The Bible and the war against God's true and only work.

Originally posted by Garfee
reply to post by Vsc1981

 

We are all blind to the truth - even those who claim they know what it is.

That's not true , Jesus has selected a remnant of the people to know the truth , they are his elect and when Satan shows up on seen they will witness against him for the spiritually blind . These elect will also be the Priests off Jesus in the millennium , they will be of the order of Melchezadek and will teach Gods word to all the people's who did not make the first reserection.

Originally posted by Vsc1981
But i am saying people are blind to the truth. Thats not being rude nor mean. Its fact! A

It is not only VERY rude, it's also VERY dumb, and very condescending.
Religion is a lot like a "male member" it's ok to have it, and to keep it in your pocket, but once you get it out and start shoving it down people's throat, then you get exactly what happened in this thread: Most people here called you out on being blind yourself: blinded by faith.

I do have a legitimate question: you seem to take the bible pretty literary, so let me ask you this:
Since God created him, did Adam have a belly button according to you?
Did Eve have one? (she was created out of a rib of Adam)

Questions for the OP:

God is the almighty creator? Meaning he creates without flaw? Then his entire creation is perfect, and without flaw. Thus, evil does not exist. Any work that claims otherwise is false, put there by God to test us, so that we reject all blasphemous doctrines which tell us to fight evil as opposed to loving the good.

The excuse or reasons given for believing the Bible are many. The two I hear most are it was written by men and there are so many versions each changing from the "original texts"

Lets address the first one. That the Bible was written by man so we can not trust it. I ask what books weren't written by men? We have books of knowledge that we have studied and learned from. Books that teach us how to teach and build, yet we do not question if they are teaching us the right way of doing either; all of which have been written by men. We do not find fault in the authors when it is found they were wrong in their original discovery or statements. We merely overlook it and move on to the next bit of knowledge until that one is proven to be incorrect as well.

Which brings me to the next one. The Bible has change based on versions. Yes it has but, unlike when other books are changed the information being corrected in those books. The underlying message of the Bible remains the same in each version.

The Bible has changed if you want to call it that but, it is more of a word is added or taken away for the ease of the reader. Unfortunately when words are added or taken away it can sometimes make it seem to change the context of the verse. This is where we find the creation of different theologies and religions. These belief systems are created on one verse taken out of context completely. Students of the Bible should not only study from one version of the Bible because of these various translations. Students are to divide the word of truth.

If verse seem to change from version to version remember the context of what it is saying. Utilize parallel Bibles so you can see each verse side by side with in their context and if all else fails refer back to the Hebrew/Greek lexicon Strong's concordance to find the real meaning of what was said.

When done this way one will see that even though the Bible may have been "re-written" or for a better word re-translated multiple times you will see that the over all message of the Bible remains the same.

reply to post by XyZeR

It is not only VERY rude, it's also VERY dumb, and very condescending.
Religion is a lot like a "male member" it's ok to have it, and to keep it in your pocket, but once you get it out and start shoving it down people's throat, then you get exactly what happened in this thread: Most people here called you out on being blind yourself: blinded by faith.

Unbelievable: I'll refrain. For one thing God thinks way ahead of men. " For we walk by faith not by sight " 2nd Cor 5:7
So how does it matter if someone is blinded by faith ?

As for your belly button question if it were important it would be in there for us to know so really. Who cares ?
You should have gone with why do men have nipples ?

reply to post by autowrench

RELIGION is responsible for millions of innocent deaths, and people even today are being killed in the name of Jesus Christ.

This is because fools do not read the bible, particularly the areas where Jesus says to love your enemies as you love your friends/neighbors/self and forgive them their tresspasses. Jesus>old law.

Originally posted by the2ofusr1
reply to post by SOILDERSUNITEDFORCHRIST

 

The seal of God by E.R.Fink is a good example of a study of hiptatic structure . www.mun.ca... .The original work done by F. C. PAYNE ,was well before computers that would be required to even attempt to repourduce a similar work ... But yet as we become better educated and have tools to delve into the word we find micro structures that could only come from a all knowing God . A sample from page 110www.mun.ca...

There are six Greek words which are found nowhere else in Matthew.



