Is reincarnation possible?

Justice is a temporary thing that must at last come to an end; but the conscience is eternal and will never die.
Martin Luther

reply to post by NorEaster


Technically, it is the energy of our soul which is electromagnetic in nature.
Our souls are learning and advancing with each incarnation until we reach the highest state of being. Commonly known as an Angel.

The same energy that is measurable while our body is living...but ceases to exist after we are pronounced dead.
Is what this soul energy is comprised of.

Also as to why the spirit domain can transfer their thoughts onto magnetic recorders via what are called Electronic Voice Phenomenon.

Or that the presence of Spirits can be determined by the use of Electromagnetic Field Detectors.
Which sense and detect fluctuations in normal magnetic fields.


Interesting enough, science has recently discovered that electrons store not only electrical energy as in electrical charge but that electrons also store data as well.

This is the foundation of the concept of reincarnation.

Just as you can "image" a complete hard drive of a computer to another hard drive by transferring an image of it's data. and thus creating a mirror image of the drive onto the other.


A soul can also exist in a state of electromagnetic energy as data and can also replicate itself as well.

That's the concept...of reincarnation from a technical perspective.

Difficult for many to grasp but when introduced in the context of how our computers function. It reveals the potential of it's possibilities....

reply to post by nh_ee


Please post your source showing that electrons can store data above and beyond their positive or negative charge. And its important to note that if they are being strung together in "series" and a kind of binary is bein read off them, this would be useless in a reincarnation scenerio and the electrons in question would surely disperse after physical death of the body.

Ian Stevenson has spent 40 years studying the evidence for reincarnation, mainly through investigating the claims of children who appear to remember aspects of their previous lives. His research consists of a huge body of work, and is considered by many to be scientific evidence of reincarnation. Stevenson wrote this book, detailing 14 cases, with the aim of presenting an account of his research, and so it seems reasonable to assume that the evidence presented is at least representative of the whole. If anything, one would expect the book to consist of the more convincing cases. Consequently I believe it is valid to examine this quality if the evidence presented in this book, and draw conclusions from it about the rest of Stevenson’s research.

So how does the book stack up?
First, I’m impressed by Stevenson’s integrity and honesty, but less so with his intellectual rigor. The 14 cases he cites rely on nothing more than anecdotes: all the “past life behavior” had been witnessed before the author met any of the players and so the veracity of the stories is hard to determine. In addition, in the later chapters Stevenson makes several statements and draws conclusions that in my view cast doubt on his credibility and neutrality.

I am aware that Stevenson has published much more work than this, but I believe the cases and comments in this book are representative of his work.

The 14 cases
Before I got the book, I wondered how Stevenson would ensure the stories were genuine. I had the idea that he would have surveyed a number of children at random, seen if any remembered a previous life, and followed up on them. It seemed like quite a thing to attempt, but I thought it must be something like that. So as I started to read the cases I made notes on when the author had first become involved in the case. I soon gave up on that idea because, as I discovered, the author had got involved in none of these cases until some considerable time after the children were reported as remembering their prior lives. Thus they were all just anecdotes, although well documented and cross referenced. It was less than I had expected.

Anyway, of the 14 cases:

■Three were unsolved (ie, the identity of the “previous life” was unknown)
■Nine were solved, but the prior life person had (or could have had), some contact with the family of the child
■Two were solved, and the families apparently had no contact.
For me, the “unsolved” cases are worthless. The child could be fantasizing, repeating what he has heard on the TV or radio, or there could be other explanations that don’t involve reincarnation.

The nine solved but with-contact cases are interesting. The identity of the prior life had been confirmed, and often the child has been reported to know information about the deceased person, their family, method of death etc. However, there are clearly other means that the child could have received this information. These cases are more interesting, in my view, in demonstrating the strong desire the author has in proving a reincarnation connection. I will talk about four of those nine cases, and also about the two solved but no-contact cases (which should be the strongest in support of the reincarnation hypothesis).

Firstly, here are four of the cases with a family connection. I have provided very brief descriptions – the book naturally has much more.

