Why the west should fear muslims

reply to post by MrXYZ


We have no right to meddle in their affairs? I think your missing
the point of this thread, and its a valid one. Its them meddling in
our affairs. They come to our free countries and breed like rats,
They preach love and peace to non muslims while
at the mosque and then at the dinner table the
father spews out the real islam, intolerance and hate.
You say there is no proof of god, then you are not looking. Can
i assume that you have to see something in order to believe? Or
is hundreds of eye witnesses enough? If so google
MIRACLE OF FATIMA

Originally posted by babybunnies

In the Bible, there are MANY instances of the Christian God wiping out entire CITIES and ARMIES because of their belief system, even whole countries, and at one point, the entire planet (except for Noah and his family in the Ark).

Who's the bigger mass murderer here?

I'm neither Christian, Jewish, or Muslim, just pointing out the futility of religious arguments.

Correct. However that is God's right and not the right of man. Christ has forbidden christians to behave this way, outside of the just laws of civilization. (ie if you slaughter innocents expect to receive justice).

Speaking of slaughtering innocents, all those so judged by God had in fact institutionalized the slaughter of innocents. Canaanites, had been sacrificing their baby's to demons for several hundred years prior to coming under judgment. God reserves the right to judge his creation. It's not too surprising really. Perhaps the real surprise is that he sacrificed his own Son on the cross, so that by putting your faith in Him you might escape judgment. That's called mercy, something in short supply these days.

reply to post by Acharya

How can you tar ALL Muslims with the same brush? This is ludicrous! It's the Fundamentalists you should be after. And there are fundamentalist Christians, Jews, and Hindus as well.

The 'chosen' few we call Mullahs, high priests and so on are the guys who propagate hate for power and pelf. A Christian priest raping and sodomizing little girls and boys is as bad as being a Muslim 'terrorist'. These guys are so far gone that they don't seem to realize that there is just one 'supreme being'. But these self styled 'preachers', Mullahs, and Godmen propound bizarre theories that if you don't believe in THEIR religion then you must fry in hell. Or that non-believers are 'Kafirs' who need to put away.

So don't blast a religion. It's the interpretation by the religious honchos that needs to be corrected. Their brain-washing of susceptible minds needs to be stopped. And we need to stop listening to them!

As for me religion is an outdated concept. There's nothing to see here but bloodshed and despair. Humanism is my mantra where all are equal in the eyes of that 'supreme being'. It is a philosophy, or practice that focuses on human values and concerns.

over 60 MILLION people died in world war two.
minus a couple million Japanese , and related non christians..Chinese etc
lets round it off to say 50 million Christians died in world war two
50 million Christians killed by christians...
and you are worried about Muslims?
I know you don't like it when people question Christian thought processes...
its "hate"
well
you folks are fixing to do it again..

and that is not even talking about world war one.
16.5 million mostly Christians killed by...you guessed it
CHRISTIANS

so thats 65 MILLION CHRISTIAN people killed by CHRISTIANS in the two world wars...
And Christians claim the moral high ground?
I'm begining to think it is a sickness of some kind.

[edit on 16-8-2010 by Danbones]

Originally posted by Acid_Burn2009
reply to post by atlguy

 

But we are not discussing the Bible here on this thread. The discussion lies with Muslims and the Quran.

Please stop trying to derail the this thread because it is not PC. I would like to thank the poster who created the thread with the Quran verses that advocate violence toward the infidels, as they say.

Perhaps if you believe the Quran to preach love and peace, maybe you should re-read it because you obviously did not understand it the first time. Maybe you have reading and comprehension issues, not sure. I have read the Quran because sometimes there is absolutely nothing to do while you are deployed. I took those down times we had and immersed myself in local culture and history. I also took that opportunity to learn as much about Islam as I could.

I am not denying that Christians are/were violent and bloody but this thread is not about Christianity and it's history. So stop the threats of Bible verses that advocate violence.

If humans are a virus upon this planet, then the Muslims are the cancer of the world. The OP describes it perfectly.

Excellent post, Acid_Burn. cancer of the world is right.

SeaWind

In The Words Of The Great Winston Churchill

How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property – either as a child, a wife, or a concubine – must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Thousands become the brave and loyal soldiers of the Queen: all know how to die but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilisation of ancient Rome.

