Ron Paul votes against the "Cut, Cap, and Balance Act". Why?

Ron Paul will never be president. Too many sleeping people in the US.

Originally posted by TheodoreBundy
Ron Paul will never be president. Too many sleeping people in the US.

That's why it is your responsibility to wake them up.

Dont you guys think its a little suspicious Obama waits until his re-election to want to cut the defecit = more voters...and you never know what exactly they are cutting.

We have reached the point of no return and no bill or voting on anything is going to stop the default on Aug 4.

And then there's the unstoppable world financial crash thats around the corner and i don't mean in a year but sooner than that.

John Maynard Keynes was right. the moneterists are wrong. History books prove this to be true but hey when does history ever stop ideology !!!!!!!!!!!

I officially say that The SHTF already.

Originally posted by Skewed
Until they decide to target the head of the problem, they are only chopping off the arms, only to grow back.

Until the Federal Reserve is closed down, the problem will never be solved.

Precisely. Fractional reserve banking and corporate control over the issuance of money, at interest. Is an unsustainable ponzi racket. Until the Fed is killed, and the Federal Reserve Act repealed, nothing fundamenttal will change, and the USA will be driven the rest of the way, into the abyss, while all those interest payments accumulate in the form of gold bullion locked in a vault under some A-hole's castle somwhere in Europe.

I'd hate to agree with bernake on this one, but he is right GOLD IS NOT "REAL" MONEY and neither is the crap fake derivatives of fiat money that have spewed out of the fed res since its inception till today...

even though he got owned by ron paul... he got owned in another manner, ron paul asked him that because it was to show the american people that the real VIEWS that the fed res have on "MONEY" and the ones who "control" the "money" THIS IS WHAT THEY THINK OF MONEY... THEY KNOW IT DOESNT REALLY EXIST BUT IN THE MINDS OF MEN AND HAS NO "REAL" VALUE...

the truth of the matter is that this seems like only actual time bernake was ever telling the truth, and that is why ron paul asked him those questions is because he wanted him to admit and show to the american people that this is how those who are in control of this "money" think of it and how they and the reason why they just THROW IT AROUND AND SPEND LIKE ITS NOTHING......

ITS BECAUSE IT IS NOTHING...

Gold is only truly worth what its resourcefulness can be to a civilized and industrious people... in other words gold is only worth by its usefulness and that is the use of its electrical conductivity in computer and other electronic uses...

AS FAR AS ITS "FAKE AND OOOOHH ITS PRETTY AND OH SO SHINY VALUE"

IT IS WORTHLESS...

SO IS PAPER BILLS... they are only worth enough to really be what their use is and its anything paper is good for i.e. writing stuff on, blowing your nose, wiping your arse etc... I THINK YOU GET THE POINT...

what "#" is printed on them is just a # and holds NO REAL VALUE...

The same goes for diamonds and any other gem...

ITS THE RESOURCE THAT HAS VALUE NOT THE CONTRIVED AND MADE UP VALUE THAT THE BANKING SYSTEM HAS FRAUDED EVERYONE INTO BELIEVING

I WISH EVERYONE KNEW THIS SO WE ALL COULD JUST FINALLY GET OUT OF THIS REMEDIAL AND CHILDISH SYSTEM OF DISTORTED VALUE AND JUST START TO REALIZE THAT THERE REALLY IS A WAY OUT OF IT AND THEN AND ONLY THEN WILL PEOPLE HAVE THE MEANS TO CHANGE THE WORLD FOR REAL AND FOR THE BETTER...

money is the reason why there is poverty...
money is the reason why there is oppression...
money is the reason why there is starvation...
money is the reason why there is war...

kamesan

reply to post by MessOnTheFED!
You know what they say dont let your mouth write a check your arse cant cash, this is basically what the government is doing writing checks with there mouths but they dont have the arse to pay it back. Pretty sad.

reply to post by getreadyalready

By the way, everyone should have a signature banner that looks just like mine.

Why? He lost my support when he signed the Susan B. Anthony pledge

reply to post by malcr

John Maynard Keynes...

"By a continuous process of inflation, governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens. By this method, they not only confiscate, but they confiscate arbitrarily; and while the process impoverishes many, it actually enriches some.... The process engages all of the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner that not one man in a million can diagnose." John Maynard Keynes Economic Consequences of the Peace (1920)
www.overlordsofchaos.com...

