Legit Questions for ATS Liberals…Shed Some Light Please

Originally posted by seabag

Homosexuality and Muslims - Devote Muslims kill homosexuals for being homosexual (fact). Yet, liberals support both the Homosexual agenda in America as well as Muslim Sharia Law. What gives?

Originally posted by LErickson

That is a nonsense question. Apparently you do not know much about Sharia law. You have to ask questions that make sense in order to get answers.

Yet a quick check of Wikipdia reveals that homosexuality is illegal under sharia, with some imposing the death penalty for acts perceived as sodomy and homosexual activities.

Homosexual activity is illegal under sharia, though the prescribed penalties differ from one school of jurisprudence to another.

For example, these Muslim-majority countries may impose the death penalty for acts perceived as sodomy and homosexual activities: Iran, Nigeria, Saudi Arabia, Somalia.

In contrast, in some Muslim-majority countries such as Indonesia (outside of Aceh province), Jordan, Egypt and Iraq, same-sex sexual acts are illegal but there is no specific penalty.

In Turkey, homosexual acts in private between consenting individuals are legal.

Wikipedia

Click here for more information.

Be careful, liberals are notoriously tricky liars and manipulators, at least according to their responses to this thread like "Sarah Palin is not a woman" "there is no homosexual agenda in America" (followed by an explanation of what the homosexual agenda is), etc, and my favorite, in response to the death penalty vs. abortion question, the guy LErickson just ignores it.

I do think there are reasonable answers to your questions, in fact, I read a few on here; but some people just don't know how to give them.

Originally posted by Grumble
What liberal supports Sharia Law? I certainly don't.

Perhaps it is more those 'liberals' who use marxist ideology for their own ends that can support Sharia law and homosexuality at the same time?

Under Marxist ideology, everyone is a victim, except white males who are imperialists. So Muslims are vicitms, homosexuals are victims and even white women can be victims.

Hence, supporting Muslims and homosexuals at the same time is perfectly logical if you subsrcibe to Marxist ideology.

Originally posted by darkbake
Be careful, liberals are notoriously tricky liars and manipulators, at least according to their responses to this thread like "Sarah Palin is not a woman"

No one in this thread ever said that.
So you just made it up.
What were you saying about liars and manipulators just before you wrote out that lie?

reply to post by ollncasino


I don't support muslims or homosexuals for marxist ideology, I just don't have a problem with them. Just because some muslims are against homosexuality (like most abrahamic religions) does not mean I have to be against muslims or those who choose to practice religion.

I don't live in a black and white world, where I have to draw dividing lines between groups of people. I am an atheist but think religion can be a great thing for those who believe it. I don't agree with religious fundamentalism. I don't agree with any extremism of any form.

Originally posted by LErickson
And an actual understanding of Sharia law and how it works will tell you why my Muslim neighbor has not tried to kill my gay neighbor. Do you need me to explain it to you or are you capable of reading more than a wiki page?

Yet the Wiki page has links to a site called GayLawNet which appears to have taken an interest in the laws relating to homosexuality, perhaps out of a sense of self preservation, in Muslim dominated countries.

www.gaylawnet.com...
www.gaylawnet.com...
www.gaylawnet.com...
www.gaylawnet.com...

Originally posted by LErickson
Now you are confusing culture and religion.

Yet, Muhammad is clear that homosexuality is illegal, so in what sense is it confusing culture and religion to find that Muslim dominated countries have laws making homosexuality illegal?

Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas:

The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said:

If you find anyone doing as Lot's people did, kill the one who does it, and the one to whom it is done.

Sunna Abdullah ibn Abbas Book 38, Number 4447

Muhammad made it clear that the penalty for sodomy was death.

reply to post by ollncasino


And the funny thing is that homosexual prostitution is very prevalent in Islamic culture.

Young men and boys selling their booty for connections seems to be very common.

It's a mad world.