Corliss Chotkin Jr

In a community that believes in reincarnation, an elderly man tells his niece that he will be reborn as her son. Hey presto, she has a son who she claims is her uncle reborn, complete with birthmarks in the same places as her uncle’s scars. However, by the time Stevenson “first examined these birthmarks… they had both shifted.”

This is wishful thinking on the part of the mother. Also, an apparent indication of credulousness in the author, accepting that the birthmarks had “moved”.

Gillian and Jennifer Pollock

Two twin girls (aged six and eleven) are tragically killed. The father was a strong believer in reincarnation, and was sure they would be reborn to his wife as twins. Twins are born, and between the ages of 2 and 4 they start making statements about their dead siblings.

As the father believed the twins were reincarnations of their dead sisters, it is likely that he talked about it in front of the baby girls. It’s also likely that friends and family talked about the tragic death of the previous two girls. It’s hardly surprising that the girls are reported to have talked about their “previous lives”. The parents could also be reading too much into the twins’ statements, or could be lying. We’ll never know.

Michael Wright

A young girl has a childhood sweetheart who dies in a car crash. She would have married him but for this, but now marries someone else. She then has a child who she thinks is the reincarnation of her sweetheart. (She had a dream about him a year after his death that Stevenson takes as an “announcing dream”.) The child’s mother and grandmother strongly believe in reincarnation, and they are the only ones who have witnessed the child “remembering” his previous life.

This tells us more about this woman’s longing for the dead guy, and her relationship with her actual husband than it does about reincarnation. More importantly, it also tells us a lot about Stevenson’s credulity. A colleague of his, Dr Emily Kelly, apparently agrees with me here. To Stevenson’s credit he quotes her opinion:


“She thinks it quite plausible than some more benign motive, such as nostalgia or a longing for a past loved one, could have led (the mother) to encourage her son’s identification with (the sweetheart) and to have read more into his statements than was warranted”

No #! The phrase “could have”, indicates this is not proof of reincarnation.

Hanumant Saxena

An Indian woman dreamed that a recently deceased man of their village appeared to her and said, “I am coming to you”. The woman gave birth to a child who had a birthmark consistent with where this man had been shot dead. Many of the villagers began saying that the kid was the shot man re-born “before (the child) had even begun to speak about the life of (the dead man)”. Presumably the child’s parents spoke of it too, although that is not recorded in the book.

Wishful thinking again: The child probably heard people talking about his “previous life”, (again). Stevenson concludes by saying:


“A skeptic would say that his parents…. imposed this identification on him. I find this summed combination of interpretations topheavy and unsatisfactory, but I cannot deny that they have a certain plausibility.”

Again, if that explanation is “plausible”, this is not proof of reincarnation.

Solved cases with no contact

So we come to the two solved cases where the two families had no contact. The first, in India, two year old Gopal Gupta starts to remember details of his previous life in a nearby village. Details include the child behaving as though he is of a higher caste than his current family. He also (later on), knows details of how a business partner had been shot dead, and other family and business details later confirmed by the other family.

In the second case, a Lebanese boy Suleyman Andary started having dreams about a previous life. Some apparently striking examples of behavior started when the child was 11, where he acted like an adult, and remembered certain aspects of his previous life. He was able to give names of most of his children and other aspects if his life. However, when he went to the actual village he seemed “shy and inhibited” and did not recognize his “children” or photographs of people in “his family”.

Problems with these two cases

Taken at face value, these cases initially appear compelling. I have a few problems with them though, namely:

