500 Longshoremen Storm a Government Building, Take Hostages (Longview, Washington)

Some truth about unions

CPUSA Labor Commission Chairman, Scott Marshall emphasized their working relationship with the AFL-CIO president Richard Trumka, in what he calls their continuing efforts of “independent” union organizations operating in, or for political campaigns. This occurs beginning at the 12:05 mark of the 11/8/2010 video, “CPUSA analysis of the Mid Term Elections,” presented below.
Marshall’s words: “Not only did the campaigning take place from union halls et cetera, et cetera, but this time, as, uh, Trumka told us when he was in Chicago, they began with the nuts and bolts a’ building independent labor campaign organizations in specific five key cities around the country, of which Chicago was one. I think the question of how we…”
One should be apprised, this broadcast and interview were produced by PoliticalAffairs.net and the Progressive Podcast Network. This further underscores a working solidarity between self avowed Communists and America’s progressives.

gulagbound.com...

And theres a vid inset on that page

It should be evident from the woman's words in the audio that CPUSA is not happy to have Tea Partiers mess up their control of Congress.
And she even lists all the Democrat programs CPUSA wants to remain on the table including Obamacare and the Dream Act, oh and Wall Street Reform, they really want that.
If CPUSA wants it its comm unistic. And they hate Fox news!

Every other Union , has sold out, to the man,now it is the Longshoremans turn they save the hardest for last.after they take them over it's checkmate, no more union power and the country is open to invasion!

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by newcovenant

 

Actually, my intent was to illustrate bias. A mod changed the title, thus altered my intent. I have asked for a review and a possible thread deletion.

It was a fun thread, made to elicit responses and create dialogue.. And boy-golly! Did it!
Stop being so sensitive.

Intent FAIL!

You should be thanking the Mod otherwise your only responses would have been slanderous, libelious and accusatory. Thinks like troll and so forth. oh wait they were until the title got changed. hmmm....

I took one look at this when it first posted and rolled my eyes. I read the article and wanted to vomit. Not about the article but about your complete lack of originality and individual thought when you posted this thread. I have come to expect more from most of the thread's on ATS. Put a little bit of effort into your threads next time.

After a few hours I came back because I saw a new title. I've been waiting for someone to discuss Unions on here and thought maybe your ignorance had been countered with intelligence. Then I find out it is the same thread but the good members of ATS have decided they were going to talk about what the article was really about... Unions and the dockworkers. Way2Go ATS!

Your approach to this was foolish and confuseing. Your original title did nothing but exacerbate the issue. The Mod saved this thread by changeing the title. I congratulate them. That is the sort of impartiality we need in our Mod's. To take a pathetic, confuseing, misplaced, ignorant, parroted thread and make one simple change... not in the plagerized article... but in the title... forceing the title to reflect the thread and making this a viable place for ATS-ers to have a discussion. Mad kudos Mods!!!

Next time you comment on an article how about includeing your own thoughts instead of simply parotting the article eh?

Originally posted by Cinaed
reply to post by newcovenant

 

Oh believe me I realize that LOL I had to listen to it day in, day out growing up. My dad and his brothers fought really hard FOR unions, which is why he got so disgusted with them later in life when he saw what he fought for becoming like the thing they fought against.

That's what happens when you force a duck to act like a duck. I am in support of Unions but the Wagner Act and subsequent legal regulations forced them to act like a business. Yes it put them on a similar ground for negotiation but eventually they would have to face the doom that all businesses face... Corporate Greed. Grow or die. and since they are in effect a business within a business it get's even more difficult.

The rules for unions are pretty clear.
They must have a minimum of 1000 contributing members.
They must be organized and their rosters must be available to the public.
They must follow all generally accepted accounting principles (GAAP).
They must heed all civil rights and equal rights requirements of a business. They must operate within the same set of regulations as any other employer.

In addition there are some special rules for unions:
Union Negotiations must proceed under a standard set of guidelines.
These guidelines make a sudden strike without warning an illegal action; it must be organized and publicized in advance. The reasons for the strike must be clear and concise. AND the company must be given ample time to respond to their request/demands.

If you have followed me this far keep going... here is where it get's good.

If both parties feel that an impass has been reached than they may call an independent arbitrator. This rarely happens because then the arbitrator's decision becomes final. No matter which way the arbitrator decides both the company and the union must accept the decision.

All of these limitations combine to make a strike unlikely. Yet labor strikes continue to occur. This is as much the Companies fault as the Unions.

Originally posted by Kicking2bears

Next time you comment on an article how about includeing your own thoughts instead of simply parotting the article eh?

You completely missed the point of the thread and now you're lashing out. It's pretty obvious you came expecting to bash some tea parties and are now angry that you were tricked.

This thread isn't about discussing unions. It's about the media's bias and the people who fall for their manipulation.

