the very definition of collective bargaining! You might as well explain that you hate log cabins because they are houses made of logs!

I may as well mention that calling unions "Bullies" is merely namecalling, and beneath the standards of ATS.

Ridiculous premise for a thread OP. Especially when you list skill jobs as the solution for not having a job. When someone gets laid off, they either collect severance for a time, or collect unemployment. Which is a LOT less money typically, and without benefits. Unless you opt for Cobra, which is prohibitively expensive for most families.

So.. someone gets laid off.. and after the shock wears off and they go through all the red tape to start collecting unemployment - your solution is they get a job as an electrician, plumber, etc.? Seriously? If I've been doing computer work for 25 years, do you honestly expect me to immediately be able to compete with professionals in those trades? Or get a job with same? When people with even 1 year of experience would get hired before me?

Your idea is not reality. People don't have the time, nor the money, nor can afford the tools necessary (or the business license, etc.) to start doing that sort of work. They need a job quickly. And if they have worked in their own trade for 20 years, it makes sense they get something in the same field. Your idea is ludicrous - so when a plumber gets laid off, your suggestion is what.. they get a job as a computer specialist?

Someone should not flush years and years of career training down the drain, just so they can conform to the ridiculous "you need to get off unemployment as quickly as possible" premise that seems to permeate this site. If it takes me 3 or 4 months to get something in my field, with equitable pay that will sustain my standard of living, that's what I am going to do. I've paid a ridiculous amount of taxes throughout my career to the stupid military - just because my country is too stupid to invest in their OWN citizens well-being, instead spending 100 times more than the next 20 countries combined for "defense" spending, doesn't mean I am going to feel guilty about it.

Wake up and think reality - your theory isn't reality, it's fiction.

reply to post by dreamseeker

By the way why would a psychology major work at McDonalds?

No offense, but having a psychology degree is kind of like not having a degree at all. More to the point though, a psychology degree is useful in any human environment. You could make the case for using it from managing a Taco Bell, to selling Hyundais.

The idea behind taking a seemingly menial job at McDonalds is that it gets you back in the workforce, overcomes the inertia of unemployment, provides networking opportunity and a current job reference and earns you a few dollars.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


How about instead of "moving the goal posts" we instead call it "changing your mind" since you're no longer able to support your position. Well, that is other than by repeating a series of unrelated phrases over and over again—which doesn't even constitute an argument—so much as it does trying to paint a textual picture of "Tom, Dick, and Harry" living with chickens.

Nor do I so heavily rely upon strawman arguments that I make up sentences and put quotation marks around them to make it appear as if I am quoting my opponent.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Hrm ...

Well lets add some links for people to clear this bit up.

Lets recap. I commented,

[W]e make more money from patents (which are highly specialized) than we typically do writing custom software solutions for small businesses. You don't have to risk the barn to sell eggs.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

You replied:

Entrepreneurs - producers - do not "risk the barn to sell eggs", they risk the barn so they don't have to spend a lifetime selling eggs. Employees have a hard time understanding this, regardless of how well they are paid and how much property they own.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

And now you're saying,

.. pretending I am arguing that people must "go all in" in order to be producers is not one of those solid argument.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I see moving goal posts. I'm sure your counter argument consists of this bit of beautiful hedging,

Risking the barn is not "going all in". People who have barns, have far more than that.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I'm not sure redefining an idiom that has a hundred years behind it is a strong way to backpedal. So basically your original position was:

"Employees aren't producers because they don't take big risks."

This has now changed to I'm not sure what. Perhaps ...

"Producers sometimes take risks and employees never take risks?"

I think we have ourselves a congenital liar folks!

I would give anything to have a job to depend on rather than relying on my self employment/disablity. I am registed with 2 job agencies and do my research all the time. I almost fell victim to several job scams and even told my friends and relatives I am willing to babysit,(as long as the kids are not sick.), help prepare meals and do very light housekeeping.
I want to work so bad just to get out of my house more. It is definitely not the problem of not wanting to work. I write articles on yahoo for $1-$8 per article. I don't make much from it because yahoo rarely pays unless it is a perfect article that is no opionion based or overly trendy.
I have wasted so much gas on networking, and looking for the signs in the windows of businesses,

reply to post by getreadyalready


Bingo was his Name-o.

You take the crappy jobs because even though they may suck, they pay your bills (if you're lucky) and allow you time to seek out something better.

reply to post by DrEugeneFixer


Typical of the collectivist, when they ask what an individuals problem with collective bargaining is and that individual explains that their problem with collective bargaining is that it shuts out individual bargaining, the collectivist declares: "That is not an answer at all." It is an answer, it is just not the answer collectivist like to hear. That's tough!

Indeed, it is so much an answer that states have heard the individuals complaints against this collective bargaining and enacted "Right to Work" legislation to curb it. It is most assuredly an answer, sport.

Labor unions are bullies! This is precisely why "Right to Work" legislation was enacted to deal with these bullies. Indeed, they're so much bullies that they would dictate what sort of language a person can use and claim that they represent the whole in their dictation.

reply to post by getreadyalready


I am working technically speaking. I am self employed yet I just don't have the money to put into advertising. My bachelors is in communications. I got very general degrees so it would be easier to get a job.
I have $60k worth of loans to pay back I really needs a job that pays enough to start doing that.
My career is writing; while I am a pretty good writer I am a creative writer. That does not pay unless I can complete a full manuscript which I am working on so we will see.
Mcdonalds would psychically kill me and not make enough to pay back college loans.

reply to post by ZeroSumWinner


I have not changed my mind, and you have failed to make any sound argument to change it for me. Keep trying, my friend. It is better to try and fail than it is to not try at all.

The idea behind taking a seemingly menial job at McDonalds is that it gets you back in the workforce, overcomes the inertia of unemployment, provides networking opportunity and a current job reference and earns you a few dollars.

Again, not reality. What fantasy land do some of you live in?

Do you have any idea how pathetic the medical plan at McDonalds is? For a family with any sort of medical issue, the wages will be obliterated by medical costs. In addition, you then stop collecting unemployment, AND have the joy of trying to job hunt around your horrible, minimum wage job. Networking opportunity?

I can't believe you said that. That's hilarious.

It earns you a few dollars.. but so does unemployment. My unemployment (currently not collecting.. paying off "severance" for another month), makes more than I'd make at McDonalds. Your theory I should work for the sake of it is stupid, sorry. I can make much better use of my time looking for something in my field.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


You say that labor unions are bullies.

But so is management.

What's the difference?

To those staunchly (and sometimes ignorantly) opposed to unions. what alternative do you propose?

After all, it's not like you can control what management does.

But, if I go # off and fail to perform my tasks, I face warnings, etc. Why are my bosses not facing the same actions? They are incompetent!

Mcdonalds pays minuim wage and is not always full time. Working 30 hours a week at Mcdonalds makes $870 and after taxes that would be probably more like $700 that is less than what I get on disablity/benefits. That would be crazy for me to put myself at risk to have less money! Honestly with all my incomes and benefits I live on about $1000 per month. That is a little under minuim wage. That is not great but i am trying to find something where I get ahead not break even or fall behind.
I don't want to lose my disablity permantly for something that would be less or equal to what I have now. I can keep my disablity benefits up to a point but I lose $410 worth of benefits for making $300 at a job.
For me it is better to find a job where I lose all my benefits that would recquire me to find a job that pays $12.50 for 30 hours per week.