■They are anecdotes. In the first, Stevenson does not get involved until the kid is 13 and in the second the kid is 14 (11 and years after the first “remembering” in the first case, unknown in the second but probably seven or eight years after). Virtually everything has already been observed (by others), by the time Stevenson arrives on the scene and so there is much scope for invention, misinterpretation, exaggeration and enhancement of stories. We just don’t know what really happened and never will.
■Both occur in communities that believe in reincarnation, and where critical thinking is (shall we say), not thought of as a primary skill. The scope for self-delusion is high.
■Suleyman Andary only started with his strong prior life memories when he was 11 years old. In all the other cases (and I believe the majority of the cases Stevenson has studied) the child remembers things from around two years old but forgets them by about 11. This does not disprove reincarnation, but it is strange that one of the only two strong cases in the book should contradict the trend. It makes it likely that there is another solution, in my view.
■The Lebanese Druse community of Suleyman Andary believes that when you die you are instantly reborn – your spirit doesn’t hover in limbo for even a day. However, his prior person died 12 years before he was “reborn”. How did they account for this? The kid said he had been reincarnated in an intermediate life for the 14 missing years, although he can conveniently tell us nothing about this life.
So we are expected to believe that he cannot remember a prior life, but he can remember the one prior to the prior life. Not very convincing. A more prosaic solution is that he somehow has learned about the life of the guy who died 12 years before he was born, and had to invent the intermediate reincarnation to make it fit.

■Gopal Gupta had an intermediate life too – in London England. Even Stevenson concludes that this is “at least party a fantasy” , but still accepts the details of the much better remembered life prior to this “fantasy” one. Why?
■In 13 of the 14 cases the previous lives were in the same community as the current one. An Indian remembers an Indian prior life, etc. While this does not disprove reincarnation, I find it strange that the spirit world only allows souls to return to the roughly same geographic area (albeit sometimes in a lower caste). In my view this makes it more likely that some other force is at work. I would be more impressed if a child in (say) a remote Indian village remembers details his former life as (say) a surfer dude in California, with all that would entail. And why so many in the same family? It seems a little too convenient.
The one exception was a Burmese girl remembering the life as a Japanese soldier. This was an unsolved case though, and not very convincing anyway in my view.

Originally posted by nightbringr
reply to post by nh_ee

 

Please post your source showing that electrons can store data above and beyond their positive or negative charge. And its important to note that if they are being strung together in "series" and a kind of binary is bein read off them, this would be useless in a reincarnation scenerio and the electrons in question would surely disperse after physical death of the body.

Diamond crystal atoms pass test storing data

I usually don't respond to such inquiries, in requests for proof for the Doubting Thomas' of the world for it isn't my responsibility to educate the masses.

This is the problem that many have in conceptualizing new concepts and why inventors are so few and far between in our world.

For We tend to constrain and limit everything within our own framework or paradigm of understanding.

And hence Proclaiming everything else as an Impossible endeavor.

It's as if the Wright Brothers had listened to Lord Kelvin proclaiming that heavier than air aircraft were scientifically Impossible.

And merely constraining themselves to the concepts of Newtons Laws of Gravity without any regard to negating the effects of gravity via the utilization and principles of aerodynamic lift.


But I digress...

The storing of data involves quantum mechanics and is actually performed by the spin rate of the electrons and not merely the charge itself.

It also appears to be the future to computing and storage for bits of data could possibly be stored at a sub atomic level.

Making it considerably more compact and requiring considerably less power.
I bit of data per atom ? And not one transistor as we currently utilize ?

Think about the possibilities !

(Discover) Physicists have worked out a new method of storing information in the quantum states of atoms in diamond crystals. The scientists linked the spin of individual nitrogen atoms in the diamond--impurities at the jewelry counter, but boons in the physics lab--to the spin of nearby electrons. They could form a quantum link between the spin of the nitrogen atom and the spin of a nearby electron, letting the electron store information more stably than if it were spinning on its own. When a nitrogen is next to an empty spot in a diamond's carbon framework, it lets off an extra electron,leaving that electron free to have its quantum played around with. Using what they call "intense microwave fields" [PDF], the physicists were able to link the spin of a nitrogen atom to a neighboring electron, a pairing sparked by magnetic fields. Scientists have been looking at diamonds--with and without nitrogen impurities--as a quantum computing material for several years, in part because it can store quantum memory at room temperature, not the far-below-freezing temps required by some other materials. Some have even proposed the idea of diamond supercomputers, which would store millions of times as much data as today's machines. One hurdle in quantum computing is getting the information to last long enough to use it. In the recent study, the nuclear spin stayed coherent for more than a millisecond--enough time for a ten petaflop supercomputer to do ten trillion operations. But don't start rooting around in your hard drive for a rock just yet; diamond-based quantum computing is still a long way off.