Originally posted by FallenWun

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by FallenWun

 

Its all about bias. Take it from there.

Bias from whom
aimed at what?

Have you been living in a cave? Have you not seen the almost daily tea party bashing on this thread that is directly related to the press coverage given to them? The tea parties have never done anything remotely violent, yet the Democrat controlled MSM constantly tars them as violent extremists.

On the flip side, these union thugs are regularly getting violent and yet, no negative press coverage. My guess is that your one of the people who has been manipulated by that coverage and now you're mad because the OP proved it.

Originally posted by FallenWun
[
Bias against the TEA Party? Where? I Read the OP and it is about longshoremen. How are you finding bias against the TEA Party in a story that has nothing to do with them? Just because you made up that lie of a title, that proves someone else did something?

Do I need to read the OP again? Did I miss something?

You are not very bright.









When are we going to see some MSM reports like this about the union protesters?

would you rather smear these guys and get pummeled or smear the tea party and maybe have a cane waved at you


I didn't know that anyone denied that the media was heavily biased any longer. You might ask did the media divide the country or did the country divide the media?

Personally I find one side to be a mirror of the other and both to be deplorable.

Originally posted by Gannicus

Originally posted by Kicking2bears

Next time you comment on an article how about includeing your own thoughts instead of simply parotting the article eh?

You completely missed the point of the thread and now you're lashing out. It's pretty obvious you came expecting to bash some tea parties and are now angry that you were tricked.

This thread isn't about discussing unions. It's about the media's bias and the people who fall for their manipulation.

edit on 12-9-2011 by Gannicus because: (no reason given)

What the OP proved is a complete lack of originality. This thread was almost verbatum from the article that was linked.

I am in support of what the tea party is trying to do. I don't agree with all of their political opinions but I have attended a local rally or two. Believe me when I say they are no threat to anybody.

Unless people are threatened by patriotism and elderly people who have become disatisfied with the republican party. The tea party around where I live would never debase themselves by being associated with such ignorance and foolishness as was demonstrated in the web-link (and by imitation the OP as well).

Originally posted by Kicking2bears
\

What the OP proved is a complete lack of originality. This thread was almost verbatum from the article that was linked.
\

You're a little too upset about it. Clearly, many people understood the point he was making and thought it was a good point. Including me. Those of you getting butt hurt were most likely the people coming expecting to have your MSM manipulated notions of the tea party confirmed.

Originally posted by Gannicus

Originally posted by Kicking2bears
\

What the OP proved is a complete lack of originality. This thread was almost verbatum from the article that was linked.
\

You're a little too upset about it. Clearly, many people understood the point he was making and thought it was a good point. Including me. Those of you getting butt hurt were most likely the people coming expecting to have your MSM manipulated notions of the tea party confirmed.

Then go start a thread about MSM's blatent lies and manipulation. Oh wait, everybody already knows that.

So why go dragging Unions into this. I know that most Unions have become complacent but that is only because most companies have started treating their employees with dignity. Because they have learned that the last thing they want is Unionizing. If there were a Union they wouldn't be able to move job's overseas and they would have to keep enough employees on hand to do the job safely and humanely.

From that point of view Union's were helping keep America strong.
For example, the increase in our unemployment rate has been directly proportional to the decrease in the Union's influence.

Originally posted by Kicking2bears

What the OP proved is a complete lack of originality. This thread was almost verbatum from the article that was linked.

I am in support of what the tea party is trying to do. I don't agree with all of their political opinions but I have attended a local rally or two. Believe me when I say they are no threat to anybody.

Unless people are threatened by patriotism and elderly people who have become disatisfied with the republican party. The tea party around where I live would never debase themselves by being associated with such ignorance and foolishness as was demonstrated in the web-link (and by imitation the OP as well).

Um, duh. It was an opinion piece. I wrote it to elicit the same responses that the writer did. That's why my title was identical to the source. And the content was identical also, with appropriate quotes and source identificaton as per T&C. If you haven't figured out MY opinion on the subject then I might recommend reading some of my past posts and threads. I try to be very clear on where I stand.

The mods felt it was misleading. So it was changed. Since this is their house, I gotta play by their rules. And I'll abide by it. Enjoy the thread, the dichotomy, the posts.
Stop being so angry, or perhaps you can also start a thread on this issue and I will gladly participate.

reply to post by Gannicus


Best quote of this thread

I think you're missing the point. For the last 2 years or more, the US media and Democrat party demonized the tea parties as extreme, violent racists. Even when they're probably among the most non-violent protests ever seen in America and examples of racism are few and far between? Yet, these leftists can battle in the streets with riot police and take people hostage without any of the same condemnation or hand ringing from the MSM. I think it's pretty safe to say at this point, that our media is nothing more than the attack arm of the Democrat party.