Their numeric value is exactly 5,005

715-7's



These six Greek words have exactly 56 letters

8-7's



Now the first two verses, a natural division, have exactly 42 words

6-7's



leaving 119

17-7's



The last verse, another natural division, has exactly, 14 words

2-7's



leaving 147

3-7's of 7's



Again the 161 words occur in 105 forms

15-7's



The numeric value of these forms is exactly 65,429

9,347-7's



In these 105 forms there are exactly 35 verbs

5-7's



There are also exactly 7 Proper Names

7



The number of letters in these names is exactly 42

6-7's


The word 'Emmanuel' is used here but nowhere else in the N.T.




Its numeric value is 644

92-7's



The sum of its figures is 14

2-7's



The number of forms exclusive to this passage is 14

2-7's



Their numeric value is exactly 8,715

1,245-7's


Now we have another remarkable occurrence.

The angel speaks to Joseph, and although his words form another pattern of their own, they fit exactly into the whole!




In speaking to Joseph the angel uses, of the 77 vocabulary words, exactly 28

4-7's



The numeric value of all the angel's words is exactly 21,042

3,006-7's



The angel uses exactly 35 forms

5-7's



These 35 forms have exactly 168 letters

24-7's



The numeric value of these letters is exactly 19,397

2,771-7's



Now the angel, in using only 28 of the vocabulary words leaves exactly 49

7-7's



In using exactly 35 forms he leaves exactly 70

10-7's



The sum of the figures 70 is 7 and, its factors, 7 + 2 + 5 is 14


2-7's

This is way over my head.

Originally posted by SpeachM1litant
Honestly if you subscribe to the motto deny ignorance, you should probably abondan the bible and religion.

Not really. What you consider ignorance, other people consider truth. Maybe we consider you ignorant. Reality is based on each individual's perception, and we all have shared perceptions with others of like mind.

TextThe Bible has changed if you want to call it that but, it is more of a word is added or taken away for the ease of the reader. Unfortunately when words are added or taken away it can sometimes make it seem to change the context of the verse. This is where we find the creation of different theologies and religions. These belief systems are created on one verse taken out of context completely. Students of the Bible should not only study from one version of the Bible because of these various translations. Students are to divide the word of truth.

reply to post by the4thhorseman




Revelation 22:19

Text 19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

The only reliable bible is the KJV bible all others have been changed so bad you can not use a Strongs concordance to bring the verses back to the original languages the manuscripts were written in. Some of these changes in just one word changes the whole meaning of the text and what God was warning us of . Satan is a scripture master and knows how to change it just ever so to lead he masses into perdition.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


Yeah. Or because "fools" read the parts where god tells his followers to kill non-believers or people of other faiths.

reply to post by Vsc1981


Though I fully understand your point. I believe that God (Jehovah), God the Son (Jesus) and God the Holy Spirit are the only true way to Heaven. I also will say that there is some truth in many places if we are truly searching and seeking His truth instead of our own. To limit God and say He can not speak one way to one and another way to another is actually false. He can speak to whom ever He chooses to and how He chooses too.

God is Sovereign and He needs no explanation of what He does or does not do. I have found in my walk that everything is not written in the Bible. I have also found that there have been things that have been changed in the Word of God (Bible) down through the years. however, I have came to know and understand that it in my faith, my belief, and my relationship with God that matters not what "everyone" says or does.

It does get hard at times when you want to share and show others the Love you have deep within your heart that God showed you. My thing was "God, why don't they see, why don't they listen?" The answer was very simple, it is at His timing, not mine. So, I pray for them and go on. I will show them the Love I have through example and through conversation knowing that God will move in His timing and everything will line up perfectly.

We are to let our light shine so that others may see it, not try and force them to accept it. In my opinion, I have a saying, to each his own. Yes, that saying has been around for many years, however, it suffices for this situation and discussing. We need to be whom we are, and not jump to oppose others for who they are. Accept them the way they are, and live by example.....!!!!

I enjoyed reading your post and wanted to share a few things here....

reply to post by Vsc1981


I do agree with you mostly, although I do not believe the Bible is completely infallible and without any error. I could point out verses that prove the Bible is not the perfect "word of God".

