UFOs or Space Junk Near the Surface of the Moon?

reply to post by JimOberg


Ah yes, the good Dr. J. Allen Hynek. Isnt he the guy employed to 'debunk' ufos (hence the often quoted 'swamp gas' line), only to end his career as a fully paid up believer?

I think when people use the 'swamp gas' line in the context of debunkers, is to illustrate the ridiculous lengths some people go to in order to debunk some sightings- you know, like venus, chinese lanterns, night skydivers, flares etc.

Interesting video- does the moon have gravity strong enough to keep large objects in orbit? Would seem strange that there would be multiple objects that close together........

reply to post by Thunda



I always wonder why some people HAVE to debunk things, and sometimes coming up with ludicrous explanations?

The best debunkers always have an open mind, you can see it on these forums everyday!

Just out of curiosity, has anybody actually measured/timed/observed any relation what so ever betwen the so called ''objects'' and the a dark side of the moon?

Anyone who actually took their time and measured the speed of the ''objects'' in relation to the moons surface?

Then on the other hand, when calling something a ''space trash'' anyone who actually put some ideas up front, regards to what this trashy-looking-object may actually be? Where did it fell off from? Or why is it being ''stuck'' betwen the moon and outer space? Maybe some metallurgists with video software skill (surely there must be one at least on ATS) that could give some specification into the nature of substance which these objects are made of? (heat, light, speed, combined all etc, anywthing you could posibly use to determine the substance its made of)

This thread doesnt even scratch the area of my intrests, but i find it a very good example of what could go wrong with such a good thread. I've seen so many questions being asked, and even more opinions stated, but yet cant see much of that ''brain storm'' that the ATS was suppoused to be about, arent we here to get together and figure some stuff out?
Once i see others doing some decent research on this topic, ill come back to this thread and will post a piece of information from myself, which i believe could light the room a bit; so less people will bump their heads on door frames while standing up to raise their point.

reply to post by Aurey


I have not measured the speed of the "object", but my "eyeball test" (which may be wrong) tells me that the object/anomaly seems to be moving too fast to be space junk in Lunar orbit.

If I have time later, I could try to estimate the speed using measurements instead of my eyeball.

Like we don't have satellites around the moon? classified satellites.
they are flat disk like satellites with grey-white on one side and black on the other.
solar powered with mini thrusters.
optics based recon and usv's that can "park" on the dark side and recharge.

its like a interference free zone...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/51021214d57e.jpg[/atsimg]I remind you that humans are only a tiny minority in this galaxy.

Originally posted by paratus
Like we don't have satellites around the moon? classified satellites.
they are flat disk like satellites with grey-white on one side and black on the other.
solar powered with mini thrusters.
optics based recon and usv's that can "park" on the dark side and recharge.

its like a interference free zone...

edit on 11-7-2011 by paratus because: (no reason given)

Your knowledge of the subject of "classified" moon satellites is vast. Why would they be classified, and how would you know what they looked and operated like?

reply to post by Extralien


I see tiny reflective things like that too with my bare naked eyes. You can stare at the moon on any clear night and observe things like this happening. No way i am going to agree with the lens dust theory.

reply to post by Arbitrageur
On balance, I now think your explanation has the highest probability of being correct.

I've ruled out actual objects flying across, or impacting, the moon by reading astronomer blogs and forums from the night of July 9th and days following. Amateur and professional astronomers have their equipment pointed at, and filming the moon every night. On the night in question, there was even a star party in Chicago with no mention in the boards of unusual activity. No comets, no meteoroids. TLPs are absent too.

This won't be enough to form a conclusion that satisfies everyone, but it works for me.

This leaves more terrestrial causes and the first point is Flaxio's equipment and the points you make about droplets. They seem reasonable and plausible.

There are two well-known segments of NASA footage with apparently silver spheres appearing and moving. They look unusual and have been explained by NASA as droplets in the equipment. One is the STS-51 mission and the other one is from the past couple of years and escapes me right now...

The good bit is at 10:30


Until recently, this footage was pretty astounding to me. I've since re-evaluated and accept the NASA explanation. I've posted the link to NASA's explanation on another forum and can't find it right now...I'll edit it in later.

I'll just wait until I can go through all my footage and post when I find one that is the best to see.

This is a very curious video. I do not think it is a thermal aberration. I also don't think it is water droplets on a window or on the lens of the telescope. Something will only resolve if it is either near the plane of the thing being imaged or in the image plane itself. So water droplets on a window would not resolve unless the window was quite distant from the telescope. Edit: of course this also depends on the depth of field. Maybe I am being a little too hasty in dismissing this possibility.

I don't think these are our objects orbiting the moon (we have quite a few up there at the moment) as they are too large.

I agree that they do look like they rise up over the limb of the moon then disappear behind it, or vice versa. However, if they are in orbit it would be possible to watch them come around again at regular intervals.

Here is a challenge. It is possible to estimate the speed of these objects and their distance from the moon based on the data in the video. It is then possible to use mathematics to determine the mass of the objects. I wonder if anyone on ATS can give an approximation and error values.

It should also be possible to give a lower bound on their size based on the resolving power of the optics used.

