Piercings and tattoos at work

This will be unpopular as hell.

It's all about social class. There are rules about what middle and upper class members of society do, and what they avoid.

Tattoos are still by and large, a working class phenomenon. Getting a tatt will help you fit in with that crowd. So will smoking and having a bit of a gut on an older male.

Yes, you can be in management with a tattoo, or a cigarette addiction. Or a big gut. But each one is a strike against you, and will make people in the upper classes a bit squeamish.

People who notice the social friction are the ones either changing class, or not being allowed entry into the level they desire.

Originally posted by Caggy
uin the work i have right now, i can have tats and piercings with no problem, i was planning to get my first two tats in december... but now there's another job opportunity that's way better but I cannot have any (visible) tattoo, and i'll need to wear a skirt all time... and i want to have them on my ankles (twin wings, Hermes related).

if i get the job, well, i'll get them later =/...

So you would sell yourself out like that?

You believe in the same thing as your employer, and you jump ship and leave as soon as something 'better' by socioeconomic standard completely topples what you should stand for. In this economy it is real easy to be picky about specifics in hiring practice and dress code.

I'm baffled at you artful cognitive dissonance.

Each company has the right to require their own dress codes, tattoo/jewelry options.
Many people still view the tattoo, along with body piercings,as a negative perception and lack of professionalism.

Take UPS for an example, they have specific requirements on the above, including facial hair, hair length and neatness.The more exposed to customers in your job field, the more likely the scrutiny will be higher on tats.

Originally posted by tovenar
This will be unpopular as hell.

It's all about social class. There are rules about what middle and upper class members of society do, and what they avoid.

Tattoos are still by and large, a working class phenomenon. Getting a tatt will help you fit in with that crowd. So will smoking and having a bit of a gut on an older male.

Yes, you can be in management with a tattoo, or a cigarette addiction. Or a big gut. But each one is a strike against you, and will make people in the upper classes a bit squeamish.

People who notice the social friction are the ones either changing class, or not being allowed entry into the level they desire.

Haha, I had to reply to this as a person who had all three at one stage (only the tats are left), it didn't stop me from gaining upper level management in a major corporation for almost 15 years. The difference is my tats can be covered if need be, and most people I deal with, even my own employees would never know if I didn't tell them. The dress code in the retail industry has relaxed somewhat, 24 years ago it was in B&W that tattoos and piercings had to be covered regardless. Nowadays they simply state "Tattoos that are considered offensive must be covered while working." Many people assume their rights are the only rights when in an employee/employer capacity, but the rules exist to cover fairness to all involved, including those who do the hiring and firing. Unfortunately we all answer to someone, only the person at the top has the right to make the rules as he/she sees fit.
The company I work for now is a lot smaller, but tattoos must be covered while on the job. This is simply to maintain a professional appearance, and it is part of the T&Cs of having such a job. Piercings are the same, although two girls that work for us have a nose ring and one has snakebites. They simply place smaller, indistinguishable jewels that can hardly be seen, and I agree they look less unsightly than a band-aid covering the area.
In regards to the OP, your issue seems to be less about the piercings and more about a dispute with a co-worker that seems to be using it to create a storm in a teacup. My advice; hand 'em a shovel and let 'em dig their own grave, people who s#-stir for the sake of an argument usually shoot themselves in the foot before long, and usually in spectacular fashion too... I must ask though, does your job, even though it is in the automotive industry bring you into contact with the public or prospective clientele, or is it more a closed door position? If you have contact with the public, perhaps gauge your own reactions to how you would deal with someone you came to for professional advice, I would suspect you would want them to be a certain way, and appear a certain way even if that persona is faked. We are who we are, and having a host of tattoos doesn't change that one iota IMO, but sometimes you just gotta be that someone who impresses to get the job done. Just to prove, a close friend is a lawyer, who dresses in suits and ties, goes to court on weekdays, and then chucks on his leathers on the weekend, exposing pretty much everything from the wrist to the neck to the ankles in a full length bodysuit of ink, that, well, it looks awesome... The inked biker is who he truly is, but during the week he does the Superman and puts on his suit to pay the bills...

reply to post by comfylevy


It's a judgmental thing. Too many baby boomers fail at the live and let live mentality that they actually believed in, back when they were the ones doing it at woodstock. They largely failed at their quest for change, and now they wish to oppress others that want social change. They're probably the most judgmental group of people in this country, that were once all about forward thinking mentality. Hypocrites.

When was the last time you saw a young person following around an old person demanding that their shorts and pale as a ghost hairy chicken legs were offensive? When was the last time a fat old man was heckled off a beach because he was unsightly in his speedo? When was the last time an old person with denture breath working at their job was told directly by a young customer that they were offensive? Probably not often, but things like that do offend others equally as much as they are offended by tattoos or piercings. The difference is, we have the respect to keep our objections to ourselves, and get over it because it's not a big deal. It's high time old folks were held to the same physically judgmental standards they wish to push on us.

