Can China Invade Taiwan?

The reality is 800 million chinese have been kept out of the money hunt for so long, a new revolution is taking shape. The CCP will be brought down w/o ever taking Taiwan. Rich money soaked Taiwan.

The 800 million chinese peasants want what the city dwelling chinese have.

What is the CCP doing?

Nothing! Because commies can't add, can't figure past there own corrupt mind set.

There were 77,000 demonstrations last year some with 100's thousands of protesters. The response from the CCP...send in the thugs to beat up the demonstraters. That will work, but only temporarily. They will organize and arm and come back. Bombings in Xinjiang are getting worse and spreading.

Learn well in your chinamen's military academy and maybe after the next revolution you can get a job taking tickets on the Beijing railroad.

China's banking system and all of china's savings are insolvent.

America can get products from Africa, Malaysia, India.

The CCP can only get a free ride from the backs of the chinese.

When the tiger throws off the CCP rider it will kill it's tormentor and eat it's ill gotten gains.

Originally posted by bodebliss
The reality is 800 million chinese have been kept out of the money hunt for so long, a new revolution is taking shape. The CCP will be brought down w/o ever taking Taiwan. Rich money soaked Taiwan.

The 800 million chinese peasants want what the city dwelling chinese have.

What is the CCP doing?

They give peasants no tax on arigculture.

They also are investing a very very large amount of money in the inner cities like chongqing.

200billion over 10years.

and have appointed shanghais former governer to overlook its development

Nothing! Because commies can't add, can't figure past there own corrupt mind set. [/quote

Communist are not meant to be currupt.

Originally posted by bodebliss
That will work, but only temporarily. They will organize and arm and come back. Bombings in Xinjiang are getting worse and spreading.

Were do you get your figures from?

Learn well in your chinamen's military academy and maybe after the next revolution you can get a job taking tickets on the Beijing railroad.

MODERATORS YOU SEE HIS RACIST COMMENT

Originally posted by chinawhite

Originally posted by bodebliss
That will work, but only temporarily. They will organize and arm and come back. Bombings in Xinjiang are getting worse and spreading.

Were do you get your figures from?

Right here:

www.atimes.com...












[edit on 10/10/2005 by bodebliss]

Your source doesn't give any statistics nor a list of bombings/death rate and in fact, displays China not 'cracking down' in a 'hard line' fashion which would be expected of them and in fact is what you have been attempting to display over the last few threads.

Good work.

Thank you for showing China has changed and backing up my claims.

China lacks both the amphibious capability and the logistical means to support such an adventure, even one so close to it's own shores.

China is increasing it's amphibous capability. Their latest is the Yuting-class large landing ship:

The PLAN's amphibious fleet provides sealift sufficient to transport approximately one infantry division. The PLAN also has hundreds of smaller landing craft, barges, and troop transports, all of which could be used together with fishing boats, trawlers, and civilian merchant ships to augment the naval amphibious fleet. Shortcomings in long-range lift, logistics, and air support, however, hinders China's ability to project amphibious forces.

Source: www.fas.org...

That I agree with, China lacks the ability to invade Taiwan, its irrelevent how many men we have if we can't field them effectively in the theartre of operations.

However given a withdrawel of US support from Taiwan, a massive PRC economy Taiwan, and possibly improved relations, peaceful Unification is within reach. All within 10-20 years.

However if circumstances warrent that we have to sieze that Island, then also in 10-20 years we will have the ability to do so, with say a possible new T-100 MBT and amphibious varients, a large array of amphibious craft and assualt ships the invasion while hard and bloody will be attainable, Taiwan just doesn't have a substantial economy enough to build up an effective enough military fend off a determined and well coordinated assualt, numbers + quality will wear down the effectivness of Taiwans defences.

But then again, as with ym first statement, "it is not the acme of skill to win a 100 battles, subdueing the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill." Sun Tzu

[edit on 10-10-2005 by The Middle Kingdom]

Originally posted by The Middle Kingdom
Taiwan just doesn't have a substantial economy enough to build up an effective enough military fend off a determined and well coordinated assualt, numbers + quality will wear down the effectivness of Taiwans defences.

[edit on 10-10-2005 by The Middle Kingdom]

Taiwan has enough economy to build up an effective defense. This doesn't mean that it will fend off China for sure, because it is hard to predict the result of a conflicts. However, Taiwan is capable of muster enough resource to build up an effective military forces that are prepared for possible invasion. The only problem is the pan blue parties, who have now turn their loyalties to CCP. What worries me the most is that a lot of people in Taiwan might not have seen this clearly...and will be fooled before it is too late.

The offense may wear down the effectiveness of the defense, but the offensive ability will also be wear down, plus the offensive side will be opened up for a possible counter attack.