HOWEVER

.... While much of Professor Yeager’s work in monetary disequilibrium theory is compatible with Austrian economic thought, his view of injection effects and intermediation is remarkably similar to the views of John Maynard Keynes.4 Yeager (ibid., p. 162) argues that fractional-reserve banking provides an important intermediary service, “Demands for additional ‘money’ thereby get intermediated into additional supplies of ‘credit.’ And this intermediation is appropriate. It does not counterfeit or misrepresent the availability of resources.” If banks do not engage in such intermediation an increased demand for money may “impair the allocation of resources as savers and investors (and consumers) desire” (ibid.).5
mises.org...

So although Keynes was completely aware of the fact that "By a continuous process of inflation, governments can confiscate...wealth" he APPROVED of that function!!!!

This is the critical idea (fallacy) put forth by banker supported economists. That the money supply MUST GROW to provide the cough, cough "Wealth" needed for business to grow. They just do not bother to tell anyone that the wealth is stolen from the common people by wage deflation and price inflation. Remember at any given instant "wealth" that is product and services is a finite entity and the value of currency is a function of the amount of wealth and the amount of currency.

For those who think an increase of currency some how magically increases "wealth" consider the fact that a nickel coke now costs over a dollar and the US Dollar has Lost 96% of Value since Federal Reserve Creation in 1913

reply to post by Kamesan

money is the reason why there is poverty...
money is the reason why there is oppression...
money is the reason why there is starvation...
money is the reason why there is war...

Money is a convenience a natural step in the barter system.

In and of it's self money, is like fire - value neutral. It is the FRAUD of the Fed not money, an economic tool, that is the problem.

The real problem is the "lending" of worthless "credit" that make people think they have exchange an asset (house, car their wages) for a thing of value - "fairy dust fiat currency" In this type of exchange there is no actual "Consideration" (value) on the part of the banker and therefore the contract is legally null and void and has been found so in court! - First National Bank of Montgomery vs. Daly (1969)

The Average credit card debt per household is $14,687 this does not include education loans, car loans and house mortgages. 97% of the US money supply is in the form of banks loans.- Interesting that the US dollar has lost 96% of its value since the Federal Reserve Act.

MONEY: GOLD vs FIAT

Humans originally used "barter" or the direct exchange of goods. This was cumbersome so a certain type of trade good became the generally agreed upon medium of exchange. This could be metals such as Gold, Silver and Copper as well as many other things such as cowry shells or obsidian points (Arrows). All these things used as "money" had elements in common.

... money exists to facilitate trade when basic barter isn’t practical....

Perhaps I am in one group with a surplus of dried meat and you are in the other with a surplus of tubers. It would stand to reason that we would agree to trade some quantity of one for the other. But what if I don’t want your tubers? ...

Eventually you show me some flint knife blades and I don’t need them because I have plenty of my own knife blades but I realize the following…

* They never go bad, rot, etc.(durable)
* I can trade them later for something I do want (intrinsic worth)
* It took me less energy to get my meat then to make a blade (profit)
* I can trade multiple blades with multiple individuals (divisible)

www.trtam.com...

The KEY is
* durable
* intrinsic worth
* profit
* divisible

I am going to add two more characteristics to the list.
* relative scarcity - a part of intrinsic worth
* easily transported

Metals have all of these characteristics but does paper money??? When the paper money was a SILVER (or gold) certificate, that is a contract obliging the bank/government to exchange it for metal upon demand, then yes paper money had intrinsic worth. Fiat currency which is NOT backed by metal has NO intrinsic worth. It has no more worth than toilet paper as has been proved in countries such as Germany and Zimbabwe.

Note that while US citizens were not allowed to own gold when in 1933 President Franklin D. Roosevelt outlawed private gold ownership, the international BANKS could demand US dollars be exchanged for gold. (Bankers are not dumb THEY wanted GOLD not pieces of paper and still do to this day) This had Congressman, McFadden, Chair of the House of Representatives Committee on Banking and Currency, hopping MAD. Finally in 1971, President Richard Nixon ended trading of gold at the fixed price of $35/ounce. At that point for the first time in history, formal links between the major world currencies and real commodities were severed". Even About.com Economics "glossary defines [FIAT MONEY] as "money that is intrinsically useless; is used only as a medium of exchange".