Originally posted by Masterjaden
reply to post by NoHierarchy

 

Hey dude, if these longshoremen want better conditions, then they need to train and find a better high skilled job, or better yet start a business, there's nothing stopping them from doing so. If you don't like where you're at, you move on and you do whatever is necessary to get what you want in life, short of destruction of others property and other illegal activities.

You people disgust me.

The difference between this and revolting against tyrannical rule is that you can't choose a different government under tyrannical rule, there's nothing stopping these folks from choosing a different job, or learning a skill that demands the higher pay. You don't demand higher pay than what the job demands, that's ridiculous. You get a job that demands higher pay.

Spoken like someone that's never worked long or hard at any job. These people perform hard labor in an extremely dangerous work environment. That deserves fair pay, regardless of what you think. The job did demand decent pay, until management found morons willing to put their life at risk for peanuts. Say you work a job for many years, poured everything you had into your job, then management comes and says they're slashing pay so they can save a few bucks. You see money wasted everywhere, idiotic managers, useless executives, nepotism, back door deals on equipment, terrible contracts... but where they make the cut is your pay. But hey, if you don't like it, you're free to leave. All of the investment you put into the company doesn't mean squat.

This is one of the founding reasons unions were created. To protect the interests of the worker. To make sure your life's investment wasn't destroyed in a second.

The grain terminal under attack is owned by EGT, LLC, which is a joint venture of U.S., Japanese and South Korean companies. The consortium built the facility for $200 million and announced it would employ non-union longshoreman to save $1 million a year in operating costs.

Wow, 1 million won't even pay a quarter's bonus for your average executive. Funny how most companies toss around a million bucks like it's nothing when pissing it away.

This country doesn't stop you from achieving higher education or learning a skill or any number of other methods of achieving more; however, attitudes like yours are contributing to B.S. laws that make it more difficult to be successful in independent self supportive endeavors.

God, you really really disgust me in ways I can't even begin to illustrate.

Wow, you arrogant little jackass. Stop judging people because they perform a job you turn your nose up at performing. Performing back breaking labor with the constant risk of injury is worth compensation, it's not flipping burgers. Not everyone is a doctor, and guess what, these people don't want to be paid like doctors... but they do want to be paid fairly for the time they've put into a company, their knowledge of their jobs, the labor involved, and the risk.

You're in for a shock once you get your degree, then find your job taken away by a cheap H1B from India that's willing to work 24 hours a day 7 days a week, for half your pay. His quality of work is terrible, but he works nonstop out of fear he'll be laid off and deported. He also thinks Americans are lazy for not working like he does. He has no life. He sends all his money back home to India, and spends the barest minimum in this country because everything's too expensive.

I'm not condoning violence, but expect to see a lot more of this. Right now there's this attitude that billionaires are better than everyone else, and if you don't like it, become a billionaire too. If you don't, you're just lazy. You, the American worker, should be happy to have a job for whatever low pay a company feels like providing. If you don't like it, tough, there's the door. In the mean time, companies are earning record profits and executives are getting record sized bonuses. The working class will be expected to shoulder more of the tax burden, and their salaries will be cut, their benefits evaporated.

Amass all of the wealth and power in the hands of a select few. Support the expenses of a nation on the backs of those that don't have much. History has shown time and time again that this ends in violence.

Hmmmmm, these American workers seem to be doing something similar to the original Boston Tea Party, which involved destruction of private property (dumping of tea) in a protest against a company/govt out of touch with the people. I would hardly compare this Tea Party-like action to the actions of the TPM that got co-opted by corporate and govt officials. Maybe the true re-incarnation of the patriotic Tea Party should be called the Grain Party.

Originally posted by desert
Hmmmmm, these American workers seem to be doing something similar to the original Boston Tea Party, which involved destruction of private property (dumping of tea) in a protest against a company/govt out of touch with the people. I would hardly compare this Tea Party-like action to the actions of the TPM that got co-opted by corporate and govt officials. Maybe the true re-incarnation of the patriotic Tea Party should be called the Grain Party.

So, they kidnapped, caused destruction of property in challenge to what. Not taxation without representation, but because they wanted more stuff. Selfish, doesn't describe it. To compare thugs to the orignal Tea Party is akin to comparing rioters to the original Tea Party. Just because they're "sticking it to the man" doesn't paint them as noble.

Originally posted by beezzer
So, they kidnapped, caused destruction of property in challenge to what. Not taxation without representation, but because they wanted more stuff. Selfish, doesn't describe it. To compare thugs to the orignal Tea Party is akin to comparing rioters to the original Tea Party. Just because they're "sticking it to the man" doesn't paint them as noble.