If they want me to stop piercing my face, then I want them to get a reasonable amount of sun on their legs, cover themselves with more than string, and brush their dentures every single day so that I can speak to them without having to fight my nose turning up at the smell. What's fair, is fair.

reply to post by getreadyalready

Why does society have a lot of growing up to do?

Racism, homophobia and xenophobia are rampant, we fight wars and squabble over resources and our politicians are all corrupt. I could go on and on, suffice it to say there are a LOT of ways society could grow up. It's not that I'm saying tattoos should be mainstream, merely that they should be accepted as commonplace by now, it's the 21st century, you'd think discrimination based on body art would be as dead as discrimination based on natural skin color... instead both are alive and kicking. So yeah, a lot of growing up to do.

Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
It's not that I'm saying tattoos should be mainstream, merely that they should be accepted as commonplace by now, it's the 21st century, you'd think discrimination based on body art would be as dead as discrimination based on natural skin color... instead both are alive and kicking. So yeah, a lot of growing up to do.

You mean that people should accept things they don't like, because its what YOU want.

It would be like all the stores switching to playing classical music in every public space. What if you don't like it? Tough. But no one expects you to be happy about it.

Here again we see the difference between tolerance and approval.

Expecting tolerance is one thing. The definition of tolerate, after all, is to endure something that is disliked. But what you are really demanding is approval. That people like the things you like, and not be irritated by the things that...irritate them.

Small children are often uneasy around tattoos, unless family members have them. The fangs and horns and blackeyes and whatnot are supposed to look like Halloween, and they succeed at their aim.

People don't get tattoos to look cuddly and approachable, they get them to look fierce or sexy. And people who aren't in the mood to be intimidated or sexualized don't like them. Who can be surprised by that?

My mom has a few tattoos, I think 6, and her co-workers have even gone as far as to say, "You look really nice today, except for THIS" and point to her tattoo. It's really petty is you ask me. It has nothing to do with people professional, or decent, or anything like that. It's all about making someone feel like less than you. It's ink, big deal, if you don't like my tattoo then sorry, don't look at it. But there is no reason to make me cover my body day in and day out just because YOU don't agree with my lifestyle. Let's just agree to disagree. Whats next, having to wear a company hat if your hair is two-toned, or an unnatural hair color?

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


Race isn't a choice, like a tattoo. Sexuality is not apparent by a mere look, unless the person intends it to be, and in that case they are intentionally eliciting a reaction, so they have no right to complain when they are successful at getting that reaction. Xenophobia is taught to our kids! We are supposed to be wary of strangers!

If a person makes a conscious decision to change their appearance in a manner that is known to elicit certain reactions, then what right do they have to complain about those reactions?

The OP here is a little different. She has a subtle piercing not intended to be offensive. She has a valid argument. But, those with gawdy and overt piercings and tattoos are intentionally vying for negative attention, and they have no right to complain when they are treated exactly as they expected to be treated. They want to be viewed as outsiders, treated as outsiders, feared or given some extra personal space, and that is what they get, they should be happy.

reply to post by Celestica

Whats next, having to wear a company hat if your hair is two-toned, or an unnatural hair color?

Yes. Absolutely. It's my company, if I don't like your purple hair, you can dye it, cover it, or look for an employer that better suits your needs. If I want everyone wearing an engineer hat, then they will all wear an engineer hat or start looking for a different employer.

reply to post by Celestica


Um, the hat thing has been going on forever, and yes they do that at some places. It really comes down to the fact that society has decided to tolerate some things that they may even find more offensive, but not this one. It's something that's more or less a youth thing, and we get walked all over. I think it shows a lack of respect from the elder generation. I'm going to start telling that nasty old man that bags my groceries with his smelly dentures and licking his dirty fingers to get the hell away from my purchase. I'm tired of being a tolerant and open minded person only to have these people throw it back in my face and ridicule me.

While we're at it, the tea party can take a long walk off a short pier as well. Bunch of racists in disguise imo.

reply to post by Evolutionsend

If they want me to stop piercing my face, then I want them to get a reasonable amount of sun on their legs, cover themselves with more than string, and brush their dentures every single day so that I can speak to them without having to fight my nose turning up at the smell. What's fair, is fair.

I totally agree!

A subtle piercing is nothing compared to ugly legs, halitosis, or improper dress. Fair is Fair. Everyone better look and act professional, tidy, and presentable. Anything that causes someone to flinch away is a bad thing. Bad breath, body odor, wrinkled clothing, slurred speech, bloodshot eyes, or scars and wounds should all be dealt with directly.

