500 Longshoremen Storm a Government Building, Take Hostages (Longview, Washington)

Originally posted by megabytz
reply to post by MidnightTide

 

No not mad I knew it was bs as soon as I saw the title.

The tea party has given me plenty of reason to bash and criticize their fake astroturf populist "movement", I don't need another one.

The tea party is to American politics what taco bell is to Mexican food,
A cheap populist substitute that leaves you full of crap.

There I got a little bashing in.

Yes, your mad or you would have just ignored my comment. But that is ok. I for one realize that the public Tea Party has been corrupted by corporate interests, the same as the GOP - unlike the liberal crowd here at ATS is unable to realize the Democrats are as bad as the rest of them.

The Tea Party maybe corrupted, but the ideals that made the Party are alive and well.

But your comment did put a smile on my face...thanks.

Originally posted by NoHierarchy
That's complete BULLSH*T beezer and you know it!!

These union protesters have good reason to do what they're doing.

What you FAIL to realize is that the REASONS and the TARGETS of such protest are EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to whether or not people support their actions.

If the Tea Party engaged in such a thing... I imagine it would be to the WRONG targets and for the WRONG reasons. However, if they targeted the RIGHT things and for the RIGHT reasons, I WOULD SUPPORT THEM!! But until they wise up and do the right thing, the tea party has only proven it is a puppet movement meant to rally scared xenophobes into fighting against their own best interests. These union members are FIGHTING FOR THEIR BEST INTERESTS and not taking any crap from higher-ups and corporate pigs. And MORE POWER TO THEM.

Stop your divisive propaganda and wake up to the DETAILS of reality, your assumptions are false and your support misguided.

Longshoremen storm Wash. state port, damage RR
Emphasis mine:

Six guards were held hostage for a couple of hours after 500 or more Longshoremen broke down gates about 4:30 a.m. and smashed windows in the guard shack, he said.

The blockade appeared to defy a federal restraining order issued last week against the union after it was accused of assaults and death threats.

Union Dispute, Turning Violent, Spreads and Idles Ports

Judge Leighton had issued the original restraining order at the request of the National Labor Relations Board, which said that the longshoremen’s union was engaged in unfair labor practices and improperly harassing workers at the EGT terminal.

Judge Leighton told the union’s lawyers on Thursday that there was a peaceful way to protest. “It requires some restraint,” he said. “Your clients have none of that.”

“They have to obey local laws,” he added. “They must restrain themselves from violence, threats, vandalism and the like."

Why all the ruckus in the first place?

Longshoremen back at Seattle port after clash

The situation at the plant has been simmering since November 2010, when EGT told the ILWU it would not be hiring union Longshoremen to man its giant grain plant — jobs the union had counted on and the Port of Longview had assumed would be given to union workers when it finalized its 30-year lease with the company in 2009.

However, EGT said the lease gives it the option not to hire union workers. In its lawsuit against the port, EGT wrote, "The lease did not impose any obligation whatsoever upon EGT to utilize union labor at the terminal, much less obligate EGT to utilize persons who are represented by Local 21 of the International Longshore and Warehouse Union."

The Port disputes this, saying it had a working agreement with the union that EGT knew about when it began negotiating the lease in 2007.

So EGT says the lease gives them the option to hire anyone they want to, but the port says they had a "working agreement" with them for work. A working agreement is not a contract, it is permission. The port is claiming to be wronged even though the lease (supposedly) says no wrong was done.

The ILWU thinks they are entitled to something they are legally not, if the lease is written as EGT says it is. We won't know until there is a ruling. But they have done nothing so far to convince a rational person that taking hostages with the threat of harm is a good reason for anything.

/TOA

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by NoHierarchy

 

yeah well my alliiegence lays with the peope who pay me

There is a name for this Neo. It's lackey.
You said it not me. I'm just pointing out to you your own words.

Unfortunately for all of us, The hatred will continue down both 'sides' of the aisle.

Until the Tea Party can look at the Liberals and see a bit of themselves, and the Progressives can look at the Neo-cons and see their own faces staring back, the war will never be won.

Perhaps its all just a problem with perspective...