So why are we stuck with a fiat currency and why hasn't the USA hit hyper inflation given the Fed is printing money like mad??? I finally found a reasonable explanation.

...Given the previous hyperinflation, clearly there was ample reason for currency revulsion. So you can consider this argument a necessary but not sufficient precondition. What makes the universal acceptance stick is that government accepts its own money to expunge liabilities to it. In plain English, fiat money has value because it is the only money you can use to pay taxes. ....The fact that this money is also the medium of exchange only entrenches its use.

So the tax liability is a necessary pre-condition for fiat currency to work, something I will return to....

No wonder Amendment 16 - Status of Income Tax Clarified was Ratified 2/3/1913, a couple months after the Federal Reserve Act!!!!









if you have any doubts at all about the CRIMINAL INTENT of those who conspired on Jekyll Island to bring about the Federal Reserve Act of 1913. Here are the words of the organizer:

Of all the contrivances for cheating the laboring classes of mankind, none is so effectual as that which deludes them with paper money. It is the most perfect expedient ever invented for fertilizing the rich man’s fields by the sweat of the poor man’s brow. Ordinary tyranny, oppression, excessive taxation, these bear lightly on the happiness of the community compared with fraudulent currencies and the robberies committed by depreciated paper. [inflation cv] Our own history has recorded enough, and more than enough, of the demoralizing tendency, the injustice and intolerable oppression on the virtuous and well disposed, of a degraded paper currency, authorized by law, or in any way countenanced by Government. ~Nelson W. Aldrich, United States Senator, at a New York City dinner speech on October 15, 1913 IV Proceedings of the Academy of Political Science #1, at 38 (Columbia University, New York (1914)). [He was quoting Andrew Jackson. cv] www.linuxtoday.com...

Originally posted by buster2010
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

By the way, everyone should have a signature banner that looks just like mine.

Why? He lost my support when he signed the Susan B. Anthony pledge

I don't think anyone can argue that there is a unique "pro-life" or "pro-choice" argument to be made.

I definitely do not agree that "pro-choice" is a viable solution. It is not a choice any more than putting a newborn in a dumpster is a choice. My son was born 13 weeks early, barely into the 3rd trimester, and he survived, and he is a normal 3 year old now. So aborting a baby at the age when other babies are being born healthy is the same thing as throwing a baby in a dumpster.

I definitely do not agree that "pro-life" is a viable solution either. Doctors have to have the latitude to make life-saving decisions. The health of the mother should come before the health of the baby in my opinion. A doctor should be able to make those calls. In the cases of rape, abuse, or incest, the mother and the doctor and a counselor should be able to work through the options in the first trimester or so, and decide the best course of action.

Abortion should never be used for birth control = pro-life.
Abortion should never be off the table for doctors to consider = pro choice.

How can anyone pick a side and argue it rationally? There are too many exceptions to either view.

I still support Ron Paul.

Ron Paul is on the right track with his thinking.

On the other side if the ceiling isn't raised its all gloom and Doom, like its not that now,

But this rising debt with no end in sight is like putting some duct tape on a radiator hose and trying to drive cross Country its just a matter of how soon and when you will break down and will have to fix the problem once and for all to keep driving or you'll burn your engine out.

All of these proposed Bills only help for a very short fix and help for re-election bid of these clowns with a parlor trick and some smoke and mirrors.

We the people are the ones who will get screwed in the end as always. with the debt limit being raised or not.

its a lose lose situation for the average person.

Any major tax hikes or programs to be taken away will be directed at the poor and middle class not the rich.

8 out of 10 people i know are in a bad position from not being able to pay bills , mortgages, their house lost almost all its value or they can't put food on the table some can't find work and see no light at the end of the tunnel for them.

But the rich are buying everything up at a discount, South Hampton NY's real estate sales are through the roof while everyone else's real estate market is stagnant and under valued.

To fix a problem you have to go to the root of the problem which Washington refuses to do. they rather keep borrowing and keep up the reckless spending without balancing the books.

All the fat needs to be trimmed, its time for Washington to down scale its self and all its programs.

reply to post by dreamfox1

I officially say that The SHTF already.

That is not correct. We are in deep trouble but there is time to pull out if people wake up. Getting rid of the "Free Trade Agreements" and a lot of regulations is key.