I've had the unfortunate experience of having to address employees with body odor problems, an employees with pet odor problems, and employees with extreme dental problems. None of those things have a place in a retail or professional setting. It is what it is. They can either take care of their self, or get a job that doesn't have contact with the general public.

ETA:

While we're at it, the tea party can take a long walk off a short pier as well. Bunch of racists in disguise imo.

And for the record, I'm a Tea Partier. My local Tea Party is about 25% black, and 10% Hispanic just about identical to my local community. The racist stuff is old and stale. Don't fall victim to the liberal presses talking points. Go visit a Tea Party rally if you don't believe me.

reply to post by getreadyalready


I could go down a whole list of rants about other people's views, but I don't. Know why? Tolerance. You want my tolerance? Give me yours. It goes both ways, and I've never met a person that someone on this earth could not nitpick at over something. It's all petty, it doesn't matter. Like someone else said, society needs to grow up.

reply to post by getreadyalready


That's stupid. Why would you force people to do something they don't want to do? Why make unnecessary drama? All that's going to do is drive people or business away from you, and those that stick with your little hats are just going to hate you anyway. Why would you do that on purpose? This is so kids in the sandbox, why can't people just get along and stop worrying about what other people do?

reply to post by Celestica


It was a hypothetical, but if I'm running a business, and I'm the visionary that sees the business a certain way, and it is my money on the line, and it is my decision to hire and fire, and I am the one answering to the customers and the bankers and the lawyers, then it is solely my decision how my customer service staff will look.

If I decide that a little train engineer's hat serves some purpose and will increase my bottom line, then it is perfectly acceptable to make my employees wear the hat.

It is quite common in business to wear uniforms. It is quite common to have a script to follow at the counter or on the phone. There is very little room for self-expression for an employee, and if they don't like it, then their participation is always voluntary, and they are free to opt out at any time.

reply to post by Celestica


He supports the rights of corporations and small businesses to control your body at your place of work. He does not support banning employees from having piercings completely. It's a reasonable stance, but he was just used to make a point. You say piercings are offensive, I say bad breathe is offensive. At some point, we all need to, "cry a river, build a bridge, and get over it".

reply to post by Evolutionsend

He supports the rights of corporations and small businesses to control your body at your place of work. He does not support banning employees from having piercings completely.

Very true. My wife once got called to the office at her bank. At a bar, on a Friday night, she was in one bathroom stall, and in the next stall was a black girl complaining about their white boss. (My wife is white.) Our circle of friends is very eclectic and racial discussions are quite common and entertaining. My wife tells the black girl, "Don't worry about her, she's just a cracker, she doesn't get it." It was funny to them both. There was some alcohol involved, it was midnight on a Friday miles from the work place, and it was one white girl calling another white girl a cracker. Unbeknownst to them, the third stall had a third co-worker and she was offended, and they all went to the office Monday morning. The boss that was called that name was crying, the 3rd party went to her first, etc., etc., etc.

WOW! No employer has a right to know or influence anything that happens outside of the work place. That is just stupid. I'm not even 100% in favor of drug tests unless they suspect usage on the job.

reply to post by Evolutionsend


I don't think it's reasonable. If something makes me unhappy its unreasonable, if the only purpose something serves is to put extra money into YOUR pocket then its unreasonable. Money, money, money. It's so stupid. If I had a business than I would let people dress how they want, no cover-ups. If it makes you happy, do it.

reply to post by Celestica


It would be nice if they all would agree with the fact that piercings are not offensive, but they won't. I do not like the fact that they are trying to extend that control over me outside of my job. They're not so much trying to, as they are capitulating to coward. I still do not like it though.

I'm not sure if there's an actual law about employers trying to dictate body changes, but there should be one. Then again, they would cry about that too. Omg I hired this dancer and now she's 300 lbs QQ. It never really stops. We as a society have to stand up for even the small things, that is what will fix this. Perhaps those of us with piercings are too tolerant?

reply to post by Celestica


What if it makes me happy to sleep with your wife? Or just take my lunch money from the drawer? Or tell the customers exactly how I feel about their ridiculous special requests? What if I just happen to have a bad case of gas that day? They can still buy their scones and coffees despite the rotten egg smell, it makes me feel better to just let it go. What if I want to wear a Pasty over my nipples and a loin cloth?

You're being ridiculous to think you can just let people do whatever they want or whatever makes them happy. I hope you're not a parent. Sometimes responsibility is more important than just feeling good.

If it was your business, you have responsibilities to keep your people employed and keep your bills paid. If one employee is damaging the business, you have to protect the others by getting the one to either cooperate or leave.

It sucks to be the boss sometimes. Maybe you're not cut out for it.