People have the right to assemble in any peaceful way they see fit, and until we show one another some true compassion and understanding, the beatings will continue.

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

reply to post by beezzer




Well played Beezer!

We've all known for some time that the media is strictly propaganda.

Kinda like on Drudge at the moment.

Headline.

"AMERICA DOES NOT GIVE INTO FEAR"

above it, pictures of TSA, cops with rifles, and a cop checking a trunk.

BE AFRAID BE AFRAID!

News flash.

Credible but unconfirmed reports are that someone somewhere is about to do something.

reply to post by MidnightTide




Good deal!

I'm glad I made you smile.

Compareing unions to the tea party is ridiculious! You can compare unions to businesses or corporations since they have to follow the same rules, but they are not anything like a political party. Honestly, some people will grasp at any straw to bash the Tea Party.

Anyone who has been to tea party ralley can tell you that they are mostly a bunch of senior citizens chillin' on lawn chairs singing patriotic songs and listening to each other give speaches. Mad kudos' to the tea party for taking a stand but they are no real threat to anybody.

reply to post by Gannicus


The Tea Party doesn't need the Democrats' help. They shoot themselves in the foot over and over with those racist crazies that support them.

Time to dump the tea (party).

(Sorry for the back2back post but these were two seperate thoughts.)

According to the Wagner Act of 1935 union negotiations must proceed under a standard set of guidelines. These guidelines make a sudden strike without warning an illegal action. It must be organized and publicized in advance. The reasons for the strike must be clear and concise. The company must be given ample time to respond to their request and/or demands.

I support Union's for the simple reason that it is a constitutionally protected right. But these dock workers weren't on strike. (Yet.)

When they stopped acting like a union and started acting like a mob they were breaking the law and giveing all unions a bad name.

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Kicking2bears
Comparing unions to the tea party is ridiculious! You can compare unions to businesses or corporations since they have to follow the same rules, but they are not anything like a political party. Honestly, some people will grasp at any straw to bash the Tea Party.

Anyone who has been to tea party ralley can tell you that they are mostly a bunch of senior citizens chillin' on lawn chairs singing patriotic songs and listening to each other give speaches. Mad kudos' to the tea party for taking a stand but they are no real threat to anybody.

But did you bother to notice that the person who bashed and compared unions to the Tea Party, was the pro Tea Party guy who wrote the Article?

It is a method to stir up controversy and emotions... The article elicited the desire response from you and
you failed to recognize that the attack was wholly fictional.

Why does an honest, wholesome and legitimate movement resort to such a big government, base way
of manipulating receptive people?

And that's how you take over the government. storm washington with a million union teamsters.
no one will say a word

reply to post by TerryMcGuire


totally missed the point of what i said so lets break it down

i want a job but the only job around is a union job there are no if ands or buts about it

then if i want that job i have to be union in doing so I HAVE TO PAY DUES but wait for it thats not all

back dues come into play so the few weeks or however long it take YOU PAY BACKDUES every week until you get current.

next up if senority and if you aint got it your nothing but the lowest scum and are treated as such once your in a union forget about individual rights they dont exist.

whose the lackey?

Originally posted by MasterGemini

Originally posted by Rockdisjoint
Well, there are bad apples in all types of organizations, union members aren't perfect......

They just so happen to be the highest paid union in all the land.

dailycaller.com...#-out-of-this-parking-lot-right-now%E2%80%99/

Longshoremen are among the best-paid blue collar workers in the country, partly because of union-negotiated contracts. Longshoremen with 10 years’ of experience earn roughly $30 per hour, according to payscale.com, a website that tracks typical salaries across various U.S. careers.

An the crane operators make about 100 dollars an hour and are on call all the time. That is why that particular job is coveted and are hard to get even through the union. But they are highly paid and it's not that this company went overseas or hired illegals, they moved to another port with another union that had lower pay and they went ballistic.They see their pay going down and are afraid. I agree that they are using kit gloves with the union. But by allowing them to get away with what they did will embolden them to do more. After what they did, the should have had police and federal authorities go into that union and start arresting using the RICO act on them. They know eventually some will roll on others just to get out of jail.

reply to post by beezzer


The leader of genius must have the ability to make different opponents appear as if they belonged to one category.