[edit on 11-10-2005 by twchang]

"it is not the acme of skill to win a 100 battles, subdueing the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill." Sun Tzu


Yeah, quoting Sun Tzu, huh?

If he would have been alive during the Cultural Revolution, he'd have been put to death before writting his book, and his notes would have been burned.

I am glad you can say for sure what would have happened, it is so nice to know that you bodebliss, know all down to the last letter because you wouldn't wish to be posting information that you know is false.

Originally posted by ZPE StarPilot
China lacks both the amphibious capability and the logistical means to support such an adventure, even one so close to it's own shores.

China is increasing it's amphibous capability. Their latest is the Yuting-class large landing ship:
Source: www.fas.org...

THat article is over 7years old. nearly a decade.

There is already a improved varient of the yuting already out.

And chins maritime flett is more than capable of transporting 100,000men

Originally posted by Odium
I am glad you can say for sure what would have happened, it is so nice to know that you bodebliss, know all down to the last letter because you wouldn't wish to be posting information that you know is false.

Odium,

I'm pretty sure because this is what happens to activists in China today.

Sun Tsu was not an activist. He's a revolutionary. They'd shoot him.

This is what happens to activists in China. Those who would rectify such disparaties.

Activist Lu Banglie was taking a journalist into a village known for its budding democracy movement when their journey was brutally halted by a group of men

They pointed flashlights at us, and when the light hit Lu's face, it was as if a bomb had gone off. They completely lost it. They pulled him out and bashed him to the ground


The last time I saw Lu Banglie (呂邦列), he was lying in a ditch on the side of the street -- placid, numb and lifeless -- the spit, snot and urine of about 20 men mixing with his blood, and running all over his body.

I had only met him that day. He was a very soft-spoken man. One of those skinny guys who looks like he may start tearing at any moment. Born as a peasant in Baoyuesi village of Bailizhou town in Zhijiang City, Hubei Province, he was a people's representative and had been in the village of Taishi since the start of a democratic movement in the area.

That movement, deeply unpopular with the local authorities, has widely become considered a weather vane for China's tentative steps toward a more representative society. It has led to beatings and mass arrests among its population as well as for observers who venture into its environs.

Lu was at the forefront of this maelstrom. And on Sunday this is where the problem lay. We arrived on the outskirts of Taishi, just as the dirt roads start. There were 30 to 50 men -- angry, inebriated, bored men. Most looked like thugs. Some wore military camouflage uniform. Some wore blue uniforms with badges on the shoulders and one guy had a greyish-mauve uniform with a walkie-talkie. Our taxi driver, who we had hired randomly in a neighboring village, was called out by the thugs. They screamed at him: "What the # are you doing here?"

He knew nothing. He came back in and screamed at us.

"# all of you, look now you've gotten me into trouble," he said.

We told him to reverse but by that time it was already too late, the car was encircled.

"Don't go out!" I screamed, telling everyone to lock their doors. I called a colleague on my mobile, and asked him to stay on the phone with me.

The men outside shouted among themselves and those in uniform suddenly left. Those remaining started pushing on the car, screaming at us to get out. They pointed flashlights at us, and when the light hit Lu's face, it was as if a bomb had gone off. They completely lost it. They pulled him out and bashed him to the ground, kicked him, pulverized him, stomped on his head over and over again.

The beating was loud, like the crack of a wooden board, and he was unconscious within 30 seconds.

They continued for 10 minutes. The body of this skinny little man turned to putty between the kicking legs of the rancorous men. This was not about teaching a man a lesson, about scaring me, about preventing access to the village; this was about vengeance -- retribution for teaching villagers their legal rights, for agitating, for daring to hide.

They slowed down but never stopped. He lay there -- his eye out of its socket, his tongue cut, a stream of blood dropping from his mouth, his body limp, twisted. The ligaments in his neck were broken, so his head lay sideways as if connected to the rest of his body by a rubber band.

We were probably in the car another five to eight minutes. The front windows were open and various men were reaching in to unlock my door. I held my hand tight to the lock. They punched me, twisted my wrist, tried everything possible with a quick grab to get me out. But I wouldn't let go, and I defended myself while watching Lu get murdered through the window.

Eventually, my translator got out. I followed. They opened my pen, search my pockets, underwear, socks, asked my translator if his watch could record anything. They asked what we were doing in Taishi. They found my Chinese press pass.

"You foreigners you are ruining Taishi," they screamed. "You write write write so much about what's happened here that all these businesses have fled the new industrial zone."

My head was spinning. I was in a mixed state of shock at what has happened to Lu and utter fear for my life. I shamelessly begged. I prayed. I offered them money. I tried to smile at them.