- The River War


Our government would do well to remember the nature of the forces arrayed against us, and to remember Churchill’s advice about recognizing the enemy sooner, rather than later:

“Still, if you will not fight for the right when you can easily win without bloodshed, if you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not so costly, you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance for survival. There may be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no chance of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves.”

As to the 'Why' after all, our leaders getting to the positions they are today, are not stupid. I believe we should look to an antique book called the protocols of the learned elders of Zion, a supposed 'forgery' which has been scarily accurate up to the present day. It states it shall destroy the main religions of the day, Christianity and Islam, as one part of their plan.
Now we have to ask ourselves, what would be the most efficient way of doing that, make Christians and Muslims fight between each other. Flooding Christian lands with Muslims would bring about the situation in where the fighting would become necessary.

I know most of the people here will bash you based on the content of your post, knowing full well that its true just to try to act like better people, unfortunately everything you say is true. I've seen how the Muslim takeover works and its happening in the UK and Sweden. I'm glad certain people are aware of this and not just ignoring it. Great post!

reply to post by Acharya


Have you every considered the moslem contribution to science. Do you know that moslems go to universitylike other people do. I do not deny there is social unrest. I am however against idiotic blanket-statements like you OP.

Do you know what the word "fundamentalist" means?

Originally posted by Tiger5
reply to post by Acharya

 

Have you every considered the moslem contribution to science. Do you know that moslems go to universitylike other people do. I do not deny there is social unrest. I am however against idiotic blanket-statements like you OP.

Do you know what the word "fundamentalist" means?

Muslim contribution to science is a point constantly raised by bleeding hearted liberals. How about doing some proper research for once and you will find they have not contributed much at all to the world of science.

Alot of what islam claims is theirs is actually either, translated from Latin and Greek texts or comes from ancient Persia.

Originally posted by babybunnies

Originally posted by SeaWind

Originally posted by inforeal
reply to post by Acharya

 

Why don’t you directly answer me about your own lies?

The Quran itself and Muhammad has praised Christians and Muslims have lived with them throughout history. It also criticizes them. So what.
Muhammad never murdered anyone for their belief. To say such a thing is a lie.

Also, cetrtainly not all that history has been positive but to single out a group is bigotry of the worst and ignorant kind.


I challenge your heart and intelligence. It is wanting!


[edit on 15-8-2010 by inforeal]

Inforeal, here I was bopping thru this thread looking at all Islamophile trolls, until I came to your:

"Muhammad never murdered anyone for their belief. To say such a thing is a lie."

I'm looking at my old copy of the Koran (Qu'ran). It says here just after the intro:

627 AD "The Jewish tribe of Qurayza raided by Muhammad; some 800 men beheaded (only one Jew abjuring his religion to save his life) and all the women and children sold as slaves."

My copy was printed in 1972, translated by N.J. Dawood, an Iraqi Muslim.

Some books say only 700 Jewish men were beheaded at Qurayza.

A mass murderer who had people killed for refusing to accept him as a "True Prophet of God" invented this "religion."

SeaWind

In the Bible, there are MANY instances of the Christian God wiping out entire CITIES and ARMIES because of their belief system, even whole countries, and at one point, the entire planet (except for Noah and his family in the Ark).

Who's the bigger mass murderer here?

I'm neither Christian, Jewish, or Muslim, just pointing out the futility of religious arguments.

Babybunnies, you canNOT compare a hypothetical God of the Old Testament will a REAL man who was a documented historical figure.

SeaWind

638 The Romans were defeated at the Battle of Yarmouk and Muslims entered Palestine. Before entering Jerusalem, Caliph Umar formed a covenant with the Jews, promising to protect their religious freedom.
641 Islam spread into Egypt. The Catholic Archbishop invited Muslims to help free Egypt from Roman oppressors.

atheism.about.com...

Then the crusades, the first roughly after the turn of the year 1000. The christians invaded the "holy lands" and unless you count the romans who were for the most part Pagan, which really you can't count as christian even if some did accept it, the majority didn't, the christians were not even there first.

I find it odd that some might castigate another religion while not expecting the same treatment for them selves.... especially like I said after killing 65 million people conservatively in the 20th century.

not to mention upwards of some say as high as 65 million NDNs in north and south america.

It is difficult to have sympathy for Christains who overlook this sort of thing.

[edit on 16-8-2010 by Danbones]

[edit on 16-8-2010 by Danbones]

[edit on 16-8-2010 by Danbones]

Originally posted by Magnum007
BS this is all BS... from the IQ to the good 'ol their religion is evil...