Originally posted by ollncasino
Yet the Wiki page has links to a site called GayLawNet which appears to have taken an interest in the laws relating to homosexuality, perhaps out of a sense of self preservation, in Muslim dominated countries.

www.gaylawnet.com...
www.gaylawnet.com...
www.gaylawnet.com...
www.gaylawnet.com...

Yep because different things happen in different countries with different laws. I live in America right next door to a Muslim so I kind of do not care what they are doing in another country with different laws. I understand Sharia and so does my neighbor. Why has he not killed all the infidels in this complex?

Yet, Muhammad is clear that homosexuality is illegal, so in what sense is it confusing culture and religion to find that Muslim dominated countries have laws making homosexuality illegal?

No more so or less so than the Christian bible. So both religions have books that say gay people should die. Cool, what is your point? What does that have to do with Sharia law?

You need to stop reading wikipedia pages of notes and actually learn about Sharia law. I keep waiting for you to finally mention the most basic part of Sharia law that is why I do not fear it nor care if my neighbor adheres to it. It is one of the first things you learn when actually researching Sharia law.

Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas:

The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said:

If you find anyone doing as Lot's people did, kill the one who does it, and the one to whom it is done.

Sunna Abdullah ibn Abbas Book 38, Number 4447

Muhammad made it clear that the penalty for sodomy was death.

edit on 8-4-2012 by ollncasino because: formatting

You do not know what sodomy is do you?
I have engaged in lots of sodomy and I am not gay nor a man.

Originally posted by poet1b
And the funny thing is that homosexual prostitution is very prevalent in Islamic culture.

Young men and boys selling their booty for connections seems to be very common.

It's a mad world.

Isn't it. A world of double standards.

Unfortunately, those double standards can cut both ways, meaning if a homosexuals face doesn't fit, he can easily end up in trouble or perhaps even dead.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by ollncasino

 

And the funny thing is that homosexual prostitution is very prevalent in Islamic culture.

Young men and boys selling their booty for connections seems to be very common.

It's a mad world.

The Christian religion has the exact same view on homosexuality and look at how many church leaders have been caught with boys and men. I do not think it is a religion thing. I think it is a repression thing.

reply to post by ollncasino


Tell me, here in America what does a non-Muslim gay person have to fear from Sharia law?
I am not looking for opinion either.

reply to post by LErickson


From my understanding, the monasteries were havens for homosexuality.

I am not a big fan of Catholicism either.

They fear ostracism.

Originally posted by LErickson
Cool, what is your point? What does that have to do with Sharia law?

The Koran makes it clear that homosexuality is illegal.

Muhammad made it clear that homosexuality is illegal (penalty of death).

Sharia law makes it clear that homosexuality is illegal.

Strange that you should appear to suggest that homosexuality isn't illegal under Sharia law in this post here.

Originally posted by seabag
1) Homosexuality and Muslims - Devote Muslims kill homosexuals for being homosexual (fact). Yet, liberals support both the Homosexual agenda in America as well as Muslim Sharia Law. What gives?

I haven't heard anyone non-Islamic, even those who would consider themselves on the Left, say that they actively want Sharia Law.

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by LErickson
Cool, what is your point? What does that have to do with Sharia law?

The Koran makes it clear that homosexuality is illegal.

As does the bible.

Muhammad made it clear that homosexuality is illegal (penalty of death).

As does the bible.

Sharia law makes it clear that homosexuality is illegal.

As does Abrahamic law.

Strange that you should appear to suggest that homosexuality isn't illegal under Sharia law in this post here.

Strange you would think that when it is not what my post says. Maybe you cannot read?

It's almost as if you don't know what you are talking about.

Obviously you are the one with the problem knowing of what you speak here. I did not say any such thing. Quote me and respond to what I wrote and see how it works for you.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by LErickson

 

From my understanding, the monasteries were havens for homosexuality.

I am not a big fan of Catholicism either.