My guess is either condensation on the eyepiece or objects passing in the night sky. I would estimate that the latter is actually quite unlikely. The probability is quite small.

Notice that one object appears to actually cross part of the surface of the moon. I think this rules out quite a few potential explanations.

Very interesting footage. CGI is still of course possible and hard to rule out. The fact that the person who put this up on YT is answering questions about it is a good sign.

reply to post by virraszto


I do not see any objects in your video. Moreover, I can't tell what the main image is of. It looks astronomical as it moves very slowly across, pixel by pixel. But it appears featureless on my monitor.

Originally posted by Phage
They seem to move at the same rate and opposite the Moon across the field of view.

I get the impression they are the result of thermal distortion within the telescope, sort of a mirage effect.

edit on 7/10/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Phage what are you smoking ? LOL

There Space Nazi's !!

Iron SKY
Space nazis attack! Iron Sky teaser 720P HD


Iron Sky Teaser 2 - The First Footage


Iron Sky Teaser 3 - We Come In Peace!




Phage i can show you something that is Astounding ! About a V2 Rocket when the (Americans) For the First Time Launched the Rocket into Space ! Something was caught on the Analog Film Camera and tho it Could maybe be Space Debris from the V2 rocket it self There was something in space caught filmed in the distance and that was no just some Speck and it was no satellite they did not exist until 1958 Sputnik

what was caught was in a Second was in Frame and in the Film it was Paused for 2 second then started again the American Government must of thought the same thing my speculation because of that pause !

Here is that Video ! watch the 50 sec MARK!! then Pause it !! as they did!!

V-2 Rocket, White Sands, NM 1946/11/21


Note There is a Crystal Clear (Film) Below

Air&Space Smithsonian
www.airspacemag.com...#
to the Right of this site is the Video

Named == V2 Camera Views of Earth,1946

reply to post by JimOberg


No problem, friend!

Originally posted by Mark_Frost
The only thing that left me a little skeptical was how the clip abruptly ended, even as a 6th anomaly is spotted.
Why not keep the clip running?

Why not read what the film maker says? He was testing his equipment and didn't see the objects until after he viewed it

Originally posted by JimOberg
I second the motion -- whatever turns out to be the explanation, it's important to keep watching the skies and reporting results for discussion. And the discussion here as been first rate -- ATS at its best. Kudos to the OP and all subsequent posters.

So Jim... what do YOU think they are?



This group of Amateur Astronomers that could look at it... funny I never heard you mention them before...do you have a link I missed?

Originally posted by TruthxIsxInxThexMist
Well i was hoping to see some conclusive evidence but what i saw was not much really... how is one supposed to have any explanation for something which is hardly visible???

Didn't you read the thread? Arbitrageur says its definitely water droplets... well 67% for sure

Case closed

:shk:

Originally posted by Kandinsky
There are two well-known segments of NASA footage with apparently silver spheres appearing and moving. They look unusual and have been explained by NASA as droplets in the equipment. One is the STS-51 mission and the other one is from the past couple of years and escapes me right now...

The good bit is at 10:30

Until recently, this footage was pretty astounding to me. I've since re-evaluated and accept the NASA explanation. I've posted the link to NASA's explanation on another forum and can't find it right now...I'll edit it in later.

Surely you can't be serious? You're saying the completely obvious water droplet at 10:39 exactly was until recently, "pretty astounding to (you)?" Remarkable!

Sorry Kandinsky, but the footage in the OP bears absolutely no resemblance whatever to the footage you just showed us. You must be having a laugh trying to palm that off as evidence that arbitrageurs water droplet explanation is correct. I've rarely seen you guys clutch at straws like this before.

reply to post by Pimander
I added it as an example of apparent water droplets causing the appearance of solid objects in flight. I also was clear that my thinking is based on probability and not conclusions. Furthermore, why haven't other observers recorded or noticed this activity on that night? Did you also look for any references by astronomers?

For my money, it seems more probable that the equipment is the source of the 'objects.'

Originally posted by Kandinsky
Did you also look for any references by astronomers?

I haven't found anything useful useful yet. There is a the claim from a member - if he can back it up that is.

Originally posted by Pervius
Dig out your old 35mm photo negatives. On those negatives take the black portion (usually found on the end of one of the negatives) and cut it off. Get some cardboard and tape and make a "cap" for your telescope with 1 or 2 layers of that black film on the end for light to pass thru.

With that on your telescope you will only see Ulra-violet....the moons brightness will disappear since you are blocking out everything except Ultra-violet and you will EASILY see objects circling the moon.

Looks like the moon picked up some hitch hikers and they are HUGE!
www.abovetopsecret.com...

The main reason I suspect we might have something is that if they are droplets, not one is even slightly visible further away from the moons surface. Even a rudimentary knowledge of how a water droplet refracts light would indicate that some droplets from further outside the lunar disk in our view would be visible. The droplets further from the disk would be less visible but some would still visible. There is a chance that none appeared anywhere else on the lens I guess but...

I think that might be why we can't find any similar footage. Because it is not something as common as water droplets. After all, astronomers must take footage of the moon in moist environments all the time.