The Bible is mans best interpretation of God and what His character is.... God didn't write it, He influenced men to write it.

S&F for a good thread. Way to be a soldier for Christ! Amen

reply to post by Vsc1981


Vsc1981,
Thanks for posting!
You do know however know though that almost every story from the Bible, is taken from another story dating back much further than the Bible, different religions and races.
Also every Christian holiday is stolen and derived from other religions, mostly Pagan holidays...Not raining on your parade, just being real. The word you read is a revised, written book of an original you have never seen. You do not have proof what was recorded was really God's word, nor if anyone writting was who they say they were.
I went to a Christian Academy for years and have read the whole Bible backwards and forwards, I could recite it if need be. But if you have actually read it too, and cared enough to study other religions, and your own, you will see no originality in the Bible. Just an attempt to block out other beliefs and direct it all towards one. Whats funny is Christianity comes sooooo long after every other religion yet Christians don't care to learn where their word really came from, a mix of all. You know quite a few people worshipped women before God, the Goddess? And many other Gods were worshipped. Christians took Pan, a Greek God, and gave him the name of the Devil.
It reminds me of the time in Egypt when the pharoh tried to erase many Gods off walls of the pyramids while he was in rule, only for when he was no longer in rule his son to go back to the normal ways of Egypt, worshipping more than one God, instead of giving all ode to one.
Surprizingly, a lot of what is wrong in the Bible is ass backwards. Read some, it is fun to learn!
Everyone has to learn for themselves, I am just being honest and telling you, question everything you are told. Form your own opinions.

reply to post by Vsc1981


Vsc1981,
Thanks for posting!
You do know however know though that almost every story from the Bible, is taken from another story dating back much further than the Bible, different religions and races.
Also every Christian holiday is stolen and derived from other religions, mostly Pagan holidays...Not raining on your parade, just being real. The word you read is a revised, written book of an original you have never seen. You do not have proof what was recorded was really God's word, nor if anyone writting was who they say they were.
I went to a Christian Academy for years and have read the whole Bible backwards and forwards, I could recite it if need be. But if you have actually read it too, and cared enough to study other religions, and your own, you will see no originality in the Bible. Just an attempt to block out other beliefs and direct it all towards one. Whats funny is Christianity comes sooooo long after every other religion yet Christians don't care to learn where their word really came from, a mix of all. You know quite a few people worshipped women before God, the Goddess? And many other Gods were worshipped. Christians took Pan, a Greek God, and gave him the name of the Devil.
It reminds me of the time in Egypt when the pharoh tried to erase many Gods off walls of the pyramids while he was in rule, only for when he was no longer in rule his son to go back to the normal ways of Egypt, worshipping more than one God, instead of giving all ode to one.
Surprizingly, a lot of what is wrong in the Bible is ass backwards. Read some, it is fun to learn!
Everyone has to learn for themselves, I am just being honest and telling you, question everything you are told. Form your own opinions.

The Bible was written by Humans not God... The stories in it were written by Humans not God e.g The Bible . Infact all versions of every religious text on this planet.... "WAS WRITTEN BY HUMAN HAND AND HUMAN INTERPRETATION OF DOCUMENTS WRITTEN BY HUMANS". God hasn't written a word unless we take into account, "The Ten Commandments" but they are lost or inside a hut in the middle of Ethiopia.
True faith doesn't rely on what has been written in any book... Whats the point?.... you just don't understand how and what life is... carry on reading your book if it helps, the truth is so much more enlightening than any written human book....

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
I gave you a star for the rest of your post, good stuff. But this part I've taken exception to. I don't know exactly where you get your information from, but the Council at Nicea didn't make Jesus God in 325 AD, they voted on how to exactly define His deity from scripture. Was He eternal, or was He still created, but way before the angels and the universe?

A bishop from Alexandria, Egypt (Gnostic headquarters) Arius began to teach that Jesus WASN'T God incarnate, that He was created by the Father, less than God. Arius got a big cadre of people to follow him and it was tearing apart the church at Alexandria. Constantine called the council to address the issue. No different than the apostles councils they called twice to vote on things in Jerusalem. The only ones to abstain from voting with the creed was Arius's two companions. Oh yeah, and Constantine had not vote.