They fear ostracism.

Like I said. It points far more to repression than religion.

Originally posted by seabag
1) Homosexuality and Muslims - Devote Muslims kill homosexuals for being homosexual (fact). Yet, liberals support both the Homosexual agenda in America as well as Muslim Sharia Law. What gives?

Murder is murder is murder. There is nothing wrong with a cultural court to settle cultural issues in their own communities as long as they are not being used to supercede or circumvent the greater laws and laws of society as a whole. Or enforcing a cultural belief on someone that does not share that belief i.e. it would be improper for a sharia court to have anything to do with a case involving a non-muslim and a practicing muslim.This is easy because it saves a burden on the court system with BS cases that are easily settled.

Homosexual marriage, from the dawn of time there have been homosexuals. At the end of time there will be homosexuals. So given this why would you see it as ethical to not give a homosexual couple the same rights as a hetrosexual couple that is willing to make the same level of commitment to each other? It makes no sense at all if you believe all citizens are to be treated equally, it makes even less sense from an economic perspective.

2) Racism – (Hot topic these days…I know…I will tread lightly) It seems liberals keep the term “racists” alive. Why are vocal black democrats given praise by the left (Sharpton, Jackson, Rangel, Shiela Jackson Lee, etc) while vocal black conservatives (Clarence Thomas, Alan West, Herman Cain, etc) called names by the left?

I don't particularly care for Sharpton's or Jackson's politics, personally I think Bill Cosby has a far better view of what is wrong in many black communities. But they are not entirely wrong in many regards, and the system has done a great deal to ensure that blacks have a disadvantage. As to your conservative list what names exactly have they been called based on their race and not on their positions or actions?

Also, why do liberals continue to promote social programs that enslave blacks at poverty level? Left policies have NEVER led to black prosperity (Chicago, Detroit, ALL of California, etc are good examples) yet they get the majority of the black vote. What does the left offer that should inspire black Americans and keep their vote? I think the tide is turning, by the way. This video is a good illustration of what I’ve said.

There are more white people on social programs than there are black. Social programs come down to basically one principle. That the greatness of society will be judged in posterity by how well it treated the least of it's citizens. Unfortunately as with everything else the way our social programs are designed to keep people in a cycle of dependence on them instead of giving them a means of upward mobility and are in need of refinement.

3) Pro Women yet Anti Conservative Women – Liberals say they’re for women’s rights yet they destroyed Sarah Palin and her family in 2008. Liberals love Hillary but what did they have to say about Condoleezza?? Have liberals ever denounced all of the chauvinist remarks about Bachman?

It isn't about being Anti Conservative Women. It is being Anti-Stupid women in the case of Palin and Bachmann. Face it they open their mouth and the most uninformed, unresearched, uneducated things come out of their mouth. The only thing more frightening than what they say is the fact that people actually pay to hear them say it. Personally I have alot of respect for Condoleezza Rice, I don't particularly care for her politics but she isn't an idiot. Meghan McCain and Olympia Snowe come to mind as other examples of intelligent and respected conservative women. Women that you could actually have a conversation and work with.

4) Pro Abortion yet Anti-Death Penalty – Need I say more on this issue?

It is pro-choice not pro-abortion. Just simply phrasing the question this way points out the fact you are incapable of any meaningful conversation on the subject. I don't personally agree with abortion, but I also realize that I am not the one that has to face the hardship a child would bring. So if I am not the one that has to face it, who am I to dictate to the person that does? If we had a society that ensured every child born into it was adopted, or the family was given the resources to take care of it, then the argument on the morality of abortion could be had. Until that time it is an issue that is best left to those that have to directly deal with the consequences of the burden.

As far as the death penalty. To take a life does not bring the person they killed back. Not to mention that there is no way we can be 100% sure the person convicted is guilty. So how can I possibly be asked to condone extinguishing someone's life with the possibility of a false conviction?