Read the Qur'an maybe you'll learn something... It's not a book advocating violence, it's actually a peaceful book... Stop demonizing Islam with your ignorant words. Learn about it directly instead of what you "heard" or "read" from BS sources...

How do you test the IQ of people in war zones and who are poverty stricken where education is not a priority? How do you justify this?

You are forgetting the real people to fear. The American government... They are the ones who have invaded Korea & Vietnam (in the name of preventing communism), most of South America ONLY to put in their own puppet governments. Should I go on???

You are writing like a true Nazi. Oh they are more stupid than us, we waste money on them, and they are taking over everything... Let's get rid of them, yeah! let's kill 'em...

I can't believe I even read your post...

Magnum

For someone that claims to have read the Qur'an yousure do not know much about what it states or its imperialistic ideology.

Muslims are not bad people just as Germans were not bad people during Nazi rule. However the fervent and dominating systems that govern both can cause those people to do great harm in the name of what those systems proclaim as great. It can happen to any culture and we should not ignore what history has taught us because we are afraid of being labeled intolerant. That is what is dangerous.

I think you should read it and the Hadith.

Sooo...why should "the west" fear muslims again? I don't get it. Issues such as intelligence, traditions(be it the mutilation you mentioned) I don't see necessarily as being a religious issue. The latter being more a sexual equality issue (men are sexually less restrained than women, remember chastity belts?) And the education issue once again, not a muslim issue, I don't recall seeing in a Quaran(sp?) Anything saying "do not educate yourself, only know the Quaran(once again, spelling) but I implore any more islam adept people to correct me if I'm wrong.

what you've spouted, sir, is no different than how most have characterized other races. africans were called "savages" years ago to justify extracting/or colonizing resource rich areas, as were native north/south americans, who were nearly exterminated to create this nation which I live in. As were aborigine people were made second class or worse, citizens in the land down under and india was colonized presumably under the same view.

One issue I acknowledge with humanity, is that greed(for influence economically, socially, or with natural resources) and lack of knowledge(be it in regards to cultural differences, education) and fear have caused us all a lot of problems.

My issue with ANY religion, is when they are twisted from their original teachings of peace by people looking for an excuse to cause harm or resources or land. There are/have been extremists in all religions I'm sure, just like crusaders and jihadists.

Just as my issue with individual people is the same way, I do not intend to harm, unless I myself are harmed(by violence, intimidation, theft, breaking of trust, etc). And until I see reason to dislike someone, I like everyone. And I try not to lump all persons, based on 1 persons action. If I did that, id hate african americans...and myself, as of the 3 times I've personally been robbed directly, were commited by people that looked jjust like me, in respect to heritage.

If men respected women equally, there would be no sexism, if individual peoples respected other individuals personal beliefs and property, there probably would be less violence over all, and if europeans respected asians, respected indians, respected africans, respected native north/south americans, aborigines down under, and arab people for who they were, where the live, how they learn and their respective cultures, we'd all probably be having a cool enjoyable time on this rock.

Religious hatred is widespread, especially amongst the religious.

Can anyone prove to me that there are no examples in the Bible calling for prejudice against those who believe differently?
Of course you can't. Same with the Koran.
These words are systematically used for personal/political agenda and it still amazes me how vehemently people stand behind some passages, but ignore others. Interpretation of badly written books to aid in the promotion of agenda is folly.

Grow up, or Santa Claus won't leave you any Easter Eggs.

Originally posted by Badgered1
Religious hatred is widespread, especially amongst the religious.

Can anyone prove to me that there are no examples in the Bible calling for prejudice against those who believe differently?
Of course you can't. Same with the Koran.
These words are systematically used for personal/political agenda and it still amazes me how vehemently people stand behind some passages, but ignore others. Interpretation of badly written books to aid in the promotion of agenda is folly.

Grow up, or Santa Claus won't leave you any Easter Eggs.

Can you quote the hate from the New Testament please ?

Originally posted by Badgered1
Religious hatred is widespread, especially amongst the religious.

Can anyone prove to me that there are no examples in the Bible calling for prejudice against those who believe differently?
Of course you can't. Same with the Koran.
These words are systematically used for personal/political agenda and it still amazes me how vehemently people stand behind some passages, but ignore others. Interpretation of badly written books to aid in the promotion of agenda is folly.