Adolf Hitler 1943

reply to post by NoHierarchy


Hey dude, if these longshoremen want better conditions, then they need to train and find a better high skilled job, or better yet start a business, there's nothing stopping them from doing so. If you don't like where you're at, you move on and you do whatever is necessary to get what you want in life, short of destruction of others property and other illegal activities.

You people disgust me.

The difference between this and revolting against tyrannical rule is that you can't choose a different government under tyrannical rule, there's nothing stopping these folks from choosing a different job, or learning a skill that demands the higher pay. You don't demand higher pay than what the job demands, that's ridiculous. You get a job that demands higher pay.

This country doesn't stop you from achieving higher education or learning a skill or any number of other methods of achieving more; however, attitudes like yours are contributing to B.S. laws that make it more difficult to be successful in independent self supportive endeavors.

God, you really really disgust me in ways I can't even begin to illustrate.

Guess what, I'm not rich. Not even close. I hope to be well off some day and I'm working towards that end.

You can too... Those longshoremen can too. But the method they are choosing should make them either dead or in prison....

Jaden

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by TerryMcGuire

 

totally missed the point of what i said so lets break it down

i want a job but the only job around is a union job there are no if ands or buts about it

Where is this fictional land? I used to live in a very liberal area where unions are strong and they only accounted for a fraction of available jobs. No one had to work in a union job.

then if i want that job i have to be union in doing so I HAVE TO PAY DUES

This sounds to me as if you think of dues as extortion. This of course is your prerogative but not all union members view dues in this manner.

but wait for it thats not all
back dues come into play so the few weeks or however long it take YOU PAY BACKDUES every week until you get current.

This sounds like an individual who once was in a contractual relationship with a labor organization which provided certain services for an established price. The back dues you bring up would come into play if the individual had previously faulted on that obligation, that contract. Here, the blame should not be on the union but on the individual who faulted on the earlier agreement.

next up if senority and if you aint got it your nothing but the lowest scum and are treated as such once your in a union forget about individual rights they don't exist.

So do you speak from experience here or are you just conjecturing from an anti-union bias. The unions I am familiar with call this period of membership, apprenticeship. Apprenticeships have grievance committees which oversee individual rights.

whose the lackey?

I leave you once again with your own words

yeah well my alliiegence lays with the peope who pay me

reply to post by TerryMcGuire


a decade of my life being treated and sub human and extorted

i earn my viewpoint.

if you have never been in a union you have no clue i have

Originally posted by Masterjaden
Guess what, I'm not rich. Not even close. I hope to be well off some day and I'm working towards that end.

The great lie told to the American middle class. "You can be just as rich as that other guy someday..."

All the while that 'other guy' is purposefully keeping you poor or simply middle class, he'll make more money off of you over time than he will just taking all your money at once.

Suddenly, you're 60 years old and not any better off than you were 20, 30, 40 years earlier. Now some politician is saying you might not get your retirement because that 'other' guys son needs the money to 'create jobs.' That's right, his son is now your sons employer, but keep working hard son, so you'll be better off than I was.

Stop defending them, they're doing nothing but holding the stick with the carrot on the end.

Good on these longshoremen, labor needs to stop getting # on by businessmen.

i live in longview..i could get footage lol

i tend to take the middle of the road position, because it is the only position that works in the real world.

many people on the right bash unions, but i say that some unions are a good thing. blue collar jobs requiring specialized skills and training that provide a valuable service should have unions. i was a part of the UA for a time, a welder/pipefitter.

the powerplant where i worked payed more money to non union workers than union workers, AND they got per diem. after the private company saw the difference in work quality, they CHOSE to hire only union hands. the union taught me more about welding and furthered my skill more in half the time it took in a conventional program.

so, we have the union workers making less than non union workers, but making much higher quality welds. i was raised republican, and i'm still conservative when it comes to economic policy, but a pure free market economy doesn't work in the real world.

some unions have their place and give more than they take.

you are right about the bias though, if it were the tea party taking hostages like this, they would have been arrested and vilified as violent racist usurpers.