Thank You for the Star!

That is a good question and I suppose to couch this answer in the correct light that we have to travel back to the times of Mary, Joseph, and Jesus being exposed to the teachings of Alexandria and what they took home to the Phonecian area of Mt. Carmel and the home of the Essene Church there.

Today, we can visually travel to this area and see some of the old ruins where Jesus walked and was taught, and to what many of the Bible Narratives speak:

www.essene.com...

www.essene.com...

It appears that Arius knew the most, perhaps because what the Essene learned from Alexandria, in terms of astrology and reading the skies allowed him to have the greater insights into the Essene's teachings and religious motivations. Of the three Jewish sects of the period, Pharisee, Sadducee, and Essene, the Essene were known as the most truthful and most honest and held most close to the original belief of Moses as he departed from the Egyptian's closeness with the gods associated with Nimrod, Semiramis, and Tammuz. Egypt cloned these same Babylon gods under different names, but the same associations as to their relevance and being worshiped.

What Joseph, Mary, and Jesus gleened from Egypt appears to be lots of learning about religion's sordid history and they took that and followed the old teachings as they came to disrespect not only the Egytian gods cloned from Babylon's tyranny, but also the Jewish Babylon Talmud version of god was also rejected. In order to attempt to change away from the ways of evil from Babylon infecting the Second Temple, they decided to follow the old astrology concepts and move back into the most revered theme for God from Moses experiences.

As the Essene story develops, Joseph is an Essene Religious Master teacher and he knows the religious themes well. In the astrology theme, the alignments of three stars in the heavens marks the time for the making of a King, Savior, or a Messiah. Mary is one of the temple females considered to be most chaste and pure, and Joseph seeks to marry Mary to create their special child to deliver man from evil by teaching him all the most pious issues of religion gleened from Alexandria and Judaic history. The retelling of the story is splintered a good bit due to transliteration issues and perhaps too much use of allegory methods common to the aramic language. But for those that can include these features the story is most true, but not in the sense that too many in religion attempt to suggest Mary's was a Virgin Birth or supernatural theme. Going into the supernatural theme gets back to the story of Sematamis and Babylon to make Tammus, so most all consider that a great wrong. But it is part of the infections of the Pagan issues into the story of Jesus, which Arius understood.

The Essene sought to bring into the world a man that would be held high above all others as to his pious teachings on religion, and this person would be the Essene Messiah sent by God to deliver man from the Evils of Babylon's Pagan gods. Words get swapped around some in the retelling over time, so that when they mean't to explain Mary was most pure, it becomes she is a Virgin, and Virgin Birth. This gets into misunderstanding the term Immaculate Conception, as that only mean't that the parents of Jesus were most pure in their theology and pious respect for the theme of God. Joseph and Mary were just linked to high master priest issues of the Essene and they were both most pure of their religion concepts, but Jesus came into the world in the usual way with the standard human procreation method. Arius appears to have understood well these language problems and allegory methods to retell the story of how Jesus came into specialness for the Essene. Jesus was called a Nazarine, because they lived near the Mt. Carmel area that was close to the area of Nazareth and the battlefield area of Armageddon.

Many, as they attempt to pin down the day of Jesus real Birth go back to the time of the astrology and look for the alignment of the three planets that mean't that a Savior or Messiah was to be born. And with computer methods these days some have traced that down to around April 17. It was this planetary alignment that the Wise Men were said to be following as they searched for this theme for a Messiah to come unto the world to deliver man from evil and into a higher realm. On March 15 there is a good planetary alignment in the US western skies due to Venus and Jupiter, so be sure to watch this conjuction and think back to the times of the Essene's and their sign for a Messiah to be born. Signs from the Heavens were important to the Egyptians and the Essene. This book speaks to the planet's alignment issues for the Star and finding Jesus Birthday:

www.eclipse.net...

The Essene sought to make Heaven Upon the Earth and do that with utmost truth to promote everyone being a servant toward their fellow man. The Essene lived simply and they didn't seek great wealth, and they were very communal and even socialistic in how they held money in common. They were very different that the Pharisee and Sadducee in this regard.