You know the original Tea Party participants were called lawless thugs too, right? A lot of the people protesting back then were also involved in Tea Smuggling. They dumped Tea owned by the East India Company (the competition), not the crown, into the ocean. The East India Company had the government it it's back pocket and had a monopoly on importing Tea.

So this came down to destroying the property of a private company that colonists felt was in corrupt dealings with the crown over their rights being violated (no representation), and the money they'd lose over nobody purchasing their smuggled tea. After the deed was done, most colonists were appalled by it and wanted to pay for the damages. You're attributing a lot more nobility to that event with rose colored glasses.

So here we have a company getting tax breaks and financial incentives to build a facility in a depressed area, with the purpose of creating jobs in that area, then turning around and importing all their labor from outside of that area. Then ignoring the contact the Port, where they built their facility, has with the labor union and deciding to litigate it instead. In the meantime, all the people who were led to believe would have jobs are jobless, the taxpayers are out the money in tax breaks given, and the courts have to litigate this mess for lord knows how many years.

Wanting the government and companies not to screw you is being selfish? For better or worse, it seems like this is a repeating cause of violence.

reply to post by links234


Wrong it isn't a lie. You can be. The only thing stopping you is you. The truth is you likely will never be. Because you aren't capable of being. The trick to your happiness is therefore being satisfied with what you have. You won't be. Not likely, very few people are.

I love you blaming someone else for your misfortune. That other guy is keeping you down. The only person keeping you down is you. The non-skilled job the blue collar middle class does, doesn't deserve the pay it gets let alone more. Atleast in most cases where it is unionized.

I worked in a highly skilled job that required intellect, experience and training and I didn't make what most unionized non-skilled blue collar workers do. That isn't right. I know that for what I was doing, I was getting paid what was fair for the job. So these unskilled workers getting paid more than I did is ridiculous and they just want more. lol....

Yeah your communist everyone deserves the same mentality and the rich don't deserve what they have belongs in a country that isn't free, that is predicated on individual liberty and personal responsibility, Do not continue to try and corrupt my country to your communist ideals. There are many of us who won't let you take it much farther without failing to continue to work within the system through non violent means.

We cherish and do everything to protect the second amendment for a reason and eventually we WILL utilize it if necessary....

Jaden

reply to post by hlang


You have absolutely no idea what I have done "JACKASS" I have worked menial labor many times and I worked hard at developing a skill to not have to.

I worked for a construction company fifteen hours a day, sometimes six or seven days a week dumping 55 gallon drums of tar into a plant. I would have to wash my hair in diesel fuel to get the tar out of it at the end of the day.

Don't presume to know me or what I've done.

There was nothing arrogant about what I posted.

Your attitude and others like yours is what has aided in ruining this country and taking it from what it was meant to be.


Jaden

reply to post by neo96


First, let me say that I am sorry for your negative experience with unions. That being said, taking the actions of a few and applying your conclusions about those few to an entire group is making an extremely broad generalization. I understand that unions can be corrupt. But you can hardly say that all unions are corrupt.

I, for example, am a longshoreman in the city of buffalo, ny. Again, I cannot speak for all ILA workers everywhere, but my union is far from corrupt. My local's president makes 10000$ per year and VP is unpaid.

We work our butts off and are fairly compensated, thanks to the union. Buffalo was once one of the biggest grain ports in the US. However since the advent of the St Lawrence Seaway, buffalo was bypassed, and most companies shut down operations here. There are now only 18 full time ILA workers.

As for not looking out for the little guy, when I found out I had Crohns disease I missed a lot of work due to flare UPS and subsequent 4 major surgeries. The union protected my job as did my two direct supervisors, thanks to my reputation as a hard worker.

My union also stopped the company from giving us a health plan that provided so little prescription coverage, that I would be the highest paid homeless guy ever if they had their way (due to the high cost of my meds). One med alone would have cost me 499.00$ for a 30 day supply. Thank you union.

I am only responding to this because I feel it is unfair to paint all unions with the same brush just because of the actions of a few of us.

As for seniority, I was the lowest rank until just recently and I can tell you that being the lowest, we have enough comradeship amongst the nine of us, that even when I had the worst jobs, the other guys would always help out when they can. We all look out for each other. In addition, since I've been sick, sometimes when I do get a really difficult job, some of the guys will switch jobs with me for the day so I can have a better job.

We are like a family. And it beats being in management like I was at my old job at UPS. I'm proud of my union and, as much as I can help it, I will always work a union job.

Plus there never even would have been a need for unions if corporations didn't take advantage of workers. And to say that unions serve no purpose anymore is a bit disingenuous. My employer is always trying to cut another full time job from our crew. With just the nine of us in our grain elevator, we are already so under-staffed that we can barely keep up with all of the work. We already work 60- 90 hours a week. Then uncle Sam takes 44 percent of our pay. Literally.