Kicking the thieves out of D.C. and stuffing the BANKSTERS in jail for fraud would help bunches.

Why hasn't the USA hit hyper inflation given the Fed is printing money like mad???

I finally found a reasonable explanation and I want to repeat it at more length here:

...Given the previous hyperinflation, clearly there was ample reason for currency revulsion. So you can consider this argument a necessary but not sufficient precondition. What makes the universal acceptance stick is that government accepts its own money to expunge liabilities to it. In plain English, fiat money has value because it is the only money you can use to pay taxes. ....The fact that this money is also the medium of exchange only entrenches its use. So the tax liability is a necessary pre-condition for fiat currency to work, something I will return to....

[No wonder Amendment 16 - Status of Income Tax Clarified was Ratified 2/3/1913, a couple months after the Federal Reserve Act. cv]


Weimar Germany 1919-1923

The key to Weimar's hyperinflation was two-fold.

1. The German government had a large foreign currency debt obligation.
2. The German economy lost huge amounts of productive capacity causing prices to soar as demand outstripped supply....


Zimbabwe

While the facts in Zimbabwe are different, the underlying causes for hyperinflation were the same: foreign currency obligations and a loss of productive capacity.

Zimbabwe had established Independence from Britain in 1980. Yet, by the late 1990s 70% of productive arable land was still held by the small minority 1% of white farmers in the country. After years of talk about redistribution, in 2000, the President Robert Mugabe began to redistribute this land.

The redistribution process was a disaster, .... With agricultural production having plummeted, Zimbabwe was forced to pay to import food in hard currency.

Meanwhile, the government turned to the printing presses to fulfil its domestic obligations. as in Germany, the foreign currency obligations, the loss of productive capacity and the money printing was a toxic brew which ended in hyperinflation.

Hyperinflation in the USA, May 2010

As you can see from the two most severe cases of hyperinflation, the problem in each case was a loss of productive capacity, foreign currency liabilities, and a loss of the ability to tax....

In the German example, the Germans had a huge foreign currency liability that it had to pay, meaning it could not make good on the liability by printing money. It was a currency user as far as these liabilities went. Meanwhile, with productive capacity limited, the government was then unable to ease price pressure through the tax lever. The shortage of goods drove up prices inexorably and the government was forced to turn to the printing press in order to meet its domestic obligations.

In the Zimbabwe example, taxes were again central. Unable to recoup enough tax revenue and with large foreign currency obligations and a loss of productive capacity, the government resorted to printing money in an environment where prices were rising.

So, hyperinflation has very specific preconditions that are not apparent in the U.S..

1. No foreign currency liability: The U.S. dollar is the world's reserve currency so the U.S. can pay for trade goods in U.S. dollars.. The U.S. does not have a peg to gold or some other currency which acts as a de facto foreign currency liability. And the U.S. government has substantially no foreign currency liabilities. All of the debt is issued in domestic currency.

2. Price pressures are still anchored: While commodity prices are rising, they are rising in all currencies, not just in USD. Moreover, their rise will create demand destruction before any hyperinflation could occur. Why? Unemployment is high and capacity utilization is low, meaning there are no inflationary pressures on that front to help push inflation higher before demand destruction sets in.

3. Currency revulsion has not set in: Tax compliance is high in the U.S. We are not talking about Russia, Greece or Argentina where government has had a difficult time in raising tax. Moreover, as the USD is still the world's reserve currency, there has been no freefall sell off of dollars, nor do I anticipate any in the near-to-medium term.

In short, there will be no hyperinflation in the U.S. any time soon.... www.creditwritedowns.com...

The article states tax compliance is high in the U.S yet the Grace Commission Report to the President (1984) states"...one-third of all their taxes escapes collection from others as the underground economy blossoms in direct proportion to tax increases and places even more pressure on law abiding taxpayers, promoting still more underground economy-a vicious cycle that must be broken...." Now we have a 20% unemployment rate and the retiring of the baby boomers as well as a federal debt increase from fiscal 1983 deficit of $195 billion to over $14 TRILLION (Interestingly the report projected $13 trillion by the year 2000)

Second when the price of fuel rises there is a corresponding rise in the price of everything else.

Third the Russians, China and others are calling for a different world reserve currency than the dollar.

If the US dollar ever losses reserve currency status we are going to be in a world of hurt.