Random people came up to Lu and kicked him in the head, clearing their nose of snot on his body, spitting on him, peeing on him, showing off for each other. I had no idea what to do. I stood there, sweating, my hands ripping my hair out, just staring at the blood all over the man who had risked his life to help me.

An ambulance came. The medic got out, checked his pulse and left. Then it hit me: I'd done absolutely nothing to save Lu Banglie. I stood there watching. I'm trained as a medic, and I did nothing to save Lu Banglie. Absolutely nothing.

They put us in a car, told us we were being taken for interrogation. On the way the men joke, laugh and we shake.

Lu spent his adult life working to empower villagers and to get the attention of Beijing and the world. He was beaten up many times, had scars all over his body. This was part of his work.

They put us at a conference table with flowers and spring water. About 15 officials sat round it and politely questioned us, videotaping the interaction as if it were a TV show.

"Why did you come to Taishi? Why did you meet Lu Banglie? How did you meet him?" they asked.

"We are not interested in the reception of media interviews of any kind at this juncture in time," one official explains. His superior arrives: Qi Hong, associate director of the government news office in Guangzhou.

"China is open to foreigners," she said.

"We welcome any journalists in Guangzhou, but if you don't follow the proper procedures how can we guarantee your safety?" she added.

The orchestrater of Lu's beating sits at the table, eyes bloodshot, arms crossed at an angle, his elbow jutting into the air as if to show his extreme disinterest in us.

They said we had broken the law by coming here without permission. We apologized. That is all, that is how the night ended.

We walked out of the government building, still being filmed, across the lawn, past the Chinese flag at high mast, and into the car. They waved and smiled, filming us as we drove off.

The last words of Lu Banglie I wrote down were: "The police cover their asses. They employ all these thugs whose lives mean nothing to them to kill you. That's why once we are in this we can't go out."

www.taipeitimes.com...

I don't about taiwan but they've got two takionauts in space right now..

Sun Tzu was neither Activist or Revolutionary, he was a General employed by the State of Wu and "he defeated the strong state of Ch'u to the west and entered Ying to the north and intimidated Ch'i and Chin'. The name of Wu was illustrious among the feudal Lords was partly due to his achievements." page 59 of Sun Tzu the Art of War, the Samuel B. Griffith edition and forewarded by Liddell Hart.

The Cultural Revolution was not an attempt to stamp out revolutionarism, but was an cultural revolution begun by the people and brought to order by an effort of the revolutionary commities and the PLA.

The Cultural Revolution did not purge the PLA is Sun Tzu existed today and was writing his book he would have been a high ranking general in the PLA and undoubtably would've defeated NATO in the Korean War, would've entered and occupied India and have secured Taiwan.

Better watch what you wish for. And quite frankly I doubt many of us would take the Taipei times with anything more then a grain of salt. Villages already have a high degree of democracy in village and town level and is progressing upwards.

The point is whether China could with a military expedition take Taiwan. I believe that such an adventure would be premature and fail all but secondary goals and upset the peace. However is circumstances demand that we are forced to engaged in Combat 10-20 years would be enough time to have a suitably advanced and profficient Navy capable of projecting strength past Taiwan and keeping US carriers at bay.

Middle kingdom,

The US's tech advances at a higher rate and is deployed much faster and more pervasively than China can do the same.

no not really sure you have alot of military projects but so does China, just alot more secret.

Also, while you may have alot of projects none of them are getting enough funding to fully deploy them to their fullest potential.

MK, that news doesn't just appear in Taipei Times.

here are several links with the same story:

edition.cnn.com...

www.guardian.co.uk...

www.smh.com.au...

I think Taipei Times's report is all right.

Originally posted by The Middle Kingdom
no not really sure you have alot of military projects but so does China, just alot more secret.

Also, while you may have alot of projects none of them are getting enough funding to fully deploy them to their fullest potential.

Hmm...I don't think that is correct. From the look of it the US military is very well organized and prepared. Their military R&D systems are also very matured I think.

And I think they were used to their fullest...look at their past project like F-15, F-16, JDAM etc....they are used, and upgraded for various different missions.

Also, now the information and communicaiton technologies of the US military will give them quite some advantages during battle.


[edit on 12-10-2005 by twchang]

Originally posted by Daedalus3
I don't about taiwan but they've got two takionauts in space right now..

Hahaha...I don't think Taiwan is capable of doing such a thing, and I don't think Taiwanese will want to do that any time soon.

Taiwan produced and send satellites into orbit though. But if I remember correctly, it was launched by another country.

Edit: Hmm...just remember something...more than 20 years ago Taiwan's military has a ballistic missile development called Sky Hourse (Pegasus) program. But it was later halted due to US pressure, because of anti-nuke agenda, hahaha.

www.globalsecurity.org...


[edit on 12-10-2005 by twchang]