So, Arius was the more correct as to the origins of Jesus coming into the world to become a Messiah, perhaps because the Essene learned from the Alexandrians and they shared the information and tradiations in common and both understood the celestial signs popular in Egypt. As we get into the times of Constantine, this issue of the truth was starting to take over and the like issues of the Pharisees being threatened by the Messiah's real story was at issue. The Council wanted to only allow a vote on which method that Jesus became considered God, and never to explore or touch upon the fact that Jesus was a high master Essene Priest and very special in his learning and teaching, he was very inspired and devinely inspired, yet a man. It was the Constantine period that Jesus was cemented into the theme that he was God, and the real story of the Essene and Arius was burried. Jesus had to be made to more look like the god Nimrod and Tammus to stay compatable with the Roman Empire's games for wealth and control, as the real story of Communial Living and Shared wealth was not something Rome desired to make popular.

Most consider the major turning point was Constantine because this Council attained consensus that Jesus was God, and Constantine went on to Commission Bibles built on this concept as that concept was ratified. So, what we get again is a corruption of religion of the same sort that the Essene and Jesus sought to correct and save the masses from the methods of tyranny from Babylon. Thus, the issues of Revelations stem from the knowledge that Jesus didn't get to fix this problem in his time and that two millenia later that the truth would come out and more and more people would wake up as to what the Essene and Jesus wanted to do to save mankind of eternal wars for wealth. They had the formula for Peace, return of Heaven Upon the Earth, and the most poius concepts for God rendered as good stewardship to others and being servants to each other's well being.

The Essene were healers and always cared for the unfortunate. Jesus was one of the best, and if one really looks for the secrets of religion one find the theme for the Eucharis involve bread and wine and the area of Mt. Carmel and the Jordan River was very rich in a mineral called Boron and this mineral balanced the body well and was an essential element for good health and longevity. Even today, this area of the Holy Land is known for Boron in the water and food and Israel has the lowest rates of Arthritus due to Boron's effects on bone health. Jesus never got the chance to fully explain this either, but the Last Supper as a part of the Lord's Supper ritual tells this story. The Last Supper was over the Tomb of David, and connected with the Essene Quarter of Jerusalem. The Essene highly valued David and were the Guardians for the Tomb of David. Jesus was blood related to Daviid, also making the story for the Messiah all the more perfect in its rendition by the Essene's design for their Messiah. It is a signficant story for the Messiah, but one that few can grasp because the reality has been so cloudied by the need to make Jesus into Nimrod and Tammuz, which is the theme of the anti-Christ.

Today, we can even go visit some of the little known issues of the Essene in Jerusalem, as they discover the Essene Gateway there and how the Essene's lived:

www.centuryone.org...

There is a lot to learn on religion that is outside the Bible's 66 Book Narratives and these other informations are essential to understanding how those 66 books came into being and deeper associations. Some would tell that "Ignorance is Bliss", but when such ignornance allows those so blind to worship Babylon's Satanic Image more than Jesus, then that shall never be blessed as you have become the anti-Christ. That is the prophecy for the end times and the corruption of the church by the anti-Christ.

I hope this addresses your question in sufficient detail as to the merits of Arius and the critical junction in the times of Constantine and the Council. There are a lot of good Internet Sites to read more of the Essene, which the Bible's Narratives omit, but no one can know Jesus without the study of the Essene.

Originally posted by randyvs
Unbelievable: I'll refrain.

Did that offend you? Good, maybe now you can understand ... it works the same way the other way around like what you said here:

For one thing God thinks way ahead of men. " For we walk by faith not by sight " 2nd Cor 5:7

I can't respond to this mumbo jumbo bible quotes, what does that even mean?
"For we walk by faith not by sight" I get that, cause if you would walk by sight, you might actually see the huge gaping logic holes in the fairy tale that is the Bible
Do you realise the bible was written as one big collection of metaphores that can be applied to life?

So how does it matter if someone is blinded by faith ?

It matters to me, when someone starts a spectacularly ignorant thread ona forum who's motto is deny ignorance, and then have the sheer audacity to call people with a different way of thinking ignorant.

As for your belly button question if it were important it would be in there for us to know so really. Who cares ?