However as I said
Get rid of the FREE Trade Agreements
By this I mean TAX imports (Tariffs) If nothing else we MUST do this. This brings in real revenue from the mega-corporations without slamming small business too and therefore encourages job growth in the USA not in China.

Wipe-out/defund a lot of regulations. The Corporate/Government revolving door means small businesses are unfairly regulated out of existence and the mega-corporations go scott-free. Again cut off tax payer money for the mega-corporations small competition extermination programs.

KILL the FED - goes without saying

Originally posted by Grimbone
This is a joke. I must balance my budget and so should the government. They should be forced to balance the budget and stop spending money NOW or our future generations will suffer drastically. We are already seeing the beginning of it.

Why we continue to let them play by a different set of rules is beyond me.

Falsehoods:

It tickles me to hear that "future generations will pay for it". Do you not understand that we are paying for it now in the form of inflation?

It amused me for people to think we really have two parties. We have the illusion of a muti-party system, but have you noticed, no matter who gets elected, it's the same ole stuff? The illusion of the two party system is for us PEONS. TPTB dictate policy, and you do not get elected unless you are towing TPTB party line.

This is the world we live in.

It must be nice to be able to simply raise the "debt ceiling".

Anyone out there care to tell me how I can raise mine? You know, since I'm 30, unemployed, stuck living with my parents, have cancer, and have to deal with the collectors continuously calling me at least 5 times a day -- because I haven't paid back my student loans. At this point, I can't even pay back my loans even if I had 20,000 cash in my hands - Why?

Because they've sold my loans so many damn times I don't even have a clue to pay anymore.


Please, feel free to let me know. :@@

While I'm "ranting and raving", our entire system of economics is built this way intentionally.

We are, for the most part, forced to go off to college spending thousands and thousands of dollars to listen to someone tell us what books to read simply because without that magical peice of paper known as a diploma, most employers won't even bother looking at you, let alone give you an interview.

We are, for the most part, forced to purchase a method of transportation so that if we manage to find a job somewhere, we get to sit in traffic for 1 - 2 hours a day until we manage to get to our amazing jobs earning pocket change; do any of you out there know any Trillionaires? No?!? Wow, me neither.

After "succeeding" at all of this, we then get to do fun things like purchasing a house, which requires us to - guess what - get a loan from the bank! Do any of you out there know anyone that can throw down $100,000 cash to buy a nice new home? Ok, maybe some of you do.... I hear a few politicians out there have recently purchased new homes :: cough ::

So,after we go to college - with a loan from the bank, buy a car - with a loan from the bank, buy a house, with a loan from the bank -- what comes next??? We get to worry about our medical needs - if any of you ever has the joy of going through cancer like I am, you'll quickly realize how fast the bills add up. It's funny how much things like an ambulance ride cost, or a night in a hospital room - with those amazing, rubbery eggs for breakfast costs - or how much your nice new prescription of anticonvulsants costs. And on top of all of this, do any of your doctors ever tell you they know how to cure you? Nope, why would they? They gotta pay their bills too, you know?

Funny how it all works, huh?

Cutting $1 trillion while authorizing $2 trillion in additional spending? How does that help? 3, 4 wars now (I lost count), reckless spending, sending obscene amounts of money to third world despots, etc. Cut off foreign aid, close over seas military bases and bring the troops home, while not a definitive fix, it would go a long way towards getting our house in order.

Originally posted by buster2010
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

By the way, everyone should have a signature banner that looks just like mine.

Why? He lost my support when he signed the Susan B. Anthony pledge

-----------------
Yes, Ron Paul is pro-life. He's very honest about that, and I find it very refreshing. And he doesn't waffle back and forth like some candidates (Pro-life yesterday, pro-choice today, pro-life tomorrow, etc.). I am female and pro-life, as well. I have always considered abortion murder.
Anyway, he will not force his views onto you when elected POTUS. He wants the Federal government to have no say in the matter and let each of the states decide. If you don't like your states' view on the matter, move to a state that agrees with your viewpoint. The Constitution is VERY clear about what powers the Federal government has, and this issue isn't one of them.

Ron Paul has my vote in 2012.

reply to post by robyn


Because it's about the most juvenile, ignorant, myopic, flat out stupid piece of legislation ever passed by our House of Representatives. We have 4th graders running the House./\ Every Conservative economist from coast to coast laughs at them as the fools they are.