Even though there exists many sources of this information I also made sure to post source from a good TPTB approved website....as in CBS.

And not one of those crazy "Damn Fool Conspiracy" websites ...that most would most assuredly doubt and completely disregard.





www.cbsnews.com...

And Furthermore....

Putting a New Spin on Computing

"Spintronics avoids this because it treats the electrons as tiny magnets that retain the information they store even when the device is powered down. That might save a lot of energy." ......

Physicists at the UA have achieved a breakthrough toward the development of a new breed of computing devices that can process data using less power. In a recent publication in Physical Review Letters, physicists at the University of Arizona propose a way to translate the elusive magnetic spin of electrons into easily measurable electric signals. The finding is a key step in the development of computing based on spintronics, which doesn't rely on electron charge to digitize information. Unlike conventional computing devices, which require electric charges to flow along a circuit, spintronics harnesses the magnetic properties of electrons rather than their electric charge to process and store information. "Spintronics has the potential to overcome several shortcomings of conventional, charge-based computing. Microprocessors store information only as long as they are powered up, which is the reason computers take time to boot up and lose any data in their working memory if there is a loss of power," said Philippe Jacquod, an associate professor with joint appointments in the College of Optical Sciences and the department of physics at the College of Science, who published the research together with his postdoctoral assistant, Peter Stano.
"In addition, charge-based microprocessors are leaky, meaning they have to run an electric current all the time just to keep the data in their working memory at their right value," Jacquod added. "That's one reason why laptops get hot while they're working."

"Spintronics avoids this because it treats the electrons as tiny magnets that retain the information they store even when the device is powered down. That might save a lot of energy." ......

Now lets get back to discussing reincarnation.....which I find considerably more intriguing.




Above quote Excerpted from the following article:

uanews.org...

reply to post by nh_ee


I wasn't implying anything was impossible, I simply asked you for a source. I found what you had to say interesting, and in fact somthing I wanted to learn more about, hence my request for a source.

You shouldn't believe everything you hear on the Internet, you know.

Originally posted by IkNOwSTuff
I believe in reincarnation, to me it just makes sense.

My Mum believes Im my great grandmother who died while she was in labour.
A few things made her think this.
When I was 3 we were driving to visit some family whos home I hadnt been to before, on the way I asked mum to go down a street, she did and when we got half way down I said "I used to live there" It was my nans old house.
Same year I was at my grandfathers looking through some photos, I grabbed the wedding pic of nan and pop and said " I remember that day"
and finally when I was about 5, one day when I should have been at Kinder I was at home tearing around the house (mum said I couldnt sit still for more than 5 sec) when all of a sudden I stopped and sat down in front of the TV. Australian TV at 11 am on a weekday isnt exactly kid friendly and mainly consists of boring talk shows.
Mum didnt say anyhthing just watched me sitting there not blinking. When the ads came on the spell broke and I got up and started running around again. Mum asked me "what was that you were watching" and I said " I used to watch him everyday" It was Ray Martin, my nans favourite show!!!!!!

I dont know what to make of this, to be honest its kinda cool yet gross at the same time to think I could be my great grandmother

I don't believe in reincarnation, but that is a very fascinating story... Thanks for sharing!

I think it is very possible. Not in the way most people think where someone’s spirit is transferred to someone being born. We are all made up of ions, electrons, etc… All our movements are electrical impulses from our brain through our body. Energy cannot be created or destroyed it can only change its form. Like current through a light bulb. The energy is used but it doesn’t disappear it changes to heat. Well, I believe when someone dies this energy is released from the dead body. Just like reaching for a door knob and getting zapped, the energy sort of floats around until it is absorbed by another being, like someone that’s going to have a baby. Then maybe they have more capacity to collect more energy. I hope I’m a little clear on what I’m trying to say and don’t sound crazy.