I CARE, you see i posed that question for a reason, to check whether people have ever really thought about the fiction that is the creation story in the bible. The fact that you dismiss with a simple "Who cares" is enough to ensure me you have never really critically thought about what the bible proclaims as "thruth"

You should have gone with why do men have nipples ?

I have a list of 506 thing that are UNintelligently designed ( example on the human body : what kind of deluded "god" designed a waste- facility so close to our reproductive facilities...?)

edit= fixed quote tags

reply to post by XyZeR

example on the human body : what kind of deluded "god" designed a waste- facility so close to our reproductive facilities..

The same kind that made the airway and esophagus accessible through the same hole.

I had never thought of the belly-button issue because I've never believed in the Adam/Eve myth. Preposterous. If anything, I can see how it is conceivable that we are here due to off-planet beings coming and injecting their DNA into primitive forms of homo species...
I'm not sure I believe it completely yet, but honestly, it makes more sense, and with the symbols left behind (both on cave-walls and in megastructures, all over the planet, including underwater), it just seems to me that "we" are not the first and best crowd that has ever lived here or been here, and we are certainly not the only civilization that has arisen and collapsed. Like a flan in a cupboard. We, if we keep this up, are going down, same as all the ancients did, from Egypt to Rome to Sumeria to Axtec and Mayan and all those that are now submerged and remembered only as "legends."

I'm learning that the gods of our current cycle of sentience, being a pantheon, were only merged when Philo was writing, trying to merge Greek and Monotheism. He's the man. Lived at the same time as Christ.

Before Monotheism, every time a nation invaded or absorbed another nation, the gods of each were embraced.

People said, I worship El. Oh! I worship Yahweh, but El's cool too.....sure, go ahead, keep your shrine, and we'll even put on in our neighborhood as well! Until then it wasn't cool anymore. Then some jackass decided "your god is crap", so I'm going to kill it, and kill you if you don't start worshiping mine and ONLY MINE.

Ridiculous.

Tolerance was the original method; there was a hierarchy of gods just as there are hierarchies of people, dogs, horses, birds, ants, bees.....someone is in charge. And there was a god for each tribe or community. When they started to blend together through trade, it was mutually beneficial to accept the others' gods...non-zero-sum....win/win. But no, the win/lose streak took hold, and voila. War, hatred, excessive greed, monopolies.

Insisting that other people's deities do not exist is: Just. Plain. Stupid.

For more information and a fascinating linear history of the phenomenon:www.evolutionofgod.net...
Robert Wright
The Evolution of God
2009, Little Brown.

Just in case anyone is tempted but afraid, or wants to poo-poo it out of hand, thinking their faith will be dissed, or the author is just another heretic demon posing as an author:
no nonono.....he actually EXPLAINS how we got to here, does NOT discuss ancient aliens (yet, but I'm not done with it yet), and holds out hope for a unified humanity based on faith and cooperation.

A must-read for anyone who follows or is interested in the Abrahamic religions. And funny, too, even while it discusses serious things.

reply to post by XyZeR

Did that offend you? Good, maybe now you can understand ... it works the same way the other way around like what you said here:

Offended ? Please get in line.

I can't respond to this mumbo jumbo bible quotes, what does that even mean?
"For we walk by faith not by sight" I get that, cause if you would walk by sight, you might actually see the huge gaping logic holes in the fairy tale that is the Bible
Do you realise the bible was written as one big collection of metaphores that can be applied to life?

The thing about people like you who are always ready to ridicule and scoff at what someone believes is the best
explanation they've come across for this existence ? Is that you do so without offering anything better. Please
in all your wisdom, level the playing field and tell us, how everything came to be?

Also I don't see how you can count out any possibility that makes it's home here on earth. How long have you been around and a fully functional know it all ? 30 yrs tops ? Prolly far less.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by autowrench

 

RELIGION is responsible for millions of innocent deaths, and people even today are being killed in the name of Jesus Christ.

This is because fools do not read the bible, particularly the areas where Jesus says to love your enemies as you love your friends/neighbors/self and forgive them their tresspasses. Jesus>old law.

Right?? Would not all those evil people be the examples of the wolves in sheep's clothing who would infest His church and lead His sheep astray? Christ warned they were coming.