Grow up, or Santa Claus won't leave you any Easter Eggs.

Can you quote the hate from the New Testament please ?

reply to post by ahmonrarh


It is far different when such violence and bigotry is a religions duty to God and a prerequisite to salvation.

In Christianity all instances of evil deeds (Inquisition , Salem, witch trial in Europe, etc.) were validated by the Old testament on 1 or 2 verses that totally contradict what Jesus taught and were fueled by superstition or pure political chicanery.

In Islam the whole book is law and cannot be abrogated or refuted. The Qur'an outlines very distinctly it's views about global domination and infidels . It outlines the punishments and methods of persecution. The Hadith , which are a collection of sayings from Muhammad , are even more meticulous in their methods of intolerance.

Yes, the Old Testament is very intolerant and sexist , but Christianity has made those passages mute for the most part and replaced them with a better moral law. Very few instances of war or genocide can be blamed on this religion or its creed,

Islam is another story, it's creed definitely encourages it in most instances and most conflicts, although political, are fueled by what it states.

“The Wahhabi Invasion of America”

Reza F. Safa, author of Inside Islam, estimates that since 1973, the Saudi government has spent an unbelievable $87 billion to promote Wahhabism in the United States, Africa, Southeast Asia and Europe.

According to official Saudi information, Saudi funds have been used to build and maintain

over 1,500 mosques,

202 colleges

210 Islamic Centers wholly or partly financed by Saudi Arabia

and almost 2,000 schools for educating Muslim children in non-Islamic countries in Europe, North and South America, Australia and Asia

www.jfednepa.org...



The above information was supplied by a respected ATS poster in another thread

Imo, it provides plenty of reasons why 'The West Should Fear Muslims'

It also, imo, explains a LOT

for example, explains why the ATS and other forums are being flooded with pro-muslim threads and posts

After all, the Saudis have BILLIONS of dollars to invest in the muslim take-over of the West, so a few million dollars invested in Online Propagandists is small change -- particularly when the platforms (forums such as ATS and other) are FREE !

Lot cheaper than taking out paid political advertisements in the media, isn't it ?

Flies under the radar of the general public, also -- until it's too late

And of course, there are plenty out there with NO love of Westerners --- even though they may have been living in the West and working as low-level undercover agents for decades, spreading anti-Western propaganda

so they'd be more than happy to get their hands on some of that Saudi blood-money. And all they have to do in return is establish themselves in forums just like this one -- play the 'good guy' for months until people get to recognise and trust them -- and then they start peddling muslim propaganda to the trusting

Some of the Paid-to-Posts peddle the soft-line, pretend to be 'liberal' and 'fair and reasonable' to the tune of sobbing violins

while others take the hard-line approach

(usually, the same people who're Paid to Post have multiple forum identities. Makes it so much easier to back-up their own posts. As well, a common tactic is for them to post in gangs and get in early, in order to 'form and shape' people's opinions)

The Saudis have invested $87 BILLION in the spread of Wahhibism -- that's by their own admission !

How much more have they invested in Wahhibism on the sly ?

How many 'donations' to various politicians have the Saudis made --how many billions ? How many politicians are on the Saudi payroll ?


So yes, plenty of reasons the West should fear muslims and the determined, well-funded spread of Wahhibism

Ps: would be a good idea to read-up on Wahhibism, when your nerves can take it

[edit on 16-8-2010 by Dock9]

YOU COULD ALL BE WRONG !

To all the skeptics in this thread.

The op says Muslims and does not make a distinction between Muslim factions.

You who say the OP is a racists and a liar, also do not take into account that the Muslims the Op is talking about could be from one extreme faction, and he does not see the other good Muslim sitting at home, so he may think this is how all Muslims act.

What is the difference between Shiite and Sunni Muslims?

The Sunni Muslims I have seen would have you believe they are the peace loving ones and the extremists that the Op talks about come from the Shiite faction.

We need to get to the bottom of THIS issue to know what the truth is.

I want to hear from people who have really studied this indepth - the differences between these two factions.

The op could be telling the truth in this light and all you people who say he's just a racists could be wrong because you are ignorant of facts.

How about it folks?

It's always the same,

Right wing panicking and being hateful, the left being overly liberal and labeling everyone who criticizes the immigration policies as a racist or anti-something.

Waste of breath.