Originally posted by nh_ee
reply to post by NorEaster

 

Technically, it is the energy of our soul which is electromagnetic in nature.

Really? And what technical information exists to support this idea? The truth is that this idea was popular 100 years ago - when electricity was the new magic show in this society. It's not a serious premise anymore, and hasn't been for quite a while.

Our souls are learning and advancing with each incarnation until we reach the highest state of being. Commonly known as an Angel.

Okay. I'm going to lay off here, and let this be your own "truth" about all of this. I see no real value in debunking your presentation here. It's very traditional, and while there is a lot that's been determined within the community of professional folks who study this issue, I don't think that ripping into this faith-based way of seeing things benefits either of us.

I'll just suggest that if you do some deep research into this topic, you'll discover that information manifests in a variety of manners, and that the manipulation of specific natural corporeal forces is the means by which self-aware, dynamic information "reaches out" and lets us know that it's in the room.

That's the concept...of reincarnation from a technical perspective.

Difficult for many to grasp but when introduced in the context of how our computers function. It reveals the potential of it's possibilities....

I think it's kind of endearing to have someone seriously use this approach to school me on the technicals surrounding dynamic post-corporeal human existence. You lifted my mood this evening. Thanks.

Originally posted by thetruthseeker789
Hey there

Did anyone ever heard of a real life reincarnation case? Do you think it is actually possible?
I've just been wondering how is it possible to have past life memories or memories that do not belong to you.

Thanks guys

Hey there thetruthseeker789 ... I can't believe I missed this thread

To answer your OP questions ...

Not only did I hear about a real life reincarnation case I have experienced 4 of my own pastlife memories spontaneously ... and researched the details to my satisfaction ... these are the events that prompted me to study Applied Psychology in order to help me understand the workings of the human mind more thoroughly ... and what also prompted me to become a Pastlife Regression Therapist over 17yrs ago (long before it became trendy).

So yes, there is not one doubt in my mind that it is indeed possible ... and I'm pretty sure that the 100's of people (from all walks of life) who I have regressed (using a technique that I developed myself that does not use hypnosis ... in order to prevent subliminal suggestion and false-memory) over the years would agree with me ... especially the ones who take the time to research their memories in an effort to confirm the details are historically viable and not a vast figment of their imagination.

If you'd like to read a few case-histories from my files you can find them on my website;

>>>PastlivesParanormal&Pagans

I definatly think its real. this might sound crazy but i think my grandfather was reincarnated into my cat. maybe its just me but he doesnt act like any cat ive seen before he sits in my grandfathers old chair all the time but he wont sit anwhere else and he likes tobaccco which my grandpa did to and there is an intellligence in his eyes thats hard to explain. call me crazy but its my gut feeling

Conservation of energy states energy cannot be destroyed only transformed.

Originally posted by thetruthseeker789
Hey there

Did anyone ever heard of a real life reincarnation case? Do you think it is actually possible?
I've just been wondering how is it possible to have past life memories or memories that do not belong to you.

Thanks guys

I don't buy "reincarnation". Where do people get the idea that it's true? If everybody is reincarnated, why are there more and more people? Wouldn't there be less people? I'm sure some people "learned all the lessons they needed to learn" and moved on. Where do all these new people come from? Also, how many people can be Cleopatra in a previous life? Why does nobody say they were a bum in a previous life? To me, it just sounds like a made up idea from people who have no connection with God.

Originally posted by thetruthseeker789
Hey there

Did anyone ever heard of a real life reincarnation case? Do you think it is actually possible?
I've just been wondering how is it possible to have past life memories or memories that do not belong to you.

Thanks guys

Hey..
Most definately YES!
Thats what I believe...

//MillsCore

Originally posted by nightbringr
reply to post by nh_ee

 

You shouldn't believe everything you hear on the Internet, you know.

Hi..
Thats true, BUT you should always believe in what you FEEL..
I have learned the hard way never to ignore any feeling EVER again.
//MillsCore